Socialism talk will sink Democrats: How left-wing overreach could backfire big-time in 2020

[Dexter]

Currency is not the root of all evil.  The lust for currency is the root of a lot of it, usually powered by envy.

Either way I think humanity will eventually outgrow currency.

[Cyber Liberty]

I believe Dex's point here is that not everybody will be able to "repair the robots".  If they did, you wouldn't make a living where you would retire at 60.

Supply and demand.

BTW....don't forget that can of Lysol and a paper towel before you touch that fecal-filled touch-screen to place your order.   

No, not everybody can fix the robots.  There are people who think a college education is the be-all end-all, while snubbing people who get their fingernails dirty fixing robots.  The Liberal Arts wise guys are the ones who will end up raiding the back of garbage trucks to eat.

And, yeah about the touch screens.   

[Cyber Liberty]

Either way I think humanity will eventually outgrow currency.

Maybe.  If we do, it will be the breaking of a thousands-year-old order.  You can count on resistance.

[Dexter]

You can count on resistance.

That's usually the case for anything worth doing. 

[Cyber Liberty]

That's usually the case for anything worth doing. 

Your comments on this thread make a pretty good case for resisting your utopia that you would have to enforce universal submission to accomplish.  Not everybody thinks socialism is a wonderful thing that just hasn't been tried by the right people (you).

You may go to Hell for it, but the rest of us will be damned if we let you and your friends try to drag us to Hell with you.  Count on it.

[Dexter]

you and your friends

There aren't a lot of people that would consider me a political ally. Conservatives call me a socialist and liberals call me a fascist.

I'd like to think that deep down you and others here have seen enough of me to know my views are more complex than that, but maybe not.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

I can't wait until we finally get past currency and move on to a proper barter based economy.

I get so tired of using a credit card when I buy gas just because that ahole won't accept ten chickens.

[Cyber Liberty]

There aren't a lot of people that would consider me a political ally. Conservatives call me a socialist and liberals call me a fascist.

I'd like to think that deep down you and others here have seen enough of me to know my views are more complex than that, but maybe not.

It's hard to tell when you never move past talking points you repeat over and over.  We've seen enough to form opinions, I can assure you.

[roamer_1]

And it's not if the robots take over work, it's when they do. What other options are there? Production needs will be met by intelligent technology. What happens after that seems obvious and inevitable.

Again, bass-ackwards. Intelligent technology producing WHAT? If no one has jobs no one can afford to buy that which  is being produced. So the market dies and robots are idled. At that point, the people are what is expendable. But ten there is even less production, and even less money, and the whole thing just goes to shit.

The inevitable end is an upperclass that doesn't need to work because they have the money for the robots and they serve only themselves, and a serf class that is basically ignored by the upper class and the government (because government follows the money), and in the mean time the serf class has to get along without money and without land and without industry... THAT is your inevitable end...

[Dexter]

Intelligent technology producing WHAT?

Whatever people need.

If no one has jobs no one can afford to buy that which  is being produced. So the market dies and robots are idled. At that point, the people are what is expendable. But ten there is even less production, and even less money, and the whole thing just goes to shit.

Before currency could be phased out there'd have to be a period where people are given allowances that keep the economy alive. Universal basic income will happen. Again, I see this as inevitable. There's no way to stop technology from ravaging the job market.

The inevitable end is an upperclass that doesn't need to work because they have the money for the robots and they serve only themselves, and a serf class that is basically ignored by the upper class and the government (because government follows the money), and in the mean time the serf class has to get along without money and without land and without industry... THAT is your inevitable end...

My generation and the ones that follow it won't let it go down like that.

[roamer_1]

I think one day automation will progress to the point where basic needs (not wants, though that will come too for many) can be supplied by machines that are serviced by machines that are serviced by other machines.  Some people will always want more than just the basics, and they will work, innovate, etc, to get there.  Some won't.  As much as I hate to say it, I think a universal basic income is inevitable (did I mention I hate to say it?).

What I don't see is some sort of destruction of human society because "no one" can "find" a job.  Sure, I might have to spend all day fishing and posting online videos to make a few extra bucks, but I can live with that if I really have to.

I don't think so. Right now, basic needs are almost free. If you plant your own garden and raise a few chickens and rabbits, Hunt and fish a bit and buy long on rice and beans, you can have your belly full for very little per day. If I were well enough to walk off, I could literally live for free, just on forage, trapping and hunting. Nobody does that. Even our poor 'require' more than that.

The truth of it is, as long as someone has something someone else wants, that feller is going to figure out how to get that thing, and a voluntary transaction will take place. Barter or currency, or gold itself, that is capitalism, and it will never go away. And you will always have to grind off your nose. With all the gains in technology, that has never changed because it is the nature of life. Doesn't matter if you don;t have a dime, the work is still there. Just different.

The utopian life of ease that folks think will come of technology will never, ever occur.

[roamer_1]

Whatever people need.

LOL! With what means of exchange? With what determining value? Do you think it will just be given to you?

ROTFLMAO!!!
Never ever going to happen.

Before currency could be phased out there'd have to be a period where people are given allowances that keep the economy alive. Universal basic income will happen. Again, I see this as inevitable. There's no way to stop technology from ravaging the job market.

You assume the job market to be a static pie. That is never true.

My generation and the ones that follow it won't let it go down like that.

The way you are talking, yes, that is exactly what you will do.

[roamer_1]

I think you underestimate humanity.

I think you overestimate technology.

[roamer_1]

Your comments on this thread make a pretty good case for resisting your utopia that you would have to enforce universal submission to accomplish.  Not everybody thinks socialism is a wonderful thing that just hasn't been tried by the right people (you).

You may go to Hell for it, but the rest of us will be damned if we let you and your friends try to drag us to Hell with you.  Count on it.

Damn straight. Smells like socialism to me. And it has not worked in a hundred iterations. It always promises utopia, it always delivers death. Folks don't know how precious liberty is.

[roamer_1]

There aren't a lot of people that would consider me a political ally. Conservatives call me a socialist and liberals call me a fascist.

I'd like to think that deep down you and others here have seen enough of me to know my views are more complex than that, but maybe not.

Complex perhaps, but entirely lacking in wisdom. No offense meant.

[roamer_1]

I can't wait until we finally get past currency and move on to a proper barter based economy.

I get so tired of using a credit card when I buy gas just because that ahole won't accept ten chickens.

How will you mash em in that tiny little slot, anyway?

[sneakypete]

Maybe.  If we do, it will be the breaking of a thousands-year-old order.  You can count on resistance.

@Cyber Liberty

DUHHHHH! Money/wealth is something real you can hold in your hands to protect,or to give to someone else. Digital numbers on a screen represent nothing but digital numbers. The INSTANT the government or a talented hacker takes a dislike to you,ALL your wealth can disappear in the blink of an eye with digital "wealth",and it will be like it never existed to start with,and you can't prove it ever did exist.

And do not even TRY to say this won't happen. It CAN happen,and anything that CAN happen WILL happen as long as there is someone around who can profit from it.

[sneakypete]

That's usually the case for anything worth doing. 

@Dexter

You need to study a little history and learn to be vewwy,vewwy careful about what you ask for,lest you get it.

[sneakypete]

There aren't a lot of people that would consider me a political ally. Conservatives call me a socialist and liberals call me a fascist.

@Dexter

And?????

Are you so confused you don't understand they are often/always the same people?

[sneakypete]

I can't wait until we finally get past currency and move on to a proper barter based economy.

I get so tired of using a credit card when I buy gas just because that ahole won't accept ten chickens.

@InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

Credit cards are credit. They don't represent assets. YOU are in control of the assets you use to pay off the credit cards.

Granted,there is a huge gray area involved in banking because you are trusting your fluid assets to some butthole sitting behind a desk,but if you know where he lives that gives you some room to negotiate the return of your cash.

With real physical assets,you can't take them with you when you go somewhere,so it is up to you to pay attention to who you elect to represent you in government,because government is the ultimate bully that decides who owns what.

[sneakypete]

Whatever people need.

How are the people going to pay for it? Will you be pimping out your wife and daughters?

Before currency could be phased out there'd have to be a period where people are given allowances that keep the economy alive. Universal basic income will happen. Again, I see this as inevitable. There's no way to stop technology from ravaging the job market.

Does this textbook start out with "Once upon a time....."?

My generation and the ones that follow it won't let it go down like that.

Yeah,causen yew bees special little sun flowers,right? No matter how many times you sing "When you wish upon a star",it's still nothing but a goofy song.

Just out of curiosity,what do you think "the natives" will do with all the free time they suddenly have to wonder where their next meal will be coming from?

[sneakypete]

Complex perhaps, but entirely lacking in wisdom. No offense meant.

@Dexter  @roamer_1

I think a better way to word that would be to say "....entirely lacking in experience."

The Utopian Left ALWAYS overlook the natural NEED to produce some sort of work that is innate to most of humanity. It is mans NATURE to create and evolve through our work and our thoughts. Remove this and you remove our humanity and end up with nothing but useless trust fund children good for nothing but target practice as the oxygen thieves they are.

[LMAO]

Your comments on this thread make a pretty good case for resisting your utopia that you would have to enforce universal submission to accomplish.  Not everybody thinks socialism is a wonderful thing that just hasn't been tried by the right people (you).

You may go to Hell for it, but the rest of us will be damned if we let you and your friends try to drag us to Hell with you.  Count on it.

Anyone can be for anything. You can even vote for candidates that support your vision of what the country should be. The problem is forcing that vision onto others

I see basic Universal income mentioned. Finland tried it and abandoned it. To give people basic universal income, the money has to be there and come from somewhere. The money would be printed and distributed so you would get a check that’s worthless due to inflation

All this will be debated and fought. Our young friend and his cohorts are under the impression that all they want they should get with no resistance simply because they want them

[DCPatriot]

Anyone can be for anything. You can even vote for candidates that support your vision of what the country should be. The problem is forcing that vision onto others

I see basic Universal income mentioned. Finland tried it and abandoned it. To give people basic universal income, the money has to be there and come from somewhere. The money would be printed and distributed so you would get a check that’s worthless due to inflation

The churches used to care for their less fortunate flock.  Too bad nobody attends anymore.

Ironically, the last best hope to sustain that lies with the Catholic Hispanic immigrant.  Legal or otherwise.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

The churches used to care for their less fortunate flock.  Too bad nobody attends anymore.

Ironically, the last best hope to sustain that lies with the Catholic Hispanic immigrant.  Legal or otherwise.

Gee Whiz, who'd a thunk?

Cut taxes and private charity goes up.