Author Topic: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?  (Read 5409 times)

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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #50 on: August 05, 2018, 01:38:14 am »
To: Anti Tariff Zealots

truthseeker39525 says:   
August 3, 2018 at 12:29 pm   

I was in mechanical engineering at George Washington University (in DC) in the 1970’s.
At that time, at that school, it was many of the Iranians who were the blatant cheaters.
(If those students had put the same effort into studying instead of cheating, they would have aced the tests on the merits.)
After one exam in a Materials Science class, some of us American students were grumbling to the professor about all the cheating.
He told us “Boys, don’t worry, I’ve got ’em outsmarted.”
We were dumbfounded. “How did you outsmart those slick SOB’s?” we wanted to know.
The professor replied “I just give ’em all “A’s” and send ’em home.”
Then it sunk in….. not understanding basic Materials Science and Strength of Materials, the things they design are likely to break, bridges fail, etc.
Let them reap what they sow.


jkash (@USjkash2) says:   
August 4, 2018 at 3:53 am   

It’s funny, I WORK with engineers from China and those who I admire the most are the most culturally balanced and good hearted and so in demand..but they actually are not chomping at the bit to advance, but want some balance.

On the OTHER hand, there are some who come here and their…hygiene…has caused us to have to actually tutor them on how it is NOT inappropriate to wash your face AND YOUR FEET in the kitchen sink or spit in it. Their tendency to dismiss this as just silly because the water stream is more powerful and therefore they prefer it – and then to just leave it at that, is mind blowing. Culturally they are remedial. And at work I cannot say that these are those that excel.

The comment that without the VALUES, with the tendency to view human beings as mere statistics and to view the family as a source of productivity potential, China can never emulate our success, is absolutely spot on.

Interestingly, Mary Kay Ash of Mary KAy, saw how her business model was studied in schools and even copied, but the ONE thing that was dismissed as optional was the thing that Mary Kay valued above all else and to which she attributed her gob smacking success:

The Golden Rule.

Mary Kay is having a bit of a challenge now as those who have been faithful to her 60+ year model, understanding the importance of carrying on her priority of faith, family, career, are confronting younger women trained now for decades in short cuts, self-gratification and with social media…a glaring deficiency in observing those around them.

Ironically, Mary Kay is a newer model in China and it is exceeding all expectations..and those who are doing the best are actually successful by CHina’s standards of productivity, but they are getting a taste for Mary Kay’s deep and profound respect for human life, which is NOT China’s favorite frame of mind. They are actually considered a threat to the country’s mindset and are not allowed to gather in the larger forums for awards and recognition as they are in the U.S. , for fear of having too much influence on the culture.




China Is Collapsing, just from Threats (and you want to wave the White Flag, Set All The Pieces Back Up on the Board Just The Way They Were Before, . . . . . while bitching about a 10 to 25 pct Increase in the cost of a frigin Pocket Phone?

Last time I looked the cost of an iphone, at the point of manufacture, was $8.35.

Even if they've gone up 100% since then, your bitch is with Apple, not the threat of a 25% tariff on top of that $8.35.




AceODale says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:46 pm   

I work in the transportation and tourism industry. For the past decade(?) we have benefited immensely from Chinese tourism. This summer we experienced a significant decline in Chinese charters.
If your company is dependent on Chinese business, you could have some rough sailing ahead.


Jenny R. says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:33 pm   

Short answer: might be a good time to pull out of some of that China investment, diversify that China laden portfolio….a better time would have been before now (the returns are going down swiftly) but sometimes you just have to roll that hard six and make it out with your skin intact.
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Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #51 on: August 05, 2018, 02:00:25 am »

And BTW: repeatedly calling me a Liberal Leftist or a Democrat doesn't bother me, considering it's you and that's your coldest shot.

I said 'just like' a freaking liberal leftist - I did not say you WERE one.  But hey - big-government punitive tax-loving advocates under the flag of 'keeping us' (and the children) safe and 'leveling playing fields' using punitive taxes on Americans while telling us to suck up paying more for something you, personally see no use for - is a hallmark and registered trademark of your average freaking liberal Leftist.

Which your following replies more than illustrate your commonality with the aforementioned.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #52 on: August 05, 2018, 02:30:12 am »
Then why are we buying $500 billion of their stuff?  Why are we trading with them at all?

Go back and read your own post to see your own answer.  You do not want to pay more is what you said in #26.

Quote
What we are seeing is citizens paying more taxes with each purchase, and governments collecting it.  We are seeing the government pick the winners and losers of business.  We will soon see a lot more of those losers.
Yes, the losers used to be the US being sucker-punched by others placing tariffs on our goods and us rolling over and refusing to retaliate.  Now the losers will become those others.

