The future of the GOP doesn't have to rely on Trump

[mystery-ak]

The future of the GOP doesn't have to rely on Trump
by Kimberly Ross
 | November 11, 2021 11:00 PM

From the moment Donald Trump announced his presidential aspirations in June 2015, he has dominated the political landscape. Trump's turn in the spotlight has persisted for so long that it seems impossible to get away from him. Both his critics and fans are many. Though Democrats control the White House and Congress, they are eager to remind others of the Trumpian loyalty still alive within the Republican Party. But when it comes to elections, there is no placing Trump on a ballot if he is not running. This truth played itself out on the Nov. 2 election night.

The GOP has to answer for much in terms of strong allegiance to one man over conservative policies. The media may have hung on every word and treated him unfairly on many occasions, but the 45th president was often insulting, dishonest, embarrassing, and unpresidential. In terms of his election success, the 2016 win against Hillary Clinton was more a fluke than a foretelling. And losing to Joe Biden in 2020 was a significant disaster that most likely would have evaded any other Republican nominee. The loss can be attributed to many things, including a great deal of self-sabotage.

The Never Trump movement has always been a bipartisan venture. In the mix is an untold number of Democrats, Republicans, and independents. Current and former Republicans who consider themselves to be Never Trumpers were quickly turned into party pariahs at the outset. Not liking Trump is akin to wholly embracing leftism or some such nonsense. For some voters, rejecting Trump meant only that: refusal to support him by way of vote. Actively considering Republican candidates beyond that? Well, all bets were off.

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/the-future-of-the-gop-doesnt-have-to-rely-on-trump

[DefiantMassRINO]

... but that would require ideas and courage.

[massadvj]

The problem, Ms. Ross, is this:

People tend to remember who was in the trenches fighting with them, and who was outside cavorting with the enemy.  The so-called "Never Trumpers" are an American version of the Vichy government of France during WW2.  Now that their allies are in power, and have failed miserably, they want back into the mainstream of the Republican Party.  But people will have long memories when it comes to betrayal, so these folks will not be welcome into the mainstream of the GOP for some time.  Shall I name names?  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Ben Sasse.  None of these people has any chance of holding a significant role of leadership in the party in the foreseeable future.

This is one of many articles I have seen lately from moderate "Never Trumpers" looking to find a way to extract Trump from the party as we head into 2022 and 2024.  I myself will likely vote for someone else in the 2024 primary (Rand Paul would be my first choice).  But if Trump is nominated again, I will support him, as I did in 2016 and 2020.  And I will do it with no regrets whatsoever for the simple reason that politics in the USA often comes down to a Faustian bargain, which is something  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich and Ben Sasse are smart enough to know.

You want Trump out?  Beat him in a primary.  If you can't do that, then STFU.

[sneakypete]

Maybe not,but it does.

Deal with it.

[sneakypete]

... but that would require ideas and courage.

@DefiantMassRINO

No courage there. It's not ladylike.

[Bigun]

The problem, Ms. Ross, is this:

People tend to remember who was in the trenches fighting with them, and who was outside cavorting with the enemy.  The so-called "Never Trumpers" are an American version of the Vichy government of France during WW2.  Now that their allies are in power, and have failed miserably, they want back into the mainstream of the Republican Party.  But people will have long memories when it comes to betrayal, so these folks will not be welcome into the mainstream of the GOP for some time.  Shall I name names?  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Ben Sasse.  None of these people has any chance of holding a significant role of leadership in the party in the foreseeable future.

This is one of many articles I have seen lately from moderate "Never Trumpers" looking to find a way to extract Trump from the party as we head into 2022 and 2024.  I myself will likely vote for someone else in the 2024 primary (Rand Paul would be my first choice).  But if Trump is nominated again, I will support him, as I did in 2016 and 2020.  And I will do it with no regrets whatsoever for the simple reason that politics in the USA often comes down to a Faustian bargain, which is something  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich and Ben Sasse are smart enough to know.

You want Trump out?  Beat him in a primary.  If you can't do that, then STFU.

