Exclusive — House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy: ‘No Longer Just Republicans Versus Democrats; It’s

[Absalom]

Quoting a constant thread complainer who hates Trump is a weak attempt to say there is 'disarray in the White House'.

-------------------------------
I'll let Invar speak for himself.
As for myself, I voted for Trump and hope he achieves and prospers.
Yet I refuse to become deluded over his behavior; so allow an opinion.
As each day passes, he becomes increasingly isolated, because his
enemies have absolutely no fear of him. Why???
Because they know his core weapon is yip-yap!!!

[Hoodat]

The left wants what Scandinavia has. They want the government to pay for college, healthcare and large social safety nets.

In other words, they want government to replace themselves as the consumer

All of that is possible without destroying capitalism

Uh, no.  When government becomes the consumer, it does away with the individual acting in his best interest, which is in direct contrast to the most basic tenet of capitalism.  Government gets to decide whether I can have an MRI.  Government gets to decide how much education I can afford.  Government gets to decide whether certain transplants will be made available to me based upon age.  That is NOT capitalism.

Capitalism is when Joe Blow can save up his money and buy an MRI machine and sell MRIs to people on his own accord at whatever price he deems will maximize his profit.  Capitalism is when a patient can cut his own deal with a doctor instead of letting Medicare or Medicaid set the price.  And capitalism is when a student can get a fair price on a university education without being squeezed out of the market due to government largess.

[jafo2010]

Libertybele.....you said two things in this thread that are inaccurate.  First, you do not pay Medicaid taxes from your income, you pay Medicare taxes.

2nd, while the Republicans have a simple majority in the Senate, votes require a vote of 60 to pass legislation.  To get 60 votes today, it requires all the Republicans and I believe 8 Democommies.  They refuse to vote on anything, so the Senate has basically been frozen for two years.

The ONLY legislation of consequence to get through the Senate was the Tax Cuts, which the Republicans used the Harry Reid nuclear option, requiring a simple majority of 51 votes.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

In other words, they want government to replace themselves as the consumer

Uh, no.  When government becomes the consumer, it does away with the individual acting in his best interest, which is in direct contrast to the most basic tenet of capitalism.  Government gets to decide whether I can have an MRI.  Government gets to decide how much education I can afford.  Government gets to decide whether certain transplants will be made available to me based upon age.  That is NOT capitalism.

Capitalism is when Joe Blow can save up his money and buy an MRI machine and sell MRIs to people on his own accord at whatever price he deems will maximize his profit.  Capitalism is when a patient can cut his own deal with a doctor instead of letting Medicare or Medicaid set the price.  And capitalism is when a student can get a fair price on a university education without being squeezed out of the market due to government largess.

Very well, said, but I'd like to add...

And capitalism is when Joe Blow tries to charge too much for his MRIs, gets undercut by the competition, and there's no government bailout.

[Dexter]

In other words, they want government to replace themselves as the consumer

Uh, no.  When government becomes the consumer, it does away with the individual acting in his best interest, which is in direct contrast to the most basic tenet of capitalism.  Government gets to decide whether I can have an MRI.  Government gets to decide how much education I can afford.  Government gets to decide whether certain transplants will be made available to me based upon age.  That is NOT capitalism.

Capitalism is when Joe Blow can save up his money and buy an MRI machine and sell MRIs to people on his own accord at whatever price he deems will maximize his profit.  Capitalism is when a patient can cut his own deal with a doctor instead of letting Medicare or Medicaid set the price.  And capitalism is when a student can get a fair price on a university education without being squeezed out of the market due to government largess.

There is a LOT of space between government paid for healthcare/school and totalitarian socialism. It is simply a fact that Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark and Iceland are not socialist countries. They have large welfare states and humanitarian priorities, but their countries run on capitalism. They can earn good money, buy their own homes, own their own vehicles and other things etc. Liberals in the states want us to emulate them, not Cuba and not Venezuela. Bernie has spent countless hours talking about how we should emulate the Nordic countries, not failing systems from Latin America. THAT IS WHAT THEY WANT, AND IT'S NOT SOCIALISM, EVEN IF THEY CALL IT THAT IN THEIR IGNORANCE. My fiance is from that part of the world and I will actually be moving there with her in a couple of years. I'm very excited. It's a beautiful place with a lot of good people.

[Night Hides Not]

There is a LOT of space between government paid for healthcare/school and totalitarian socialism. It is simply a fact that Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark and Iceland are not socialist countries. They have large welfare states and humanitarian priorities, but their countries run on capitalism. They can earn good money, buy their own homes, own their own vehicles and other things etc. My fiance is from that part of the world and I will actually be moving there with her in a couple of years. I'm very excited. It's a beautiful place with a lot of good people.

I feel the same way about the area of Germany I lived in for four years. Granted, it was long ago (40 years), but I doubt the rural areas have changed that much.

The geography of the Mosel River sure hasn't changed, where over 2/3 of the grapes are grown on slopes greater than 60 degrees. These steeper slopes are inaccessible to machinery, so the vineyards must be tended year round by hand.

If I had the money, I'd seriously consider buying property there. It's beautiful, peaceful, and the people are friendly.

We can dream, can't we?

[Dexter]

I feel the same way about the area of Germany I lived in for four years. Granted, it was long ago (40 years), but I doubt the rural areas have changed that much.

The geography of the Mosel River sure hasn't changed, where over 2/3 of the grapes are grown on slopes greater than 60 degrees. These steeper slopes are inaccessible to machinery, so the vineyards must be tended year round by hand.

If I had the money, I'd seriously consider buying property there. It's beautiful, peaceful, and the people are friendly.

We can dream, can't we?

Europe is incredibly beautiful in a lot of areas. The same can be said for the states, though, especially out west.

[GrouchoTex]

Hey America!!! The socialism is already here...We're just arguing how much it needs expanding or restricting.  And very few are talking about restricting.

No kidding @Once-Ler
I'd like these folks to start talking about reductions for a change.
The only argument seems to be how and where to spend the largesse.

[LMAO]

No kidding @Once-Ler
I'd like these folks to start talking about reductions for a change.
The only argument seems to be how and where to spend the largesse.

  They can do that because they can print dollars.. But it will not last forever.   At some point,  significant cuts in government spending will be forced. The American left keeps pointing to the Scandinavian countries as examples of what the US should emulate. But they’re comparing  small, fairly homogenous(sp) populations  unlike the US. Can anyone name a social welfare program in the US that is either not facing insolvency and/or mismanaged? Even in these countries that have this great universal healthcare for all, also have private insurance. Even most Medicare recipients also have private supplemental insurance

 I can see a day were Social Security and Medicare, for example, rolled into just one package and only available for those who are truly in poverty. And to receive either one,  you are only allowed to have a very limited number of assets. Social safety net in this country will never disappear. But the requirements to receive that help will become stricter and stricter.

It ultimately is about the math

[Dexter]

  They can do that because they can print dollars.. But it will not last forever.   At some point, big cut and government spending will be forced. The American left keeps pointing to the Scandinavian countries as examples of what the US should emulate. But they’re comparing  small, fairly homogenous(sp) populations  unlike the US. Can anyone name a social welfare program in the US that is either not facing insolvency and/or mismanaged?

 I can see a day we’re Social Security and Medicare, for example, rolled into just one package and only available for those who are drooling in poverty. And to receive either one,  you are only allowed to have a very limited number of assets. Social safety net in this country will never disappear. But the requirements to receive that help will become stricter and stricter.

It ultimately is about the math

We definitely need to work on efficiency. There's a lot of corruption in our government that needs to be eradicated somehow. Billions of dollars to build and maintain the Obamacare website? Are you bleep kidding me?

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Weak?

I assume your definition of 'disarray' in what Trump says and what is actually reported in regards to 'pushback' from within his own cabinet is different than what the rest of us would define 'disarray'.  But then war is peace, freedom is slavery, socialism is Conservatism in todays lexicon.

Not weak, but totally without any substance.
the poster has no basis in his assertion.

BTW, neither do you

[IsailedawayfromFR]

-------------------------------
I'll let Invar speak for himself.
As for myself, I voted for Trump and hope he achieves and prospers.
Yet I refuse to become deluded over his behavior; so allow an opinion.
As each day passes, he becomes increasingly isolated, because his
enemies have absolutely no fear of him. Why???
Because they know his core weapon is yip-yap!!!

So advise the quote you claimed denote disarray?

PS - there was none.

[Sanguine]

There is a LOT of space between government paid for healthcare/school and totalitarian socialism. It is simply a fact that Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark and Iceland are not socialist countries. They have large welfare states and humanitarian priorities, but their countries run on capitalism. They can earn good money, buy their own homes, own their own vehicles and other things etc. Liberals in the states want us to emulate them, not Cuba and not Venezuela. Bernie has spent countless hours talking about how we should emulate the Nordic countries, not failing systems from Latin America. THAT IS WHAT THEY WANT, AND IT'S NOT SOCIALISM, EVEN IF THEY CALL IT THAT IN THEIR IGNORANCE. My fiance is from that part of the world and I will actually be moving there with her in a couple of years. I'm very excited. It's a beautiful place with a lot of good people.

Referring to your bolded sentence above, that gets to the heart of the misunderstanding.  The thing that makes us different from Europe, for instance, and explains why we are not a democracy is the recognition of and sovereignty of the individual.  It doesn't matter what "they" want, individuals should not be forced to participate in anything that exceeds the bounds of our "articles of incorporation", the Constitution.  Our government was set up to deny the tyranny of the majority.  It's a whole different way of thinking.

[GrouchoTex]

Referring to your bolded sentence above, that gets to the heart of the misunderstanding.  The thing that makes us different from Europe, for instance, and explains why we are not a democracy is the recognition of and sovereignty of the individual.  It doesn't matter what "they" want, individuals should not be forced to participate in anything that exceeds the bounds of our "articles of incorporation", the Constitution.  Our government was set up to deny the tyranny of the majority.  It's a whole different way of thinking.

