Author Topic: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'  (Read 705 times)

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Online mystery-ak

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Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
by Brady Knox, Breaking News Reporter
August 27, 2023 04:21 PM

Entrepreneur Vivek Ramaswamy said that former Vice President Mike Pence missed an opportunity for heroism with his behavior on Jan. 6, 2021.

While saying he would've certified the election results as well, Ramaswamy criticized the way in which Pence went about it, going so far as to say that he missed a "historic opportunity" to "reunite the country." His comments came during an appearance on NBC News' Meet the Press, when asked by host Chuck Todd if he believed Pence did the right thing on Jan. 6 by certifying the results of the election.

“I would have done it very differently," Ramaswamy responded. "I think that there was a historic opportunity that he missed, to reunite this country in that window."

"What I would have said is: This is a moment for a true national consensus where there's two elements of what's required for a functioning democracy in America," he continued. “One is secure elections, and the second is a peaceful transfer of power. When those things come into conflict, that’s an opportunity for heroism.”

Ramaswamy said that he would have pushed reforms to the voting process through Congress before the decision to certify came if he were in Pence's shoes, avoiding the pressure the vice president was faced with.

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https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/campaigns/vivek-ramaswamy-mike-pence-missed-heroism
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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2023, 10:42:33 pm »
Oh FFS!
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Online Timber Rattler

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2023, 10:53:17 pm »
That makes no sense whatsoever.  Pence had NO Constitutional authority to intervene in the Congressional counting of certified electoral votes.  None. Period.
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Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2023, 11:04:39 pm »

Ramaswamy said that he would have pushed reforms to the voting process through Congress before the decision to certify came if he were in Pence's shoes, avoiding the pressure the vice president was faced with.  “Here’s what I would have said: ‘We need single-day voting on Election Day, we need paper ballots, and we need government-issued ID matching the voter file.’ And if we achieve that, then we have achieved victory, and we should not have any further complaint about election integrity. I would have driven it through the Senate," Ramaswamy said.
In my capacity as president of the Senate, I would have led through that level of reform, then on that condition certified the election results, served it up to the president — President Trump — then to sign that into law. And on January 7th, declared the re-election campaign pursuant to a free and fair election,” he added. “I think that was a missed opportunity."

That's just such an incredibly sleazy and dishonest answer.  The VP has no authority over the Senate or the House to "push through" anything.  The Democrats in the Senate and House would have told him to take a hike and wouldn't have passed anything.  So when (not if) that happens, would Ramaswamy have certified the votes in the absence of that, or not?

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2023, 11:20:16 pm »
That makes no sense whatsoever.  Pence had NO Constitutional authority to intervene in the Congressional counting of certified electoral votes.  None. Period.
What Pence did not do, as called for in the normal procedure was ask for objections.
There were some, but after the ruckus had died down, that part of the proceedings was skipped.

Quote
The Electoral Count Act of 1887 and several federal statutes address questions about contested electors that land in Congress. The Congressional Research Service’s current interpretation of the Electoral Count Act explains its understanding of the process when it comes to objections to electoral votes.

“Objections to individual state returns must be made in writing by at least one Member each of the Senate and House of Representatives. If an objection meets these requirements, the joint session recesses and the two houses separate and debate the question in their respective chambers for a maximum of two hours,” the CRS said. “The two houses then vote separately to accept or reject the objection. They then reassemble in joint session, and announce the results of their respective votes. An objection to a state’s electoral vote must be approved by both houses in order for any contested votes to be excluded.”
https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/explaining-how-congress-settles-electoral-college-disputes
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Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2023, 12:05:19 am »
What Pence did not do, as called for in the normal procedure was ask for objections.
There were some, but after the ruckus had died down, that part of the proceedings was skipped.

@Smokin Joe

No, the objections were NOT skipped.  That myth is like a bad case of herpes that will just not go away.  I've laid that out here before.  There were some media reports on the afternoon of January 6 that the objections would not be heard, and the election just certified.  I remember watching that chryon scrolling on the TV that afternoon and thinking that was a bad idea.

But what actually happened is that after the riot, there were some Republican Senators who withdrew their objections, and therefore there was not the one Senator and one Representative sponsor necessary to object to some state certifications.  Kelly Loeffler of Georgia had planned to object to Georgia's electors, but withdrew it after the riot so there wasn't the requisite sponsorship by a Senator.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/kelly-loeffler-resinds-objection-election

However, the Objections to the Arizona and Pennsylvania certifications still had sponsors, and they were properly heard, debated, and voted upon prior to the certification of the vote as a whole.

Don't take my word for it - you can literally watch the Senate debate and vote on Senator Cruz's Arizona vote on C-Span right here.  First, the part of the debate before adjournment because of the riot, with Pence himself presiding:

https://www.c-span.org/video/?507698-2/senate-debate-arizona-electoral-college-vote-challenge-part-1

And then the Senate returning to the chamber after the riot, continuing the debate, and then voting on Cruz's Arizona objection.  Once again, Pence actually presiding at the exact event.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?507698-5/senate-debate-arizona-electoral-college-vote-challenge-part-2

And then the vote on Hawley's Pennsylvania objections, again with Mike Pence presiding.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?507698-101/senate-debate-pennsylvania-electoral-college-vote-challenge

The claim that the election objections were not taken up after the riot is simply false.   You can literally watch the post-riot debate and vote on the objections yourself in the above links.  But if you don't want to watch the actual debate/votes above, then here is what happened:

The Election Objection filed by Senator Cruz and Representative Gosar to the certification of the Arizona electoral votes was considered separately by the two Houses, as required by the ECA.  The Objection was rejected by the Senate 6-93 at 9:58 p.m. on January 6, and was rejected by the House 121-303 at 11:08 p.m. on January 6.   

https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1171/vote_117_1_00001.htm
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/117-2021/h10

The Election Objection filed by Senator Hawley and Representative Perry to the certification of the Pennsylvania electoral votes also was considered separately by the two Houses, as required by the ECA.  That Objection was rejected 7-92 by the Senate at 12:30 a.m. on January 7, and rejected 138-282 by the House at 3:08 a.m. on January 7, 2021.