Excellently stated @massadvj as usual.  The only daylight between us is that I never voted for Trump until 2020.

[HoustonSam]

Excellently stated @massadvj as usual.  The only daylight between us is that I never voted for Trump until 2020.

I second @Bigun 's motion.

[goatprairie]

The problem, Ms. Ross, is this:

People tend to remember who was in the trenches fighting with them, and who was outside cavorting with the enemy.  The so-called "Never Trumpers" are an American version of the Vichy government of France during WW2.  Now that their allies are in power, and have failed miserably, they want back into the mainstream of the Republican Party.  But people will have long memories when it comes to betrayal, so these folks will not be welcome into the mainstream of the GOP for some time.  Shall I name names?  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Ben Sasse.  None of these people has any chance of holding a significant role of leadership in the party in the foreseeable future.

This is one of many articles I have seen lately from moderate "Never Trumpers" looking to find a way to extract Trump from the party as we head into 2022 and 2024.  I myself will likely vote for someone else in the 2024 primary (Rand Paul would be my first choice).  But if Trump is nominated again, I will support him, as I did in 2016 and 2020.  And I will do it with no regrets whatsoever for the simple reason that politics in the USA often comes down to a Faustian bargain, which is something  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich and Ben Sasse are smart enough to know.

You want Trump out?  Beat him in a primary.  If you can't do that, then STFU.

For one reason by lying about losing for the last year causing many normal Republicans to believe the system is corrupted, Trump forfeited any right to show his face in public much less run for president on a major party platform. And yes, I too voted for him twice.
Not only his incessant lying and narcissism but his other shenanigans like instigating a riot at the CB supremely disqualify him.

[mountaineer]

Yes, @massadvj ! Quite agree.

[Fishrrman]

Ms. Ross:
"The future of the GOP doesn't have to rely on Trump"

Perhaps not, Ms. Ross.
But WITHOUT Mr. Trump, that "future" doesn't look to be very good, at all.

[massadvj]

For one reason by lying about losing for the last year causing many normal Republicans to believe the system is corrupted, Trump forfeited any right to show his face in public much less run for president on a major party platform. And yes, I too voted for him twice.
Not only his incessant lying and narcissism but his other shenanigans like instigating a riot at the CB supremely disqualify him.

I have no doubts that the voters are well aware of Trump's personality "deficiencies," and, assuming Trump is healthy, they will hand him the nomination again.  Why?  Because I think most Republicans know Trump is an incessant liar and narcissist, but they think he is OUR incessant liar and narcissist, and he is a damned good one. 

[skeeter]

The problem, Ms. Ross, is this:

People tend to remember who was in the trenches fighting with them, and who was outside cavorting with the enemy.  The so-called "Never Trumpers" are an American version of the Vichy government of France during WW2.  Now that their allies are in power, and have failed miserably, they want back into the mainstream of the Republican Party.  But people will have long memories when it comes to betrayal, so these folks will not be welcome into the mainstream of the GOP for some time.  Shall I name names?  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Ben Sasse.  None of these people has any chance of holding a significant role of leadership in the party in the foreseeable future.

This is one of many articles I have seen lately from moderate "Never Trumpers" looking to find a way to extract Trump from the party as we head into 2022 and 2024.  I myself will likely vote for someone else in the 2024 primary (Rand Paul would be my first choice).  But if Trump is nominated again, I will support him, as I did in 2016 and 2020.  And I will do it with no regrets whatsoever for the simple reason that politics in the USA often comes down to a Faustian bargain, which is something  Bill Kristol, Jonah Goldberg, Mitt Romney, John Kasich and Ben Sasse are smart enough to know.

You want Trump out?  Beat him in a primary.  If you can't do that, then STFU.

Nailed it. It was always about Trump taking their franchise away from them. They could not care less about the issues he promoted.

[skeeter]

I have no doubts that the voters are well aware of Trump's personality "deficiencies," and, assuming Trump is healthy, they will hand him the nomination again.  Why?  Because I think most Republicans know Trump is an incessant liar and narcissist, but they think he is OUR incessant liar and narcissist, and he is a damned good one.

A incessant liar who will be known as the only republican president in 45 years who actually tried to deliver what he promised.

[libertybele]

A incessant liar who will be known as the only republican president in 45 years who actually tried to deliver what he promised.

Yes, President Trump tried to deliver.  Can you imagine what could have been accomplished had McConnell and Ryan not stood against him at the onset?  Sessions was another huge problem and I still think Jared was yet another problem.

The leftists are worried that he'll run again, personally, I'm worried that he may not run again.  If not Trump, then who?

[Absalom]

Trump has been w/o Character since the womb and devoid of Principle all his life.
Yet his neurotic sycophants will conjure up any fantasy to keep him positive in
the eyes of the R rank and file till 2024, when they can go on offense again. Yet why?
Because Trump controls their subconscious just as Jones & Koresh did with their
Disciples. Reflect a moment on how those adventures ended!!!

[jmyrlefuller]

No, it doesn't, nor should it.

Trump got us into this mess. Bad SCOTUS nominees. Corrupt public health zealots. Deficit spending just like Obama or Biden. He didn't do squat and didn't try. He was only interested in aggrandizing himself, and he managed to fool tens of millions of people into thinking he gave a damn. All he ever did was run his mouth. Where's that flipping wall?

Maybe it's because I'm autistic, but I still don't see how so many people refuse to see right through this clown. He's been around for over 30 years. We all know he's a self-aggrandizing liar and always has been. Every time he opens his mouth or puts out a press release, it's plain to see... and tens of millions of people think he's more credible than anyone else out there? Even after his disaster of a Presidency?

Donald Trump managed to lose an election despite being the incumbent in a one-on-one race for the first time since Jimmy Carter (and Joe Biden is giving Carter a run for his money). You can scream about rigged elections all you want, but he did nothing to stop it.

If the Republican Party insists that the clusterbuck that is Donald Trump is the best we have to offer, we are screwed. Do you think it's any coincidence that the first real success the GOP has had in a substantial election is the first one without Trump dominating it? I mean, Virginia is in the GOP column for the first statewide election in nearly a decade BECAUSE the other side overplayed the Trump card.

Let's face it: the Trump era is over. We can do better. We MUST do better.

[Right_in_Virginia]

I have no doubts that the voters are well aware of Trump's personality "deficiencies," and, assuming Trump is healthy, they will hand him the nomination again.  Why?  Because I think most Republicans know Trump is an incessant liar and narcissist, but they think he is OUR incessant liar and narcissist, and he is a damned good one.

You should have stopped while you were ahead @massadvj  and allowed folks to wonder how little you understand.   

Donald Trump is not a liar, incessant or otherwise, 

What you can't seem to wrap your head around is that for six years Donald Trump has been the only one telling the truth ---- whether about our media, the socialist agenda, China, global warming iniatives, global trade agreements, endless wars, mail-in ballots, the endless election day, CRT, the long-term goal of historic monument destruction,  national sovereignty and illegal immigration, Russiagate, and on and on. 

Donald Trump has pissed off all the right people precisely because he's told the truth --- and this has earned him our respect and trust.

So, please, stop insulting 75+ million Americans. 

BTW, when you can name three individuals who think they should be the leader of the free world who don't have a  healthy streak of narcissism, we'll talk about this, too. 

In the meantime, how about you get a little control over those jerking knees?

[Right_in_Virginia]

For one reason by lying about losing for the last year causing many normal Republicans to believe the system is corrupted,

Is it your opinion @goatprairie that the dead voting en masse, truckloads of the same prefilled mail-in ballot arriving after an election ends, illegal connections of voting machines to the Internet, algorithms deductung votes, five states ejecting poll watchers from vote counting rooms, five states simultaenously going dark while counting votes on election night and each returning with the same new candidate in the lead, election commissions changing vote counting rules without statehouse approval, as required by the US Constitution, no chain of custody of ballots, and the "winning" candidate announcing, on camera, that his campaign has the most effective fraud machine in the history of US elections ------ is all proof the system is NOT corrupted?

