Author Topic: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020  (Read 4679 times)

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Online Bigun

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"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Elderberry

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #76 on: August 05, 2020, 10:57:43 pm »
Any idea how much TNT 2700 tons of ammonium nitrate is equivalent to? That's a really big bomb...

The relative effectiveness of Ammonium Nitrate is 0.42. So 2700 tons would be equivalent to 1,134 tons of TNT.

Now if the ammonium nitrate was contaminated with a combustible, such as fuel then the effectiveness is more.

ANFO (94% AN + 6% fuel oil)  has a relative effectiveness of 0.74 or equivalent to 1,998 tons of TNT.

Online DB

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #77 on: August 05, 2020, 11:02:17 pm »
The relative effectiveness of Ammonium Nitrate is 0.42. So 2700 tons would be equivalent to 1,134 tons of TNT.

Now if the ammonium nitrate was contaminated with a combustible, such as fuel then the effectiveness is more.

ANFO (94% AN + 6% fuel oil)  has a relative effectiveness of 0.74 or equivalent to 1,998 tons of TNT.

Thank you.

Really dumb storing so much in one place in a densely populated city.

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #78 on: August 05, 2020, 11:12:12 pm »
Thank you.

Really dumb storing so much in one place in a densely populated city.

For SIX YEARS!  I'm aghast.
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Offline Elderberry

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #79 on: August 05, 2020, 11:15:21 pm »
Beirut blast: How does ammonium nitrate create such devastating explosions?

By Live Science Staff  8/5/2020

https://www.livescience.com/28841-fertilizer-explosions-ammonium-nitrate.html

Quote
The devastating explosion at a port in Beirut yesterday evening (Aug. 4) that killed more than 100 people and injured at least 4,000 seems to have stemmed from a storage unit housing enormous amounts of ammonium nitrate, according to news reports.

The initial explosion ignited a fire, while the second painted the sky in an apocalyptic mushroom cloud and sent a shock wave rippling across the city, leveling buildings and wounding thousands.

Ammonium nitrate, which is used in fertilizers and bomb making, is a salt made from ammonium and nitric acid, and it is highly explosive. The more ammonium nitrate, or NH4-NO3, the bigger its explosive capacity. And there was a lot, reportedly, being stored at the port: The Lebanese Prime Minister Hassan Diab said 2,700 metric tons, or more than 2,900 tons, of ammonium nitrate had been being stored at the port since 2014, The Washington Post reported.

But ammonium nitrate has a potentially lethal downside: The compound is considered an oxidizer, meaning at an atomic level, it removes electrons from other substances in a chemical reaction. What that means in a more practical sense is that it increases the burning of fuels by increasing the oxygen that's available to those fuels. To start the reaction, ammonium nitrate must come into contact with an open flame or other ignition source. In the Beirut incident, experts suggest fireworks were involved.

Once a reaction is sparked, ammonium nitrate explodes violently. The explosive force occurs when solid ammonium nitrate decomposes very rapidly into two gases, nitrous oxide and water vapor.

That explosive force from the Beirut blast triggered a shock wave that rippled across the city, causing destruction that some witnesses are comparing to the nuclear bomb’s aftermath at Hiroshima: Smoke hung in the air Wednesday; A sprawling crater had been scooped from the earth; piles of rubble were strewn across the city; entire buildings were just skeletons of the former day; and on videos shared online, rescue workers could be heard searching for anyone trapped beneath the debris.

The orange mushroom cloud that erupted just after the blast can be attributed to toxic nitrogen dioxide gas that forms after an explosion with nitrates, The Associated Press reported.


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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #80 on: August 05, 2020, 11:21:50 pm »
Trump tempers his description of Beirut explosion as an attack: 'Nobody knows yet'
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/510780-trump-tempers-description-of-beirut-explosion-as-an-attack-nobody
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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #81 on: August 05, 2020, 11:25:10 pm »
Esper contradicts Trump: 'Most believe' Beirut explosion was an accident
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/510737-esper-most-believe-beirut-explosion-was-an-accident
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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #82 on: August 05, 2020, 11:27:34 pm »
Thank you.

Really dumb storing so much in one place in a densely populated city.

Call me anything you like, but I strongly suspect that other things were going on in that area and the stockpile needed to be nearby.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Online DB

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #83 on: August 05, 2020, 11:34:10 pm »
Call me anything you like, but I strongly suspect that other things were going on in that area and the stockpile needed to be nearby.

Interesting. But wouldn't a good portion of it have been consumed in 6 years if that were the case?
« Last Edit: August 05, 2020, 11:41:21 pm by DB »

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #84 on: August 05, 2020, 11:35:15 pm »
Call me anything you like, but I strongly suspect that other things were going on in that area and the stockpile needed to be nearby.

...or the bureaucrats simply forgot about it in the last couple of purges.
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Online Bigun

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #85 on: August 05, 2020, 11:49:40 pm »
Interesting. But wouldn't a good portion of it have been consumed in 6 years if that were the case?

Perhaps. but knowing what I know about that part of the world, it's entirely possible that the amount seized was actually much more.  And further, we relly have no way of knowing how much was involved in yesterday's event although it was obviously a lot. We also don't know what else might have been stored in that warehouse.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #86 on: August 06, 2020, 05:17:49 am »
"When we came to the office that morning...this huge column of orange smoke coming from down at the dock...."

