SOLDIERS STRUGGLE TO FIND THEIR WAY AS LAND NAV RETURNS TO BASIC LEADER COURSE

[rangerrebew]

SOLDIERS STRUGGLE TO FIND THEIR WAY AS LAND NAV RETURNS TO BASIC LEADER COURSE
October 13, 2022 ·Jenna Biter
 
WASHINGTON, DC — Since the Army put land navigation back into its mandatory curriculum for would-be sergeants, about half of the soldiers who have participated in a trial program have failed, a senior enlisted leader said on Tuesday, Oct. 11.

Command Sgt. Maj. Daniel Hendrex from the Army’s Training and Doctrine Command, or TRADOC, said the trial program has seen “on average, 40% to 60% failure rate on the basic skill set of land navigation.”

Hendrex discussed the return of land nav to the Basic Leader Course at the Sergeant Major of the Army’s Professional Development Forum at the Association of the US Army, or AUSA, annual meeting in Washington, DC.

Sgt. Maj. Jason Stadel, a spokesperson for TRADOC, told Coffee or Die Magazine that land nav was implemented in the Basic Leader Course at Fort Bliss, Texas; Fort Drum, New York; and Schofield Barracks, Hawaii. BLC is the Army-wide professional training school that teaches the basics of being a noncommissioned officer and is mandatory for all specialists or corporals expecting to be promoted to sergeant.

 https://www.coffeeordie.com/army-ncos-land-nav

[EdinVA]

To dependent on technology (GPS)... makes folks dumb instead of saving time...

[sneakypete]

WTF?????

WHO  was the idiot in charge that approved removing the land navigation course?

That is as basic to an infantry soldier as being able to disassemble and clean his weapon.

Was Miss Miley behind this?

[Smokin Joe]

WTF?????

WHO  was the idiot in charge that approved removing the land navigation course?

That is as basic to an infantry soldier as being able to disassemble and clean his weapon.

Was Miss Miley behind this?

Virtually everything has become GPS dependent (It's not just for missile submarines any more). Even surveyors and geologists in the field and hunters are relying on a widget rather than a map and compass. I'm glad they are getting back to basics in the military, at least, where batteries notoriously die fastest. low tech is less vulnerable when someone knows what they are doing, and at least is a great backup to the high tech stuff.

[sneakypete]

Virtually everything has become GPS dependent (It's not just for missile submarines any more). Even surveyors and geologists in the field and hunters are relying on a widget rather than a map and compass. I'm glad they are getting back to basics in the military, at least, where batteries notoriously die fastest. low tech is less vulnerable when someone knows what they are doing, and at least is a great backup to the high tech stuff.

@Smokin Joe

Not to mention that land navigation across country to attack a city,an outpost,enemy border,etc,etc,etc is one HELL of a lot simpler that trying to put a missile on a 20 square foot target from thousands of miles away.

If you  have a compas and some idea of where you are and where you need to go,you  can do it. Without the compass,you rely on the sun and the sun moves.

BTW,I learned how to use a compass in the Cub Scouts. I even had one on my watch band in VN. One of my bastard roommates in Virginia after I got out of the army stole my Seiko with the compass on it after I forgot and left it on the sink after taking a shower.

You just can NOT trust civilians,period.

[Hoodat]

I would hope that every naval officer is still taught how to use a sextant.

[Smokin Joe]

@Smokin Joe

Not to mention that land navigation across country to attack a city,an outpost,enemy border,etc,etc,etc is one HELL of a lot simpler that trying to put a missile on a 20 square foot target from thousands of miles away.

If you  have a compas and some idea of where you are and where you need to go,you  can do it. Without the compass,you rely on the sun and the sun moves.

The worst situation I was in was driving in from a rig in Wyoming in a ground blizzard. No compass. I got turned around a little, and the only real landmarks the whole 60 mile trip was a pipe stuck in the ground and an old uranium mill. Something told me I was going the wrong way (no sun visible, no shadows to go by), so I turned around and eventually made it to the nearest gas station (where I'd filled up on the way to the rig) with two gallons in the tank. Waaay too close for comfort.
I have kept a compass in my field gear ever since.

[sneakypete]

The worst situation I was in was driving in from a rig in Wyoming in a ground blizzard. No compass. I got turned around a little, and the only real landmarks the whole 60 mile trip was a pipe stuck in the ground and an old uranium mill. Something told me I was going the wrong way (no sun visible, no shadows to go by), so I turned around and eventually made it to the nearest gas station (where I'd filled up on the way to the rig) with two gallons in the tank. Waaay too close for comfort.
I have kept a compass in my field gear ever since.

@Smokin Joe

Been a couple of decades since I was in a Army Surplus Store,but I am guessing you can still buy a surplus Army lensatic compass for about 20 bucks or so.  Might be some of the best money you ever spent,if all you do with it is throw it in the glove box of your car.

[Smokin Joe]

@Smokin Joe

Been a couple of decades since I was in a Army Surplus Store,but I am guessing you can still buy a surplus Army lensatic compass for about 20 bucks or so.  Might be some of the best money you ever spent,if all you do with it is throw it in the glove box of your car.

I picked up a surplus Brunton years ago, and it travels with me.  But with my herd of vehicles, I should have one in every glove box. Three have the compass heading in the mirror thingy, and that has come in helpful a couple of times.

[GtHawk]

Maybe they can invite some Boy Scouts onto the bases to give classes in  Orienteering, heck maybe they could even award merit badges to those who successfully complete the course.

[sneakypete]

Maybe they can invite some Boy Scouts onto the bases to give classes in  Orienteering, heck maybe they could even award merit badges to those who successfully complete the course.

@GtHawk

How freaking embarrassing would THAT be?

I flat LOVE it!

[roamer_1]

To dependent on technology (GPS)... makes folks dumb instead of saving time...

That's right...

[roamer_1]

I picked up a surplus Brunton years ago, and it travels with me.  But with my herd of vehicles, I should have one in every glove box. Three have the compass heading in the mirror thingy, and that has come in helpful a couple of times.

I keep a good compass in my go-bag. Not that it does any good here. Everything here is landmark. Guardrails and backstops.

[Bigun]

I keep a good compass in my go-bag. Not that it does any good here. Everything here is landmark. Guardrails and backstops.

I have several good compasses and know how to use them but freely admit to preferring GPS.

[roamer_1]

I have several good compasses and know how to use them but freely admit to preferring GPS.

compasses don't work here, and neither does GPS, not reliably.

[Bigun]

compasses don't work here, and neither does GPS, not reliably.

I can understand problems with a compass in some places but the GPS not working baffles me.

[roamer_1]

I can understand problems with a compass in some places but the GPS not working baffles me.

It don't work well in deep forest or heavy cloud and snow. Also you are usually working a drainage to travel, and if you are hard up against a side, particularly against the south (I think), the mountain is in the way.

Some of them receive intermittently and go by reckoning somehow in between... which is some better, but can still be off.

I dunno. I don't have one. But I have been with when they've failed. And the dumb Luddite redneck who thought to bring a map got it done.

[roamer_1]

Oh, and anything electronic below -10, you're taking your chances. - 20, forget about it.