Author Topic: DeSantis says Trump deploying ‘Democrat attacks’ on Social Security, Medicare  (Read 4902 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,874
TRUE, but then, a governorship is the vetted proving ground for presidents... So off the cuff, I would take that bet over a failed president anytime.


:thumbsup:

Offline bigheadfred

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,362
  • Gender: Male
  • One day Closer
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley

Offline bigheadfred

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,362
  • Gender: Male
  • One day Closer
And Trump started off with a GOP controlled Congress and still couldn’t get anything done.  So even on that count, DeSantis is probably better than Trump as a political leader.

Trump started off with an antagonistic GOPe controlled Congress.  Coalition building takes all parties to be involved. Trump never had that.
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley

Offline libertybele

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 55,982
  • Gender: Female
Trump started off with an antagonistic GOPe controlled Congress.  Coalition building takes all parties to be involved. Trump never had that.

Ah, but wasn't Trump supposedly the ultimate deal maker? He didn't use the best people and was unable to form that coalition; that is on him. He created divisiveness and still is.   The GOPe still is the majority.  That is why I will never vote for anyone other than a conservative -- the RINO's need to go.
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline LMAO

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14,609
  • Gender: Male
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Gender: Male
  • I'll make Mincemeat out of 'em"
Trump started off with an antagonistic GOPe controlled Congress.  Coalition building takes all parties to be involved. Trump never had that.

Trump personalizes every disagreement, and insults those who disagree with him on anything.  That alienated some RINOs who might otherwise have been persuadable.

That same approach of pissing off everyone who disagrees with him because he thinks insults are funny are likely why we lost a massive 41 seats in the midterms, and handed the House back to Nancy Pelosi.  He deliberately alienates anyone who isn't already a supporter.

You just can't do that if you want to be a successful politician The lefties are always going to vote for the left, conservatives are going to vote conservatives, so the key is getting as many people in the middle as you can.  A lot of those people are not voters on issues, but on things like personality and how "Presidential" someone seems.  Trump loses almost all those obtainable votes because of who he is and how he acts.

We've already seen that show in his first term.  I can't imagine how a second term, post-Jamuary 6 and post-lawsuit/conviction Trump would be any more appealing to independents than he was in his first term.

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 35,217
Trump started off with an antagonistic GOPe controlled Congress.

Trump started off married and deeply committed to the GOP Establishment.  That was his coalition.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,874
Trump started off with an antagonistic GOPe controlled Congress.  Coalition building takes all parties to be involved. Trump never had that.

Boo-hoo-hoo. 

Thank you for admitting that Trump was not a leader. 

That’s not the way it works; this isn’t some new agey “everyone has to consent” bullshit.  This is the age-old art of political leadership, in which an actual leader can figure out how to herd cats.

Trump was such a failure as a political leader that he couldn’t even corral the cats that were already on his side of the fence, let alone the other side.

Face facts:  Trump was a pretty decent businessman, but a complete failure at political leadership, which just goes to show that skill in business does NOT translate into skill in political leadership, so idolizing big business leaders is just another useless, self-defeating fetish. 

Offline Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,874
Trump personalizes every disagreement, and insults those who disagree with him on anything.  That alienated some RINOs who might otherwise have been persuadable.

That same approach of pissing off everyone who disagrees with him because he thinks insults are funny are likely why we lost a massive 41 seats in the midterms, and handed the House back to Nancy Pelosi.  He deliberately alienates anyone who isn't already a supporter.

You just can't do that if you want to be a successful politician The lefties are always going to vote for the left, conservatives are going to vote conservatives, so the key is getting as many people in the middle as you can.  A lot of those people are not voters on issues, but on things like personality and how "Presidential" someone seems.  Trump loses almost all those obtainable votes because of who he is and how he acts.

We've already seen that show in his first term.  I can't imagine how a second term, post-Jamuary 6 and post-lawsuit/conviction Trump would be any more appealing to independents than he was in his first term.


:thumbsup:

Offline roamer_1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 42,637
Boo-hoo-hoo. 

Thank you for admitting that Trump was not a leader. 

That’s not the way it works; this isn’t some new agey “everyone has to consent” bullshit.  This is the age-old art of political leadership, in which an actual leader can figure out how to herd cats.

Trump was such a failure as a political leader that he couldn’t even corral the cats that were already on his side of the fence, let alone the other side.

Face facts:  Trump was a pretty decent businessman, but a complete failure at political leadership, which just goes to show that skill in business does NOT translate into skill in political leadership, so idolizing big business leaders is just another useless, self-defeating fetish.

That's damn well right.

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 35,217
Boo-hoo-hoo. 

Thank you for admitting that Trump was not a leader. 

That’s not the way it works; this isn’t some new agey “everyone has to consent” bullshit.  This is the age-old art of political leadership, in which an actual leader can figure out how to herd cats.

Trump was such a failure as a political leader that he couldn’t even corral the cats that were already on his side of the fence, let alone the other side.

If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,220

That’s not the way it works; this isn’t some new agey “everyone has to consent” bullshit.  This is the age-old art of political leadership, in which an actual leader can figure out how to herd cats.

And look what all those decades of age-old political leadership have done to this country.  We're being crushed by the golden age of the Uniparty, and you're crying out, pleading for more from it.

I don't know if you refuse to believe the tectonic shift in the national political paradigm that took place in 2016, or if you simply don't understand it. The Uniparty certainly understands what happened, and why --- so do the DOJ, FBI, CIA; and they're all deadly serious about stopping it.   Why are you helping them?




« Last Edit: May 12, 2023, 06:29:22 am by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline kevindavis007

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,316
  • Gender: Male
And look what all those decades of age-old political leadership have done to this country.  We're being crushed by the golden age of the Uniparty, and you're crying out, pleading for more from it.

I don't know if you refuse to believe the tectonic shift in the national political paradigm that took place in 2016, or if you simply don't understand it. The Uniparty certainly understands what happened, and why --- so do the DOJ, FBI, CIA; and they're all deadly serious about stopping it.   Why are you helping them?




So let me get this straight... Trump was unable to do the stuff the first time around so let's give him another chance to fail. Sorry, but you can blame the so-called GOPe, Uniparty, or some other talk radio BS all you want. The fact is this Trump failed the first time around.  Reagan was able to get a lot of his agenda through and he had a Democrat control Congress to work with.


Yes, he didn't get all he wanted, but that is life. Sometimes you win some or lose some. But he knew that you go for the easy victories and then fight another day.
"If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business, and we hope that if anything happens to us it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life."

Gus Grissom

Offline Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,874



So let me get this straight... Trump was unable to do the stuff the first time around so let's give him another chance to fail. Sorry, but you can blame the so-called GOPe, Uniparty, or some other talk radio BS all you want. The fact is this Trump failed the first time around.  Reagan was able to get a lot of his agenda through and he had a Democrat control Congress to work with.


Yes, he didn't get all he wanted, but that is life. Sometimes you win some or lose some. But he knew that you go for the easy victories and then fight another day.

Exactly.  Why elect a proven loser for a second round of losing?

Offline kevindavis007

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,316
  • Gender: Male
Exactly.  Why elect a proven loser for a second round of losing?


Exactly... Also, I'm done with the so-called fights on social media. I want an American President to act Presidential. The Bull in the China shop routine is old and tiresome.
"If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business, and we hope that if anything happens to us it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life."

Gus Grissom

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Gender: Male
  • I'll make Mincemeat out of 'em"
And look what all those decades of age-old political leadership have done to this country.  We're being crushed by the golden age of the Uniparty, and you're crying out, pleading for more from it.

I don't know if you refuse to believe the tectonic shift in the national political paradigm that took place in 2016, or if you simply don't understand it. The Uniparty certainly understands what happened, and why --- so do the DOJ, FBI, CIA; and they're all deadly serious about stopping it.   Why are you helping them?

