Nativity Scene Shows Holy Family Separated, Caged at U.S. Border

[sneakypete]

There is definitely a significant conservative portion UMC in the US.  Groups like the Confessing Movement, Good News, UMAction and Wesleyan Covenant Assocation have gained in strength and numbers.  If that turns the church or splits it apart will be a question that many within are already asking.

@thackney

"UMC"= United Methodist Conference,or whatever the official name is?

[TomSea]

Ignore the

 

[EasyAce]

Care to explain your basis for that claim?

@PeteS in CA
@Cyber Liberty
I can't speak to the specific claim, but I was put in mind of Jesus's distinction between Caesar and God, and of the sad fact in the eons that have passed since that people of various political stripes still seem to think that rendering unto Caesar equals Caesar's entitlement to make off with the whole pot.

[roamer_1]

@PeteS in CA
@Cyber Liberty
I can't speak to the specific claim, but I was put in mind of Jesus's distinction between Caesar and God, and of the sad fact in the eons that have passed since that people of various political stripes still seem to think that rendering unto Caesar equals Caesar's entitlement to make off with the whole pot.

That's a weird little passage, @EasyAce ... In fact, everything is God's, to include the breath in Caesar's lungs. It is fun to contemplate what Yeshua was saying from that angle...

[TomSea]

Looking over their website and location on Google Maps I'd guess it's a congregation of 100-300, depending on whether they share the parking lot of the neighboring bank. They have just one service on Sundays, so I would not be surprised if they're under 200 attendees. All ministerial staff are women, for whatever that's worth.

These are guesses too. I won't go into google maps but guessing attendance, one might wonder why they only have one service on Sunday. Many have two say.

[Cyber Liberty]

These are guesses too. I won't go into google maps but guessing attendance, one might wonder why they only have one service on Sunday. Many have two say.

Most UMCs have two:  One "Traditional" (Wesley hyms) and another "Modern-now-a-go-go"  (Guitar). 

[PeteS in CA]

These are guesses too. I won't go into google maps but guessing attendance, one might wonder why they only have one service on Sunday. Many have two say.

@Cyber Liberty mentioned one purpose for having multiple services. Another, possibly more common, is that the number of attendees exceeds the capacity of the room in which services are held. E.G., the church of which I am currently a member has four services, two Saturday evening, and two Sunday morning. Two, and possibly three, of those services are typically pretty full.

I inferred from the church having one Sunday service (and none on Saturday) that its sanctuary is large enough to accommodate all attendees.

[Cyber Liberty]

@Cyber Liberty mentioned one purpose for having multiple services. Another, possibly more common, is that the number of attendees exceeds the capacity of the room in which services are held. E.G., the church of which I am currently a member has four services, two Saturday evening, and two Sunday morning. Two, and possibly three, of those services are typically pretty full.

I inferred from the church having one Sunday service (and none on Saturday) that its sanctuary is large enough to accommodate all attendees.

That is a reasonable assumption.

[EasyAce]

That's a weird little passage, @EasyAce ... In fact, everything is God's, to include the breath in Caesar's lungs. It is fun to contemplate what Yeshua was saying from that angle...

@roamer_1
The actual quote from Christ, in the Gospel According to Matthew, is, Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's.

[roamer_1]

@roamer_1
The actual quote from Christ, in the Gospel According to Matthew, is, Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's.

@EasyAce
Right. And everything belongs to God. Even that which belongs to Caesar... There is a logic there to follow. This is a pretty typical Hebrew philosophical quip.

[EasyAce]

@EasyAce
Right. And everything belongs to God. Even that which belongs to Caesar... There is a logic there to follow.

@roamer_1
The trouble is that Caesar, or today's assorted governments, think everything belongs to them. The further trouble is who knows how many million people---in these United States and elsewhere---think likewise.

[Cyber Liberty]

@roamer_1
The trouble is that Caesar, or today's assorted governments, think everything belongs to them. The further trouble is who knows how many million people---in these United States and elsewhere---think likewise.

This is why I open any discussion with a suspected leftist with two questions:  "What is the purpose of money?  To whom does it belong?"  If I don't get "to distribute scarcity" and "the person who earned it," then the person is to the left.

[TomSea]

@Cyber Liberty mentioned one purpose for having multiple services. Another, possibly more common, is that the number of attendees exceeds the capacity of the room in which services are held. E.G., the church of which I am currently a member has four services, two Saturday evening, and two Sunday morning. Two, and possibly three, of those services are typically pretty full.

I inferred from the church having one Sunday service (and none on Saturday) that its sanctuary is large enough to accommodate all attendees.

And there are a lot of old churches around that are big and don't have high attendance. Maybe 40 people show up.

[PeteS in CA]

More about this "pastor" from https://hotair.com/archives/jazz-shaw/2019/12/10/nativity-scene-characters-cages-deemed-bold-statement/

As it turns out, this isn’t the first time Pastor Ristine has mangled the Nativity to invoke political debates. In 2014 she depicted Mary as a homeless person at a bus stop. The year before that she replaced Joseph with a representation of Trayvon Martin.

The pastor has also displayed Mary without Jesus to portray her as a single mother whose son is in prison. Another annual display created a desert scene reminiscent of Iraq with the Savior and His parents shown as war refugees.

Since the famous Kidz in Kages pics were published in 2014, I wonder why this "pastor" didn't do the current display 4 or 5 years ago.

[roamer_1]

@roamer_1
The trouble is that Caesar, or today's assorted governments, think everything belongs to them. The further trouble is who knows how many million people---in these United States and elsewhere---think likewise.

@EasyAce

Right... But no different than Rome... Or Greece, or Babylon, or Egypt...
in the end, the logic must be: Follow Man, or follow God. You cannot do both.

[roamer_1]

This is why I open any discussion with a suspected leftist with two questions:  "What is the purpose of money?  To whom does it belong?"  If I don't get "to distribute scarcity" and "the person who earned it," then the person is to the left.

@Cyber Liberty  @EasyAce

Here is a philosophical argument by/based in JD Unwin, which is a propos, and revealing.
U are here.

https://www.kirkdurston.com/blog/unwin

I thought to post it on it's own... It's a 'big think' thing...