Trump's Achilles' heel? [COVID-19 Lockdown--15 Days to Flatten the Curve]

[Idiot]

Here's Trump's press conference where it all started:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWvbLKgpQlM

Wow....15 days that ended up being 2 years.  I remember staying at home for months...seeing people on tv disinfecting their groceries on the porch before letting them in the house...not having Thanksgiving or Christmas.  I did lose a handful of friends.  A good friend died and they had no funeral...That was a pretty crappy 2 years. 

[DB]

Note that he says he contacted the governors and organized the lockdown.

[libertybele]

Wow....15 days that ended up being 2 years.  I remember staying at home for months...seeing people on tv disinfecting their groceries on the porch before letting them in the house...not having Thanksgiving or Christmas.  I did lose a handful of friends.  A good friend died and they had no funeral...That was a pretty crappy 2 years.

Yes, Trump held many press conferences but remember he relied on information from the CDC, WHO, Fauci and Birx. They advised him on the "flattening the curve"  and when he began to question what was going on they shut him down and by that time those mentioned above had terrified the public into believing that we were all going to die if we didn't flatten the curve, etc., etc.  You know the rest.

Trump ultimately left the shutdowns up to the individual states. Perhaps one of the wisest directives he gave.

[massadvj]

I don't really blame Trump for the initial lockdowns.  No president could have resisted the CDC and MSM at that point. They would have led every program with "Trump killed another X-thousand people today...."  I said this in an article I wrote for American Thinker at the time.  It is amazing how well this article has stood the test of time, even if I say so myself.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/04/covid19_the_security_implications.html

[roamer_1]

States have their own health departments.  It’s they that have the responsibility and obligation to assess their own citizens public health risks. 

Ours is a federal government system, not one of a national government that states must answer to.

Except in the case of a State of Emergency, which we've been under for YEARS.

[libertybele]

Note that he says he contacted the governors and organized the lockdown.

Organized or mandated?? Big difference.

[DB]

Organized or mandated?? Big difference.

It opened the door. That's the big difference.

[libertybele]

It opened the door. That's the big difference.

Again, Trump ultimately left it up to the States to shutdown which was the correct thing to do. Yes he called the governors through conference calls and discussed the shutdown; it was still the governors' choice.  TX and FL I believe were the last states to shutdown and the first to open back up.  I know DeSantis took a lot of criticism for opening back up, and did it in phases but rather quickly.

Trump did not issue a mandate.

[libertybele]

I don't really blame Trump for the initial lockdowns.  No president could have resisted the CDC and MSM at that point. They would have led every program with "Trump killed another X-thousand people today...."  I said this in an article I wrote for American Thinker at the time.  It is amazing how well this article has stood the test of time, even if I say so myself.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/04/covid19_the_security_implications.html

 

[DCPatriot]

Well that didn't take long for such a warm welcome back!   

My computer crashed...am not going to converse per my cellphone...
Fingers too stumpy!

Lucky for you...lucky for a half-dozen other posers around here.

Finally...lucky for me!

 

[Bigun]

I don't really blame Trump for the initial lockdowns.  No president could have resisted the CDC and MSM at that point. They would have led every program with "Trump killed another X-thousand people today...."  I said this in an article I wrote for American Thinker at the time.  It is amazing how well this article has stood the test of time, even if I say so myself.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/04/covid19_the_security_implications.html

You were right then and are still right today @massadvj

[DB]

A good executive asks questions that require answers before taking action.

What are the goals? What is the cost of trying to meet these goals. Does one size fit all? How do we know we met the goals? How do we make course corrections based on what we learn along the way?

The first required assumption is that virtually everyone is going to get it - sooner or later. That you can't hide from it indefinitely. Based on that, the sooner healthy people get it and get immunity to it the better. They are no longer vectors for transmission and the sooner normalcy can return.

Regarding higher risk people, you do try to slow things down voluntarily in that group, enough that hospitals/health providers are not completely overrun. That way everyone gets treated as well as we know how to. That should have been a local decision based on local conditions and not one size fits all.

The federal government's mission should have been to facilitate resources directed where needed.

Trump did facilitate resources which was good, but not much else.

[libertybele]

A good executive asks questions that require answers before taking action.

What are the goals? What is the cost of trying to meet these goals. Does one size fit all? How do we know we met the goals? How do we make course corrections based on what we learn along the way?

The first required assumption is that virtually everyone is going to get it - sooner or later. That you can't hide from it indefinitely. Based on that, the sooner healthy people get it and get immunity to it the better. They are no longer vectors for transmission and the sooner normalcy can return.

Regarding higher risk people, you do try to slow things down voluntarily in that group, enough that hospitals/health providers are not completely overrun. That way everyone gets treated as well as we know how to. That should have been a local decision based on local conditions and not one size fits all.

The federal government's mission should have been to facilitate resources directed where needed.

Trump did facilitate resources which was good, but not much else.

No president in the history of our country has had to deal with a pandemic.  I applaud Trump for his actions and efforts and he saved lives.  Yes, the pandemic cost money and tanked the economy; that was the plan of Biden, China, Fauci, DEMS, the WHO, and the CDC to take Trump down and steal an election. You can rant and rave and try to blame Trump, but I will never place blame for the way he handled the pandemic at his feet. Never.  Trump did well for this country.