Quote
Did I say losers?  I meant casualties.
Yes, with Chinese companies heading the list.
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #53 on: August 05, 2018, 02:42:40 am »
I said 'just like' a freaking liberal leftist - I did not say you WERE one.  But hey - big-government punitive tax-loving advocates under the flag of 'keeping us' (and the children) safe and 'leveling playing fields' using punitive taxes on Americans while telling us to suck up paying more for something you, personally see no use for - is a hallmark and registered trademark of your average freaking liberal Leftist.

Which your following replies more than illustrate your commonality with the aforementioned.


 :facepalm2:

Missed the Mary Kay comment, Mr Principles?
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #54 on: August 05, 2018, 04:43:23 am »
Who said anything about progressive taxes.  You are the total master at irrelevancy.
Tariffs = taxes.  Republican = rat both think I ain't paying enough.  Thank you for your personal attack and making me look so smart. wink777

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #55 on: August 05, 2018, 04:55:49 am »
Ghost says:   
August 2, 2018 at 10:48 pm   

Maybe we should add another factor to this equation, currency manipulation.
Twice with in the few months China has devalued there currency. This was done with the idea of lowering the prices of their goods in foreign markets. It also came after the President criticized them for doing this. They showed us.

The effect however was not what they thought it would be, or VSG President Trump laid a very nice trap. Oil is bought and sold in dollars therefor the cost of their imported oil went up in equal amounts to their devaluation. Costing them a larger proportion of their reverses to purchase the needed oil.

Then add the flight of capital from their markets which many astute investors have already done. Therefor their stock markets are falling badly. Put simply if you invested $100.00 and they reduced their monetary value 10% you just lost 10% the second the decision was announced if you sell now. Once again they need to use their reserve capital to replace the fleeing capital.

A couple of weeks before the the meeting with Putin, Russia dump half of their US dollar reserves in the open market. The markets shrugged it off without much notice. Those in the currency markets made note that if it was an attempt to strengthen Putin’s position it had no effect.

I mention this because fears of China doing this are often used in predictions from so called experts of disastrous consequences of taking on China in a trade war. Bull@%&!, they need U.S. Dollars to buy oil and many of the things required for their economic plans. As the US economy continues to strengthen so will the $. Thus, so will the cost to import oil and raw materials.

If their revenue stream of the $ is reduced then cash flows will quickly dissipate much of their of the reserves they spent years accumulating.

MAGA
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #56 on: August 05, 2018, 05:21:52 am »
Ghost says:   
August 2, 2018 at 10:48 pm   

Maybe we should add another factor to this equation, currency manipulation.
Twice with in the few months China has devalued there currency. This was done with the idea of lowering the prices of their goods in foreign markets. It also came after the President criticized them for doing this. They showed us.


I don't think you can categorically state President Trump criticized China for currency manipulation.  Candidate Trump sure did, but after the election...just like with locking up Hillary...It suddenly stopped being a problem.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/12/15276544/trump-china-reverse-currency-manipulator

Quote
“They’re not currency manipulators,” he said, explaining that the Treasury Department won’t be blacklisting China in a hotly anticipated Treasury report that comes out this week.

until last April when President Trump's Alzheimers kicked in again and he tweeted


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/985858100149309441

Quote
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

Russia and China are playing the Currency Devaluation game as the U.S. keeps raising interest rates. Not acceptable!
7:31 AM - Apr 16, 2018

I think Trump believes China is the Schrodinger's cat of currency manipulation.  Both currency manipulators and not currency manipulators when it suits his argument.

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #57 on: August 05, 2018, 05:58:55 am »
I don't think you can categorically state President Trump criticized China for currency manipulation.  Candidate Trump sure did, but after the election...just like with locking up Hillary...It suddenly stopped being a problem.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/12/15276544/trump-china-reverse-currency-manipulator

until last April when President Trump's Alzheimers kicked in again and he tweeted


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/985858100149309441

I think Trump believes China is the Schrodinger's cat of currency manipulation.  Both currency manipulators and not currency manipulators when it suits his argument.

Uh-oh.

Now you're in for it.

You're gonna get a Rorshack comparison effort of Mary Kay and Vietnam to debunk the tweets from Trump you just posted.  Obviously you cannot comprehend the brilliance of Trump or the evils of China's robbery, theft and lack of American cultural decorum.  You obviously want to get rid of police departments and foster anarchy in the streets.

At least that is the kinds of rebuttals I am enjoying receiving  on this subject.
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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #58 on: August 05, 2018, 06:14:59 am »
Add on top of that our own currency manipulations, and we can see how much water those arguments hold.
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #59 on: August 05, 2018, 06:34:30 am »
Uh-oh.