People have been hoodwinked successfully by charismatic politicians since the beginning of the Republic, convinced that this singular person -- and only that person -- can make all their dreams come true.

They never do.

Fortunately, they all have a shelf life that expires sooner or later.   That includes your modern-day Huey Long.

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,564
  • Gender: Male
  • I'll make Mincemeat out of 'em"

Exactly... Also, I'm done with the so-called fights on social media. I want an American President to act Presidential. The Bull in the China shop routine is old and tiresome.

Same here.  Ronald Reagan was a bomb-thrower before he became President, with all his lines about the evils of government etc.  And he was right about all of it.  But once elected, he successfully took that passion and turned it into real, durable action.  He built coalitions while sticking to his principles, and as a result was the most consequential President since FDR.  The problem with being just a Bull in the China shop is that once you've smashed everything, you're incapable of building anything better.

Trump identified a single issue in which the GOP had been out of step with the grass roots for decades, and that was immigration.  People rightly were pissed that nobody was listening to them, and that was the issue that got him the nomination.  The problem is that the same style that won him the nomination made him incapable of building legislative support, so all we got were stop gaps and emergency funding that wasn't even all used.  As a consequence, barely two years after he left office, we're now faced with the single biggest flood of illegal immigrants ever.  I honestly cannot fathom the logic behind why we should expect it to be any different if he were somehow to win a second term.  All his bombast, all his loud promises, would once again amount to nothing more than a fart in a high wind.   And the second he'd be out of office, it would all crumble once again.

We've already seen this movie once.  Seeing it a second time isn't going to change the ending.

Offline Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 57,874
Same here.  Ronald Reagan was a bomb-thrower before he became President, with all his lines about the evils of government etc.  And he was right about all of it.  But once elected, he successfully took that passion and turned it into real, durable action.  He built coalitions while sticking to his principles, and as a result was the most consequential President since FDR.  The problem with being just a Bull in the China shop is that once you've smashed everything, you're incapable of building anything better.

Trump identified a single issue in which the GOP had been out of step with the grass roots for decades, and that was immigration.  People rightly were pissed that nobody was listening to them, and that was the issue that got him the nomination.  The problem is that the same style that won him the nomination made him incapable of building legislative support, so all we got were stop gaps and emergency funding that wasn't even all used.  As a consequence, barely two years after he left office, we're now faced with the single biggest flood of illegal immigrants ever.  I honestly cannot fathom the logic behind why we should expect it to be any different if he were somehow to win a second term.  All his bombast, all his loud promises, would once again amount to nothing more than a fart in a high wind.   And the second he'd be out of office, it would all crumble once again.

We've already seen this movie once.  Seeing it a second time isn't going to change the ending.

:thumbsup:

Offline kevindavis007

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,316
  • Gender: Male
Same here.  Ronald Reagan was a bomb-thrower before he became President, with all his lines about the evils of government etc.  And he was right about all of it.  But once elected, he successfully took that passion and turned it into real, durable action.  He built coalitions while sticking to his principles, and as a result was the most consequential President since FDR.  The problem with being just a Bull in the China shop is that once you've smashed everything, you're incapable of building anything better.

Trump identified a single issue in which the GOP had been out of step with the grass roots for decades, and that was immigration.  People rightly were pissed that nobody was listening to them, and that was the issue that got him the nomination.  The problem is that the same style that won him the nomination made him incapable of building legislative support, so all we got were stop gaps and emergency funding that wasn't even all used.  As a consequence, barely two years after he left office, we're now faced with the single biggest flood of illegal immigrants ever.  I honestly cannot fathom the logic behind why we should expect it to be any different if he were somehow to win a second term.  All his bombast, all his loud promises, would once again amount to nothing more than a fart in a high wind.   And the second he'd be out of office, it would all crumble once again.