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/117-2021/s2
https://clerk.house.gov/Votes/202111\

The Electoral Count vote itself was not completed until about 3:40 a.m. on the 7th.  So the objections were properly heard and voted upon, in the order of the role call vote, before the vote was completely.  They complied 100% with the requirements of the ECA.

I watched the first of those debates and votes myself as they were happening, live. So it is incredibly frustrating to repeatedly hear people saying that they did not happen, and that the objections were ignored.


« Last Edit: March 03, 2024, 06:04:22 pm by Maj. Bill Martin »

Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2023, 12:28:43 am »
So ... 62% of "Republican" primary voters are supporting candidates who wanted to end the republic.  15% support a guy who has no beef with Mike Pence, though he doesn't want to be asked about it in front of the other 62%. 

2024 is going to be awesome.

Yeah, pretty much.

I'm drawing the @roamer_1 line this time around.  I've been willing in the past to vote for candidates of whom I'm not very fond because I never thought they were a threat to the future of the Republic itself, and because a Democrat was so much worse. But this time around...I just can't vote for Trump or Ramaswamy under any circumstances, regardless of their opponent.

ETA:  This is weird.  I thought I was responding to a post by @cato potatoe , but it looks like my post somehow ate his.  Weird.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 12:35:02 am by Maj. Bill Martin »

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2023, 12:35:47 am »
Yeah, pretty much.

I'm drawing the @roamer_1 line this time around.  I've been willing in the past to vote for candidates of whom I'm not very fond because I never thought they were a threat to the future of the Republic itself, and because a Democrat was so much worse. But this time around...I just can't vote for Trump or Ramaswamy under any circumstances, regardless of their opponent.

h/t   :seeya:

That serves down-ticket too... The only way the Republicans will regain their cajones is to get rid of the RINOs... And the only way to do that is to quit voting them in.

I know, I know... ya need butts in the seats...

I don't buy that.

Online Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2023, 12:51:48 am »
h/t   :seeya:

That serves down-ticket too... The only way the Republicans will regain their cajones is to get rid of the RINOs... And the only way to do that is to quit voting them in.

I know, I know... ya need butts in the seats...

I don't buy that.


I actually do.

The Democrat Party was never 100% leftist.  But what happened is that there were enough leftists to control the party, and therefore the non-leftists ended up backing them because that's all they had.   I'd rather have 45 conservatives and 10 RINOs in the Senate than just 45 conservatives.  Those RINO votes saved us on Garland, and on getting Trump's Supreme Court nominees confirmed.  Reagan had some RINO's, and he figured out how to work with them.

Now sure, I'd rather have 55 conservatives, but realistically, that's not an option because there are places that just won't elect them. Or sometimes you get conservative candidates who are so flawed they could not get elected even in jurisdictions that might otherwise elect a conservative.

The problem I have with Trump and Ramaswamy is that they're not even RINO's.  They're something...worse.

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2023, 12:59:51 am »
I actually do.

The Democrat Party was never 100% leftist.  But what happened is that there were enough leftists to control the party, and therefore the non-leftists ended up backing them because that's all they had.   I'd rather have 45 conservatives and 10 RINOs in the Senate than just 45 conservatives.  Those RINO votes saved us on Garland, and on getting Trump's Supreme Court nominees confirmed.  Reagan had some RINO's, and he figured out how to work with them.

Now sure, I'd rather have 55 conservatives, but realistically, that's not an option because there are places that just won't elect them. Or sometimes you get conservative candidates who are so flawed they could not get elected even in jurisdictions that might otherwise elect a conservative.

The problem I have with Trump and Ramaswamy is that they're not even RINO's.  They're something...worse.

I'll agree with that. Somewhere (waaaaay down there) there's a balance that would work for me. I am drawing a hard line because the party is packed with RINOs, to include the moderates that hold the levers of power, to the point that there is no possible way to defend even moderately conservative ideas.

Go to any site measuring conservatives in congress, and draw a mean line at say 85% (I prefer above the 90% line), then go count how many actual members that is.

The number will tell you why I yam what I yam.  happy77

Give me something close to 60% Conservative butts in the seats and I will likely tone down.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 01:01:04 am by roamer_1 »

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Re: Vivek Ramaswamy claims Mike Pence missed an ‘opportunity for heroism'
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2023, 01:04:26 am »
I'll agree with that. Somewhere (waaaaay down there) there's a balance that would work for me. I am drawing a hard line because the party is packed with RINOs, to include the moderates that hold the levers of power, to the point that there is no possible way to defend even moderately conservative ideas.

Go to any site measuring conservatives in congress, and draw a mean line at say 85% (I prefer above the 90% line), then go count how many actual members that is.

The number will tell you why I yam what I yam.  happy77

Give me something close to 60% Conservative butts in the seats and I will likely tone down.

 :thumbsup: