In The Throes Of A REAL Coup...

[Emjay]

My goodness, what a delicate teacup you are!   

Folks don't hate you, INVAR, but neither do they give a shit about you and your peculiar demons.   I'll say this - your self-absorption is astonishing.   May patriots act while you sulk.   

Agree @Jazzhead   @INVAR has really tried to make people hate him with his utter dismissal and contempt for anyone who is a Trump supporter.

I don't hate him, but I wish he would wallow in his own misery without posting it every two minutes.

[Mesaclone]

Why would I allow myself to be in alliance with a bunch who have declared me to be an 'enemy' and who hate and hold my beliefs in the same contempt the the radical secular Left does?

@INVAR

I'll be glad to answer your question quite candidly if you will answer mine.

Re-posting it below:
"....you seem to be saying that we cannot work together to fight such a thing, because those of us who support Trump are unworthy of your alliance. Is this correct?"

[Sanguine]

And I do and I have.... much to my chagrin later on.....lolol.  It's all good tho.  Every time you forgive someone that has wronged you in some way, you are blessed for it.   

 

(Is beer ok in this context?)

[INVAR]

I have a strong feeling that if things ever went all the way downhill, and we ended up in violence, we'd be fighting on the same side. 

I appreciate your optimism and goodwill, but after the last couple of years - I have to ask - what "side" would that be exactly?

The "Side" that says you are either with Trump or with the "enemy"??

The Side that says my biblical faith and moral principles are a 'danger' to the country and that we are establishing a 'theocracy' if we are not willing to surrender them and shut up about morality??

Or the Side that says voting your conscience and/or third party is not only selfish and stupid but hands the enemies of the country the reigns of power?

Why is it that the Principled are always expected to 'join' the side that demands compromise?  When will they join 'our side' for a change? 

The answer is obviously never.

I'm not sure what common ground is left anymore.  Decency has taken a leave of absence and virtue is seen as an evil by a whole lot of folks on "our side" who are pissed off that we will not excuse it when their guy does things that they got pissed about when Democrats did them.

[Emjay]

See, that post right there by @INVAR is all you need to know about the utter futility of trying to reason with the guy.

I've tried several times.  Believe me, it is a total waste of time.

[INVAR]

FWIW, I don't think the document is real.

It very may well not be.  I just found it interesting that it does come from a site that has been cited for 'truth' by the Trump movement because of it's support for him.

I will say that if it does turn out to be true - I will not be surprised one iota.

I mean, John Effing Kerry just went to Iran to provide a completely different diplomatic agenda and policy directive than the current Administration provides for did he not?

[roamer_1]

@INVAR

I'll be glad to answer your question quite candidly if you will answer mine.

Re-posting it below:
"....you seem to be saying that we cannot work together to fight such a thing, because those of us who support Trump are unworthy of your alliance. Is this correct?"

No, that is not correct.
There is nothing there to fight *FOR*
Just like there was nothing there to vote *FOR*

[INVAR]

Folks don't hate you, INVAR,

Shall I provide quotes for you that contradict your assertion?

Here's one from a member right here at TBR:

The difference sir, is that I embrace the hatred I have for the likes of you and your ilk here on the forum.

I don't deny it.

I'll say this - your self-absorption is astonishing.   May patriots act while you sulk.   

I'll wave at you patriots as you go march off to mix it up with the Left in Trump's army.   Have fun.

[XenaLee]

(Is beer ok in this context?)

As long as it's Corona!   

[LegalAmerican]

First, congratulations on a very well written and focused essay @Mesaclone   It is truly impressive.   

I cringed a little at one quote --- because not only is it incorrect, it's part of the defining blurb on who this President is.  I want you, and all others are welcome too, to recognize that Donald J. Trump understood exactly what was going on in Washington -- and there is nothing accidental about Trump fighting these bastards head on.  It is not happenstance.  It is his plan.

So, I take a little exception to this:







This one speech explains why this "pampered Bull Elephant" ran for the office and should convince you that he did so with both eyes open.  And this is why we elected him. 

! No longer available


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2qIXXafxCQ

So do I.  What is wrong with people, thinking bad mouthing the president & saying things NOT TRUE about him, then asking for people to UNITE,  under this person, that was just badmouthed?   

I keep saying conservatives keep shooting themselves in the foot!

 They just can't stop saying negatives words, about my president!  It is some sort of SPORT, for people.  I just have to shake my head. Nothing wrong with president TRUMP, however the people in America, those people, I have my doubts.

Where is common sense? 

[roamer_1]

It very may well not be.  I just found it interesting that it does come from a site that has been cited for 'truth' by the Trump movement because of it's support for him.

And likewise why I find it suspicious.

I will say that if it does turn out to be true - I will not be surprised one iota.

Well, it likely is true, in spirit... Ol Chucky Schumer has said as much, publicly. That any means would justify the end is not a surprise coming from the liberals. But neither is it a surprise coming from Tump  Agitprop General ...

go team. rah.

I mean, John Effing Kerry just went to Iran to provide a completely different diplomatic agenda and policy directive than the current Administration provides for did he not?

meh. So what? John Effing (I've got three Purple Hearts) Kerry has been doing this very same thing ever since Nam. What gives this particular time the special sauce?

[Bigun]

! No longer available

[roamer_1]

Where is common sense?

Out the window, with every single Conservative principle.

[INVAR]

@INVAR

I'll be glad to answer your question quite candidly if you will answer mine.

Re-posting it below:
"....you seem to be saying that we cannot work together to fight such a thing, because those of us who support Trump are unworthy of your alliance. Is this correct?"

Again, your compatriots have made it abundantly clear that they are not interested in an 'alliance' unless I pledge 100% fealty to Trump, because they themselves have said that unless that happens, I am untrustworthy to have in their ranks.  I am never going to pledge fealty or loyalty to Trump.  So again, why should I consider being in alliance with a bunch that holds me in the same contempt that they do the Left?

Also, as Roamer_1 rightly noted - what is it exactly that we would be fighting FOR?

Preservation of virtue and foundational principles that make liberty and a civil society possible in the first place?

Nope.   Certainly not as recent threads clearly illustrate.

It seems to be all about preserving Trump or the GOP - and those are not worth my time or effort to fight for.

[libertybele]

I've been saying this for months and people gave me the 'tin foil' hat  line.  IMHO there has been more than one attempt and at times I believe there has been a coup within a coup.  President Trump is like a lone man on an island surrounded by alligators and piranha.  He has no protection as his AG was bought and paid for a long, long time ago.

[Mesaclone]

I appreciate your optimism and goodwill, but after the last couple of years - I have to ask - what "side" would that be exactly?

The "Side" that says you are either with Trump or with the "enemy"?? No such side exists, though it is concurrently true that not voting and/or wasting your vote on no chance 3rd parties does facilitate the election of Dem-Leftists.

The Side that says my biblical faith and moral principles are a 'danger' to the country and that we are establishing a 'theocracy' if we are not willing to surrender them and shut up about morality?? There is no "side" on this board that believes this. Not one person on this board believes anyone should surrender their moral principles or biblical faith...that is a silly canard.[/i]

Or the Side that says voting your conscience and/or third party is not only selfish and stupid but hands the enemies of the country the reigns of power? Again, I know of no side that believes you should vote against your conscience, though it IS true that wasting a vote on someone with no chance of being elected IS tactically and strategically stupid...and its effect IS potentially to hand the reigns of power to the Dem-Left.

Why is it that the Principled are always expected to 'join' the side that demands compromise?  ALL of us here are principled people, quit pretending only you fit that description. But without compromise, no conservative can ever be elected...there's good reason that Reagan himself has been called the Great Compromiser. When will they join 'our side' for a change? When a man like Pence or Cruz win the nomination, which is very likely to happen post-Trump (2024). If nominated, both would have my vote in an instant.

The answer is obviously never.

I'm not sure what common ground is left anymore.  Decency has taken a leave of absence and virtue is seen as an evil by a whole lot of folks on "our side" who are pissed off that we will not excuse it when their guy does things that they got pissed about when Democrats did them.Another straw man. You are no more decent than the rest of us here...and none us believe bad behavior or policy should be excused. What we don't do is expect perfection...or that our leaders all be choir boys and saints. We expect them to push conservative ideas and policies, something Trump has been doing more than any President since at least Reagan himself.

Come down from your pedestal, you are no more principled and imbued with "faith" than the rest of us. We hold to our principles and expect others to do the same...but that does not mean we believe that none of us can achieve compromise and cooperation with fellow conservatives and Republicans. Intellect demands that we do so.

[Mesaclone]

Again, your compatriots have made it abundantly clear that they are not interested in an 'alliance' unless I pledge 100% fealty to Trump, because they themselves have said that unless that happens, I am untrustworthy to have in their ranks.  I am never going to pledge fealty or loyalty to Trump.  So again, why should I consider being in alliance with a bunch that holds me in the same contempt that they do the Left?

Also, as Roamer_1 rightly noted - what is it exactly that we would be fighting FOR?

Preservation of virtue and foundational principles that make liberty and a civil society possible in the first place?

Nope.   Certainly not as recent threads clearly illustrate.

It seems to be all about preserving Trump or the GOP - and those are not worth my time or effort to fight for.

For purposes of clarity....is that a yes or a no.

[LegalAmerican]

People I trust who have first hand knowledge of Donald Trump, describe a very different man than the media caricature; they describe a man who is intelligent, hard-working, reads everything he gets his hands on, who in person has a gracious and kind personality and is the furthest thing from racist (fought his Florida town to integrate his golf club) or xenophobic (two marriages were with foreign women) or anti Semitic (his daughter converted to Judaism), and on and on. Fact is, the Left and NeverTrumpers have had Donald Trump wrong all along.

