Author Topic: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero  (Read 544 times)

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Online mystery-ak

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Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« on: February 10, 2020, 09:50:21 pm »
Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
By Gregory J. Wallance, Opinion Contributor — 02/10/20 03:30 PM EST

The Purple Heart medal is awarded to U.S. service members who have been wounded as a result of enemy action and posthumously presented to their next of kin if they were killed in battle. More than 1.8 million Purple Heart medals have been awarded since the award was created in 1782.  Among the recipients were President John F. Kennedy and the late Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.).   

In October 2004, infantry officer Alexander Vindman was leading a reconnaissance patrol near Falluja, Iraq. He was wounded when his vehicle was struck by a roadside bomb. Vindman was awarded the Purple Heart and served out his deployment.

Last Friday now-Lt. Col. Vindman, a highly decorated career officer serving on the National Security Council, became the victim of a presidential revenge campaign. His offense was testifying pursuant to a subpoena in the House Intelligence Committee’s Ukraine impeachment inquiry.

more
https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/482312-lt-col-vindmans-firing-was-no-way-to-treat-a-war-hero
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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2020, 09:54:58 pm »
So, here's the lesson:  Get a Purple Heart and become immune to repercussions from being insubordinate.  This from the same people who say if you run for office as a Democrat, you cannot be investigated for any crime you commit.
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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2020, 10:13:23 pm »
Being awarded the Purple Heart and a CIB doesn't make you a hero.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2020, 10:46:17 pm »
Being awarded the Purple Heart and a CIB doesn't make you a hero.

It does to writers at The Hill, provided the recipient behaves in an insubordinate manner to Donald Trump. 
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2020, 10:47:45 pm »
From the same people who considered Bergdahl to be a "War Hero".

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2020, 12:36:54 am »
Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
By Gregory J. Wallance, Opinion Contributor — 02/10/20 03:30 PM EST

The Purple Heart medal is awarded to U.S. service members who have been wounded as a result of enemy action and posthumously presented to their next of kin if they were killed in battle. More than 1.8 million Purple Heart medals have been awarded since the award was created in 1782.  Among the recipients were President John F. Kennedy and the late Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.).   

In October 2004, infantry officer Alexander Vindman was leading a reconnaissance patrol near Falluja, Iraq. He was wounded when his vehicle was struck by a roadside bomb. Vindman was awarded the Purple Heart and served out his deployment.

Last Friday now-Lt. Col. Vindman, a highly decorated career officer serving on the National Security Council, became the victim of a presidential revenge campaign. His offense was testifying pursuant to a subpoena in the House Intelligence Committee’s Ukraine impeachment inquiry.

more
https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/482312-lt-col-vindmans-firing-was-no-way-to-treat-a-war-hero

 @mystery-ak

Ok,here is what really happened. He was a PASSENGER is a truck that was hit by a roadside mine. He bled,so this TECHNINALLY
qualified him for a Purple Heart,even if the bleeding was stopped by a bandaid. His biggest qualification was being an infantry
branch Field Grade Officer with no CIB and no combat ribbons. So he was awarded a CIB and a Purple Heart that would have NEVER
been awarded to an enlisted man or a junior officer without political connections.

He did NOT earn the Combat Infantryman's Badge,even technically. The regulations state to earn a CIB the soldier MUST be serving
as an infantryman in combat,and both receive and return enemy fire.

IIRC,he was serving as a staff officer,NOT an infantryman,and he was never fired on and he did NOT return fire.

That CIB should be stripped off his uniform in public.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2020, 12:39:56 am »
Being awarded the Purple Heart and a CIB doesn't make you a hero.

@txradioguy

 The CIB is ESSENTIAL for any valor award if you are serving as an infantryman. No CIB,no valor award.

He got it because one of his field grade pals on the staff wrote him up for it and nobody had the stones to protest.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2020, 01:06:18 am »
General David Petraeus earned a Bronze Star with Valor, but that didn't stop the Left from treating him like crap.
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2020, 01:34:07 am »
That is a John McCain gut reaction.