Absolutely correct, whether we call it government overreach or Socialism, we instinctively know that government involvement is a bad thing.
A large degree of skepticism against government and politicians as a wise and desirable thing.
That's how we became who and what we are-Americans.

[Dexter]

Referring to your bolded sentence above, that gets to the heart of the misunderstanding.  The thing that makes us different from Europe, for instance, and explains why we are not a democracy is the recognition of and sovereignty of the individual.  It doesn't matter what "they" want, individuals should not be forced to participate in anything that exceeds the bounds of our "articles of incorporation", the Constitution.  Our government was set up to deny the tyranny of the majority.  It's a whole different way of thinking.

Both sides have a vision for the world that they want to see enforced by the government. It's impossible to have a society without infringing upon the preferences of some individuals. I believe in democracy and the goodness of humanity as a whole. I do not believe that evil will win as long as good people have the power to stand up to it.

[Dexter]

Absolutely correct, whether we call it government overreach or Socialism, we instinctively know that government involvement is a bad thing.
A large degree of skepticism against government and politicians as a wise and desirable thing.
That's how we became who and what we are-Americans.

Republicans aren't really about small government anymore either, though. I am ALL ABOUT limiting the power and influence of the government. I'm all about state rights, but there doesn't seem to be honest efforts to push true conservatism. Every bill and proposal is polluted with nonsense and half truths. Nothing works the way it should.

[dfwgator]

Government run healthcare is not socialism. These terms and labels get abused way too often. Socialism is the government taking over the private sector and managing all production. Most leftists in the states don't want to take it that far. Most people in the states don't even understand what the bleep they're talking about when it comes to capitalism vs socialism, and that's true for both sides. The left wants what Scandinavia has. They want the government to pay for college, healthcare and large social safety nets. All of that is possible without destroying capitalism, but the left AND right seem to be ignorant of that fact.

The Swedish model cannot work in a large multi-cultural country.  And it's starting to fail in Sweden, because it has become multi-cultural.

[Dexter]

The Swedish model cannot work in a large multi-cultural country.  And it's starting to fail in Sweden, because it has become multi-cultural.

I think it's more about how many people are using those benefits and less about the color of their skin. The Swedes let a million poor people immigrate into their country that had a population of 9 million at the time. That's equivalent to us letting 40 million poor people immigrate to America in the span of a year or two. I think the left is very illogical when it comes to immigration. I think some of what they want can work and be successful, but not if we let legions of poor people from other countries in for a slice of the pie.

[Sanguine]

Both sides have a vision for the world that they want to see enforced by the government. It's impossible to have a society without infringing upon the preferences of some individuals. I believe in democracy and the goodness of humanity as a whole. I do not believe that evil will win as long as good people have the power to stand up to it.

Believe it or not, there are a whole lot of us Constitutionalists.  Some of us call ourselves Republicans also, or Libertarians, or whatever, but while Constitutionalists can be Republican, all Republicans are not Constitutionalists.

You may believe in democracy, but our founding fathers worked hard to avoid it here.  I know the term is ubiquitous, but it is wrong, just as referring to leftists as liberals is wrong, and the misuse of both terms is calculated to effect a certain mindset and misunderstanding of basic principles.

[Sanguine]

Republicans aren't really about small government anymore either, though. I am ALL ABOUT limiting the power and influence of the government. I'm all about state rights, but there doesn't seem to be honest efforts to push true conservatism. Every bill and proposal is polluted with nonsense and half truths. Nothing works the way it should.

On that we agree.

[dfwgator]

I think it's more about how many people are using those benefits and less about the color of their skin. 

Culture has nothing to do with skin color.   

[DCPatriot]

Culture has nothing to do with skin color.   

I disagree.   It is a HUGE factor in mixed race countries/cities.  Look around...geez.  South Africa?  South Philly?

They don't call it "Kaisertown" or "Chinatown" for the helluva it.

[Dexter]

Culture has nothing to do with skin color.   

Not necessarily, but it's a decent indicator of what culture an individual might be associated with. I don't think it's about culture either. I think it's about sustainability. You can't have too many poor people or a safety net won't work.

[dfwgator]

Not necessarily, but it's a decent indicator of what culture an individual might be associated with. I don't think it's about culture either. I think it's about sustainability. You can't have too many poor people or a safety net won't work.

You can't have people who think it's ok to cheat the system.   When Sweden was more or less homogenous, their culture frowned upon people who tried to take advantage of the system.  They still had a good work ethic.  But over time, generous welfare programs chip away at that.

[Dexter]

You can't have people who think it's ok to cheat the system.   When Sweden was more or less homogenous, their culture frowned upon people who tried to take advantage of the system.  They still had a good work ethic.  But over time, generous welfare programs chip away at that.

I don't think the immigrants had/have a bad work ethic. The problem is the Swedes let a million poor people that don't have lucrative skills and barely speak the language into their country of 9 million and it overloaded their social programs. It's a balance, and if you're not careful you tip the scale. I think most people have a natural desire to excel and prosper.