Classic Rock Discussion thread, including Catfish's Top 20 Lists.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Bonus Classic Rock Album of the Day- Journey- Infinity (1978)

A few reviews ago, we had a discussion about how one member of a group can hijack a band into oblivion.  Yeah, that ass hole was Dennis DeYoung of Styx.  This band is another example, but hilariously the band in this case got the last laugh.   That band is Journey.  Journey, was a good hard rocking band that had 3 so so albums that barely charted from '75-'77.  They had a shredder in the name of Neil Schon, who had great tutorledge under the eye of Carlos Santana.  These three albums had some good content, but was just missing that slight edge.....   A distinctive voice, and a more public friendly songwriting angle.  Enter 1978-  Steve Perry.

Perry with his high voice, gave the band their big break.  Infinity became Journey's most successful and best seller to that point.  At from my POV, this and the following album - Evolution, are near great. 

With these two albums, Journey hit the sweet spot of a rocking edge, Perry's voice, and some apparently solid songrwriting chops.  Several really good tunes on this album.  But then the disaster:

Steve Perry wrestled artistic control of the group, and made them a rocking pop band for the following wildy successful 4 albums.  Sadly, with that success Journey became more of a band beloved by teenaged girls than their  prior customer base.  By the time Perry left the band in '86, I despised what he had done to the product and to the band itself.  What made it worse, was the level of finger pointing that took place after the band disbanded.  Perry laughingly blamed his bandmates, when everyone on earth knew who the culprit was. 

Funny point, and what makes the story different from Styx, is that Journey basically found a clone who sounded more like Perry than Perry himself.  Nothing like getting the last laugh, revenge, and the band did have a couple of top 10 charting LP's afterward.   Good for them.

But on to Infinity.  I could have picked this or Evolution as the creme of that era of the golden age of Journey.  Both are very good.

Side 1-

Lights-  The world is introducted to Steve Perry with this light hearted rocker that is well hooked, and a solid harmony line, and Schon soloing.  3

Feeling that Way / Anytime-  On this album this is two songs, but it SHOULD NEVER be played separately.  They are like a neopolitan ice creme.  You just don't separate the three out of respect.  Starts as a semi-crooning Perry/Rolle duo, that mediun pleasant rocker that abruptly blends and shreds into Anytime, which in the Journey catalog is their expedtion into bad ass Chaos.   The melodic cruch of all the instruments at the end of this one is epic, and my favorite moment in the entire Journey collection.  1

La do da- A rocker in the old tradition of Journey that I guess Perry didn't get his grubby hands on.  He sings it, but as in the nonsensical lyrical aspects of the song.  This is more a song about flexing the axes than the song's meaning.  Machine Gun sounds and Schon blaring his stuff, make this a top notch addtion to the LP.  4

Patiently-  Geez, first taste of crappy Perry crooning-  Sadly, this shit would be what Journey would be about in 3 years.  9

Side 2-
------------

Wheel in the Sky-  Another highy played and memorable number from this excellent in the album.   Not only a staple on Classic Rock radio, but powerhouse of where Perry's voice actually worked and augmented well in the band's repitoire.  If they had stayed this course, just think how well this band would have kept its legacy, and not sold out- 2

Something to Hide-  Lesser fare and more Perry's influence that at least gets some Schon guitar work by mid to late song.  Not a memorable one in the grand scheme of Journey's list of tunes. 6

Winds of March-  Ditto, minus the Gibson tool. 7

Can Do- Just when you were about to give up, the bandmates come to the rescue, and  come back with a number that harkens back to some what Journey was doing in 1975. 5

Opened the Door-  More like closed it with a thud. More inane Perry slush.  I estimate Perry contributed about 40% of the content.  Too bad he just didn't sing, and had shut up about the balladry.   8


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGVsggMhoT0

I like Journey now more than I did in the 80's -- probably because they're at least closer to the kind of music I really like than is most of the stuff being produced today.  Not enough to go see them, but enough to prefer them to other radio schlock.  That doesn't apply to the heavy schlock like "Faithfully", though.  Still can't stand that stuff.

Completely agree with you on this album, and on Journey's trajectory.  I did always like Separate Ways, which to me would have fit stylistically on this album quite well.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Classic Rock Album of the Day- Nirvana- Nevermind (1991)

Part of this process, I have pretty much stuck with albums that I have loved, or at least really liked.  Now, in the interest of keeping integrity with that process, I have to diverge to the flip side a tiny bit.  But first, a little history of evolution of Rock and Roll, which has been a lot of its charm as it has morphed generationally.  Of course some of these trends overlapped genre wise, but this is a semi-chronological 20th century approximate run down of its metamorphous

1956- Pre-history- Elvis, Buddy Holly, Chuck Berry, Jerry Lee Lewis
1964- Beatlemania
1967- Sgt. Peppers- Psychodelia
1968- Hendrix revolutionizes how guitar into fuzz and feedback are incorporated into rock music.
1968- Hard Rock, Blues Infused- Yardbirds, Clapton, Led Zeppelin
1969- Singer- Songwriter bastardization from post Byrds area- Van Morrison, Neil Young, Jackson Browne, C, S, & N
1970- Black Sabbath creates Heavy Metal, soon incuding Deep Purple, and Judas Priest
1970- Progressive Rock- King Crimson, Yes, ELP, and Pink Floyd
1972- Shock, Glam- Alice Cooper, Bowie, Stooges, and soon afterwards- Kiss
1975- Punk- Ramones, Sex Pistols, and soon afterwards Clash
1976- AOR domination- Van Halen, Boston, Styx, others.
1979- New Wave- Cars, Police, Talking Heads
1982- The decline starts- Alternative, and somehwat directionless.  Rap, Pop, and Dance start easing rock right off the charts. .  Many other bands from prior eras continue, but it all seems almost in nostalgia.
1990- Grunge - Bands like Nirvanna, Pearl Jam, Alice In Chains
1996- Era of the Alpha Numeric Rock Bands- Blink 182, Sum 41, 3 Doors Down, Matchbox 20, and a host of others.