Just because John and Vindy were both war heroes means nothing in another gig.

Both failed miserably in the last jobs they held.
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2020, 01:39:36 am »
General David Petraeus earned a Bronze Star with Valor, but that didn't stop the Left from treating him like crap.

@Hoodat

   Vinman didn't even earn a lousy Bronze Star for Meritorious Service,something usually given to staff officers
leaving a country to thank them for not burning the country down.

I have honestly never seen a LTC in the US Army that didn't have a BS for Meritorious Service before. He must
have been a real slacker when assigned to actual units.
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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2020, 02:00:02 am »
@txradioguy

 The CIB is ESSENTIAL for any valor award if you are serving as an infantryman. No CIB,no valor award.

He got it because one of his field grade pals on the staff wrote him up for it and nobody had the stones to protest.

Gotta disagree. A CIB is not essential for a valor award.

I’ll give you two examples. LTC Bruce Crandall and SFC Paul Smith.

You can get a Purple Heart without being in what’s traditionally considered a “combat” MOS as well.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2020, 02:06:48 am »
Gotta disagree. A CIB is not essential for a valor award.

I’ll give you two examples. LTC Bruce Crandall and SFC Paul Smith.

You can get a Purple Heart without being in what’s traditionally considered a “combat” MOS as well.

@txradioguy

 I stand corrected,thank you!

I was writing from the POV of an infantryman,and if you are an infantryman,you are NOT going to get a valor award without a CIB attached
to it in one way or another.

BTW,in SF pretty much everybody on a team in combat gets a CIB,regardless of MOS. The only exception to this are the medics,who get
a choice of a CIB or a CMB. It's not unusual to see medics with both.
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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2020, 04:56:21 am »
Is it safe to say this Vindman fellow is as much of a "war hero" as John Kerry was?
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline PeteS in CA

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2020, 05:17:32 am »
Taking the argument to an extreme, Benedict Arnold was a war hero. And later became a traitor. Whatever the merits of Vindman's service 15+ years ago, he disobeyed an order from his immediate superior and bypassed his change of command in order to do a partisan act while in uniform. He should be court martialed.
If, as anti-Covid-vaxxers claim, https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/robert-f-kennedy-jr-said-the-covid-19-vaccine-is-the-deadliest-vaccine-ever-made-thats-not-true/ , https://gospelnewsnetwork.org/2021/11/23/covid-shots-are-the-deadliest-vaccines-in-medical-history/ , The Vaccine is deadly, where in the US have Pfizer and Moderna hidden the millions of bodies of those who died of "vaccine injury"? Is reality a Big Pharma Shill?

Millions now living should have died. Anti-Covid-Vaxxer ghouls hardest hit.

Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2020, 06:37:16 am »
It looks like Eric. C, Vindman, Schiff & staff, conspired in an attempted soft Coup d' Etat, like Brennan, McCabe, Comey, and several others.

It may have been initiated by Obam's direct reports, without all of the specifics; just use any means available, don't let up, don't get caught, don's squeall, blame Putin, blame Trump, etc.

Trump's instincts were good,  when he remarked he was being wiretapped, and moved Hq. with hourse.

His instincts were good when he asked Comey about loyalty.
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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2020, 03:15:37 pm »
@txradioguy

 I stand corrected,thank you!

I was writing from the POV of an infantryman,and if you are an infantryman,you are NOT going to get a valor award without a CIB attached
to it in one way or another.

BTW,in SF pretty much everybody on a team in combat gets a CIB,regardless of MOS. The only exception to this are the medics,who get
a choice of a CIB or a CMB. It's not unusual to see medics with both.

Yeah you're right about an Infantryman not getting a valor award without a CIB. 

Correct me if I'm wrong but IIRC there was a point in the Army that if you were merely assigned to an Infantry company and were engaged in a firefight or sustained combat with that unit you got a CIB.  They stopped the practice after the Vietnam war.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2020, 03:16:33 pm by txradioguy »
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2020, 03:35:30 pm »
Quote
Yeah you're right about an Infantryman not getting a valor award without a CIB. 

Correct me if I'm wrong but IIRC there was a point in the Army that if you were merely assigned to an Infantry company and were engaged in a firefight or sustained combat with that unit you got a CIB.


I honestly don't know a lot about the regular army. I didn't like it,and worked hard to stay away from them,but I do believe that to be true. I BELIEVE there is/was an army regulation that stated if you performed satisfactorily in a certain MOS for a set period of time,you were awarded that MOS as a secondary MOS you could serve in.

BUT...,being assigned to an infantry unit or company did NOT get you a CIB,even if you had an infantry MOS. The regulations required you to both be fired on AND return fire.


 I had a friend that had several covert recon missions into Laos on a 6 man team before he ever got his CIB,despite being fired up by probing fire as the NVA tried to get the team to give their position away. Being fired on was only HALF of the requirement. Let's just say he was a little frustrated before he finally earned one.

I know this was a fact in SF,but SF people,even senior officers back then,weren't all that concerned about formalities. Your ability to do the job was all they cared about. If you could handle yourself in a firefight like my friend Stanley that I wrote about earlier,that was good enough for them. You had the stones and you had the instincts,so they gave you the MOS,and if necessary,sent you off for more training.

There is NOTHING more valuable and rare in the "nose in the mud" army than courage and instincts. Neither can be taught. You either have it,or you don't,so when the army ran into both by circumstance,they tried to nourish it. The next generation of infantry leaders has to come from somewhere.

The whole "variable MOS" thing kinda screwed things up,and I sincerely hope that no longer exists. My original MOS was for a clerical job and has a VRB of 4,which was the highest. Worldwide shortage in the army. Problem was there was only ONE E-5 slot for my MOS in an entire SF Group,and there was no way in hell any Group Signal Company was going to promote someone in a line company to E-5,and neglect their own guy. So I ended up being the only E-4 on SF teams for over 4 years before getting promoted to E-5. It really didn't bother me much because the additional money was so little it wasn't worth worrying about,and nobody in the SF line companies gave a damn about your rank. If you could do the job,you got the job,and you got the respect that went along with doing that job well.  If you couldn't do it well,no big deal. They would just transfer you to a support unit and find someone else. No harm,no foul,and no blemish on your record.

Plus,being a Spec 4 meant that people who didn't know me didn't pay any attention to me when I went out wandering around to amuse myself. If I did attract attention,the MP's would go looking for the suspect in a support company,not a line company. I absolutely freaking LOVED what I was doing and the people I worked with,and would have done it for free if that had been my only option.


Quote
They stopped the practice after the Vietnam war.

I didn't know that. Did they also stop the practice of awarding MOS's based on ability and knowledge,or do you now have to go to an official army school to learn a new trade?
« Last Edit: February 11, 2020, 03:51:02 pm by sneakypete »
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2020, 04:13:43 pm »
Yeah you're right about an Infantryman not getting a valor award without a CIB. 

Correct me if I'm wrong but IIRC there was a point in the Army that if you were merely assigned to an Infantry company and were engaged in a firefight or sustained combat with that unit you got a CIB.  They stopped the practice after the Vietnam war.

BTW,to give you a better idea of the importance of a CIB in SF,my camp commander was a LTC that didn't have a CIB. He was a young officer in the Korean War that was a tanker. Won a SS and a couple of other doodahs in the Korean war,and went on serving in the regular army until he was a field grade officer,and went to the SF officers course. Not having a CIB made him feel like an outsider that didn't belong there,so he got a recon team leader named Joe Walker to take him out on a recon mission into Laos with his team. Joe agreed,providing the LTC agree to carry the radio and obey any and all his commands while in the field. After all,no team can have more than one leader,and Joe probably had 30-40 recon missions into Laos and Cambodia by then,and he and his team knew each other to the point where everybody knew what to do,and when to do it without having to hold a briefing.

The LTC agreed,so off they went. It just so happened that it was my turn to pull radio watch duty at our remote radio relay in Laos,call name "Leghorn". There was a squad of yards and 2 SF recon team members up there at all times to relay messages back and forth between the teams on the ground and the camp/

I was on radio watch the day that LTC earned his CIB,and there can be no doubt he earned it because the mic was shot out of his hand as he was giving me the noon sitrep. Which means Joe's team was ambushed,under fire,and had lost radio contact . "Organized Panic" is probably the best description of what happened. Joe and his team were on the run for a couple of hours with sporadic contact until they could get to an LZ to use their emergency radio to call for an extraction.

BTW,in case you don't know,the emergency radios we had were only carried by the Americans,and they were USAF issue to pilots. One of our guys managed to procure a bunch of these,and we all carried them on missions. VERY short range,but when you pulled the antenna out  it automatically broadcast an emergency signal to every US aircraft in range,and every pilot that heard it automatically assumed a airplane had been shot down and the survivors needed rescuing. In other words,the air would suddenly fill with airplanes,most of them carrying bombs,rockets,napalm,and/or cannons. HAPPY DAYS!

They couldn't rescue you,but they could damn sure provide you with cover fire and relay your messages to get helicopters in the air to come and pick you up. There were some happy people back at Kontum when they heard that,and a BUNCH of recon team leaders sitting around the radio shack waiting to hear if there were any volunteers needed to go in and get them out. Joe was VERY highly thought of,as was the LTC.

This was ONE senior officer that EARNED his CIB!
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2020, 10:48:06 pm »
According to Alexander, the hero acts w/courage/valor in the grave danger of battle.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 07:02:51 pm by Absalom »

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2020, 01:12:15 am »
According Alexander the hero acts w/courage/valor in the grave danger of battle.

@Absalom

You have to BE in danger first. Alexander heard a bomb go off and got a boo-boo from the
truck accident it caused. He was never in a battle.
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2020, 01:24:44 am »
@Absalom
You have to BE in danger first. Alexander heard a bomb go off and got a boo-boo from the
truck accident it caused. He was never in a battle.
------------------------------
Apologies.
The quote I paraphrased was from Alexander the Great's comments
following his defeat of the Persians at Gaugamela in 330 BC.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2020, 01:32:53 am »
------------------------------
Apologies.
The quote I paraphrased was from Alexander the Great's comments
following his defeat of the Persians at Gaugamela in 330 BC.

@Absalom

I knew it didn't apply to the fat Ltc
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Offline jafo2010

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2020, 08:50:55 am »
Hero or not, Trump is Commander in Chief, and it doesn't matter what Pelosi or any other has to say, if he wants the Vinmanns out of the White House, they are out.  Frankly, the sedition and coup effort in my humble opinion fully warrant trials for quite a few that should result in a number being lined up against a wall and shot.

The utter failure of the Trump DOJ to take these people to task will result in another coup effort, perhaps the next one being a bloody event.  My biggest fear is that they pull a JFK on Trump.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Lt. Col. Vindman's firing was no way to treat a war hero
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2020, 04:57:59 pm »
Hero or not, Trump is Commander in Chief, and it doesn't matter what Pelosi or any other has to say, if he wants the Vinmanns out of the White House, they are out.  Frankly, the sedition and coup effort in my humble opinion fully warrant trials for quite a few that should result in a number being lined up against a wall and shot.

The utter failure of the Trump DOJ to take these people to task will result in another coup effort, perhaps the next one being a bloody event.  My biggest fear is that they pull a JFK on Trump.

@jafo2010

 Relax. I have a suspiscion that once Trump is re-elected and not worried about running again that a LOT of people who
have been getting away with a LOT of illegalities will soon discover there is a new sheriff in town,and one that is
not afraid to name names and lock people up.

Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!