Author Topic: Why Does No One Ever Talk About Sweden Anymore? A look into a very confusing development (Read 536 times)

Hoodat · « **on:** September 17, 2021, 01:03:59 pm »

Why Does No One Ever Talk About Sweden Anymore?
A look into a very confusing development

IM | 19 hr ago

One of the most consistently repeated trends of COVID has been the premature declarations of victory from areas with a perceived level of “success” in “controlling” the pandemic.

It’s happened in countries all over the world — Vietnam, Japan, Taiwan, Australia, Mongolia — just to name a few examples. They all have been praised for their ability to “control” the virus with masks and public health measures, only to then see cases invariably skyrocket.

Incompetent media reporting and dangerously ignorant “expert” pontifications have been an infuriatingly persistent aspect of COVID messaging, with their incoherent ravings becoming increasingly desperate as time wears on. . . .

https://ianmsc.substack.com/p/why-does-no-one-ever-talk-about-sweden

Sweden's Covid death rate is now considerably lower than the US, UK, France, etc. Sweden has experienced only 136 Covid deaths over the last 3 months.

mountaineer · « **Reply #1 on:** September 17, 2021, 01:07:47 pm »

It amuses me that leftists always demanded we be more like Sweden, as they insisted (falsely, of course) that Sweden was a great example of a functioning socialist nation. But they ignore Sweden's approach to Covid.

Kamaji · « **Reply #2 on:** September 17, 2021, 01:25:24 pm »

Very interesting graphic from that article, comparing Israel and Sweden:

PeteS in CA · « **Reply #3 on:** September 17, 2021, 01:53:12 pm »

Pure numbers are not very meaningful, unless comparing to nations of similar population size. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries gives per-million-population numbers as well as pure numbers. Ignoring countries like China or Iran or Russia or India, whose numbers are fictional (intentionally or otherwise), Sweden' deaths per-million-population numbers are pretty much mid-range in the context of Western Europe - Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, Austria, Ireland, Norway, Finland, Luxembourg, and Denmark faring less badly. Other Western European countries fared similarly or worse, obviously.

So Sweden is not a shining star, other than demonstrating that masking and shutdowns accomplished, at most, not a lot.

Hoodat · « **Reply #4 on:** September 17, 2021, 02:29:41 pm »

Quote from: PeteS in CA on September 17, 2021, 01:53:12 pm

So Sweden is not a shining star, other than demonstrating that masking and shutdowns accomplished, at most, not a lot.

Sweden is a shining star in the fact that they did not subvert the freedoms of its own citizenry. They did not shut their economy down. And they did not take on over $8 trillion in new debt in the name of fighting something. Nor did they suffer the consequences of any of that by having a worse death rate than the one they ended up getting for free.

Kamaji · « **Reply #5 on:** September 17, 2021, 02:37:42 pm »

Quote from: Hoodat on September 17, 2021, 02:29:41 pm

Sweden is a shining star in the fact that they did not subvert the freedoms of its own citizenry. They did not shut their economy down. And they did not take on over $8 trillion in new debt in the name of fighting something. Nor did they suffer the consequences of any of that by having a worse death rate than the one they ended up getting for free.

Exactly

DefiantMassRINO · « **Reply #6 on:** September 17, 2021, 02:53:30 pm »

What's so great about Sweden? What makes them special?

worldometer - statistics - Sweden

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

coronatracker - Sweden

https://www.coronatracker.com/country/sweden/

John Hopkins Corona Virus Resource Center:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/region/sweden

mountaineer · « **Reply #7 on:** September 17, 2021, 03:32:44 pm »

Quote from: DefiantMassRINO on September 17, 2021, 02:53:30 pm

What's so great about Sweden? What makes them special?

Probably not IKEA, so it must be the meatballs.

cato potatoe · « **Reply #8 on:** September 17, 2021, 04:49:10 pm »

They will probably have another surge in the winter ... as will our cold states ... but they will not follow our march into shutdowns and crippling debt. One major advantage is Sweden does not have millions of third world immigrants flooding in. A negative test is required to enter.

PeteS in CA · « **Reply #9 on:** September 17, 2021, 04:53:45 pm »

Quote from: DefiantMassRINO on September 17, 2021, 02:53:30 pm

What's so great about Sweden? What makes them special?
...

Quote from: mountaineer on September 17, 2021, 03:32:44 pm

Probably not IKEA, so it must be the meatballs.

And the lutefisk.

What self-respecting virus loves lutefisk?!

I suppose adding bacon would be an improvement, especially if one throws away the lutefisk and eats the bacon.

Hoodat · « **Reply #10 on:** September 17, 2021, 05:19:19 pm »

And then there's this:

( for @corbe )

DB · « **Reply #11 on:** September 17, 2021, 05:40:12 pm »

Quote from: Hoodat on September 17, 2021, 02:29:41 pm

Sweden is a shining star in the fact that they did not subvert the freedoms of its own citizenry. They did not shut their economy down. And they did not take on over $8 trillion in new debt in the name of fighting something. Nor did they suffer the consequences of any of that by having a worse death rate than the one they ended up getting for free.

And Sweden likely achieved herd immunity which will last much longer and provide better protection against mutations in the future.

PeteS in CA · « **Reply #12 on:** September 17, 2021, 07:29:18 pm »

Quote from: DB on September 17, 2021, 05:40:12 pm

And Sweden likely achieved herd immunity which will last much longer and provide better protection against mutations in the future.

Shutdowns slow the development of immunity within a population. As can be seen here, https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/ (especially from late October 2020 through mid May 2021), immunity from recovery did not come at a trivial price. Neither did the lower death rates (compared to Sweden) of the countries I listed above. Simplistic "We wuz right!" claims don't work very well - for either approach.

