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Offline mystery-ak

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'Landslide' defeat: Second quarter recession will doom Trump, warns forecaster whose model always works
by Rob Crilly
 | March 19, 2020 11:20 AM



A sudden economic downturn in the second quarter of the year could doom President Trump’s chances of reelection in the fall, according to a new election forecast that factors in the impact of the coronavirus crisis.

White House officials are warning of a steep economic shock, with unemployment even hitting 20%, as COVID-19 cuts through the workforce and employees stay at home.

Trump aides are briefing that the economy can bounce back before November, but many economists believe second-quarter GDP growth is the factor most closely correlated with an incumbent president’s reelection hopes.

In a new forecast, Alan Abramowitz, professor of political science at Emory University, writes that Trump could be heading for a defeat of “landslide proportions.”

He cites projections suggesting a 5% contraction in the American economy during the next three months.

“That’s significant because, in many election forecasting models, including my own ‘time for change’ model, economic growth in the second quarter is a key predictor of the election results,” he writes for Sabato’s Crystal Ball, a nonpartisan election forecaster at the University of Virginia.

“Models like mine use second-quarter GDP growth to measure the state of the economy because GDP is a broad measure of economic activity and the performance of the economy in the second quarter seems to shape opinions of the economy in the fall.”

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/landslide-defeat-second-quarter-recession-will-doom-trump-warns-forecaster-whose-model-always-works
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Offline Mesaclone

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'Landslide' defeat: Second quarter recession will doom Trump, warns forecaster whose model always works
by Rob Crilly
 | March 19, 2020 11:20 AM



A sudden economic downturn in the second quarter of the year could doom President Trump’s chances of reelection in the fall, according to a new election forecast that factors in the impact of the coronavirus crisis.

White House officials are warning of a steep economic shock, with unemployment even hitting 20%, as COVID-19 cuts through the workforce and employees stay at home.

Trump aides are briefing that the economy can bounce back before November, but many economists believe second-quarter GDP growth is the factor most closely correlated with an incumbent president’s reelection hopes.

In a new forecast, Alan Abramowitz, professor of political science at Emory University, writes that Trump could be heading for a defeat of “landslide proportions.”

He cites projections suggesting a 5% contraction in the American economy during the next three months.

“That’s significant because, in many election forecasting models, including my own ‘time for change’ model, economic growth in the second quarter is a key predictor of the election results,” he writes for Sabato’s Crystal Ball, a nonpartisan election forecaster at the University of Virginia.

“Models like mine use second-quarter GDP growth to measure the state of the economy because GDP is a broad measure of economic activity and the performance of the economy in the second quarter seems to shape opinions of the economy in the fall.”

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/landslide-defeat-second-quarter-recession-will-doom-trump-warns-forecaster-whose-model-always-works

Models don't work with situations that are utterly unique...as is this one. Fairly certain we don't have a past Presidential election event with a market crash caused by a Chinese virus...or any virus...leading into a presidential election. The Spanish flu was in an off year, for example...so that's out. Essentially, there is nothing to model this upon.
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Offline DCPatriot

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Guess what?

I.  Don't. Care.

'You' SOBs deserve what's coming.
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline Mesaclone

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Guess what?

I.  Don't. Care.

'You' SOBs deserve what's coming.

FYI...your Theodore Sturgeon quote is actually a Mark Twain quote borrowed by Mr. Sturgeon. You probably know already but I'm a bit of a Mark Twain fanatic so thought I'd mention it!
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Offline DB

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This is all uncharted territory.

I think it is more likely the markets and the economy will be rocketing up prior to election day.

But who really knows. No one as a matter of fact.

Offline Jazzhead

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Models don't work with situations that are utterly unique...as is this one. Fairly certain we don't have a past Presidential election event with a market crash caused by a Chinese virus...or any virus...leading into a presidential election. The Spanish flu was in an off year, for example...so that's out. Essentially, there is nothing to model this upon.

Correct.   This is a crisis,  and there's no need to let a crisis go to waste.   If the President exhibits leadership, as he is now doing, he can and will change hearts and minds.   
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Offline libertybele

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I wonder if the forecaster has a crystal ball or maybe a magic genie in a bottle?

