Author Topic: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian  (Read 5134 times)

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Offline FeelNoPain

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #50 on: July 16, 2020, 03:40:32 pm »
Federal Debt added by POTUS

Trump (based on $29T EOY estimate)-  $8.9T (4 yrs.)
Obama- $8.1T (8 yrs.)
GWB- $4.4T (8 yrs.)
RWR-$1.7T (8 yrs.)
WJC- $1.6T (8 yrs.)
GHWB- $1.4T (4 yrs.)
Carter- $0.3T (4 yrs)

Tell me again, how Buckley would have loved this?

Well, for one, Buckley was a master wordsmith, with a stunning vocabulary. Likewise, Trump "knows words. He has the best words."

Furthermore, conservative stalwart Rush Limbaugh has boldly proclaimed that "concern for the deficit and budget is bogus." Surely, you aren't suggesting that William F. Buckley would have remained tethered to some hidebound dogmatism. Like Rush, Buckley would have similarly "evolved" and abandoned long held principles solely to accommodate Mr. Trump. That is now what's done. Get with it, boomer.

"I’d like to begin by addressing the heinous attack on the United States Capitol. Like all Americans I am outraged by the violence, lawlessness and mayhem...

To demonstrators who infiltrated the Capitol: you have defiled the seat of American democracy. To those who engage in the acts of violence and destruction: you do not represent our country. And to those who broke the law: you will pay." - President Donald J. Trump, January 7th, 2021

Offline FeelNoPain

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #51 on: July 16, 2020, 04:00:35 pm »
In three years (maybe seven), Donald Trump will no longer be president. But conservatives who bent the knee will still be writing and thinking. How will it be possible to take them seriously?

The short answer is, it won’t. But that is not an answer that Bill would give. Minds change, hearts change. That’s why he spent so much time arguing, with foes and friends alike. It will take a lot of arguing to rebuild a conservative movement that one can contemplate without scorn.


Donald Trump is the greatest gift to the Left ever. He has eviscerated credible, mobilized, principled opposition to the Left, while growing their numbers exponentially.
"I’d like to begin by addressing the heinous attack on the United States Capitol. Like all Americans I am outraged by the violence, lawlessness and mayhem...

To demonstrators who infiltrated the Capitol: you have defiled the seat of American democracy. To those who engage in the acts of violence and destruction: you do not represent our country. And to those who broke the law: you will pay." - President Donald J. Trump, January 7th, 2021


Offline FeelNoPain

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"I’d like to begin by addressing the heinous attack on the United States Capitol. Like all Americans I am outraged by the violence, lawlessness and mayhem...

To demonstrators who infiltrated the Capitol: you have defiled the seat of American democracy. To those who engage in the acts of violence and destruction: you do not represent our country. And to those who broke the law: you will pay." - President Donald J. Trump, January 7th, 2021

Online DB

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #54 on: July 16, 2020, 04:46:03 pm »
I was being silly. Even a smacked rump like me knows Buckley's views better than that.

I know...

Offline Absalom

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #55 on: July 16, 2020, 06:15:35 pm »
LMAO.....  Moral precepts?  And you are the one accusing me of being on a specific topic "hobby horse"?,  I guess you meant "high horse".
Sorry, but this might be the most vague gibberishy, and  goobly goop, I have seen  at TBR in awhile.   In all respect, WTH are you talking about?  Not trying to be rude, but surviving and thriving exists mainly on man's ability to maintain a level of subsidence and wealth, to (1) sustain and grow his family, (2) accumulate stores, to weather economic down turns and storms, (3) Be able to take care of extended families and friends in need, (4) Accumulate enough to be able to influence politcal narrative, be it at a local, state, or national level.  (5) Establish enough financial base to not burden children in old age.  That is just the cold hard facts, and any less an endorsement of that is unacceptable.

Your dig at me around economic restraint and entitlement is especially puzzling.  In my youth, before the time of massive ovespending by the federal government this philosphy may have not have held the same level of importance as now. In that time frame, people were expected to live withn their means, and those who didn't or filed for bankruptcy for were looked down in shame.  You can debate the merits of that, but that was the way it was.  Nowadays people not only embrace entitlements, but expect them. It has created a mindset in a significant percentage of our populaton, that they can put forth minimal effort in society, since the government wil take care of them anyway.  If that doesn't constitute an "immoral precept", I am wondering what  you are doing at. a conservative forum.