I know you might think I am going through some unnecessary detail to history that  is not needed, but the point I am bringing up, and sorry if sounds disrespectful, is that  the time frame  I've bolded, who I call the Nickleback Gen.s  almost killed Rock and Roll.  Grunge as a genre, was about the most useless, pointless, uninspired, and unimagniative stuff every made in rock and roll.  To me this was alll almost jokingly contrived by M-TV punking the music world.  I know there are going to be many Gen X's out there wanting to flame me, but.....   I challenge you to provide a rebuttal of how this musical genre has really added anything to the equation.

Band of course centers around he tortured and enigmantic Kurt Cobain, who sadly ended his life a few years into his band's success.  Most entire album is a mindless  numbing buzz punk repititon fest.   They make Cobain sound like a poet laureate, but I am sorry.....   many of us had better poetry in High School.   And IMO, their latter drummer Dave Grohl, actually had better music with his band later on with the Foo Fighters. 

Case in point, and hating to sound petty, but if this band and this album is considered your Sargent Pepper's moment.  Help us. 

Here goes.....I'll try to keep it as positive as I can.......

Track-
------------

Smells Like Teen Spirit-  Mentioned earlier-  Pivotal Band, Pivotal Album, and now pivotal song of an entire generation-  Hooky song, with a screaming Cobain, and one repetitive riff.  Let me put it this way.  Wierd Al Yankovic has parodied 100's of songs famously, but I always considered this one that he most most disrespectfully copied.  Rightfully so.  Still one of the best of this over-rated, over hyped so called classic. 2

In Bloom- In the 1990's seems every other rock song sounded exactly like this. I am hoping and guessing that Cobain sang off-key on purpose?  And Cobain the philopsher?     7

Come as You Are- The fact this was the 2nd highest charting song on this CD, is really head scratching. Maybe less offensive than others, but......  Crap, I have to sit through nine more these don't I?  3

Breed- Please Don't. 8

Lithium- Actually one of the only  decent cuts, I do like how the band works the buzz punk pretty effectively into an innovative way.  Still not great, and numbingly repeititve.  1

Polly- More nonsensical shit from Cobain- I feel sorry for the 50,000 garage bands that didn't make it.  This is proof.  11

Territorial Pissings- '60's diss?  No....More like Punk Blather of no redeeming musical quality.  They sound  like a shitty Sex Pistols cover band on this one. When I think of Territorial Pissings I think of dogs pissing on trees, marking it theirs.  Pretty apt analogy to this crap.   10

Drain You- The bright side, is I only have to listen to 4 more. To me this is an album of half filler, and half noise. 7

Lounge Act- I'll say and share the obvious.  This is about as far as Nirvanna should have reached as far as success.  I sure wish I could write somethig about a decent song. At least something, this is almost torture. 6

Stay Away- Showed some decent punk chops at first, and then Cobain opened his mouth.  I don't think I have ever heard an album that every song was sang so out of tune.  I know that might be his schtick, but its damned annoying to me. Meh thinks maybe Nirvanna should have been an instrumental punk band. 5

On a Plain- Even though the tiring repetitive phrasing is driving me crazy, this one is one of the lesser offensive tunes of this wretched classic. Some decent melodic workings- 4

Something in the Way-  . 12



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHfriOyeWN0

Don't like most of this album.  However....

My brother and I are both classic/progressive rock guys, and I can remember hanging out at his house during my Thanksgiving break from law school in 1991.  It was after midnight, and MTV had been on in the background and neither of us had really noticed it because it was all hair bands and pop crap.  Then "Smells Like Teen Spirit" came on, and we both just stared at it.  I remember one or the other of us saying something like "wow", and the other agreeing.  Yes, it's overplayed and all that, but there was something about it that was a great antidote to the increasingly poppy sound of the 80's hair bands.  I don't really know how to analyze the quality of that song, but I can say it is one of the very few songs where I remember exactly where and when I was when I first heard it.

That being said, I generally detest grunge as being just boring and self-indulgent as hell.  Songs like "Plush" by Stone Temple Pilots make me want to jam pencils in my ears.   So maybe one reasons I like Smells Like Teen Spirit is the exact reason so many grunge fans don't like it.

[catfish1957]

I like Journey now more than I did in the 80's -- probably because they're at least closer to the kind of music I really like than is most of the stuff being produced today.  Not enough to go see them, but enough to prefer them to other radio schlock.  That doesn't apply to the heavy schlock like "Faithfully", though.  Still can't stand that stuff.

Completely agree with you on this album, and on Journey's trajectory.  I did always like Separate Ways, which to me would have fit stylistically on this album quite well.

Did see Journey in 1982 in the Astrodome, and they were very sloppy.  Voltage and spotlights were amped up on Perry, Schon's solos were subdued, and whole performance pretty much a disappointment.  Hagar and Santana were actually more enjoyable listens.

Seeing Perry wrestle artistic control of the band was like Styx.  A slow moving train wreck. No doubt he prefered the pop star persona.  Because.....   If the band had made albums like this one and Evolution, their legacy as a "rock band" would have been considerably better.

I have noticed, like you, that Journey among other bands are doing what I call the Casino Circuit.  So far, I have resisted going to any of these, because I am afraid they are going to be sad nostalgic types of gigs.   I prefer to remember them when they were really rocking, and at their prime. 

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Classic Rock Album of the Day-  The Moody Blues- Days of Future Passed - (1967)

We've had great discussions about the early days of Prog, and including trying to dissect when and where it was born.  About a half dozen examples could be thrown out there.   This is my actual pick.  The Moody Blues Days of Future Passed was released in November 1967- less than 6 months after Sgt. Peppers.  I might get into blaspheme territory, but in several ways The Moody Blues were better than the Beatles.  Especially in musicianship.  They in true prog fashion had compostions that were more lush, more complex, and intricate too.  But of course, the Moody's did not have that cultural entrenchment and absolute ability of ultra-masterful songwriting.  And for that the Beatles were the iconic, among the iconic.