First of all, if the majority in the real world can imagine electing someone who forgets what he's saying half the time and has no clear path forward, then we'll see Biden in office.

Trump is doing what he can, expeditiously, under extraordinary circumstances -- anyone think that Uncle Joe or Crazy Bernie could do any better?  I don't think so.

We may very well fall into a depression; again, anyone thinking rationally knows Uncle Joe wouldn't be an answer.

Sure the MSM and the liberal idiots out there will try to blame this all on Trump, but I'm hoping that we still have enough rational thinking people in this country to understand the absurdity of such blame.

I Believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes.  I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey its laws to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies.

Offline truth_seeker

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Correct.   This is a crisis,  and there's no need to let a crisis go to waste.   If the President exhibits leadership, as he is now doing, he can and will change hearts and minds.

I watched the news conference this morning with my non-political wife.

For the most Trump made the young-gotcha-fake-news- reporters look obviously biased, in the midst of a serious world tragedy that their "communications" professors gave them nothing to apply to such situations.

A 30 year old today, was 9 years old on 9-11-2001.

Has gone without nothing in life,  wants their college debts forgiven, since their jobs don't pay high enough.

Could it be that what they do in life is nearly worthless?My wife said the males look gay, and the females haven't born children.

They have to look, at the written questions given them by their media higher-ups.

And Trump knocked it out of the park.
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Online Smokin Joe

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I wonder if the forecaster has a crystal ball or maybe a magic genie in a bottle?

First of all, if the majority in the real world can imagine electing someone who forgets what he's saying half the time and has no clear path forward, then we'll see Biden in office.

Trump is doing what he can, expeditiously, under extraordinary circumstances -- anyone think that Uncle Joe or Crazy Bernie could do any better?  I don't think so.

We may very well fall into a depression; again, anyone thinking rationally knows Uncle Joe wouldn't be an answer.

Sure the MSM and the liberal idiots out there will try to blame this all on Trump, but I'm hoping that we still have enough rational thinking people in this country to understand the absurdity of such blame.

Not from what I am seeing, no. Rational thinking is on holiday, in quarantine, and sheltering in place.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline skeeter

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Correct.   This is a crisis,  and there's no need to let a crisis go to waste.   If the President exhibits leadership, as he is now doing, he can and will change hearts and minds.

He is exhibiting leadership and has taken more effective action in crisis as fast or faster than any executive I've seen, but he looks exhausted.

Online Smokin Joe

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He is exhibiting leadership and has taken more effective action in crisis as fast or faster than any executive I've seen, but he looks exhausted.
Well, let's pray for POTUS's health, then.  :0001:

He has done a stellar job of clearing red tape to have a more effective response to an unknown disease.
Far better than the Partisan Media have given him credit for.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline skeeter

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Well, let's pray for POTUS's health, then.  :0001:

He has done a stellar job of clearing red tape to have a more effective response to an unknown disease.
Far better than the Partisan Media have given him credit for.

Lets do.

If anyone had told me ten years ago it would be Trump 'standing in the breach' I wouldn't have given them the time of day. But we badly need this guy to stay there for another 4 years.

Offline DCPatriot

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FYI...your Theodore Sturgeon quote is actually a Mark Twain quote borrowed by Mr. Sturgeon. You probably know already but I'm a bit of a Mark Twain fanatic so thought I'd mention it!

LOL!  Some people have suggested it's a W.C. Fields quote.  You're the first one who suggested "Mark Twain". 
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

Offline libertybele

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I watched the news conference this morning with my non-political wife.

For the most Trump made the young-gotcha-fake-news- reporters look obviously biased, in the midst of a serious world tragedy that their "communications" professors gave them nothing to apply to such situations.

A 30 year old today, was 9 years old on 9-11-2001.

Has gone without nothing in life,  wants their college debts forgiven, since their jobs don't pay high enough.

Could it be that what they do in life is nearly worthless?My wife said the males look gay, and the females haven't born children.

They have to look, at the written questions given them by their media higher-ups.

And Trump knocked it out of the park.