Or are you simply admitting the truth is so ugly you cannot handle it?

[art.prout]

Our former President Trump was born a lightning rod, remains a lightning rod (mostly by choice), and will leave this mortal coil as a lightning rod.

I submit as evidence this thread, countless others here, and all over the rest of the public Internet and other forums.

Mr. Trump has many flaws, as do all humans.

Mr. Trump has many strengths, as do most humans.

Mr. Trump has an outsized ego matched by few.

Mr. Trump has a love of country and belief in all everyday Americans, matched by few.

If there is no other that will step forward and risk all (and that is clearly not hyperbole) that holds the same pure and uniquely American beliefs and love for his/her fellow patriots, then I will remain dedicated to backing the candidacy of Mr. Trump.

For though he has made countless mistakes, and often speaks out loud what would be better held in silence, he remains a lightning rod, and perhaps selfishly on my part, he is my lightning rod.

[Bigun]

Our former President Trump was born a lightning rod, remains a lightning rod (mostly by choice), and will leave this mortal coil as a lightning rod.

I submit as evidence this thread, countless others here, and all over the rest of the public Internet and other forums.

Mr. Trump has many flaws, as do all humans.

Mr. Trump has many strengths, as do most humans.

Mr. Trump has an outsized ego matched by few.

Mr. Trump has a love of country and belief in all everyday Americans, matched by few.

If there is no other that will step forward and risk all (and that is clearly not hyperbole) that holds the same pure and uniquely American beliefs and love for his/her fellow patriots, then I will remain dedicated to backing the candidacy of Mr. Trump.

For though he has made countless mistakes, and often speaks out loud what would be better held in silence, he remains a lightning rod, and perhaps selfishly on my part, he is my lightning rod.

By his performance, he has certainly earned another vote or two from me should he desire them!

[skeeter]

Our former President Trump was born a lightning rod, remains a lightning rod (mostly by choice), and will leave this mortal coil as a lightning rod.

I submit as evidence this thread, countless others here, and all over the rest of the public Internet and other forums.

Mr. Trump has many flaws, as do all humans.

Mr. Trump has many strengths, as do most humans.

Mr. Trump has an outsized ego matched by few.

Mr. Trump has a love of country and belief in all everyday Americans, matched by few.

If there is no other that will step forward and risk all (and that is clearly not hyperbole) that holds the same pure and uniquely American beliefs and love for his/her fellow patriots, then I will remain dedicated to backing the candidacy of Mr. Trump.

For though he has made countless mistakes, and often speaks out loud what would be better held in silence, he remains a lightning rod, and perhaps selfishly on my part, he is my lightning rod.

Thanks for your succinct comment. Describes my own thoughts perfectly.

And it no longer concerns me that others may disagree.

[mountaineer]

Mr. Trump has a love of country and belief in all everyday Americans, matched by few.

True. It's probably fair to say that none of the 2020 Dem candidates loved this country (though I can't remember all 24 or so of them).

[Cyber Liberty]

Trump has been w/o Character since the womb and devoid of Principle all his life.
Yet his neurotic sycophants will conjure up any fantasy to keep him positive in
the eyes of the R rank and file till 2024, until they can go on offense again. Yet why?
Because Trump controls their subconscious just as Jones & Koresh did with their
Disciples. Reflect a moment on how those adventures ended!!!

There you go again, calling Trump supporters a "cult."

[mountaineer]

There you go again, calling Trump supporters a "cult."

Is there a secret handshake?

[Fishrrman]

skeeter wrote (of art prout's post):
"Thanks for your succinct comment. Describes my own thoughts perfectly.
And it no longer concerns me that others may disagree."

Me, too.

If Mr. Trump remains living, breathing, and sentient in 2024, he WILL be the Republican candidate for president once again.

Nobody else comes close...
NOBODY (and that INCLUDES Ron DeSantis, not yet, nope).

If I'm still here, I'll be votin' for him.