Author Topic: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?  (Read 19610 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #100 on: February 12, 2024, 12:21:15 am »
Seems like we wanted it.

Then we didn't want it.

I am particularly troubled by statements by people like Rand Paul who said it was done "in secret" and hidden from view.  Does that really happen in the senate or house where a bill is hidden from other house members ?

Then there is the optics of the GOP saying they want the bill (or many of them did) and encouraged the negotiations. 

Then Trump comes out against it. 

And suddenly things turn.

Even if it's not the case, the GOP senate certainly looks like a group of Trump lapdogs.

Seems we can't do enough to shoot our selves in the foot, arse, and head.


Just so people are clear on the OP. 

More questioning the wisdom of ever saying we wanted it tied to funding when everyone knows you are NOT going to get full border closedown.

And Speaker Johnson might well wonder why he comes off looking like an ass, commenting on bills the senate is working on when he should be making sure a slam dunk impeachment actually happens.

You can't make this stuff up.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2024, 12:22:33 am by HikerGuy83 »

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36,314
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #101 on: February 12, 2024, 02:43:39 am »
And the bill does things that move in the right direction.

Such as?  Please be specific.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36,314
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #102 on: February 12, 2024, 02:44:39 am »
I did say that there were plenty of things that were useful in the bill

Such as?  Please be specific.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36,314
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #103 on: February 12, 2024, 02:52:42 am »
BTW: Speaker Johnson is turning out to be a bigger moron than McCarthy. 

He was never really interested in the bill (or any bill for that matter that wasn't "perfect" (which everyone knows will NEVER happen)

Not sure what Speaker Johnson has to do with a bill that originated in the Senate.  Can you expand on that?

H.R. 2 has been in the Senate now for 9 months waiting for a vote.  And you want to blame Johnson for that?  Please.  If we wanted to hear Dem talking points, we could hear them parroted on MSNBC.  No need for you to repost them here.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #104 on: February 12, 2024, 02:17:43 pm »
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/gop-lawmakers-won-t-govern-while-trump-runs-for-president-they-re-just-following-orders/ar-BB1i8TAH?ocid=msedgntp&pc=LCTS&cvid=834da4fd9fac4a6fbc985b6bec8832c6&ei=15

Even though it might not be true, it certainly comes off that way.

The GOP isn't very bright at the top.

Still have not figured out that what's real does not seem to matter.

It's spinning the better tale.

And this one is going to spin from now until November.

Offline DefiantMassRINO

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,113
  • Gender: Male
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #105 on: February 12, 2024, 03:11:39 pm »
Biden / Mayorkas can't be trusted to secure the border.  There's not point giving Biden additional money for anything until Mayorkas is fired.
Self-Anointed Deplorable Expert Chowderhead Pundit

I reserve my God-given rights to be wrong and to be stupid at all times.
"If at first you don’t succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried." - Steven Wright

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #106 on: February 12, 2024, 03:30:17 pm »
Biden / Mayorkas can't be trusted to secure the border.  There's not point giving Biden additional money for anything until Mayorkas is fired.

Let's take your statement as true......

My question is....why did the senate sign up for high profile "bipartisan negotiation" that was led by a good conservative from OK ?  Saying they wanted it, then voting against it (for the reason you listed or others....does not matter) and invite yet another PR Nightmare ?

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36,314
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #107 on: February 15, 2024, 02:43:52 am »
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/gop-lawmakers-won-t-govern-while-trump-runs-for-president-they-re-just-following-orders/ar-BB1i8TAH?ocid=msedgntp&pc=LCTS&cvid=834da4fd9fac4a6fbc985b6bec8832c6&ei=15

Even though it might not be true, it certainly comes off that way.

I see that critical thought is not your strong suit.  In fact, it's a null suit for you.  Because there is zero rationality to that statement above.

First, if it isn't true, don't push it as coming off truthful.  Either call it out as a lie, or don't post it at all.  Capisce?  Frankly, no one here bought Pelosi's argument when she said 'It doesn't matter if the charges are true, what matters is the seriousness of the charges'.  Your crap is easily recognizable.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36,314
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #108 on: February 15, 2024, 02:47:40 am »
My question is....why did the senate sign up for high profile "bipartisan negotiation" that was led by a good conservative from OK ?  Saying they wanted it, then voting against it (for the reason you listed or others....does not matter) and invite yet another PR Nightmare ?

@HikerGuy83

Clearly, you are still upset that Republicans didn't help pass Schumer's 'border bill'.  Why are you so enamored with it?  I mean seriously, after several requests, you are still unable to identify a single thing in it that will help stem the tide of illegals flowing into this country.  So why pass it?  What is in it that you consider good?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #109 on: February 15, 2024, 04:21:43 am »
Anecdotal....but what the hell.

Seems like nobody is interested in discussing the totally retarded GOP strategy regarding the border bill.

Regarding the loss of Santos' seat back to the democrats.

CNN anchor Dana Bash reported that several voters said to her on Election Day “that they don’t want to vote for the Republican because it’s clearly impossible to get a solution on the issue of immigration” after the party tanked a bipartisan border bill last week amid pressure from Trump.

“The fact that Republicans killed that bipartisan deal put them over the edge to vote for Tom Suozzi,” Bash said.

***********************

Yep...optics don't matter.