Yes he did!!  :patriot:
I Believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes.  I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey its laws to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies.

Offline libertybele

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Lets do.

If anyone had told me ten years ago it would be Trump 'standing in the breach' I wouldn't have given them the time of day. But we badly need this guy to stay there for another 4 years.

Yeppers .... that's what I've been trying to tell a few fellow Briefers in here ... but ... they insist in pointing out nothing but the flaws.
I Believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes.  I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey its laws to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies.

Offline TomSea

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I'd largely dismiss it for reasons given, this situation is very different.  It's also to many, like being at war, often a boost in an election year.

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Correct.   This is a crisis,  and there's no need to let a crisis go to waste.   If the President exhibits leadership, as he is now doing, he can and will change hearts and minds.

@Jazzhead I agree.  no sarc tag coming.

Offline DCPatriot

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Yeppers .... that's what I've been trying to tell a few fellow Briefers in here ... but ... they insist in pointing out nothing but the flaws.

Screw them all.   They're dead to me.
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

Offline skeeter

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Yeppers .... that's what I've been trying to tell a few fellow Briefers in here ... but ... they insist in pointing out nothing but the flaws.
Well no one else is paying attention to what we say here, nor care what we think, anyway, so we might as well all be baying at the moon.

Our prayers are important, though.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 10:43:46 pm by skeeter »

Offline DB

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Well no one else is paying attention to what we say here, nor care what we think, anyway, so we might as well all be baying at the moon.

Our prayers are important, though.

I'm following the thread...

Offline skeeter

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I'm following the thread...

No one outside our little interweb forum, I mean.

Offline DB

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No one outside our little interweb forum, I mean.

Thought that might be the case but I wasn't sure.

Offline DCPatriot

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"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

Offline Absalom

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Models don't work with situations that are utterly unique...as is this one. Fairly certain we don't have a past Presidential election event with a market crash caused by a Chinese virus...or any virus...leading into a presidential election. The Spanish flu was in an off year, for example...so that's out. Essentially, there is nothing to model this upon.
--------------------------------
So Trump, who cannot utter a coherent sentence, has no core principles
and is dealing w/a catastrophic event that is wrecking the world economy,
will do just swell come November?????
Landslide is likely an understatement.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2020, 05:16:33 am by Absalom »

Online Smokin Joe

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Models don't work with situations that are utterly unique...as is this one. Fairly certain we don't have a past Presidential election event with a market crash caused by a Chinese virus...or any virus...leading into a presidential election. The Spanish flu was in an off year, for example...so that's out. Essentially, there is nothing to model this upon.
Actually, there is. Step back from the virus. It is a trigger, but not the real threat.

It's 2008 all over again. The market is crashing, housing sales and new starts to follow if this is sustained, and small businesses will crater taking a large chunk of the 49.2% of the private sector jobs with them. Only difference this time is that oil won't be going up, and the oil industry won't be pulling America's bacon out of the fire with a boom.
Which means a sustained "recession", and the Democrats are already shoving bailout bills across the Congress knowing that if POTUS doesn't sign they can use that against him, and if he does, the debt goes up, provided someone will even buy treasuries. Considering the Chinese have been big in buying that, don't expect it to keep up.
Which leaves reserve currency status teetering, and if we lose that, while 23.3 trillion dollars in debt, our money will rival Zimbabwe money, and someone else's money (China's?) will assume the status of reserve currency.

In this sense we're breaking new ground, with uncertainty the greatest it has been in ages, all over a disease that has yet to rival many more common causes of death in the US. America needs to get a handle on the panic, and not let the MSM and the bureaucrats feed it. This is the Deep State's Hail Mary play. It's 4th and long and they're throwing the bomb.

The only way they will oust Trump is to make things so bad that being owned by the government seems like a good option. (Think store shelves are empty now, just wait until we're on the Soviet model.) But people don't think that far ahead, only to the next full belly, and if they're hungry, they will vote for whoever promises lunch.

That's how Obama got elected, with the media convincing everyone how bad they'd had it for the past 8 years, even though the panic in the markets in 2008 was launched by none other than Chuck Schumer, and that SOB smiled when he did it.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis