Christians Dodged Romney’s Bullet. He Wanted Us Marginalized and Voiceless

[don-o]

Begging for Scraps at the GOP’s Table

How close we came to a Republican party dominated entirely by its squishy, center-left Establishment. Remember how since 1996, the Christian Right begged for scraps at the GOP’s table? Somehow the neocons got all the wars they wanted. Big business got all the cheap labor immigrants it could wave across the border. But pro-lifers? We got a phone call. GOP presidents literally phoned it in when it came to the March for Life. That gesture said it all, and was echoed by the low, low, low priority that social conservatives’ concerns got in the party.

We were the red-headed stepchild, who when the big dogs had eaten was allowed to scarf down their scraps. And that’s how things were meant to stay, how they would have stayed, if Donald Trump hadn’t run for president.

https://stream.org/christians-dodged-romneys-bullet-he-wanted-us-marginalized-and-voiceless/

[don-o]

@roamer_1
This piece does confirm my decision to abandon my initial Never Trump stance.

[dfwgator]

And that's why, Trump.

Flaws and all, he is more conservative than any of the other alternatives.  Perfect?  Of course not.  We'd all love to see lower spending.  But the fact is, that's not really what the people want.  Oh, sure, they say it, except when it comes time to cut spending on their pet programs.   And that's why I'm pessimistic that anyone can really cut spending.

[roamer_1]

@roamer_1
This piece does confirm my decision to abandon my initial Never Trump stance.

@don-o
It only confirms my position against Tump.
Nothing has changed.

Wooing Christians for their votes has been happening for a long time. This is not a change.
There is a big money east coast liberal in the Oval office, with a Goldman-Sachs cabinet
And New World Order globalists running the party.

Exactly the same thing as if Romney were president.

[Absalom]

@don-o
It only confirms my position against Trump.
Nothing has changed.
Wooing Christians for their votes has been happening for a long time. This is not a change.
There is a big money east coast liberal in the Oval office, with a Goldman-Sachs cabinet
And New World Order globalists running the party.
Exactly the same thing as if Romney were president.

-------------------------------
Indeed roamer.
The Republicans, politically ascendant from Lincoln to Hoover promoted growing centralized government.
Roosevelt arrived in 1932, accelerating this and the trend has continued to this day.
As a result DC overflows w/those of the hard left who fill the ranks of the bureaucracy.
These are the types Trump appointed, as well as those in office before him.
And many wonder why nothing changes in Washington???

[dfwgator]

-------------------------------
Indeed roamer.
 
And many wonder why nothing changes in Washington???

George Carlin was right:

“Now, there's one thing you might have noticed I don't complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don't fall out of the sky. They don't pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It's what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain't going to do any good; you're just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here... like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There's a nice campaign slogan for somebody: 'The Public Sucks. F*ck Hope.”

[roamer_1]

-------------------------------
Indeed roamer.
The Republicans, politically ascendant from Lincoln to Hoover promoted growing centralized government. Roosevelt arrived in 1932, accelerating this and the trend has continued to this day.
As a result DC overflows w/those of the hard left who fill the ranks of the bureaucracy.
These are the types Trump appointed, as well as those in office before him.
And many wonder why nothing changes in Washington???

That's right. And it is no surprise at all that as usual, the two conservative factions thrown under the bus are yet again the civil-libertarians and the fiscal conservatives - The two factions that would stop this overweening federal government by grasping it by the short hairs and giving a hard yank:

It don't run without printing money and ignoring Constitutional demands for federalism... State sovereignty.

Literally the very same thing. Deja vu all over again.

[Absalom]

George Carlin was right:

“Now, there's one thing you might have noticed I don't complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don't fall out of the sky. They don't pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It's what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain't going to do any good; you're just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here... like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There's a nice campaign slogan for somebody: 'The Public Sucks. F*ck Hope.”

----------------------
In a nutshell, people get the governance they deserve!!!

[skeeter]

George Carlin was right:

“Now, there's one thing you might have noticed I don't complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don't fall out of the sky. They don't pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It's what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain't going to do any good; you're just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here... like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There's a nice campaign slogan for somebody: 'The Public Sucks. F*ck Hope.”

The sad truth.

[berdie]

George Carlin was right:

“Now, there's one thing you might have noticed I don't complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don't fall out of the sky. They don't pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It's what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain't going to do any good; you're just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here... like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There's a nice campaign slogan for somebody: 'The Public Sucks. F*ck Hope.”

Carlin was pretty darn smart.

[Cyber Liberty]

“Bipartisan usually means that a larger-than-usual deception is being carried out.”

[sneakypete]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong,but aren't Mormons Christians?

[sneakypete]

And that's why, Trump.

Flaws and all, he is more conservative than any of the other alternatives.  Perfect?  Of course not.  We'd all love to see lower spending.  But the fact is, that's not really what the people want.  Oh, sure, they say it, except when it comes time to cut spending on their pet programs.   And that's why I'm pessimistic that anyone can really cut spending.

@dfwgator

And let's not forget that most of the money in this years budget was money that Congress agreed to spend years ago. Anybody that thinks that any President can just come into office and cut spending right away is clueless.

[don-o]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong,but aren't Mormons Christians?

I do not know if Mormons consider themselves to be Christians. Various Christians have various and common difference with Mormons. Roman Catholic and Orthodox would not consider them Christians, because they do not affirm the Nicene Creed. Baptists and some other Protestants would not consider them Christians because they give credence to the Book of Mormon. Episcopalians  and some other "Mainline denominations"? Who knows what they believe today or tomorrow?

That being said, most Christians that I respect consider Mormons to generally be of high moral character. But that does not compensate for their erroneous theology.

This is my honest attempt to address the question @sneakypete I do not intend to misrepresent Mormon belief and I apologize in advance if I have done so. I have not done a deep study on their theology. And I know that @mystery-ak does not want us "going there" too much.

[Axeslinger]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong,but aren't Mormons Christians?

First I offer the same disclaimer that @don-o offered.  My experience is limited.
My HS age son dated a Mormon girl for a while and my understanding is that they consider themselves Christian.  Or maybe more accurately “Christian Plus”.  They believe in the Bible and its Word. The believe in Jesus Christ.  BUT they also believe that Joseph Smith, author of the Book of Mormon, is a prophet chosen by God.  And they view the Book if Mormon as an addition to the Bible, of equal importance and holiness.

While I think their beliefs extending from the BoM are wacky, all of the Mormons I have met have been solid, upstanding people with an envious devotion to family and leading a wholesome life.

[sneakypete]

I do not know if Mormons consider themselves to be Christians. Various Christians have various and common difference with Mormons. Roman Catholic and Orthodox would not consider them Christians, because they do not affirm the Nicene Creed. Baptists and some other Protestants would not consider them Christians because they give credence to the Book of Mormon. Episcopalians  and some other "Mainline denominations"? Who knows what they believe today or tomorrow?

That being said, most Christians that I respect consider Mormons to generally be of high moral character. But that does not compensate for their erroneous theology.

This is my honest attempt to address the question @sneakypete I do not intend to misrepresent Mormon belief and I apologize in advance if I have done so. I have not done a deep study on their theology. And I know that @mystery-ak does not want us "going there" too much.

@don-o

I thank you for the attempt. I asked because I know nothing about Mormons other than that they exist and are based in Utah.

[sneakypete]

First I offer the same disclaimer that @don-o offered.  My experience is limited.
My HS age son dated a Mormon girl for a while and my understanding is that they consider themselves Christian.  Or maybe more accurately “Christian Plus”. 

@Axeslinger

Doesn't everybody that considers themselves to be Christians? I can't recall ever meeting one that didn't. If not him/herself personally,they considered their "branch" to be "more Christian" than any other branch.

 They believe in the Bible and its Word. The believe in Jesus Christ.  BUT they also believe that Joseph Smith, author of the Book of Mormon, is a prophet chosen by God.  And they view the Book if Mormon as an addition to the Bible, of equal importance and holiness.

While I think their beliefs extending from the BoM are wacky, all of the Mormons I have met have been solid, upstanding people with an envious devotion to family and leading a wholesome life.

@Axeslinger

Thanks. I don't think I have ever knowingly met one,but the people I know who have say pretty much the same things about their character.

Mittens seems to be the exception.

[Fishrrman]

Axe wrote:
"BUT they also believe that Joseph Smith, author of the Book of Mormon, is a prophet chosen by God.  And they view the Book if Mormon as an addition to the Bible, of equal importance and holiness."

It might be worth pointing out that the [formerly known as] Reformed Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints -- now known as the Community of Christ -- no longer requires its members to "believe" the Book of Mormon as a requirement of their faith. The "Reformed" Saints was organized in 1860 by Joseph Smith III with Emma Smith's blessings (she distrusted Brigham Young and refused to migrate to Utah with the original Church). But the reformed church is small compared to the SLC church.

The Salt Lake Church seems to be in the midst of some reforms and re-alignment. My prediction (and it's only an off-the-wall prediction) is that at some point in their future, they, too, may no longer require fealty to The Book of Mormon for membership. The Doctrine and Covenants will still apply, of course.

[PeteS in CA]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong,but aren't Mormons Christians?

I thiunk the thread is about Romney's stated policies, not whether or not Romney is a Christian or whether his policies are consistent with his professed religion. Pelosi, Biden, and the Kennedys claim to be Catholics, but their policies (and the Kennedy lifestyles!) are/were contrary to Catholic teaching. But the dangers to the country are in the Pelosi/Biden/Kennedy policies.

[sneakypete]

I thiunk the thread is about Romney's stated policies, not whether or not Romney is a Christian or whether his policies are consistent with his professed religion. Pelosi, Biden, and the Kennedys claim to be Catholics, but their policies (and the Kennedy lifestyles!) are/were contrary to Catholic teaching. But the dangers to the country are in the Pelosi/Biden/Kennedy policies.

@PeteS in CA

Ok,thanks,but I was asking for information because I really didn't know. I DO sorta vaguely remember the Mormons were ran out of the east for their religious viewpoints,but that's about it.

[Cyber Liberty]

@PeteS in CA

Ok,thanks,but I was asking for information because I really didn't know. I DO sorta vaguely remember the Mormons were ran out of the east for their religious viewpoints,but that's about it.

It's a good question, actually, judging from the answers you received.

[roamer_1]

@PeteS in CA

Ok,thanks,but I was asking for information because I really didn't know. I DO sorta vaguely remember the Mormons were ran out of the east for their religious viewpoints,but that's about it.

Mormons are wholly integrated into the Rocky Mountain West. I know many of them. I consider many of them to be my friends. They are, by and large, an hardy, good and gentle folk.

There are doctrinal differences which are indeed insurmountable, much as @don-o has stated, and everyone knows that to be true (from both directions).

But socially they are accepted in the Christian community, functioning side by side in many ways where Christianity intersects the community at large... Much in the same way that Protestants and Catholics can get together to work or have fun, where doctrinal differences can be set aside.

But maybe the West is strange that way, as independence makes for strange bedfellows.

Different story where doctrine applies. Marriages as an instance. Mormons marry Mormons, just as Protestants marry Protestants, and Catholics marry Catholics. Where it must, we stand apart.

But there is much upon which we all agree, and that is where the focus is most of the time.

[sneakypete]

But there is much upon which we all agree, and that is where the focus is most of the time.

@roamer_1

Ok,thanks!