The Case For Keeping Trump [RE: CT article]

[don-o]

The Case For Keeping Trump

Should the Senate remove President Trump from office?

Mark Galli, editor of Christianity Today, says “yes!” He articulates the moral case against Trump. By his account, Trump is a con man and a liar who has spent his life exploiting legal and moral loopholes to his own advantage. As Galli says, Trump did just what Democrats claim: He used military aid and other carrots as bargaining chips to get Ukraine to damage a political rival.

Galli calls for Trump’s removal, whether by the Senate or at the ballot box in 2020. We don’t yet know the options for 2020, so I focus here on the case for impeachment. Cogent though it is, Galli’s case for removal is not convincing.

For starters, there’s a difference between selecting a president and retaining him. Once a ruler is in power, the demands of Romans 13 kick in. We owe honor to whom honor is due, tribute to whom tribute. At times, we have to skate close to giving due to devils. In America, we have Constitutional mechanisms for removing a sitting president, but the Christian tradition urges caution. It’s a truism of Christian political thought that we must bear with wicked rulers. God gives power to evil men, Peter Abelard wrote, “for vengeance against perverse men or for purgation or testing of those who are good.” Trump is no tyrant. In policy terms, his presidency has been a mixed bag. Yet his personal flaws and political errors pose a test we should suffer with patience.

https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2019/12/the-case-for-keeping-trump?fbclid=IwAR1Sx2_uN8eh3vdSDPbFC5CPiXcpfOh7ohAhbhMIiTEVFjuBI6LrUWQMYHw
 

[don-o]

Could not find the original thread on the CT piece referenced. So I started new one. 

[truth_seeker]

This fellow Galli, had already announcede his resignation/retirement from the magazine.

What better way to kick-start his next career, but an divisive, controvertial article.

#Nevertrumpers just swill this sort of thing down.

Is #nevertrump media playing all of the articles, by Trump Supporting Christian leaders?

No, just this previously unknown guy.

and #nevertrump media

[don-o]

The Flag in the Whirlwind: An Update from CT’s President

Reader responses to Mark Galli’s recent editorial have spanned the spectrum. We have received countless notes of encouragement from readers who were profoundly moved. They no longer feel alone. They have hope again. Many have told us of reading the editorial with tears in their eyes, sharing it with children who have wandered from the faith, rejoicing that at last someone was articulating what they felt in their hearts. They felt this was a watershed moment in the history of the American church—or they hoped it would prove to be. Stay strong, they told us, knowing we were about to reap the whirlwind.

On the other hand, we have heard from many readers who felt incensed and insulted. These readers felt the editorial engaged in character assassination, or maligned a broad swath of our fellow evangelicals, or revealed that we prefer the Democrats to a President who has done a lot of good for causes we all care about.

Of course, we appreciate the support and listen humbly to the criticisms. But at the end of the day, we write for a readership of One. God is our Tower. Let the whirlwind come.

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2019/december-web-only/trump-evangelicals-editorial-christianity-today-president.html

[Wingnut]

This fellow Galli, had already announcede his resignation/retirement from the magazine.

What better way to kick-start his next career, but an divisive, controvertial article.

#Nevertrumpers just swill this sort of thing down.

Is #nevertrump media playing all of the articles, by Trump Supporting Christian leaders?

No, just this previously unknown guy.

and #nevertrump media

It was very "Christian" of him.

[ChemEngrMBA]

It was very "Christian" of him.

And the crowd chose Barabbas, not Jesus.

[Wingnut]

Nearly 200 evangelical leaders called out the president of Christianity Today for publishing a blistering editorial urging President Trump’s ouster, saying they are “Bible-believing Christians” who have been mischaracterized in the opinion piece as “far-right” zealots.

“Your editorial offensively questioned the spiritual integrity and Christian witness of tens-of-millions of believers who take seriously their civic and moral obligations,” the group of 177 evangelicals wrote to the magazine’s president, Timothy Dalrymple.

“We are, in fact, not ‘far-right’ evangelicals as characterized by the author,” the letter sent Sunday said.

“Rather, we are Bible-believing Christians and patriotic Americans who are simply grateful that our President has sought our advice as his administration has advanced policies that protect the unborn, promote religious freedom … and ensure that our foreign policy aligns with our values while making our world safer, including through our support of the State of Israel,” it continued.

[PeteS in CA]

I believe Galli had submitted his resignation before penning the editorial. He's 67. He's also started to weasel a bit, https://pjmedia.com/trending/christianity-today-editor-takes-a-step-back-im-not-making-a-political-judgment-im-making-a-moral-judgment/ .

[EasyAce]

Also from "The Flag in the Whirlwind":

Galli’s editorial focused on the impeachment, but it was clear the issues are deeper and broader. Reasonable people can differ when it comes to the flagrantly partisan impeachment process. But this is not merely about impeachment, or even merely about President Trump. He is not the sickness. He is a symptom of a sickness that began before him, which is the hyper-politicization of the American church. This is a danger for all of us, wherever we fall on the political spectrum. Jesus said we should give to Caesar what is Caesar’s and to God what is God’s. With profound love and respect, we ask our brothers and sisters in Christ to consider whether they have given to Caesar what belongs only to God: their unconditional loyalty.

Let me protect against two misunderstandings. The problem is not that we as evangelicals are associated with the Trump administration’s judicial appointments or its advocacy of life, family, and religious liberty. We are happy to celebrate the positive things the administration has accomplished. The problem is that we as evangelicals are also associated with President Trump’s rampant immorality, greed, and corruption . . . The cost has been too high. American evangelicalism is not a Republican PAC . . .

And it wouldn't hurt for one and all to be reminded that when Jesus forged the distinction between Caesar and God, he didn't mean Caesar was entitled to make off with the whole pot, either.

[PeteS in CA]

He is a symptom of a sickness that began before him, which is the hyper-politicization of the American church.

That's nice in a hypothetical, all-things-being-equal world. In the real world in which we live, one political party is less than a step away from placing antagonism to religious freedom in their party platform. That party's 2016 candidate specifically said that religious people have to change. She and Trump were the only realistic alternatives in 2016. Do I love this one-or-the-other reality? Do I love having a real world choice between a party whose leadership is expressly hostile to me and my rights and whatever else? No, but that is reality. My voting for Snoopy won't change reality, only take my vote away from the candidate who, at worst, will do significantly less harm.

With profound love and respect, we ask our brothers and sisters in Christ to consider whether they have given to Caesar what belongs only to God: their unconditional loyalty.

That is not "profound love and respect", that is a Democrat Party talking-point devised to divide Evangelical Christians by luring us into buying a straw man argument. CT should be ashamed to parrot a political party's arguments. And have the "profound love and respect" for their brothers and sisters to realize that just maybe they made rational choices based on their understanding of their faith. And since they ask such an offensive question, I'l take the liberty of giving a blunt answer: I'm not stupid enough to "give to Caesar what belongs only to God", my "unconditional loyalty".

As for how/what Evangelical Christians are "associated with", I can't control the accuracy or truthfulness of other people's associations. Nor do I fear others' views of me. For some reason CT imagines we can control people's impressions and have fallen into fearing others. Worse still, CT thinks I have to change to alleviate their fears - fearfulness and arrogance.

[Victoria33]

I read a number of people have dropped that Christian magazine, but more than that number has joined to get the magazine.

[Wingnut]

I read a number of people have dropped that Christian magazine, but more than that number has joined to get the magazine.

Post a link to that Bullshit.

[PeteS in CA]

Post a link to that Bullshit.

Galli said that on Sharp Al's MSNBC show, https://www.msnbc.com/politicsnation/watch/-christianity-today-editor-doubles-down-on-calling-for-trump-s-removal-75564613550 , at the 3:30 point.

My guess is that when all the dust of cancellations, new subscriptions, and non-renewals settles, perhaps spring of 2021, the net reaction as reflected in subscriber numbers will be negative from CT's POV. As for advertisers ... that's more likely to follow the subscriber numbers, though I suppose there could be a few advertisers who cease advertising in CT.

[Victoria33]

Post a link to that Bullshit.

@The Ghost

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/12/23/christianity-today-says-it-saw-spike-in-subscriptions-after-trump-editorial/

[libertybele]

@The Ghost

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/12/23/christianity-today-says-it-saw-spike-in-subscriptions-after-trump-editorial/

Of course CT is going to toot their own horn.  It's in their best interest.

Jerry Falwell Jr.: Christianity Today is wrong about Trump – He is a champion for people of faith

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/jerry-falwell-jr-christianity-today-is-wrong-about-trump-he-is-a-champion-for-people-of-faith


Everyone has the right to voice their opinion and everyone has the right to decide which publications to read. Just as everyone has the right to determine what they believe in from what they hear and read.

There are a lot of publications out there.  As an example you can pick up and read "Mother Jones" and then pick up the "Epoch Times". Both publications declare that they are reporting the truth, but reports on the same stories and issues are exact opposites.

Bottom line for me (and everyone else is entitled to either agree or disagree):

#1  It has not been proven that Trump committed any high crimes and misdemeanors which are the grounds for impeachment as stipulated in the U.S. Constitution. Therefore, he is innocent.  He should have never been impeached in the first place.

#2 To impeach a president and ask him to step down simply because they don't like him or judge him from afar with a preconceived notion is just plain wrong.

#3 IF you deem that Trump is so detrimental to this country and has directed us in a more negative direction, then you are absolutely more than welcome to vote either 3rd party, abstain, or vote for one of the socialists running who will bring down our Republic.

Obviously, the choice to either support or go against this President is ultimately an individual one.