I know I had previously reviewed 7th Sojourn. From a standard album oriented rock perspective, it has a better form for listening,  and traditonal structure.  OTOH,  Days of Future Passed is a better listen for me.  But it isn't everyone's kind of album.  Those of us with symphonic background might have a bit  more appreciation of the work.  Those who don't like that kind of sound, are probably going to be turned off by 30% of this record's content.  But make no mistake, this band was among the most innovative in the 1960's.  Want to know the guy who first  used synthesizers? , via a modified Mellortron?  That'd be Michael Pinder of this band.  And voice...  You'd be hard pressed to find anyone better than Justin Hayward and his full lush and expansive voice on this one, and subsequent works. 

What also makes this such a compelling listen, is how this band meshes so many '60's styles and orchestrations into a beautiful mosaic that also makes it not only one of the first prog albums, but also one of the first concept albums.  They out played the Beatles, They out psychedelic-ed the Beatles, and in a few cuts even out rocked the Stones.   How and why this band was so sadly forgotten and overlooked for their contributions, is a crime.   Don't believe me?  Give this one a listen, and don't lose site that this is 1967.  And the fact that IMO their greatest works...   This one and 7th Sojourn function as creative bookends of who are among the greatest pioneers of prog.

Fun Fact:  This was among the last standard rock albums available in Mono, and I understand those are to collectors, quite valuable.

Side 1-
---------

The Day Begins- (The Day Begins)-  Excellent orchestral performance by the London Festival Orchestra, with a poetic closing by Pinder, and his great speaking voice.  If you bought this album in 1967, you'd thought you'd first be thinking you secured a classical album.  I like it. 8

Dawn: Dawn is a Feeling-  By now, you are even wondering if this is even a rock album.  Dawn is a pleasant and talented effort by the band to lull the listener to think they've gone from classical  to contempary. Don't worry, its getting to ready to get fun....... 9

The Morning:  Another Morning-  The Song has a soft light feel early in, with a signature '60's style and feel.  But with the harmonies infused, and so emcompasive interludes between the light sets of stanzas ?  You know these guys are toying with their styles to immerse the listener into their world of innovation. 7

Lunch Break:  Peak Hour-  Really bizarre and beauftiful.   The band and its accompanyiing start a contempary almost Gerschwin sounding work, and then half way through the tune.....   BANG.....   Rock and Roll.  Like a sledgehammer.   In Rolling Stones '60's fashion ----  PEAK HOUR!!!!  Melletron behind the scene steals the show.  Great Hayward-Lodge soloing at the end too.  5

Side 2-
--------------------

The Afternoon: Forever Afternoon (Tuesday?) / Time To Get Away-  Mainstay on the Moody's play list.  Beautiful Hayward singing, and concert hall filling instrumentals make this a classic. Songs like this one and others, make this a great relaxation album if in the mood.  No one rocks out 100% of the time.  6

The second movement of this work, Time to Get Away-  Tuesday afternoon morphs into this masterpiece of songwriitng prowess.  Pinder's mellotron work on this is ground breaking.  What fascinates me, at least from my perspective is how the listener was lulled into the album by orchestratizations, and hypnotized into a gradually building prog masterpiece.  Did I mention Pinder's mellotron work?  I know I did, but hearing this in its essence in 1967, continues to  amaze me.  There are things I heard this round, that I hadn't noticed in the past.  Great works will do that.  3

Evening: The Sunset:Twilight Time-  More nice orchestrations, and Ray Thomas flute work highlight.  Mysterious tempo , and percussion, just throw the listeners into showing how that band has that level of versatility rarely seen in rock.  Especially in damned 1967. 2

Twilight Time, the second movement of this track, is my favorite moment on the album.  This is the few moments of the album, that allows the band to let all hell break loose.  Please listen to how the band phases and intertwines their harmonies into a tsunami of sound.  In many ways this is one of the Moody's finest moments, and for some reason they didn't replicate what has that hard sinister, but lush beautiful sound- 1

The Night: Nights in White Satin-  The hit on the LP.  And deserves those accolades. If you have any background in listenng to rock music, you will easily recognize it.  It put them on the map, and the song that introduced the world to the mellotron. Spooky...., especially with the poetic ending and punctuatated by Pinder.  Sadly the listening audience weren't provided that treat, and it accenuated the true prog and concept aspects of "A Day" 4



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZCzH8q1hcY

Great album - I saw them once and they were -- happily -- a bit heavier than they were in the studio.   Although I do remember them having a second drummer despite having some of the least percussive music in rock.  But while Graeme Edge was just kind of going through the motions at that point (and you could argue he was always just going through the motions...), Lodge and Hayward were still very good.   I've always kind of wondered what the Moodies might have done with a better drummer.

Anyway, love this album.

[catfish1957]

Don't like most of this album.  However....

My brother and I are both classic/progressive rock guys, and I can remember hanging out at his house during my Thanksgiving break from law school in 1991.  It was after midnight, and MTV had been on in the background and neither of us had really noticed it because it was all hair bands and pop crap.  Then "Smells Like Teen Spirit" came on, and we both just stared at it.  I remember one or the other of us saying something like "wow", and the other agreeing.  Yes, it's overplayed and all that, but there was something about it that was a great antidote to the increasingly poppy sound of the 80's hair bands.  I don't really know how to analyze the quality of that song, but I can say it is one of the very few songs where I remember exactly where and when I was when I first heard it.

That being said, I generally detest grunge as being just boring and self-indulgent as hell.  Songs like "Plush" by Stone Temple Pilots make me want to jam pencils in my ears.   So maybe one reasons I like Smells Like Teen Spirit is the exact reason so many grunge fans don't like it.

You hit the nail on the head, as Nirvanna was a groundbreaking departure.  And I am 100% agreement around the '80's hair band era.  I generally don't even acknowldege that it as an valid aspect of rock and roll history.  Too me, these particpants were parody jokes of great bands like Zeppelin and Purple.   That is the reasoning you'll never hear me mention the likes of Poison, Motley Crue, Quiet Riot, etc.

That is why I think that drastic departure is why Nirvanna was so impactful.  Joke was over.   

[catfish1957]

Great album - I saw them once and they were -- happily -- a bit heavier than they were in the studio.   Although I do remember them having a second drummer despite having some of the least percussive music in rock.  But while Graeme Edge was just kind of going through the motions at that point (and you could argue he was always just going through the motions...), Lodge and Hayward were still very good.   I've always kind of wondered what the Moodies might have done with a better drummer.

Anyway, love this album.

I am pretty damned jealous that you got to see the Moody Blues.   How was Hayward's latter era voice?  I know we had previous discussions of how great Lake's was.   IMO...Justin Hayward was up in that echelon too.   Not sure you've seen this pre-historic music video.  Though it is a Ray Thomas centered tune, it is just so indicative of the era, and bonus points for the guys appearing to be trippin'.   The lushness of the combo of mello and harmonies makes this one seductively mesmerizing song.  Early prog, at it's best.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_TbovyVOzs

[catfish1957]

But while Graeme Edge was just kind of going through the motions at that point (and you could argue he was always just going through the motions...), Lodge and Hayward were still very good.   I've always kind of wondered what the Moodies might have done with a better drummer.

Thought you might get a kick out what I'd call a "fun fact".  Edge actually had a couple of Moody's spin off albums.  And I acually have the first one (got it a bargain bin in the late '70's), sillily called "Kick Off Your Muddy Boots".  Yeah, its musical value was pretty much limited to being a frisbee.    

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Major's Prog Album of the, er, fortnight:  "Trespass", Genesis, 1970

Though this wasn't Genesis' first album (From Genesis to Revelation was), it was their first album where they put their feet squarely into progressive rock, and at the ripe old ages of 19-20 years old at that.  I started with this one because I think it is interesting to see where it falls in sort of the Great Progressive Timeline.  It came after In the Court of the Crimson King, but before anything by ELP, and before Yes' second album, Time and a Word, so it was before Yes really hit its own stride with The Yes Album.  So what they were doing here was comparatively new, and that's usually a fun listen.

The most influential member of the band at this point was guitarist Anthony Phillips, who was seen by the rest of the band as the most technically proficient and professional member of the group.  He ended up leaving the band after this album because of debilitating stage fright, but to this day is viewed by very favorably by the core members of Genesis who still talk about his influence in their interviews.  He was a big fan of the 12 string guitar, and that interplay with keyboardist Tony Banks arguably is the defining "Genesis sound".  Apart from vocalist/flautist Peter Gabriel and bassist (and occasional 12-stringer himself) Mike Rutherford, the other member of the band was drummer John Mayhew.  While older than the other members of the band, they considered him an inadequate drummer who basically had to be told what to play, and he was replaced after this album.  His drumming here is...uninspired.

So, on to the album.  The overall sound quality is not great, and there is a sparseness/hollowness to some of the songs that they hadn't quite figured out how to fill.  There are only 6 songs on the album, so that was a lot of space to fill.  Their reach exceeded their grasp at this point, so to speak.  But substituting space for intricacy isn't always a bad choice, and this is one I still listen to regularly. Still, a remarkably innovative album for a bunch of kids who were so young.  Gabriel's Genesis-era vocals are polarizing.  He's got that incredibly interesting aged quality to his very thick tenor sound, but especially on some of the later albums, has some voice characterizations/histrionics that can be overblown.  That is less of an issue on this album where is vocals tend to be more restrained, so it one of my favorite classic Genesis albums when it comes to his vocals.

Side 1:

Looking for Someone - This one was written when none of the core members had even hit 20 - Phillips was only 18.  This opens with Gabriel singing acapella for a few bars, which is a nicely unusual way to kick off an album, then some dramatic piano and keyboard bits working with Phillips on guitar. You can hear the ambition in what they were trying to do, and they partially  pull it off.  4

White Mountain - This is a somewhat silly sing about one wolf stealing the sceptre and crown of the king wolf, and their eventual battle for leadership of the pack.  A silly as it is, Phillips 12 string work is still really impressive, and give more musical depth to this song that it might otherwise have had.  As on most of this album, Mayhew just keeps inserting these rolling drum fills, likely because he doesn't know what else to do.  6

Visions of Angels - This one starts off with a nice piano intro by Banks, and moves into basically an end of the world ballad with a lot of dramatic keyboard work.  Pretty good.  3

Side 2

Stagnation -  This is a long piece, and really is the closest thing to the classic Genesis sound of interweaving guitars and keyboards that would be heard on their later albums.   It opens with a gently romantic and somewhat stagnant piece driven by Phillips 12-string, light keyboards, and Gabriel's restrained vocals, then moves into a quiet duet between Phillips and Banks.  Then around the 3 minute mark, it takes off into a more intricate, aggressive jam, which alternates with some vocal cuts before ramping up again.  This song rises above the rest of the album, and when the band went looking for a new drummer and guitarist after this album, this is the song they identified in their ad as the direction in which they wanted to go.   While they later rolled their own eyes at a lot of this album, this is one song of which they are still very proud. 1

Dusk - A low key, gentle ballad with some nice instrument work, including Gabriel's flute. 5  Maybe should have flipped this rating with Looking for Someone.

The Knife - This takes the theme of "Won't Get Fooled Again" and transposes it to a more openly violent form.  Heaviest song on the album, and was the centerpiece of their early concerts, where it would be extended and amped up.  Opens with an insistent Hammond organ hammering a riff, then distorted guitar kicks in with a martial drumbeat.  Gabriel kicks in with the lines "Tell me my life is about to begin, tell me that I'm a hero.  Promise me all of your violent dreams, light up your bodies with anger", to set the mood.  Some gunshots enter the mix at one point, along with the repeated line "Some of you are going to die, martyrs of course for the freedom that I will provide."  A bit simplistic, and could really have used a better drummer, but you can see how the heaviness of this song could have resonated in concert.  Again, impressive for a bunch of kids.  2

Click on full link below the video to jump to full album


https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLQjOqzYfC3P0yfaXfoiueYHvK8Obbc8jd

[Maj. Bill Martin]

I am pretty damned jealous that you got to see the Moody Blues.   How was Hayward's latter era voice?  I know we had previous discussions of how great Lake's was.   IMO...Justin Hayward was up in that echelon too.   Not sure you've seen this pre-historic music video.  Though it is a Ray Thomas centered tune, it is just so indicative of the era, and bonus points for the guys appearing to be trippin'.   The lushness of the combo of mello and harmonies makes this one seductively mesmerizing song.  Early prog, at it's best.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_TbovyVOzs

It was probably maybe 12-14 years ago or so, but Hayward's voice was still very good.   And you're right about Moodies using the Mellotron with their harmonies.  I don't think anyone else really did that --  Ian McDonald did some backing vocals for Lake with King Crimson, but they weren't really harmonizing the way Hayward and Lodge did. 

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Thought you might get a kick out what I'd call a "fun fact".  Edge actually had a couple of Moody's spin off albums.  And I acually have the first one (got it a bargain bin in the late '70's), sillily called "Kick Off Your Muddy Boots".  Yeah, its musical value was pretty much limited to being a frisbee.   

A Frisbee has more edge to it than did...Edge.  His incredibly bland drumming never really pushed the rest of the band, and I think they could have jumped up a level if they'd have been more able to up the aggression on occasion.

[catfish1957]

Major's Prog Album of the, er, fortnight:  "Trespass", Genesis, 1970

Really enjoyed this review Major.  I will first have to be candidly honest...  I didn't know this album existed.  I really didn't get introduced to this apsect of music and band until about the "Selling England by the Pound" timeframe" timeframe.  I had an anglo-phile pioneer prog friend who frequented the complation of King Crimson, Tull, PF, Gentle Giant, etc.   

But by now, this was into about the '74ish time.  And me?  I though was really enjoying the more mainstream fare of ELP and Yes, was not listening as much to Genesis.  But before digressing more, I did enjoy hearing how the early aspects of this band sounded, and I especially was fascinated by how the early dynamics between Gabriel and Banks were working.  No offense to Hackett, Collins, and Rutherford, but these guys were the heart, soul, and brains of the group.

I especially liked "The Knife"....  it seemed to have that aura and feel of what made Genesis great and harkens forward with the seeds of inspiration of future band topical type of fare.  Especially in the spectauclar stage presence and performance that hallmarked the band later.   

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Glad you liked it.  It does get overlooked a lot because they really didn't hit a more popular stride until Foxtrot/Selling Englang.  I suppose I'll just do some of the other albums at some point because I think they have a really interesting history, and not quite the one most casual fans think where it all becomes pre/post Gabriel.  I do think some of the stuff they were trying to do at that age is pretty remarkable.  You just don't see 18 year olds writing stuff for 12 string and piano in a rock context, so I have enormous respect for their ambition even if it didn't always result in the greatest product.  Gabriel's vocals get to be a bit much on some of their stuff, and can intrude on some damn musicianship.  Weird that he actually became must less of a "prog" guy after leaving Genesis.

[catfish1957]

Weird that he actually became must less of a "prog" guy after leaving Genesis.

To most music listeners he's the guy who did "Sledgehammer", which is about as non-prog as you can get.

Which is a tribute  to his the acutal versatile nature of his songwriting.

[catfish1957]

Classic Rock Album of the Day- Dire Straits- Making Movies- 1980 ****

Was introduced to this album by USA Network Nightflight as kind of a pre-MTV episode, as a trio of semi-themed suite of videos.  Not only were those prehistoric videos done beautifully and artfully,  Knopler shot the wad with all the marbles with Side 1.  I can honestly say that they aren't many albums out there that are this that good and lopsided in that manner in one side.  There are some damned good tunes on Side 2 also, but not at the same level of greatness of the Movie-trio

Mark Knopler made great albums prior and after this LP, but at least in my eyes this album, and particularly Side 1 is an absolute masterpiece of beautifully entrenched smooth flowing blues guitar and a voice that fits the music in a glove like manner.  When listening to this album, at least from my POV, I almost have to listen to all three to get the level of enjoymnet and understanding of how fine this work is, and how great a job Knopler did.  If you do enjoy Dire Straits, I recommend as a companion the next album in sequence, "Love Over Gold."  Same great feel and talent, just a different tone and artistic sense of flow of the LP.

Also, for the sake of the listening experience,  I am including the full album, and the Movie suite in order.  That will give you the full experience as the band intended.  They are art, by themselves.

Fun Fact:  If some of the studio sound has a familar feel, understand that the infamous Jimmy Iovine produced this album. Many huge  bands in the day employed him in the day, and used him many times, like Petty, Springsteen, and Nicks.  Iovine is also well known for being the producer of wildly successful music soundtrack "The Breakfast Club"

Side 1-
------------

Tunnel of Love- Carnival feeling opening gives rise to some sharp Knopler licks. If the song sounds familar to some, it did appear in the movie Officer and a Gentleman,  but not sure how or why that is there except from maybe some randomness.  Great songwriting, and some imaginative imagery around the hazards of the affairs of the heart. 3

Romeo and Juliet-  Doing this on Valentine's Day is pretty timely doing this reivew.  More on the topic of Love.  Knopler slows down a few RPM, and slow rolls a beautiful soulful ballad that includes some absolutely fantastic smooth Neo-classical feeling guitar. Ingenious lyricism that almost takes a sarcastic metaphorical look at modern love, not withstanding with a Shakespearen  slant. Waiing guitar at the end?  Wow.....   he is an artist. 2