April marks 73 years since the catastrophic Texas City Explosion
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/life/article/April-73-years-Texas-City-Explosion-15174717.php
« Last Edit: August 06, 2020, 05:18:36 am by AllThatJazzZ »


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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #87 on: August 06, 2020, 01:04:33 pm »
I’m just catching up with the news after being off line for two and a half days.

This is a horrible loss of lives
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"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #89 on: August 06, 2020, 05:05:50 pm »
The moment firefighters tried to enter Beirut's Warehouse 12: Missing crew sent to tackle initial blaze are seen in tragic photo just before store of ammonium nitrate ignited in devastating blast that killed at least 137

    A photo has emerged showing fire crews at Warehouse 12 in Beirut's port moments before it exploded
    Firefighters were called to tackle an initial blaze in Warehouse 9 which spread, triggering cataclysmic blast
    The photographer is known to have died in the explosion while the fire crew are missing, believed to be dead
    At least 137 people died in the blast, with some 5,000 wounded, 300,000 homeless, and widespread damage

more
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8599453/Last-photo-emerges-firefighters-Beiruts-Warehouse-12-blast.html
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Offline Idiot

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #90 on: August 06, 2020, 06:54:52 pm »
The moment firefighters tried to enter Beirut's Warehouse 12: Missing crew sent to tackle initial blaze are seen in tragic photo just before store of ammonium nitrate ignited in devastating blast that killed at least 137

    A photo has emerged showing fire crews at Warehouse 12 in Beirut's port moments before it exploded
    Firefighters were called to tackle an initial blaze in Warehouse 9 which spread, triggering cataclysmic blast
    The photographer is known to have died in the explosion while the fire crew are missing, believed to be dead
    At least 137 people died in the blast, with some 5,000 wounded, 300,000 homeless, and widespread damage

more
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8599453/Last-photo-emerges-firefighters-Beiruts-Warehouse-12-blast.html
They never knew what hit them.  How awful....

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #91 on: August 06, 2020, 07:17:26 pm »
Bride seen in terrifying viral video as massive Beirut explosion ignited says wedding will go on
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2020/08/06/bride-seen-in-terrifying-viral-video-as-massive-beirut-explosion-ignited-says-wedding-will-go-on-956540
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Offline Idiot

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #92 on: August 06, 2020, 07:24:26 pm »
Bride seen in terrifying viral video as massive Beirut explosion ignited says wedding will go on
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2020/08/06/bride-seen-in-terrifying-viral-video-as-massive-beirut-explosion-ignited-says-wedding-will-go-on-956540
Can't blame her.  Things can only get better from there...right?

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #93 on: August 06, 2020, 07:25:32 pm »
Proximity of grain elevators to that blast has oblivated that food stuffs for 6M people.  The worst part of this disaster hasn't even happened yet.
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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #94 on: August 06, 2020, 10:43:06 pm »
Death Toll Rises In Beirut Blast Linked To Seized Russian-Owned Ship

Radio Free Europe 8/6/2020

https://www.rferl.org/a/reports-link-beirut-s-devastating-blast-to-russian-owned-cargo-ship/30767495.html

Quote
Media reports say the ammonium nitrate that exploded was likely unloaded there years earlier from a cargo ship that had been seized from its Russian owner, businessman Igor Grechushkin.

Based on that timeline and the size of the cargo, media reports say the ship was likely the MV Rhosus -- which had been owned at the time of its seizure by Grechushkin.

A businessman from the Siberian city of Khabarovsk, Grechushkin currently lives in Cyprus.

The MV Rhosus was initially confiscated by Lebanese authorities in 2013 under an order by local inspectors in Beirut after it had entered the port due to technical problems, according to lawyers involved in a court case over its seizure.

Prokoshev also confirmed reports that the vessel had been transporting ammonium nitrate from Georgia's Black Sea port of Batumi to Mozambique when it experienced technical problems that forced it to stop in Beirut.

More at link.

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #95 on: August 07, 2020, 12:05:33 am »
The Russian Manifest probably just listed it as "Fertilizer," which it is.

I'd apply Occam's Razor to this one.  It was probably a screw-up.
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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #96 on: August 07, 2020, 12:16:14 am »
They never knew what hit them.  How awful....

@mrpotatohead

MUCH better than spending days dying in pain from burns.
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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #97 on: August 07, 2020, 12:53:15 am »
That was a pretty mushroom type cloud looking explosion.   Some say the should check for radiation at the blast site.......
No nuclear flash. It would have been extremely bright had there been a fission event. Its just a very large chemical explosion, and likely material stored in one place, together. Separate munitions have a way of scattering and being scattered, some detonating on the outskirts of the major blast. This was more like a chemical stockpile or explosives manufacturing depot. 
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #98 on: August 07, 2020, 01:02:13 am »
Any idea how much TNT 2700 tons of ammonium nitrate is equivalent to? That's a really big bomb...
Mixed with fuel oil, ANFO (Ammonium Nitrate/Fuel Oil) runs at about 40% of TNT, so this would be somewhat less than one kiloton. (ANFO would have been 1.08KT)
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Massive Blast in Beirut 08/04/2020
« Reply #99 on: August 07, 2020, 01:20:19 am »
Mixed with fuel oil, ANFO (Ammonium Nitrate/Fuel Oil) runs at about 40% of TNT, so this would be somewhat less than one kiloton. (ANFO would have been 1.08KT)

Well, they're Metric tonnes, and a thumbnail estimate is about a Kiloton, as we reckon it.  It's 10X the pile of TNT that was exploded at the Trinity Site a couple weeks before the Gadget, at 0.1 Kton.
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