For his presidential accomplishments and for his impact on modern politics, Donald Trump will go down in history as a significant presidential figure.

Correct!   

So many people are supporting deep state and they don't know it. They would rather believe all the DIRT/LIES on TRUMP, rather then see how he is helping our country.  It makes them "superior".  When do people grow up?  It is not about their "feelings", their "principles", it is about our country! 

Just like, you have the RIGHT of way at a stop sign.  But another car drives through & kills you.  You were 'RIGHT', but you are still DEAD!  You are dead right.  This is what N.T.'s do. They want to be RIGHT.  Yes, dead right. And that helps, who?

[truth_seeker]

Apparently rumors of a successful cranial extraction, were premature.

[Emjay]

I've been saying this for months and people gave me the 'tin foil' hat  line.  IMHO there has been more than one attempt and at times I believe there has been a coup within a coup.  President Trump is like a lone man on an island surrounded by alligators and piranha.  He has no protection as his AG was bought and paid for a long, long time ago.

@libertybele   I cannot pretend to know about the odd dynamics between Sessions and Trump.  I do know that Sessions has failed to either do his duty or resign.  I used to think he was a good, if ineffectual, man but something is very wrong.

I worry about the situation with Trump also, but, fortunately for us, I don't think Trump himself is worried.  He is steadfastly pursuing his goals and he is making headway.

Astonishing headway in the face of the obstacles thrown in front of him from all sides.

[roamer_1]

Without the principles of Conservatism, what you will have on the right is one of three:

Anarchy
Theocracy
or
National Socialism.

Since this iteration is a big spending big gov sort, dispossessed of those very principles, it is not Anarchy, though it could yet devolve there.

Since it eschews the values of Social Conservatism, and spits upon the Judeo-Christian Ethic, it certainly is no Theocracy, though with the messianic strains in hailing Tump, it certainly could yet devolve there.

Which leaves but one other option, which this current iteration fits.  Not cleanly as yet, but it fits. Welcome to the Workers Party.

National Socialist v. Communist (deja vu all over again)... I have no dog in that hunt. No matter who wins, my liberty is gone. And I will not assist either in becoming my master. A pox on both houses.

[LegalAmerican]

Apparently rumors of a successful cranial extraction, were premature.

I think it is funny, how the anti-Trump crowd wants president TRUMP to have a different personality...yet,,,THEY WILL NOT CHANGE THEMSELVES.  Thy demand something of HIM, which they would not do, themselves.  I think, that is real narcissism and being self centered!  All about themselves, their 'feelings', their principles, them, them them. 
Nothing about saving our country.   Self absorbed, using 'religion' as the reason, when even that, is false , and they don't understand the real message of scripture. From 2,000 years ago, telling stories of the times.

[INVAR]

We hold to our principles and expect others to do the same...

What 'principles'?

We have been told time and again that we must surrender those principles for the sake of the public good, political expedience and unity.

The only principles I hear being pushed by the Trump bunch, are supporting Trump. 

Fiscal restraint?

Nope.

Virtue, morality and self-control?

Nope.  Advocating for those things makes me an instant enemy that is said to be attempting to impose a theocracy.

that does not mean we believe that none of us can achieve compromise and cooperation with fellow conservatives and Republicans. Intellect demands that we do so.

Well, I'm done compromising.  You can join us in the fight for the restoration of our religious heritage, foundational principles and moral virtue in the culture - or you can continue to mix it up with the left on your own via political warfare.  Have fun.

For purposes of clarity....is that a yes or a no.

Your fellow Trump compatriots have made that answer abundantly clear - and I answered it for you already.

[LegalAmerican]

@libertybele   I cannot pretend to know about the odd dynamics between Sessions and Trump.  I do know that Sessions has failed to either do his duty or resign.  I used to think he was a good, if ineffectual, man but something is very wrong.

I worry about the situation with Trump also, but, fortunately for us, I don't think Trump himself is worried.  He is steadfastly pursuing his goals and he is making headway.

Astonishing headway in the face of the obstacles thrown in front of him from all sides.

 

[Emjay]

I think it is funny, how the anti-Trump crowd wants president TRUMP to have a different personality...yet,,,THEY WILL NOT CHANGE THEMSELVES.  Thy demand something of HIM, which they would not do, themselves.  I think, that is real narcissism and being self centered!  All about themselves, their 'feelings', their principles, them, them them. 
Nothing about saving our country.   Self absorbed, using 'religion' as the reason, when even that, is false , and they don't understand the real message of scripture. From 2,000 years ago, telling stories of the times.

@LegalAmerican   You hit the nail exactly on the head. 

The most virulent Trump critics will not change, will not budge, will not see reason.  They are totally wrapped up in their own virtue and their own views of morality.

And yet, and yet, they have the Colossal Nerve to expect Trump to change.

It boggles the mind.