Skateaway-  Most musically upbeat of the suite.  Nice flowing drum reptit, keyboard, and more smooth flowing guitar accentuate this spectuatular song.  Still the song in its upbeat nature underscores  what seems to be the melancoly heart and soul of a lonely woman living her life vicariously with her music zig and zagging out of traffic. Almost fixation and transference to her music as life.  1

Side 2-
-----------

Expresso Love- Band starts S-2, with a rocking number that hits the mark nicely.  Really good keyboard guitar interplay that does it well, and keeps the vibe moving.
Knopler continues the metaphorical plays on male-female interaction, pretty much focusing on the night club scene, at least on this one 5

Hand in Hand- Softer number that I understand that Knopler wanted to give some variation.  Of course it hits the mark (pun?) for those who like the lighter side of the equation. Definitely, not filler but not want I want from DS.    6

Solid Rock- Best on Side 2- This song has the back bone and riffs/licks that you will hear in much more expressive detail on "Industrial Disease"  from "Love Over Gold".  A really good rollicking number from that side of Strait's repitorie.  4

Les Boys-  ???  WTF.  19th century sounding and tinged number that will just leave you speechless and wondering what they were thinking.  I have no idea of how, why, or if the band were sane putting this on an album that otherwise was overall a classic.  I challenge anyone reading this to explain it.  I sure can't.   7


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F9_HwtwF8I


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAirINwjaxE


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rC95MEenIxA


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcwl-Q7pAtY
 

[berdie]

It was probably maybe 12-14 years ago or so, but Hayward's voice was still very good.   And you're right about Moodies using the Mellotron with their harmonies.  I don't think anyone else really did that --  Ian McDonald did some backing vocals for Lake with King Crimson, but they weren't really harmonizing the way Hayward and Lodge did.

I went and saw the MB in approximately the same time frame. I don't even pretend to be as knowledgeable as ya'll...but it is in my to 10 fav concerts.  Relatively small venue. They sounded awesome! For comparison, I wish I could have heard them back in the day.

The only thing I didn't initially like was...they had a huge background screen that showed concerts of the early days and their audiences. Then they would show themselves and pan the current audience.
At first it made me feel oldish...but then I appreciated the contrast. We've come a long way, baby, and today we don't have to tell people dancing on their seats in front of ya to sit the heck down!!

[catfish1957]

Classic Rock Album of the Day - Queen- Queen- 1973 ****

Another review of an immensely talented group of musicans and songwriters.  I don't think I have to tell anyone here, that this band was big, I mean really big.  The band in the original lineup had 14 studio albums that were wildly successful. Some estimates have shown that they have sold upwards to near 300,000,000 units , putting them 5th all time behind Elvis, Beatles, Michael Jackson, and Elton John.  Their catalog is so extensive, and discussing their hits and accolades would take pages of discussion.

The band of course if headed by the incredible flexible and versatile front man, Freddy Mercury.  Many rock polls have him arguably the greatest voice in rock of all time.  Again, debatable, but no one can dispute that this is an amazing voice with crazy range, and power.  The rest of the band are masters of their craft....   Brian May on the Strat, John Deacon on Bass, Roger Taylor, drums......  All considered top tier practioners of their trade.  I don't think anyone can dispute them as the Kings (Queens?) of Glam Rock, and no one comes even close.  Their sound is expansive, with majestic and often searing riffs, and overall masterful musicanship.  There is no dead air in sound of this group. It is a rock of a wall of sound , much in the way that Pink Floyd and Rush does.

My favorite by this band might  be a shocker to those who know this group well....   It's their least successful tracking LP, #83 in U.S.   While there are many many more familar albums by Queen, I enjoy their debut album the best.  For a couple reasons, inluding (1) It's has the most rock based edge than any other  (2) Queen rightfully and by choice took a gradual and more pop route at each successive album, and (3) The rawness, and missing slick production values give the album a unique feel and grinding sound.  Maybe the least "Glam" of the Lot.  There may be overall albums that have better songs, like II, and Night at the Opera,  but if I have a choice to blow the dust off the vinyl, and put one in particular on the turntable.....   This is the one.

No doubt the later stuff is great too, but extreme commerical success brought extreme pretentiousness in their music, and slavery to pop tendencies.  I rather opt to any one of the first 3 Queen LP's., than the final 11.

Fun Facts:  (1) Not even one song from this album cracked the U.S. single charts , and that means none ever made the top #100. (2)  Guitarist Brian May is an advanced degreed and published Astrophysicist.  Did not complete phD program though.

Side 1-
-----------

Keep Yourself Alive-  Rocking right out of the chute.  Nice crunched strumming highlights this well crafted one.  One thing about Queen, is they are also among the best at hooking in their songwriting.  Not near as much early on here, but everyone knows and recognizes the many so familiar songs in their catalog.  If you want to hear one song on the album....  This is the one. 1

Doing Alright-  How many men in rock in history could  do soprano, and hold a note with projection  to the level Mercury could?   An excellent light almost jazzy ballad that scares the shit out of you as it starts rocking out like a slamming door. 3

Great King Rat-  Love the fact that Queen loved to use English like story telling and phrasing, especially in the 1st 3 albums.  Would have loved to have seen Queen do some themed like prog type stuff with styles like this, and their others. This song likely gave the future thought to Ogre Battle (from II) as some of the mid parts take a real majestic turn and angle to the music. 4

My Fariy King-  More English themed mythological story telling, again in an alternating light and airy /. heavy hand that blends into some of the best keyboard work on the LP.  Again, a lot of the precurssor of the backbone of what Ogre Battle would become. 5

Side 2-
------------------

Liar-  Maybe the most tradional rocker of the album- A good bit of the song sounds like it could have been from Zeppelin, except when certain parts get into the complex phasing intracies that are typical of Queens works.  Especially that span of time. The song also goes off into some innovative tangents that this band uses to highlight their talents.  6

The Night Comes Down- May/Deacon jazz like jamming highlight that gives way to their trademarked "Procession" toned guitar sound. Overall song is a ballad in essence, and probably the weakest on the LP.  Which would be a really decent tune, on another bands work. 10