Now you're in for it.

You're gonna get a Rorshack comparison effort of Mary Kay and Vietnam to debunk the tweets from Trump you just posted.  Obviously you cannot comprehend the brilliance of Trump or the evils of China's robbery, theft and lack of American cultural decorum.  You obviously want to get rid of police departments and foster anarchy in the streets.

At least that is the kinds of rebuttals I am enjoying receiving  on this subject.

It is strange how I can recognize good intentions in Trump supporters and agree to disagree.  I can also see the limitations of my own logic, and admit mistakes I've made.  Yet the comments I receive are often designed to demean me, rather than refute me.

The rat party wants to increase my taxes, fund abortion with taxes, abolish ICE, and decimate our military.  I don't want any of that yet I'm not sure I'll vote in Nov because of the inept bumbler at the top of the GOP.

Every day its a new screw up.  Last night President Thin-skin took a stand against private charity, and Labron James's alternative to our pitiful union run public school system while insulting the intelligence of two black detractors.  This President has no standing to insult anyone's intelligence.  He is the dumbest man in any room even when he is the only one in the room. 

I don't think 2 SCOTUS picks are worth this kind of "winning."

Offline DB

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #60 on: August 05, 2018, 07:30:54 am »
Ghost says:   
August 2, 2018 at 10:48 pm   

Maybe we should add another factor to this equation, currency manipulation.
Twice with in the few months China has devalued there currency. This was done with the idea of lowering the prices of their goods in foreign markets. It also came after the President criticized them for doing this. They showed us.

The effect however was not what they thought it would be, or VSG President Trump laid a very nice trap. Oil is bought and sold in dollars therefor the cost of their imported oil went up in equal amounts to their devaluation. Costing them a larger proportion of their reverses to purchase the needed oil.

Then add the flight of capital from their markets which many astute investors have already done. Therefor their stock markets are falling badly. Put simply if you invested $100.00 and they reduced their monetary value 10% you just lost 10% the second the decision was announced if you sell now. Once again they need to use their reserve capital to replace the fleeing capital.

A couple of weeks before the the meeting with Putin, Russia dump half of their US dollar reserves in the open market. The markets shrugged it off without much notice. Those in the currency markets made note that if it was an attempt to strengthen Putin’s position it had no effect.

I mention this because fears of China doing this are often used in predictions from so called experts of disastrous consequences of taking on China in a trade war. Bull@%&!, they need U.S. Dollars to buy oil and many of the things required for their economic plans. As the US economy continues to strengthen so will the $. Thus, so will the cost to import oil and raw materials.

If their revenue stream of the $ is reduced then cash flows will quickly dissipate much of their of the reserves they spent years accumulating.

MAGA

Wasn't it you that said devaluing China's currency was a "win" for the US?

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,326102.msg1753821.html#msg1753821

Wasn't that the goal of their "currency manipulation" in the first place? So now your saying that their currency manipulation only hurt themselves because of the cost of oil wasn't factored in? Or are you saying now is different - because Trump is "doing" it?

You speak of oil priced in dollars. How much longer will it be priced in dollars when we print endless money out of thin air - which Trump is doing in spades? And how much of China's economy is spent on oil imports? I'd bet a small percentage. And meanwhile basic items cost more here lowering our consumption and our standard of living.

Offline DB

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #61 on: August 05, 2018, 07:33:18 am »
It is strange how I can recognize good intentions in Trump supporters and agree to disagree.  I can also see the limitations of my own logic, and admit mistakes I've made.  Yet the comments I receive are often designed to demean me, rather than refute me.

The rat party wants to increase my taxes, fund abortion with taxes, abolish ICE, and decimate our military.  I don't want any of that yet I'm not sure I'll vote in Nov because of the inept bumbler at the top of the GOP.

Every day its a new screw up.  Last night President Thin-skin took a stand against private charity, and Labron James's alternative to our pitiful union run public school system while insulting the intelligence of two black detractors.  This President has no standing to insult anyone's intelligence.  He is the dumbest man in any room even when he is the only one in the room. 

I don't think 2 SCOTUS picks are worth this kind of "winning."

I really doubt there will be much of a Republican party when Trump is done. He's a wrecking ball. He will attempt to destroy anything that offends him...

Offline Emjay

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #62 on: August 05, 2018, 05:00:12 pm »
Tariffs = taxes.  Republican = rat both think I ain't paying enough.  Thank you for your personal attack and making me look so smart. wink777

@Once-Ler   That cannot be a personal attack.  I made a vow not to make personal attacks here.

That was merely an observation based on your posts.

As for making you look 'so smart', that is beyond my abilities but I'll keep trying.
Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in vain.