Just gotta have that perfect bill.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/perpetual-loser-trump-rages-on-truth-social-after-being-blamed-for-stupid-strategy-in-ny-loss/ar-BB1igOvM?ocid=msedgntp&pc=LCTS&cvid=da114b6e198140ff88861a788bd4d509&ei=16

Offline Smokin Joe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 56,608
  • I was a "conspiracy theorist". Now I'm just right.
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #110 on: February 15, 2024, 04:52:52 am »
Why would the GOP pretend to even be interested in this when it was going to tank ?

Graham seems to have been looking to the amendmend process to "make it better". 

The GOP wanted this tied to funding for Ukraine and Israel.  Then they shoot it down.  Now that funding is being undertaken independent of the border (fron what I can tell).

This whole thread is about how the senate comes off looking stupid.
How stupid they look depends on what THEIR objective is, not what you think it should have been..

I seriously doubt more than a handful of either House gives a steaming shit about their oath of office or representing their constituents of, for that matter, the Constitution. They're high on baksheesh, addicted to it, and devil take the hindmost. Whatever theater they need to pull off to fool the rubes back home, well it's the price of power.

How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51,508
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #111 on: February 15, 2024, 09:34:48 am »
How stupid they look depends on what THEIR objective is, not what you think it should have been..

I seriously doubt more than a handful of either House gives a steaming shit about their oath of office or representing their constituents of, for that matter, the Constitution. They're high on baksheesh, addicted to it, and devil take the hindmost. Whatever theater they need to pull off to fool the rubes back home, well it's the price of power.

 :yowsa: pointing-up
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,958
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #112 on: February 15, 2024, 04:47:44 pm »
How stupid they look depends on what THEIR objective is, not what you think it should have been..

I seriously doubt more than a handful of either House gives a steaming shit about their oath of office or representing their constituents of, for that matter, the Constitution. They're high on baksheesh, addicted to it, and devil take the hindmost. Whatever theater they need to pull off to fool the rubes back home, well it's the price of power.

@Smokin Joe

I would LOVE to argue with you about that,I really,really would.

But........

BTW,I know I am going to get flamed by this,but I still support Lady Lindsey. I think he is doing the best job he can do,and that he is one of the few that put America ahead of self.

Of course,the flip side to that is that if he were to leave office,he would have ZERO ability to influence politics.

He still isn't anyone any of the other Congresscritters wants to piss-off,though.

Like everyone else, I wish we all lived in a perfect world,but we don't.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51,508
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #113 on: February 15, 2024, 05:04:01 pm »
@Smokin Joe

I would LOVE to argue with you about that,I really,really would.

But........

BTW,I know I am going to get flamed by this,but I still support Lady Lindsey. I think he is doing the best job he can do,and that he is one of the few that put America ahead of self.

Of course,the flip side to that is that if he were to leave office,he would have ZERO ability to influence politics.

He still isn't anyone any of the other Congresscritters wants to piss-off,though.

Like everyone else, I wish we all lived in a perfect world,but we don't.

I beg to differ with you on Lindsey "Weathervane" Graham @sneakypete I have no use what-so-ever for the Juan McCain clone. He's on every side of every issue depending on which way the wind is blowing on any given day.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 80,075
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #114 on: February 15, 2024, 06:12:01 pm »
I beg to differ with you on Lindsey "Weathervane" Graham @sneakypete I have no use what-so-ever for the Juan McCain clone. He's on every side of every issue depending on which way the wind is blowing on any given day.

Graham is McStain's "Mini Me."  Always was.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,958
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #115 on: February 15, 2024, 10:31:43 pm »
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #116 on: February 19, 2024, 03:17:30 pm »
How stupid they look depends on what THEIR objective is, not what you think it should have been..

I seriously doubt more than a handful of either House gives a steaming shit about their oath of office or representing their constituents of, for that matter, the Constitution. They're high on baksheesh, addicted to it, and devil take the hindmost. Whatever theater they need to pull off to fool the rubes back home, well it's the price of power.



For the sake of "argument", I really don't know that what you "seriously doubt" carries any weight unless you can produce evidence to support your doubt.

My assumption is that many of them are interested in "something" they think is right.....even if it violates the 10th amendment.

But my original point was that this was a no win situation for them.  Kinda like the whole "War Games" (movie) theme....the only way to win is to not play.

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #117 on: February 19, 2024, 03:20:45 pm »
@Smokin Joe

I would LOVE to argue with you about that,I really,really would.



Why would you not argue it ?

Someone just saying it does not make it so.

I guess, the larger question I have to ask is...what do you expect from those who represent you (a question we should all be thinking of an answer to).

Offline Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 80,075
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #118 on: February 19, 2024, 05:23:13 pm »
Why would you not argue it ?

Someone just saying it does not make it so.

I guess, the larger question I have to ask is...what do you expect from those who represent you (a question we should all be thinking of an answer to).

I expect them to enrich themselves at my expense.  Thus it has ever been, since the days of the Articles of Federation.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline HikerGuy83

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,444
  • Gender: Male
  • Still Trying
Re: What's the Deal With the Border Protection Bill ?
« Reply #119 on: February 20, 2024, 12:27:08 am »
I expect them to enrich themselves at my expense.  Thus it has ever been, since the days of the Articles of Federation.

Maybe we could start a thread that documents how that is happening.

In some instances it certainly seems to be the case.

I am not sure it is generally the case, but I could be wrong.