Son and Daughter- Heaviest rock sound on the LP.  Sounds a lot like of other rock we were hearing in the early 1970's.  Nothing that great 9

Jesus- Marched Tempo stoic in nature that is an incredible hooked tune that I found among the most listenable on the album .  Song is done respectfully in a religious way. Song also has my favorite May solo work on the entire LP.  Band as the only example on the LP cuts at the end to pure vocal harmonies in a spectacular  manner.   Those vocals as in similar to Bohemian Rhapsody, shorter, but no less effective.  2

Modern Times Rock and Roller-  I had forgotten that there was a song that Mercury did not sing (Taylor) Works well, just seems strange.  6

Seven Seasons of Rye- I was intially puzzled by this, and had thought I had remembered that this was on II.  Come to find out,  this is a sample (exiting), while the entire song starts Queen II.  Which is a better listen.    7


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIw_Bjp9_4I

[catfish1957]

Classic Rock Album of the Day- INXS- Listen Like Thieves- (1985) ***

Today's installment involves a band that really grooved and squeezed through the New Wave and Alternative genres in a really effective and consitently competent manner through their hay day 1982-1987.  In fact, my watering hole and local bar had them booked as a lounge act in 1982, and sadly they couldn't pull it off  due to scheduling conflicts.  Of course in my little corner of Texas, at the time, I might have been the only person aware of the band INXS. Man do I ever wish that gig had taken place. 

I earlier used this term competent to describe INXS.  That is the the absolute case, in that there are 5 backing guys who remained in relative  anonymity, but all had solid and much above average chops on the  New Wave, funky, alternative  resume', and they were as good as any of their peers at the time  in the early '80's.  Certainly as good or better than their closest peer Duran Duran.     But what truly made this band was the soulful sound, voice, and presence of their front man Michael Hutchence.  He meant more to this band than Jagger to the Stones, or Steven Tyler to Aerosmith.   From the crazy video of the scene of "The  One Thing" where the band sexually assaulted their meals with their dates, to the Funky Bluesy "Suicide Blond". Hutcheson exuded an implict and explicit sexuality with it's band sound that made your feet move, and got you lost in the musical moments  '80 quissenital 1980's.

Of course the book for all practical purposes on INXS sadly ended in 1997 with the death of Hutcheson.  Apparently he was an early victim of sexual self asphixation.  Strange way to go, and the band though they stayed togehter, never recovered even  with a number of different other Front Men.   And as far as the band's potential legacy. they were in somewhat of a creative and commerical funk in the '90's, but I am sure that the band had plenty of more to give to music history. 

Plus a little pre-warning.....   This Albums best moments are on Side 1-  Not sure why the band decided to not to even out the  quality, but if you have time constraints, stick with the 1st side. 

Fun Fact:  Band still exists, and outside the lead singer, the band has never had a lineup change. Same 5 since Day 1. (1977-2023)

Side 1-
----------

What You Need- Funky opening, with thundering bass and well oiled sax infusiatum. .  Large hit for the band. and a strong opening response after the previous album which honestly was weaker than its two predecessor. (The Swing)  INXS let the world know, they were back. 3

Listen Like Thieves-  Title Song on the LP, and by far the best on the album.   Easily one of their best 1 of  3 in their entire catalog.  Outstanding hooked chord progression, with still just a tad of that funky guitar that you see in a lot of INXS work. Last verse uses that chordal pattern with some nice wailing guitrar solo work to seal the deal.   1

Kiss the Dirt (Falling Down the Mountain)   Nice rolling rocker with some aboriginal touches that are xylophone-ish by mid song.  The tune starts rocking out significantly and aburptly and nicely, starts building on same patterns. Great song.    2

Shine Like it Does- Pleasant softer number.  Well crafted synth added that gives a nice upbeat feel. 6

Good and Bad Times- Duran-Duranish new wave in sound and syncopative style. Quite a drop after the first 4 on Side 1. 10

Side 2-
----------------

Biting Bullets-  Another New Wave number that harkens more to a 1970's kind of work than the rest of the album.  Hutcheson sang this very atypical to his normal style, going more in the mode of scream than sing.   As far as stacking it against the rest of the album?  About the middle. 7

This Time- Slower meter, but the song almost has a Stones kind of aura to it.  Can't exactly put my finger on it, but it might be how they deliver the harmonies.- 9

Three Sisters- Synth sound effects dominate in a strange manner.  I think they were trying  to sound or mimic  crickets, bugs, and birds, but I really couldn't see the intent of this silliness.  Play around in the studio guys....   not on the vinyl.  - 11

Same Direction-  Now this is the real sleeper on the LP.  This one could almost qualify as hard rock. Song also has a "Cars" Hearbeat City kind of mottiffed sound to it too.  Best on Side 2- 4

One X One- Blues based Hutcheson screamer with horns to boot. Probably one that would mostly appeal to their hard core fans, because styllistically it doesn't seem to fit on this album.  8

Red Red Sun-  Another hard rocker that is well hooked that included vocalized triplets in its delivery.  That is pretty odd and unusual for popular music if you thnk about it.   Some of the better guitar runs, though they do sound a bit forced.  Jimmy Page, you aren't.   5


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ou02PrSEsOw

[Maj. Bill Martin]

To most music listeners he's the guy who did "Sledgehammer", which is about as non-prog as you can get.

Which is a tribute  to his the acutal versatile nature of his songwriting.

