Dead in cars and homes: Northern California fire toll at 29

[Smokin Joe]

Why would that be?

Maybe because no one in CA has the sense to start a series of prescribed burns in a canyon near the top and work their way down slope with each succeeding burn.

[mirraflake]

God Almighty.

How do these fires get so huge and out of hand before they can be contained?

Ca has had drought conditions  for years which has not helped.
@CatherineofAragon

[Sanguine]

Maybe because no one in CA has the sense to start a series of prescribed burns in a canyon near the top and work their way down slope with each succeeding burn.

Could be.  I do know we have lots of dry land with juniper and pine trees and really rough canyons and not a whole lot of water.  And, of course those areas are beautiful, so lots of development there. 

[Frank Cannon]

Maybe because no one in CA has the sense to start a series of prescribed burns in a canyon near the top and work their way down slope with each succeeding burn.

Right there is the problem. So one cleans these areas up because the Libs living there don't want anything touched. Mother Nature will correct that no matter what.

[Sanguine]

Right there is the problem. So one cleans these areas up because the Libs living there don't want anything touched. Mother Nature will correct that no matter what.

And, Mother Nature did just that, didn't she?

[thackney]

Ca has had drought conditions  for years which has not helped.
@CatherineofAragon

Has it been years without mudslides from heavy rains?

This area North of San Fransico of the Camp Fire has not been in drought condition for years.

[skeeter]

Right there is the problem. So one cleans these areas up because the Libs living there don't want anything touched. Mother Nature will correct that no matter what.

I don't think the folks living in the burned areas are the problem. The environmentalist lobbyists living in Sacramento are.

[sneakypete]

Why would that be?

@Sanguine

Besides not getting the wind gusts in the flatlands that you get in the mountains,the terrain in Texas is MUCH easier for the fire crews to maneuver in to set back fires,dig fire lines,get pumper trucks to hot spots,etc,etc,etc.

Even if you can see where you need to get in the mountains,that doesn't mean you can get there the same day.

[Sanguine]

@Sanguine

Besides not getting the wind gusts in the flatlands that you get in the mountains,the terrain in Texas is MUCH easier for the fire crews to maneuver in to set back fires,dig fire lines,get pumper trucks to hot spots,etc,etc,etc.

Even if you can see where you need to get in the mountains,that doesn't mean you can get there the same day.

I grew up in the Hill Country, Pete.  You want to talk about steep canyons and hostile territory, we got it.  There are flat areas of Texas of course, like Levelland, but much of it is not at all flat.  I've spent time on fires that go on for days and the fire equipment can't get to it because of the terrain.

[thackney]

@Sanguine

Besides not getting the wind gusts in the flatlands...

I take it you have never been to Lubbock...

[sneakypete]

I grew up in the Hill Country, Pete.  You want to talk about steep canyons and hostile territory, we got it.  There are flat areas of Texas of course, like Levelland, but much of it is not at all flat.  I've spent time on fires that go on for days and the fire equipment can't get to it because of the terrain.

@Sanguine

And no matter how bad it is there,it is far worse in the mountains.

[sneakypete]

I take it you have never been to Lubbock...

No,I haven't,but I have spent time in the  mountains,and other than tornadoes,the flat lands have nothing to compare.

[Sanguine]

@Sanguine

And no matter how bad it is there,it is far worse in the mountains.

I've spent time in both Texas and CA.  And, actually fought fires in Texas.  I'll stand by my statement, but you're free to continue to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

[sneakypete]

I've spent time in both Texas and CA.  And, actually fought fires in Texas.  I'll stand by my statement, but you're free to continue to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

@Sanguine

 Gee,that's awful open-minded of you!

Ever fought fires in the mountains?

[DB]

Has it been years without mudslides from heavy rains?

This area North of San Fransico of the Camp Fire has not been in drought condition for years.

Look for an older drought map. There was a lot of rain there last year, remember the failing dam?

[Sanguine]

@Sanguine

 Gee,that's awful open-minded of you!

Ever fought fires in the mountains?

Open minded has nothing to do with.  Not liking condescending and contrarian are more to the point.

This may help you understand.  If not 

[DB]

The winds picked up a fire started by poor forest management @DB

The Camp fire looks like it started on private property from a PG&E power line problem.

Any ignition source this time of year coupled with very high winds will be an inferno. Period.

Now, I'm not saying California hasn't done a lot of stupid things with its environmentalism laws/rules. It has.

But the Camp fire was huge because of a combination of location, very dry ground, low humidity and very high winds.

Regarding prescribed burns, they still occur in California in the area I use to live - but - it was kind of a running joke there. About half the time they started a "controlled" burn it went out of control and burned a lot more than intended. Mountains and sudden shifting winds are a tough environment to control fire in. Embers can float off and start spot fires far away from the original fire source.

[Dexter]

God Almighty.

How do these fires get so huge and out of hand before they can be contained?

! No longer available

Check out how quickly the fire spreads in this video.

[sneakypete]

Open minded has nothing to do with.  Not liking condescending and contrarian are more to the point.

This may help you understand.  If not 

@Sanguine

Yes,it helps me to understand that you confuse hills with mountains,and have no clue about mountain fires.

[sneakypete]

! No longer available

Check out how quickly the fire spreads in this video.

@Dexter

Remote areas with a huge amount of dry tinder,and high winds. The fires don't "start" as much as they just "explode into existence".

[GrouchoTex]

I lived in Southern California as a kid for a while.
My family bounced back and forth from Texas to California when I was a kid.
Dad's work related moves.
Didn't ever go to one school through its completion.

October was when I remember the Santa Ana winds being really strong.
I remember waking up and finding the weirdest things in our front yard that would blow in from overnight.
Big Wheel tricycle was one of the strangest.
None of the neighbors knew who it belongs to.

[Sanguine]

@Sanguine

Yes,it helps me to understand that you confuse hills with mountains,and have no clue about mountain fires.

Nope, no confusion here.

[DB]

The latest count of homes/commercial buildings destroyed by the Camp fire:

7,600 residences, 260 commercial.

48 civilians dead, 200+ still missing.

http://www.fire.ca.gov/current_incidents/incidentdetails/Index/2277

[roamer_1]

Ca has had drought conditions  for years which has not helped.

@mirraflake
Doesn't matter.
If it is going to burn, it is going to burn.
You can elect to burn it while it can be controlled,
Or you can elect to leave it alone, and wait till you can't control it anymore.

[roamer_1]

@Sanguine

Besides not getting the wind gusts in the flatlands that you get in the mountains,the terrain in Texas is MUCH easier for the fire crews to maneuver in to set back fires,dig fire lines,get pumper trucks to hot spots,etc,etc,etc.

Even if you can see where you need to get in the mountains,that doesn't mean you can get there the same day.

That ain't right.
Sure it might take days to get heavy equipment out there,
But the hotshots and aerial suppression can arrive immediately...
Not that they do, anymore. But that is how it used to work, when it actually worked.