Sweeping VA gun ban, likely confiscation without grandfather clause, proposed by state legislature

[Elderberry]

American Military News by Ryan Morgan  November 26, 2019

Sweeping VA gun ban, likely confiscation without grandfather clause, proposed by state legislature

Virginia lawmakers are now considering a state law banning the ownership of certain semi-automatic guns deemed “assault firearms” and limiting the magazine capacity of other firearms in the state — and there are no clauses that would allow existing owners to continue possessing them.

Virginia state Sen. Richard Saslaw introduced SB16, which would expand the definition of an “assault firearm” to cover many different semi-automatic rifles and pistols. The bill would call for the ban of such firearms, barring people from purchasing, possessing, selling or transferring those weapons.

Among the changes in firearm definitions, the bill would expand the term “assault firearm” to include semi-automatic centerfire rifles and pistols with a fixed magazine capacity greater than 10 rounds. The bill would also ban semi-automatic rifles and pistols with detachable magazines that also have folding and telescoping stocks, barrel shrouds, and thumbhole grips and second hand grips.

Rifles, under the new bill, would not be allowed pistol grips, bayonet mounts, grenade or flare launchers, silencers, muzzle breaks and flash suppressors.

More: https://americanmilitarynews.com/2019/11/sweeping-va-gun-ban-likely-confiscation-without-grandfather-clause-proposed-by-state-legislature/

[mountaineer]

Virginia proposes bill that outlaws minors using guns to fend off home invaders
Posted by Gregory Hoyt
 Nov 27, 2019

...   While legislators seek to enforce more tight and universal background checks and other gun control laws while within office, as usual, they have given attention to age restrictions on access to firearms.

One such bill is SB 18 Firearms; which includes language associated with criminal history record information checks, and most importantly age requirements with regard to handling firearms.   ...

Under this bill, it will be a class 1 misdemeanor to allow a child to use firearms, unless “under parental supervision.”

Essentially what this bill means is that in the event your child is in danger, regardless of their age and knowledge of handling firearms properly, any criminal who has the intent to do them harm can do so and they’ll be left helpless from a legal standpoint. ...

Full story at Law Enforcement Today

[Smokin Joe]

Eff the State, and protect your kids! If that means leaving a responsible and trained child access to a self defense firearm, so be it.

Our long guns were never locked up when we were kids. We knew that if we wanted to go shooting, we were to ask my father.
We didn't tough them otherwise, as we had no self-defense situations arise.
Had we done so, we knew that the penalty would have been stiff, that we would be denied shooting privileges or even hunting.

We also, as we grew older, knew where the pistols were kept, but likewise, didn't mess with them.

I often think gun control laws are a result of projection by whiny liberals who don't trust themselves or their get with a deadly weapon, while the remainder are a misguided attempt to keep criminals from harming them (so they won't need a weapon to defend themselves), which are rife with unintended consequences.

[mountaineer]

Virginia to OUTLAW Krav Maga, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, kickboxing, Tai Chi, firearms instruction and self-defense training under proposed law SB64
Mike Adams -
November 29, 2019

The State of Virginia, now entirely run by truly insane Democrats who support infanticide and child murder, is proposing a new 2020 law known as SB64 (see link here) which will be taken up by the Democrat-run Senate beginning January 8, 2020.

The law would instantly transform all martial arts instructors into criminal felons. This includes instructors who teach kickboxing, BJJ, Krav Maga, boxing and even Capoeira.

It would also criminalize all firearms training classes, including concealed carry classes. ...

More

[sneakypete]

Virginia to OUTLAW Krav Maga, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, kickboxing, Tai Chi, firearms instruction and self-defense training under proposed law SB64
Mike Adams -
November 29, 2019 More

@mountaineer

Here is an excellent idea for a new bumper sticker for someone that wants to make a few bucks.

"Virginia,the East Coast California!"

[skeeter]

@mountaineer

Here is an excellent idea for a new bumper sticker for someone that wants to make a few bucks.

"Virginia,the East Coast California!"

Nope. Our local leftist lunatics haven't even gone this far yet.

[sneakypete]

Nope. Our local leftist lunatics haven't even gone this far yet.

@skeeter

The key word is "yet". Northern Virginia now dominates the state,and they are only going to go further left with every day that passes.

[Smokin Joe]

So, are they going to close the Farm? Quantico?

The law doesn't state which side of the civil disorder the skills would be used on. just that they would be used in civil disorder.

[mystery-ak]

 Gun Confiscation Comes to Virginia
See what happens when a formerly great red state turns very blue?
by Jed Babbin
December 2, 2019, 12:05 AM

Next year, Democrats will control both houses of Virginia’s state Legislature as well as its governorship. On November 18, State Sen. Dick Saslaw introduced a bill that he will sponsor in the 2020 legislative session. That bill will outlaw not only the sale or transfer but also the possession of certain firearms.

Saslaw’s bill — SB 16 — provides that “It is unlawful for any person to import, sell, manufacture, purchase, possess or transport an assault firearm” and makes such actions a Class 6 felony. (In Virginia, Class 6 felonies are punishable by imprisonment for between one and five years.)

SB 16 provides that a wide range of center-fire rifles, pistols, and shotguns are included in the definition of to-be illegal firearms:

    1. A semi-automatic center-fire rifle that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material with a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 10 rounds;

    2. A semi-automatic center-fire rifle that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine and has one of the following characteristics: (i) a folding or telescoping stock; (ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the rifle; (iii) a thumbhole stock; (iv) a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand; (v) a bayonet mount; (vi) a grenade launcher; (vii) a flare launcher; (viii) a silencer; (ix) a flash suppressor; (x) a muzzle brake; (xi) a muzzle compensator; (xii) a threaded barrel capable of accepting (a) a silencer, (b) a flash suppressor, (c) a muzzle brake, or (d) a muzzle compensator; or (xiii) any characteristic of like kind as enumerated in clauses (i) through (xii);

    3. A semi-automatic center-fire pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material with a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 10 rounds;

    4. A semi-automatic center-fire pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine and has one of the following characteristics: (i) a folding or telescoping stock; (ii) a thumbhole stock; (iii) a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand; (iv) the capacity to accept a magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip; (v) a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the pistol with the non-trigger hand without being burned; (vi) a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; (vii) a threaded barrel capable of accepting (a) a silencer, (b) a flash suppressor, (c) a barrel extender, or (d) a forward handgrip; or (viii) any characteristic of like kind as enumerated in clauses (i) through (vii);

    5. A shotgun with a revolving cylinder that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material; or

    6. A semi-automatic shotgun that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material that has one of the following characteristics: (i) a folding or telescoping stock, (ii) a thumbhole stock, (iii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the shotgun, (iv) the ability to accept a detachable magazine, (v) a fixed magazine capacity in excess of seven rounds, or (vi) any characteristic of like kind as enumerated in clauses (i) through (v).

more
https://spectator.org/gun-confiscation-comes-to-virginia/

[Smokin Joe]

Well, that's a state I won't live in again, unless this crap is repealed.

A semi-automatic center-fire rifle that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine and has one of the following characteristics: (i) a folding or telescoping stock; (ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the rifle; (iii) a thumbhole stock; (iv) a second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand

Fore grip,anyone? You're supposed to shoot the rifle one-handed?

(Never mind the technicality that smokeless powders are propellants, not explosives).

[Fishrrman]

Who would have ever thought that a key southern state would turn so corkscrew crazy ???

[240B]

Who would have ever thought that a key southern state would turn so corkscrew crazy ???

Virginia hasn't been a 'southern State' in years. It has morphed into a suburb of D.C.

[Smokin Joe]

Virginia hasn't been a 'southern State' in years. It has morphed into a suburb of D.C.

Northern Va has been a whole different place from the rest of the State for 40 years. Unfortunately, people from elsewhere dominate the politics there.

[Smokin Joe]

Solid propellants like black and smokeless powders are low-order explosives.

Yeah, the government can define a gun stock as a machine gun, too.
Doesn't make it so.

[skeeter]

Northern Va has been a whole different place from the rest of the State for 40 years. Unfortunately, people from elsewhere dominate the politics there.

It's just a smaller version of California now.

[Smokin Joe]

Single base smokeless powder is primarily nitrocellulose, an explosive. Double-base gunpowder is 40 percent nitroglycerin and 60 percent nitrocellulose.

Say again how smokeless powder is Not an Explosive?

C4 and black powder ARE explosives.

What's the source? What smokeless powders were used? Etc. I have a snippet out of context and that doesn't mean anything to me.

[Hoodat]

It would also criminalize all firearms training classes .  .  .

As a kid growing up in Virginia, I learned firearm safety from an NRA Hunter Safety Course taught during Kiwanis Summer Camp.

[Smokin Joe]

Black powder is a low explosive. It deflagrates. It does not detonate. I have only ever found one report of a test where they were successful, one time,  of achieving a high order detonation of black powder.  Smokeless powder deflagrates when used as a propellant, but it Can be caused to go high order and detonate.

This was just the first hit I came across doing a google search: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/262559143_Detonation_velocities_of_single_and_double_base_propellants

I discovered double base powders were easily detonatable some 40 yrs ago.

In the application in question, being used to propel a bullet out of a barrel, smokeless powders are a propellant.
If they detonate, that's a problem. That was and remains my point.
I vaguely recall some issues with undercapacity reloads which experienced detonation, years ago.
But for the application in question, the point is, that smokeless powders deflagrate, they don't detonate.

[Axeslinger]

Well, that's a state I won't live in again, unless this crap is repealed.
Fore grip,anyone? You're supposed to shoot the rifle one-handed?

(Never mind the technicality that smokeless powders are propellants, not explosives).

Like many states, Virginia as a state is corrupted by the urban areas.   NorthernVirginia, Richmond and the large black population in the Norfolk area are the problem.   The western 2/3s of the state are solid conservative.  In fact there are several counties in western VA, that have already declared themselves 2A sanctuaries.   

Here is a link to one county sheriff’s  Facebook page and his letter to the county:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2725943877492508&id=151261931627395&_ft_=mf_story_key.2725943877492508%3Atop_level_post_id.2725943877492508%3Atl_objid.2725943877492508%3Acontent_owner_id_new.151261931627395%3Athrowback_story_fbid.2725943877492508%3Apage_id.151261931627395%3Aphoto_id.2725942330825996%3Astory_location.4%3Astory_attachment_style.photo%3Apage_insights.%7B%22151261931627395%22%3A%7B%22page_id%22%3A151261931627395%2C%22actor_id%22%3A151261931627395%2C%22dm%22%3A%7B%22isShare%22%3A0%2C%22originalPostOwnerID%22%3A0%7D%2C%22psn%22%3A%22EntStatusCreationStory%22%2C%22post_context%22%3A%7B%22object_fbtype%22%3A266%2C%22publish_time%22%3A1574694889%2C%22story_name%22%3A%22EntStatusCreationStory%22%2C%22story_fbid%22%3A%5B2725943877492508%5D%7D%2C%22role%22%3A1%2C%22sl%22%3A4%2C%22targets%22%3A%5B%7B%22actor_id%22%3A151261931627395%2C%22page_id%22%3A151261931627395%2C%22post_id%22%3A2725943877492508%2C%22role%22%3A1%2C%22share_id%22%3A0%7D%5D%7D%7D&__tn__=%2As%2As-R

It passed unanimously.

[Smokin Joe]

So do you now agree that smokeless powders are explosives? If they can detonate they fit the definition of an explosive, right?

C4 is an explosive that can be lit and used to cook your dinner with and not explode. But it still is an explosive.

You admitted that black powder is an explosive, but it does not detonate. It only deflagrates(burns very fast), very similar to smokeless powder when used as a propellant and not as a high order explosive.

Whoa, there.

You're changing horses here. Black Powder is a low order explosive. That isn't saying it can't be used as a propellant, because it has been. It becomes a question of application.
Can smokeless powders be used to cause an explosion? Yes. A bit of plumbing material, and the pressures will build to the point you get catastrophic failure of the containment vessel. A lot depends on the flame front geometry and pressure spikes, which is why low powder charges in large cartridge cases are believed to have been a problem.
But by the same token, a hot water heater with a faulty shutoff and plugged relief valve can take a house apart, too.

In firearms, the application is that of propellant. An explosion is not a desired effect.
Sure, you can warm your Ham and MFers over a bit of C-4, too, but the desired effect, what it was made to do is something other than stove fuel.

But like I said, if the legislature writes that cattle shall henceforth be "ducks", then for lawyers, it's ducks they are.
This would be far from the first time that technical definitions were steamrolled by legislative BS.

[Hoodat]

In fact there are several counties in western VA, that have already declared themselves 2A sanctuaries.

@Axeslinger

[sneakypete]

@Axeslinger

@Hoodat

Yes,but can they get away with that according to Va law?

[Hoodat]

@Hoodat

Yes,but can they get away with that according to Va law?

That will depend on the Virginia Supreme Court.  In Nunn v. Georgia, the Georgia Supreme Court ruled that a state ban on firearms was a violation of the Second Amendment to the US Constitution.  The Virginia Supreme Court could do the same.

[sneakypete]

That will depend on the Virginia Supreme Court.  In Nunn v. Georgia, the Georgia Supreme Court ruled that a state ban on firearms was a violation of the Second Amendment to the US Constitution.  The Virginia Supreme Court could do the same.

@Hoodat

Are you aware of any indications on how they would vote?

[Hoodat]

@Hoodat

Are you aware of any indications on how they would vote?

The court is pretty evenly split:

Chaffin - the sister of a GOP legislator

Mims - Former GOP Attorney General

McCullough - Served under GOP AGs Mims and Cuccinelli

Kelsey - Appointed as appellate judge by Democrat Mark Warner

Powell - Appointed as appellate judge by Democrat Tim Kaine

Goodwyn - Vacancy appointment to Supreme Court by Democrat Tim Kaine

Lemons - Appointed Circuit Court judge by Republican George Allen.  Recommended for US 4th District court position by Senators Webb-D and Warner-R.

Supreme court justices are appointed by the Legislature and serve 12-year terms.