I've seen him a few times, mostly back in the 80's.  So wildly different from Genesis, but very good.  And he was a great showman.  I remember him closing with "Lay Your Hands on Me", which has a great percussive groove, and then falling back into the crowd and crowd surfing while the band kept jamming.  Great show.  See if I can find a clip of him doing that somewhere...Here we go.  I think this is from the tour I saw where he did this - though I remember the bass and drums being heavier/more powerful live:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXqEZfOHjh8

That was from the second tour I saw.  The first tour I saw, the band led with Intruder, and the drummer was the only one on stage.  The rest of the band slowly with the band emerged out of the dark from different points in the crowd with these powerful flashlights looking all over, slowly walking up to the stage.  Very cool visual implementation of the song's theme of a night-time criminal break-in.  Can't find the band doing that, but the song is still suitably creepy live:

That's Phil Collins on the drums with the first use of that awesome gated reverb on his drums.  Great sound.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxA8I2edT1o

[Maj. Bill Martin]

I went and saw the MB in approximately the same time frame. I don't even pretend to be as knowledgeable as ya'll...but it is in my to 10 fav concerts.  Relatively small venue. They sounded awesome! For comparison, I wish I could have heard them back in the day.

Heh -- let me stop you right there.  The only reason I'm knowledgeable about certain bands is that I'm cursed with ridiculously picky tastes, which sadly limits the kind of music I enjoy.  So I know a lot, but only about the narrow area of my interests.  I envy @catfish1957 both for his broader tastes, and for his incredible knowledge about the much wider variety of music he enjoys.

It honestly does suck when most everyone else can enjoy a piece of music, and I just can't wait for it to end.  Ugh.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

@catfish1957

I'm really glad you do this stuff because I listen to some stuff I don't normally here.  I sometimes don't have time to listen to the whole album, but I do usually hit the highlights.  Me being picky me, I can't get passed Knopfler's vocals, though he is a great guitarist.   And for some reason, I've never been a fan of Mercury's voice either -- maybe that's the pretension you identified, but I did really like some of the music on that album.  Great King Rat definitely had a bit of a Genesis vibe to it at points, and I really did enjoy that one.  I think maybe their issue for me is that there are sometimes too many hooks, and too much brightness from Mercury's vocals.  The dark bits in Great King Rat made that one a lot more interesting for me.

[catfish1957]

Heh -- let me stop you right there.  The only reason I'm knowledgeable about certain bands is that I'm cursed with ridiculously picky tastes, which sadly limits the kind of music I enjoy.  So I know a lot, but only about the narrow area of my interests.  I envy @catfish1957 both for his broader tastes, and for his incredible knowledge about the much wider variety of music he enjoys.

It honestly does suck when most everyone else can enjoy a piece of music, and I just can't wait for it to end.  Ugh.

@Maj. Bill Martin

Wow, that is an incredible compliment and praise, but I don't consider myself that knowledgeable  much around music.  I especially shut the door on interest on all around all new music soon after 2000.  Ask me about anything after say 2002?....  I'll be clueless.   

In the case of modern music, I can barely differentate between Rhiana and Beyonce.

[catfish1957]

@catfish1957

I'm really glad you do this stuff because I listen to some stuff I don't normally here.  I sometimes don't have time to listen to the whole album, but I do usually hit the highlights.  Me being picky me, I can't get passed Knopfler's vocals, though he is a great guitarist.   And for some reason, I've never been a fan of Mercury's voice either -- maybe that's the pretension you identified, but I did really like some of the music on that album.  Great King Rat definitely had a bit of a Genesis vibe to it at points, and I really did enjoy that one.  I think maybe their issue for me is that there are sometimes too many hooks, and too much brightness from Mercury's vocals.  The dark bits in Great King Rat made that one a lot more interesting for me.

Thanks, you have such a great perspective on music, that is so often spot on. I am 100% agreement on Queen/Mercury comments.  Some music  can be ultimae talent value , but not the reach aesthetic preference of the listener.  I have often listed Tarkus as the ultmate complex rock  compostion , though to 95% of the rock audience, its sounds like a garbled mess.  The same can be said about much of Queen's pretenious work, at least from my POV.  One of the most interesting aspects of listening and watching bands with  longevity is seeing how they adjust and change due to commerical, artistic, and often band interaction pressures.  We've previously had good discussions of how Dennis DeYoung and Steve Perry pretty much ruined their bands, but in the case of Queen, I don't think you can say that Freddie Mercury ruined them.  He took them to stratospheric heights commerically, but much of that was at the cost of overshawdoing the other outstanding band members. May, Deacon, etc.  Absolute monsters at their trade.

I also agree about Knopler's voice tending toward whining, and being a distraction to a great product.  But, if you think about, the same has been said many times about one of both of our favorites....   Rush.  Geddy's shrill vocals turn a lot of fans off too.

Today's review also had me thinking about how strange sometime band dynamics can work.  INXS honestly was Hutcheson.  But giving this album and Kick a listen the last few days, I have noticed that the 5 unknowns who backed him were a really tight group of musicans who really made their sound so good.   So good, that they are still considered one of the music leaders of their time.  And behind AC-DC considered the greatest Aussie bands of all time.    And I ask....  Can you even name one of them?  In their case its like the sum is 2X greater than accumulation of all of their indiviudal parts.   Yesterdays listen has me so fluxed, I can't get "Kiss the Dirt" out of my mind, and I have played it over and over about a dozen times. 

Sorry for the rambling, but old rock music is such a interesting topic for me, and there are so few I can discuss it with, with any enjoyment.

[berdie]

Heh -- let me stop you right there.  The only reason I'm knowledgeable about certain bands is that I'm cursed with ridiculously picky tastes, which sadly limits the kind of music I enjoy.  So I know a lot, but only about the narrow area of my interests.  I envy @catfish1957 both for his broader tastes, and for his incredible knowledge about the much wider variety of music he enjoys.

It honestly does suck when most everyone else can enjoy a piece of music, and I just can't wait for it to end.  Ugh.

I have a very broad base of music (with the exception of rap or opera). Consequently, I have no deep knowledge of a particular band or genre, much like other areas of my life. I have a feeling that the shuffle on my cd player might make you bang your head on the floor. But I still enjoy your reviews.

[berdie]

@Maj. Bill Martin


In the case of modern music, I can barely differentate between Rhiana and Beyonce.

That's because there really isn't much difference.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

That's because there really isn't much difference.