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #63 on: August 05, 2018, 06:47:16 pm »
Uh-oh.

Now you're in for it.

You're gonna get a Rorshack comparison effort of Mary Kay and Vietnam to debunk the tweets from Trump you just posted.  Obviously you cannot comprehend the brilliance of Trump or the evils of China's robbery, theft and lack of American cultural decorum.  You obviously want to get rid of police departments and foster anarchy in the streets.

At least that is the kinds of rebuttals I am enjoying receiving  on this subject.


https://www.grammarly.com/blog/whats-the-difference-between-a-simile-and-a-metaphor/

Must be a product of the public school system.


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In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline DB

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #64 on: August 05, 2018, 07:36:44 pm »

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/whats-the-difference-between-a-simile-and-a-metaphor/

Must be a product of the public school system.




Hey now, it was a copy machine being beat to oblivion...

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #65 on: August 05, 2018, 07:57:34 pm »
Hey now, it was a copy machine being beat to oblivion...


What? You were a 'gifted' student, never had an ignored assignment handed back to you by teacher?
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #66 on: August 05, 2018, 08:14:07 pm »
Must be a product of the public school system.


AS you go and flog it yet again.

You have taken Projection to a level that would make your average batshit crazy Leftist blush.
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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #67 on: August 05, 2018, 08:24:43 pm »
AS you go and flog it yet again.

You have taken Projection to a level that would make your average batshit crazy Leftist blush.


I don't much care for trad jazz, but I gotta admit these guys play a better One Note Samba than your griping about Govt conspiring through evil tariffs to charge you more for your toys.

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My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #68 on: August 05, 2018, 08:34:20 pm »

I don't much care for trad jazz, but I gotta admit these guys play a better One Note Samba than your griping about Govt conspiring through evil tariffs to charge you more for your toys.

Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #69 on: August 05, 2018, 09:07:14 pm »
1685 views

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,327022.100.html


The question is in reference to Criminal Theft, not Personal Choice of what to buy or not buy.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/fbi-has-investigations-into-chinese-espionage-in-all-50-states_2598562.html


Receiving/Buying Stolen Property is OK, because it's Free Trade. ?????



And I'm 'Projecting' as you gripe about 12 dimensional underwater chess?

1685 views, and with all your exalted principle(s) you tap danced around a simple yes or no answer like a buck private in a mine field.

Do you, or do you Not, condone Stealing, and characterizing it as free trade?

Your Principles extend no farther than How can I get it cheaper, legally or otherwise.

You have NO problem with buying stolen property from a crook or their fence, none.

I just hope your grandchildren don't get maimed or killed in another Chinese Proxy War in some S##thole like Pakistan, so that you can continue to buy "Cheap, Imported, Tariff Free Goods" from a Communist Hellhole that absolutely despises us.

Korea and Vietnam are projecting, huh?

Try reading a history book or two.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #70 on: August 05, 2018, 09:16:30 pm »
1685 views

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,327022.100.html


The question is in reference to Criminal Theft, not Personal Choice of what to buy or not buy.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/fbi-has-investigations-into-chinese-espionage-in-all-50-states_2598562.html


Receiving/Buying Stolen Property is OK, because it's Free Trade. ?????



And I'm 'Projecting' as you gripe about 12 dimensional underwater chess?

1685 views, and with all your exalted principle(s) you tap danced around a simple yes or no answer like a buck private in a mine field.

Do you, or do you Not, condone Stealing, and characterizing it as free trade?

Your Principles extend no farther than How can I get it cheaper, legally or otherwise.

You have NO problem with buying stolen property from a crook or their fence, none.

I just hope your grandchildren don't get maimed or killed in another Chinese Proxy War in some S##thole like Pakistan, so that you can continue to buy "Cheap, Imported, Tariff Free Goods" from a Communist Hellhole that absolutely despises us.

Korea and Vietnam are projecting, huh?

Try reading a history book or two.

Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline Suppressed

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #71 on: August 05, 2018, 09:18:32 pm »
Do you, or do you Not, condone Stealing, and characterizing it as free trade?

Whew! That red herring STINKS!

Guess its been sitting there rotting for a while because people can see it for what it is.
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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #72 on: August 05, 2018, 09:44:05 pm »
Whew! That red herring STINKS!

Guess its been sitting there rotting for a while because people can see it for what it is.


I'll take that for what it's worth, from someone who "Shredded" all the medical science pprs I offered them and drove home his point linking to an article that Directly refuted his Victory claim.

You never even read your Own article much less mine.
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #73 on: August 05, 2018, 09:47:54 pm »
Wait - does this mean the trade war is over? 

Offline DB

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