Additonally, if you read W.F. Buckley's works or watch his Firing Line shows, he periodically refered to the 3 legged stool of conservatism.  (1) National Security, (2) Social Conservatism, and (3) Fiscal Conservatism

Get Real.......  Sawing off and throwing that 3rd leg into the campfire is NOT in the best interest of anyone wanting the best for our country.
----------------------
Catfish, uninterested in engaging in a urinary contest; so pontificate about whatever you choose.
* I meant hobby horse, as ideas give you agita, so your notions remain static.
* The existence of those who preceded us was vibrant because their vision was broad;
   yet we who assert greatness, are virtually soulless because our vision is as constricted
   as a telephone booth.
* While recalling Buckley, I personalty knew Russell Kirk, a visionary in the mold of Burke
   who reminded us that economics and politics came long after principled conservatism
   by thousands of years. Most obviously, Conservatism is hardly an adoption agency for
   the assorted isms and institutions concocted by Man down thru history.
Nothing further.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2020, 01:58:09 am by Absalom »

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #56 on: July 16, 2020, 06:23:11 pm »
Nothing wrong with that.  My heartburn is that the base  cornerstone of conservatism, fiscal responsibily is being lost in his statement, and in the argument in gerneral .

@catfish1957

That's because the Dims taught the voters to accept "What are you going to GIVE to me?????" as the prime question they need to ask any political candidate,and any that gave the "wrong" answer were demonized as Nazi's.

The "Eisenhower Republicans" were spineless jellyfish that just wanted to be elected to keep the cash flowing in,so they accepted this and promoted it shamelessly.

These days it is even the first thing that alleged conservative candidates want to talk about. Any candidate that doesn't address "what are you going to do for ME?" in a positive way,or is able to BS it to  a degree the rubes THINK he agrees with them.

Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #57 on: July 16, 2020, 06:24:51 pm »
The future of conservatism, needs to be - CONSERVATISM - not populist or libertarian.

@libertybele

True,but unfortunately that meets with a head-on collision with the FACT that to take part in planning the future,you have to get elected,first.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #58 on: July 16, 2020, 06:25:02 pm »
Donald Trump is the greatest gift to the Left ever. He has eviscerated credible, mobilized, principled opposition to the Left.

Oh, for cripes' sake @FeelNoPain buy a vowel.  Donald Trump IS the credible, mobilized, principled opposition to the left.

Why the hell do you think the left spends 24/7 focused on destroying --- not beating --- but DESTROYING --- the President AND his supporters?

Let me know if you need help connecting the dots. 




Offline sneakypete

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #59 on: July 16, 2020, 06:26:05 pm »
I was unaware that presidents got to appropriate money.  If I'm wrong please show me where that authority is to be found in the constitution.

@Bigun

That is a new thing that was added when the impossible happened,and a non-politician was elected as President.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #60 on: July 16, 2020, 06:28:25 pm »
@libertybele

True, but unfortunately that meets with a head-on collision with the FACT that to take part in planning the future, you have to get elected, first.

Top notch. @sneakypete   :laugh:

Online Bigun

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #61 on: July 16, 2020, 06:32:27 pm »
I'm just guessing but it seems abundantly clear to me that there are a few people posting here who very much depend on the Swamp providing butter for their bread.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #62 on: July 16, 2020, 06:35:39 pm »
I was unaware that presidents got to appropriate money.  If I'm wrong please show me where that authority is to be found in the constitution.

Presidents don't get to appropriate money.  But they absolutely are in charge of spending it (or more importantly NOT spending it).

In other words, just because Congress appropriates money for something does not mean that money has to be spent.  That power rests solely with the Executive Branch.  Congress can't spend dick.  Even their own salaries are paid out by the Executive branch.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline libertybele

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #63 on: July 16, 2020, 06:35:48 pm »
Top notch. @sneakypete   :laugh:

Oh ... that's right .... no one can voice their opinion as to how to proceed forward in the future.  Right.  *****rollingeyes*****
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #64 on: July 16, 2020, 06:37:07 pm »
Federal Debt added by POTUS

Trump (based on $29T EOY estimate)-  $8.9T (4 yrs.)
Obama- $8.1T (8 yrs.)
GWB- $4.4T (8 yrs.)
RWR-$1.7T (8 yrs.)
WJC- $1.6T (8 yrs.)
GHWB- $1.4T (4 yrs.)
Carter- $0.3T (4 yrs)

Tell me again, how Buckley would have loved this?

It doesn't have to be this way either.  The President can balance his own spending.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Online Bigun

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #65 on: July 16, 2020, 06:41:27 pm »
Presidents don't get to appropriate money.  But they absolutely are in charge of spending it (or more importantly NOT spending it).

In other words, just because Congress appropriates money for something does not mean that money has to be spent.  That power rests solely with the Executive Branch.  Congress can't spend dick.  Even their own salaries are paid out by the Executive branch.

That is very true! Never-the-less, the executive can only spend money that the congress appropriates.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #66 on: July 16, 2020, 06:44:28 pm »
That is very true! Never-the-less, the executive can only spend money that the congress appropriates.

I had this unsupported hope that Trump would be the President who finally embraced this and began showing a pair by eliminating deficit spending on his own.  But Trump's ironclad marriage to the Establishment prevents it.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Online Bigun

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #67 on: July 16, 2020, 06:46:12 pm »
I had this unsupported hope that Trump would be the President who finally embraced this and began showing a pair by eliminating deficit spending on his own.  But Trump's ironclad marriage to the Establishment prevents it.

The PROBLEM with that is this little thing they have come up with lately called Non discretionary spending. 
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline EasyAce

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #68 on: July 16, 2020, 06:49:43 pm »
It doesn't have to be this way either.  The President can balance his own spending.
He can also use a veto pen if a) he thinks Congress has gone into drunken-sailor mode and b) he has the cojones to wield it, then tell Congress, "Lucy, you got some splainin' to do."

Unless, of course, a particular president is more than a bit of a drunken sailor himself.

Maybe I shouldn't use that comparison. At least drunken sailors spend their own money.


"The question of who is right is a small one, indeed, beside the question of what is right."---Albert Jay Nock.

Fake news---news you don't like or don't want to hear.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #69 on: July 16, 2020, 06:52:31 pm »
In three years (maybe seven), Donald Trump will no longer be president. But conservatives who bent the knee will still be writing and thinking. How will it be possible to take them seriously?

The short answer is, it won’t. But that is not an answer that Bill would give. Minds change, hearts change. That’s why he spent so much time arguing, with foes and friends alike. It will take a lot of arguing to rebuild a conservative movement that one can contemplate without scorn.


Donald Trump is the greatest gift to the Left ever. He has eviscerated credible, mobilized, principled opposition to the Left, while growing their numbers exponentially.

@FeelNoPain

When will the drugs wear off?
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #70 on: July 16, 2020, 06:56:26 pm »
The PROBLEM with that is this little thing they have come up with lately called Non discretionary spending.

Doesn't matter.  An act of Congress cannot circumvent the Constitution.  Executive power resides with the Executive Branch.  Congress can (and did) pass a law saying the Executive Branch must spend money it mandates, but that law is clearly unconstitutional.

If we only had a President bold enough to do it - a President who really did want to drain the swamp.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Online Bigun

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #71 on: July 16, 2020, 07:10:03 pm »
Doesn't matter.  An act of Congress cannot circumvent the Constitution.  Executive power resides with the Executive Branch.  Congress can (and did) pass a law saying the Executive Branch must spend money it mandates, but that law is clearly unconstitutional.

If we only had a President bold enough to do it - a President who really did want to drain the swamp.

Yeah! I'd be happy if we could get someone who did not go to Princeton, Yale, or Harvard appointed to SCOTUS as well!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline catfish1957

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #72 on: July 16, 2020, 07:11:23 pm »
I was being silly. Even a smacked rump like me knows Buckley's views better than that.

 :beer:

That is why I didn't respond.  I am a connoisseur and recognize easily  well crafted snarky sarcastic satire.   

Calling me a silly Boomer sealed it, and I will say....  was a nice touch. 
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #73 on: July 16, 2020, 07:14:54 pm »
Oh ... that's right .... no one can voice their opinion as to how to proceed forward in the future.  Right.  *****rollingeyes*****

 I thought Pete's post was very clever; still do.  :laugh:

Online DB

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Re: Ted Cruz: Future of conservatism is populist and libertarian
« Reply #74 on: July 16, 2020, 07:17:09 pm »
Doesn't matter.  An act of Congress cannot circumvent the Constitution.  Executive power resides with the Executive Branch.  Congress can (and did) pass a law saying the Executive Branch must spend money it mandates, but that law is clearly unconstitutional.

If we only had a President bold enough to do it - a President who really did want to drain the swamp.

The powers that be have decided that deficit spending doesn't matter much. That the credit card will go on until at least they are no longer in power to be blamed for it. Party on...

And meanwhile people wonder why the cost of nearly everything has increased dramatically over the last 8 years or so. It might have something to do with the value of the dollar... And the reason why gold is at $1800+ an ounce... And when the dollar loses its standing in the world there is going to be hell to pay. That transition isn't likely to be gentle.