Hoodat · « **Reply #13 on:** September 17, 2021, 08:33:34 pm »

Quote from: PeteS in CA on September 17, 2021, 07:29:18 pm

Shutdowns slow the development of immunity within a population. As can be seen here, https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/ (especially from late October 2020 through mid May 2021), immunity from recovery did not come at a trivial price. Neither did the lower death rates (compared to Sweden) of the countries I listed above. Simplistic "We wuz right!" claims don't work very well - for either approach.

Sure, if you simplistically want to only look at Oct 2020 through May 2021 and completely ignore the overall result. The US printed up over $8 trillion in new money out of thin air, permanently lowering the standard of living of everyone, just so they could end up with a death rate higher than Sweden. Personally, I look at that as a lose-lose.

DB · « **Reply #14 on:** September 17, 2021, 11:16:29 pm »

Quote from: PeteS in CA on September 17, 2021, 07:29:18 pm

Shutdowns slow the development of immunity within a population. As can be seen here, https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/ (especially from late October 2020 through mid May 2021), immunity from recovery did not come at a trivial price. Neither did the lower death rates (compared to Sweden) of the countries I listed above. Simplistic "We wuz right!" claims don't work very well - for either approach.

The end result is what matters. Nearly everyone is going to get this virus over time. Even the "vaccinated" are getting it. The primary issue would be if Sweden overloaded their hospitals causing more to die with other illnesses and the answer to that appears to be no. They suffered drastically less collateral damage as a result.

PeteS in CA · « **Reply #15 on:** September 18, 2021, 03:27:33 pm »

Quote from: Hoodat on September 17, 2021, 08:33:34 pm

Sure, if you simplistically want to only look at Oct 2020 through May 2021 and completely ignore the overall result. ...

Try reading again and understanding the first part of my sentence:

Quote

As can be seen here, https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/ (especially from late October 2020 through mid May 2021) ...

Giving the url for the Sweden page means I referred to the whole time period, not just "Oct 2020 through May 2021".

That word "especially" intrinsically means I referred to the whole time period, not just "Oct 2020 through May 2021".

GtHawk · « **Reply #16 on:** September 18, 2021, 05:35:48 pm »

Quote from: Hoodat on September 17, 2021, 05:19:19 pm

And then there's this:

( for @corbe )

You can have ABBA, as for me...

Hoodat · « **Reply #17 on:** September 18, 2021, 09:55:57 pm »

Quote from: PeteS in CA on September 18, 2021, 03:27:33 pm

Try reading again and understanding the first part of my sentence:

Giving the url for the Sweden page means I referred to the whole time period, not just "Oct 2020 through May 2021".

That word "especially" intrinsically means I referred to the whole time period, not just "Oct 2020 through May 2021".

The whole timeline shows that Sweden has experienced fewer death per capita than the US. This is what your worldometers data shows. And it is the one that you somehow took issue with.

Again, Sweden continued with business as usual while the US destroyed it's economic future with shutdowns and free money. And the end result is that the US now has more deaths per capita than Sweden. Not sure why you continue to challenge this fact.

sneakypete · « **Reply #18 on:** September 19, 2021, 03:49:05 am »

Quote from: GtHawk on September 18, 2021, 05:35:48 pm

You can have ABBA, as for me...

@GtHawk

Can't seem to remember for sure what that stuff is like,but I DO remember I liked it a lot.

mountaineer · « **Reply #19 on:** September 25, 2021, 12:17:58 pm »

Swedish journalist tweets:

Quote

PeterSweden
@PeterSweden7
Denmark: Removed all restrictions. No covid passport requirements.

Sweden: Will remove practically all restrictions. No covid passport.

Norway: Removing all restrictions tomorrow. No covid passport requirements.
5:29 PM · Sep 24, 2021·

jmyrlefuller · « **Reply #20 on:** September 25, 2021, 06:55:34 pm »

Quote from: Hoodat on September 18, 2021, 09:55:57 pm

The whole timeline shows that Sweden has experienced fewer death per capita than the US. This is what your worldometers data shows. And it is the one that you somehow took issue with.

Again, Sweden continued with business as usual while the US destroyed it's economic future with shutdowns and free money. And the end result is that the US now has more deaths per capita than Sweden. Not sure why you continue to challenge this fact.

Not just the U.S. (which ranked on the milder side of the response compared to most other countries) but the entire Western and much of the Eastern world as well. About the only other country who has been as hands-off with this virus has been Brazil, where it's been a constant disaster. Different climates bring different results, of course.

If the goal has been to achieve a permanent return to normal life as quickly as humanly possible, I have a hard time arguing with the Swedish approach.

art.prout · « **Reply #21 on:** September 27, 2021, 09:27:05 am »

The instincts of Trump were correct. (Regardless of upbringing and life situations, instincts are often correct.)

His failure was to listen to the "political advisers" surrounding him. He abandoned his instincts for the sake of political expediency. The rest is now history. (It didn't help that he was a natural "germaphobe" and that they craftily used the fate of some longtime friends and associates to advantage (i.e., they played to his overly generous emotions, sadly).)

Put simply, Trump got played. Now we all have been suffering from the effects. Sad.

mountaineer · « **Reply #22 on:** October 04, 2021, 10:24:18 pm »

PeterSweden
@PeterSweden7
I live in Norway and I can tell you everything is back to normal here.
No masks. No covid passports. No social distancing rules. Everything is open.
People are out living their lives like normal, going to restaurants, meeting friends etc.
3:50 PM · Oct 4, 2021