We've already seen this movie once.  Seeing it a second time isn't going to change the ending.


Also, the founding fathers set up a wonderful system of governance.  To their fault, they didn't foresee us electing a reality game show host and some old fart who doesn't even know where he is.



 :amen:
"If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business, and we hope that if anything happens to us it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life."

Gus Grissom

Offline corbe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 37,894
   Tip O'Neill was full of pizz and vinegar upon Reagan's Election in 80.  8 years later they were best of Friends.
   That is how you Govern, successfully.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,220
So let me get this straight... Trump was unable to do the stuff the first time around so let's give him another chance to fail.

Not at all @kevindavis007   I'm of the opinion that Trump did so damn well inspite of forces from hell, bring him back!  We need him even more now.

Quote
Sorry, but you can blame the so-called GOPe, Uniparty, or some other talk radio BS all you want

The Uniparty and their weaponized DOJ, FBI, CIA are the enemy.  I don't know how talk radio got on your list, but it looks like you crossed some Marxist talking points.  You might want to check your notes.

Quote
Reagan was able to get a lot of his agenda through and he had a Democrat control Congress to work with

So, amnesty for illegals was Reagan's agenda?  How about increasing the national debt ---- was this keeping a campaign promise?  Come to think of it, just what "Reagan agenda" did he get through Congress and sign into law?  Enlighten me.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,220
   Tip O'Neill was full of pizz and vinegar upon Reagan's Election in 80.  8 years later they were best of Friends.
   That is how you Govern, successfully.

Sure ---- Tip was a happy man.  He brought a conservative icon straight to amnesty.  Some would call *this* leadership.  :laugh:

Offline kevindavis007

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,316
  • Gender: Male
Not at all @kevindavis007   I'm of the opinion that Trump did so damn well inspite of forces from hell, bring him back!  We need him even more now.

The Uniparty and their weaponized DOJ, FBI, CIA are the enemy.  I don't know how talk radio got on your list, but it looks like you crossed some Marxist talking points.  You might want to check your notes.

So, amnesty for illegals was Reagan's agenda?  How about increasing the national debt ---- was this keeping a campaign promise?  Come to think of it, just what "Reagan agenda" did he get through Congress and sign into law?  Enlighten me.




Again spare me with Talk Radio BS! The only thing that held Trump back was Trump! Not Deep State, not the GOPe, Not the Uniparty.  It was Trump!


Reagan wasn't perfect, but I may remind you something... HE HAD A MANDATE! HE WON REFLECTION!


Trump barely beat Hillary Clinton and lost legitimately, to Joe Frickin Biden!


Sorry, I want someone new and YOUNGER in 2024!



"If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business, and we hope that if anything happens to us it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life."

Gus Grissom

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 79,220

Again spare me with Talk Radio BS! The only thing that held Trump back was Trump! Not Deep State, not the GOPe, Not the Uniparty.  It was Trump!

I'll spare you nothing.  If this upsets you, scroll on by.

Quote
Reagan wasn't perfect, but I may remind you something... HE HAD A MANDATE! HE WON REFLECTION!

You still haven't defined Reagan's legacy.  It's appearing more likely that Reagan actually squandered  ( *bouche* ) his electoral victory.

Quote
Sorry, I want someone new and YOUNGER in 2024!

Sounds like someone needs a puppy.  :chien:

Offline bigheadfred

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,362
  • Gender: Male
  • One day Closer
A perspective.

Ronald Reagan (1981-1989)
President Reagan increased the debt by $1.86 trillion, or by 186%. Reagan's supply-side economics didn't grow the economy enough to offset the lost revenue from its tax cuts. Reagan also increased the defense budget by 35%.2

Donald Trump
At the end of fiscal year 2020, the debt was $26.9 trillion. Trump added $6.7 trillion to the debt between fiscal year 2017 and fiscal year 2020, a 33.1% increase, largely due to the effects of the coronavirus pandemic and 2020 recession.
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley