Author Topic: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass  (Read 8148 times)

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Online Cyber Liberty

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #100 on: November 17, 2018, 11:46:19 pm »
I don't recall any 'due process' issues when they booted Helen Thomas from the White House Press Corps.  Has the Constitution changed since Trump took office?

I don't think they took her "permanent press pass."  I daresay Bush was a bit more...diplomatic about it.  But Helen was just irritating, I thought.  Accostya was a bit more...than that.
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #101 on: November 17, 2018, 11:49:36 pm »
Georgetown Law’s Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection Files Amicus Brief on Behalf of Reporters Committee in CNN v. Trump

I've heard if you pair up an amicus brief with a 5-dollar bill you can buy a black coffee at Starbucks. 

Just about all the "news organizations" (including Fox) filed briefs to try to entangle this with 1st Amendment rights
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Online Elderberry

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #102 on: November 17, 2018, 11:53:15 pm »
I don't think they took her "permanent press pass."  I daresay Bush was a bit more...diplomatic about it.  But Helen was just irritating, I thought.  Accostya was a bit more...than that.

They never revoked her press pass that I know of. She was forced to resign though.

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #103 on: November 18, 2018, 12:00:01 am »
Pulling Acosta's press pass was just a "test case".

How long will it be before there no longer is a White House Press Corps?

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #104 on: November 18, 2018, 12:11:43 am »
They never revoked her press pass that I know of. She was forced to resign though.

No, she was back in her front-row chair within the month.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #105 on: November 18, 2018, 12:12:18 am »
Pulling Acosta's press pass was just a "test case".

How long will it be before there no longer is a White House Press Corps?

Is that a trick question?
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Offline aligncare

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #106 on: November 18, 2018, 12:13:03 am »
Pulling Acosta's press pass was just a "test case".

How long will it be before there no longer is a White House Press Corps?

Not soon enough.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #107 on: November 18, 2018, 12:13:22 am »
How long will it be before there no longer is a White House Press Corps?

Hopefully, before Christmas.
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Offline endicom

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #108 on: November 18, 2018, 12:25:26 am »
https://openjurist.org/569/f2d/124/sherrill-v-h-knight

The District Court based its requirement of a written decision upon its determination that denial of a White House press pass to a bona fide journalist violates the first amendment unless it furthers a compelling governmental interest identified by narrowly and specifically drawn standards.


What is a 'bona fide' journalist? Journalists are not licensed in the US. If you act in the capacity of a journalist then you are one.


Offline the_doc

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #109 on: November 18, 2018, 12:30:59 am »

What is a 'bona fide' journalist? Journalists are not licensed in the US. If you act in the capacity of a journalist then you are one.

"Bona fide" will likely never be defined.  It's sort of like the NFL's vagueness about what they called "a football move."  (Did they every wind up defining that?)

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #110 on: November 18, 2018, 12:32:35 am »

What is a 'bona fide' journalist? Journalists are not licensed in the US. If you act in the capacity of a journalist then you are one.

Therefore Alex Jones should have a pass.  I'm good...anything to throw a handful of sand in the gears.
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #111 on: November 18, 2018, 12:50:52 am »
In case anyone is wondering,  this judge is coloring WAY outside the lines here and I fervently wish the president would tell him so.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #112 on: November 18, 2018, 01:18:21 am »
In case anyone is wondering,  this judge is coloring WAY outside the lines here and I fervently wish the president would tell him so.

Don't they all color outside of the lines?  I imagine all judges think of the lines as one big, empty canvas to emote to their heart's content.

This is why most Normals think the legal profession is gone beyond repair.  Shakespeare was right.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #113 on: November 18, 2018, 01:24:04 am »
Don't they all color outside of the lines?  I imagine all judges think of the lines as one big, empty canvas to emote to their heart's content.

This is why most Normals think the legal profession is gone beyond repair.  Shakespeare was right.

If no one is willing to stop their coloring outside the lines they will keep right on doing it. They've gotten away with it for so long they think they are entitled to do it.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #114 on: November 18, 2018, 01:29:49 am »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #115 on: November 18, 2018, 01:34:35 am »
If no one is willing to stop their coloring outside the lines they will keep right on doing it. They've gotten away with it for so long they think they are entitled to do it.

That's why they call it the swamp.  Nobody ever said it's going to be easy.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Online Elderberry

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #116 on: November 18, 2018, 01:40:12 am »
                                                                             

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #117 on: November 18, 2018, 01:44:16 am »
Exactly. The daily presser is NOT mandatory, or under any jurisdiction. Sanders could simply call in sick, and say that she just didn't feel like it. There is no imperative to have one every day. They could easily just shut the whole thing down.


@240B

Uhhh,not really. These press conferences are how the WH spins the news to make themselves look good,or to try to influence votes in the House or Senate without having to issue and official proclamation.

It's a mutual benefit thing for both the press and the WH.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #118 on: November 18, 2018, 01:45:15 am »
In other breaking news,President Trump has sent a personal message to the judge and to CNN that says "Go piss up a rope."
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #119 on: November 18, 2018, 02:22:26 am »
As I understand it, the judge sided with Acosta on the grounds that 1st Amendment rights (and "due process stuff," perhaps) implicitly demand that the White House have written rules for proper behavior in the White House. 

If that is his position, then the judge is a MORAL NINCOMPOOP, in my opinion.  He is a self-righteous LEGALIST who falsely invokes the Constitution under the assumption that must misapply it to reign in a tyrannical POTUS.  (Dear, dear.)  But since the POTUS is not behaving as a tyrant, the judge is.  The judge is snaky, not Solomonic. 

The President's position may be distasteful, but it is necessary.  The judge should have dismissed the case.  The matter was clearly none of his snotty business.  The President has the transcendental right to enforce even unwritten rules of decency and order in his own White House.

(I assume that Trump thought the guy he was appointing is a conservative;  perhaps the guy himself thinks he is a conservative.  But the judge is a actually the archenemy of true conservativism, i.e., the Constitutional kind.  He is legislating from the bench by ordering more regs from the Executive Branch. That is not a conservative approach.  It is part of the Creeping Destruction of our civil society.  It is ultimately anti-Christian--which is why it is happening so much in our day of pervasive reprobation.  And whether or not Trump is a genuine Christian, he is being mauled by MSM and by bad judges precisely because he identifies with Christians and presides accordingly.  The poor judge has not the faintest idea what he is doing.) 

***

At the bottom line, we have a lot of really bad conservatives in all branches of our government.  To borrow prince Hal's line, "The first thing we need to do is kill all the lawyers."

That was my first thought. Separation of Powers anyone? This isn't a court, and due process is not necessary, particularly since this wasn't an entire news organization, but one reporter.

Nonetheless, I think the sentiment that it might backfire on the media may just be right. They threw Trump in the briar patch.
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Offline the_doc

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #120 on: November 18, 2018, 02:25:23 am »
@Cyber Liberty
@Hoodat
@Elderberry

I don't care what the judge says.

If the plaintiff's special rights were not being violated by a process failure, then no special process was at issue, i.e. no tedious "process" was due.
.
The press pass did constitute a "right" for Acosta to be in the conference room.  That might sound like a special right indeed, but it was a sovereignly granted right--not an innate right for Acosta in particular, not a sacred/protected right that was merely formalized by the pass.  Unfortunately, the judge treated this "right" as a specially protected right precisely because Acosta was made a member of the White House PRESS corps.  In short, the case was implicitly being handled as a 1st Amendment case even though the judge tried to say otherwise.

The judge wound up on the wrong side by snarling issues together and pretending that he was not snarling issues together.  He's not a clear enough thinker to issue an unimpeachably honest ruling.  His ruling is stupid.  It is clearly not right for Trump not to summarily remove a disruptive jerk from the Press Corps.  (Heck, it one wants to talk about "process," how about the White House "process" of patiently tolerating Acosta's inarguably bad behavior for way too long?)

(By the way, does the White House now have to draft written rules that also say that a reporter is not allowed to chew tobacco and spit on the conference room floor?  Reductio ad absurdum.)

I gather from Elderberry's post of the Schiller link (and case summary) that Judge Kelly actually followed the Schiller case's ruling in reaching his own decision in the Acosta case.  But the crux of the Schiller case was the 1st Amendment itself.  The Schiller case ruling found that press credentialing has to follow a clear protocol--not using seemingly capricious/political criteria for denying credentials.   

Kelly evidently used the Schiller ruling to jump right past any argument as to whether the 1st Amendment applied in Acosta's case.  Kelly started off with the position that the 1st Amendment definitely applies in cases like Acosta's case.    

What could be more obvious (by the way)?  The peculiar thing about this obvious legal presupposition is that it allows Kelly to claim that Acosta's case was "not a 1st Amendment case," whereas it necessarily was.  (Again, what could be more obvious?) 

Therefore, the judge's insistence that the Acosta case was not a 1st Amendment case is terribly misleading. 

Worse still, the legal parsing gives Kelly cover for a lousy ruling ostensibly centering on due process, as though it is not a matter of due process centered on the 1st Amendment.   Consider this:  Acosta's refusal to yield the floor and hand back the microphone, followed by Acosta trying to grab it back (and also laying a hand on the WH intern during that struggle), should not be covered by "due process protocols."  The only "process" that was Acosta's "due" was obviously a summary dismissal.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2018, 02:26:25 am by the_doc »

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #121 on: November 18, 2018, 02:30:37 am »
@Cyber Liberty
@Hoodat
@Elderberry

I gather from Elderberry's post of the Schiller link (and case summary) that Judge Kelly actually followed the Schiller case's ruling in reaching his own decision in the Acosta case.  But the crux of the Schiller case was the 1st Amendment itself.  The Schiller case ruling found that press credentialing has to follow a clear protocol--not using seemingly capricious/political criteria for denying credentials.   

Kelly evidently used the Schiller ruling to jump right past any argument as to whether the 1st Amendment applied in Acosta's case.  Kelly started off with the position that the 1st Amendment definitely applies in cases like Acosta's case.    

What could be more obvious (by the way)?  The peculiar thing about this obvious legal presupposition is that it allows Kelly to claim that Acosta's case was "not a 1st Amendment case," whereas it necessarily was.  (Again, what could be more obvious?) 

Therefore, the judge's insistence that the Acosta case was not a 1st Amendment case is terribly misleading. 

Worse still, the legal parsing gives Kelly cover for a lousy ruling ostensibly centering on due process, as though it is not a matter of due process centered on the 1st Amendment.   Consider this:  Acosta's refusal to yield the floor and hand back the microphone, followed by Acosta trying to grab it back (and also laying a hand on the WH intern during that struggle), should not be covered by "due process protocols."  The only "process" that was Acosta's "due" was obviously a summary dismissal.

A summary dismissal is what this judges order richly deserves and I fervently wish the president would do that.
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- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline RetBobbyMI

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #122 on: November 18, 2018, 02:43:55 pm »
If no one is willing to stop their coloring outside the lines they will keep right on doing it. They've gotten away with it for so long they think they are entitled to do it.
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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #123 on: November 18, 2018, 02:58:11 pm »
Not soon enough.

Would you feel that way if it was a Democrat President doing the same thing?  :whistle:
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Re: Breaking- Federal Judge orders WH to reinstate Acosta's Press Pass
« Reply #124 on: November 18, 2018, 03:03:12 pm »
I don't think they took her "permanent press pass."  I daresay Bush was a bit more...diplomatic about it.  But Helen was just irritating, I thought.  Accostya was a bit more...than that.

@Cyber Liberty

Helen Thomas stayed in the WH Press Pool way longer than she should have been allowed because she was Helen Thomas.

She wasn't writing for a wire service...she didn't have a daily byline in a newspaper or a magazine and IIRC she wasn't in syndication anywhere at the time the Bush WH told her to step aside.  She occupied the first chair in the room which meant she almost always got the chance to ask the first question in any presser...a spot that should have gone to a reporter with a regular beat.

She didn't deserve to be in the room anymore but everyone was scared to tell her.

The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!