[DB]

So the argument is, no one in government is accountable.

The executive isn't responsible for the executive branch of government. They are just a figurehead. And if that's the case, why bother to fight for one.

Trump was going to get blamed for all the deaths one way or another - and did. My beef is he didn't lead, he followed. What's the point of an executive if they won't lead like one. Extraordinary times need extraordinary leaders. Some rise to the need, others don't.

[DB]

I don't really blame Trump for the initial lockdowns.  No president could have resisted the CDC and MSM at that point. They would have led every program with "Trump killed another X-thousand people today...."  I said this in an article I wrote for American Thinker at the time.  It is amazing how well this article has stood the test of time, even if I say so myself.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/04/covid19_the_security_implications.html

Well the fact of the matter is he got blamed for the deaths anyway. He didn't escape blame by following the bureaucrats taking the safe route.

The bottom line of this argument is no one in government is accountable. That the executive doesn't lead the executive branch. That these executive agencies have no superiors.

[libertybele]

Well the fact of the matter is he got blamed for the deaths anyway. He didn't escape blame by following the bureaucrats taking the safe route.

The bottom line of this argument is no one in government is accountable. That the executive doesn't lead the executive branch. That these executive agencies have no superiors.

Trump exuded extreme leadership.  He did not dictate to the states. He held numerous press conferences to inform the public as to what was going on.  He is NOT responsible for the lies of Fauci and Biden.  We are a free people and have rights under the Constitution. We are supposed to hold our politicians accountable through free and fair elections.  Of course Trump got blamed but that changes nothing. 

[Hoodat]

To: the Administrators of this forum

If you allow a complete piece of garbage troll like this "timber rattler" to post her/(maybe his)/(most likely 'it') neocon warmongering garbage here, then kindly delete my account.  Thanks for the opportunity to participate, but I can no longer be here in good conscience if a filthy piece of trash is given a forum for expression here.

@art.prout

Why not point out disagreement with what was said instead of going after the messenger?  This isn't the GroupthinkBriefingRoom.  If Groupthink is what you are looking for, you know where to find it.

Instead of launching personal attacks, why not instead engage in debate and critical thought.  If the poster really is 'garbage', then you should have no difficulty besting him.  The fact that you chose not to do so provides a hint that maybe his arguments are valid after all.

[Hoodat]

Wow....15 days that ended up being 2 years.  I remember staying at home for months...seeing people on tv disinfecting their groceries on the porch before letting them in the house...not having Thanksgiving or Christmas.

It was also two years of people being denied the right to treat Covid with long established and proven treatments.  The only thing our FDA/CDC/NIH Pfizer stock holders offered was to check yourself into a hospital and die.

[Hoodat]

The PRESIDENT has absolutely no control over ANY of those organizations!

BS.  The President is the Chief Executive Officer.  He can fire any unelected person he wants within the Executive Branch.  Sure, there may be a grievance or financial cost to it.  But he can definitely get rid of anyone.  (See:  Billy Dale - Clinton Travel Office)

[Hoodat]

States have their own health departments.  It’s they that have the responsibility and obligation to assess their own citizens public health risks. 

Ours is a federal government system, not one of a national government that states must answer to.

The blocking of anti-parasitics as a treatment for Covid occurred at the Federal level, not the State level.  The refusal of hospitals to admit non-vaccinated patients also occurred at the Federal level.

[Timber Rattler]

No president in the history of our country has had to deal with a pandemic. 

Uh, that's not entirely accurate...

"Woodrow Wilson Got the Flu in a Pandemic During the World War I Peace Talks"

https://www.history.com/news/woodrow-wilson-1918-pandemic-world-war-i

Past Pandemics

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/basics/past-pandemics.html

The Worst Outbreaks in U.S. History

https://www.healthline.com/health/worst-disease-outbreaks-history

[roamer_1]

It was also two years of people being denied the right to treat Covid with long established and proven treatments.  The only thing our FDA/CDC/NIH Pfizer stock holders offered was to check yourself into a hospital and die.

THAT is the raw truth.

[Idiot]

THAT is the raw truth.

Really?  In Texas I walked right into Tractor Supply and purchased Ivermectin.  My Dr. recommended it.

[roamer_1]

Really?  In Texas I walked right into Tractor Supply and purchased Ivermectin.  My Dr. recommended it.

Me too - less the doctor. Reduced to buying veterinary medicine (which was also shamed loudly) is not support of antivirals. That's called an end-run around the a**holes making it rare to find.

Because they outlawed it, which rubbed me wrong, and because I didn't listen, and because I found access, I don't know anyone who died from COVID. A flat none.

My liberal sister knows a dozen in her immediate circle, and dozens more beyond that.

ALL those people did not have to die. And everyone who made antivirals rare deserve everything the law can throw at em. Millions have died, and died horribly and alone, for no better reason than filthy lucre and political gain. Sonsabiches, every one. Including Tumpy. That cannot be forgiven or rewarded.

[roamer_1]

And that goes further after that... to the jab. My sister already knows three healthy people who died unexpectedly of heart trouble. Three friends who dropped dead.

I know none.

Them sonsabiches.