Author Topic: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?  (Read 5413 times)

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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2018, 07:16:59 pm »
Thanks mucho for following a non sequitur with another non sequitur.  Always fun.
You're very welcome.  Thank you for your suggestion on how much I should be paying for stuff.   happy77

Offline Emjay

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2018, 07:18:13 pm »
You're very welcome.  Thank you for your suggestion on how much I should be paying for stuff.   happy77

I don't care.  I was simply saying that if you have a job, you probably have more money to pay for stuff.
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2018, 07:28:18 pm »
I don't care.  I was simply saying that if you have a job, you probably have more money to pay for stuff.

Yeah.  I understood.  I can afford it.  That's the liberal excuse for progressive taxes.

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #28 on: August 04, 2018, 07:42:39 pm »
Yeah.  I understood.  I can afford it.  That's the liberal excuse for progressive taxes.

Yes, but now progressive taxes -err.... 'investments' ... are now "Conservative" values.   We have arrived at the place in the Republican mindset that if you consider the taxes we are forced to pay to fund a corrupt debt-driven government to be 'theft', then you will be accused of wanting anarchy and getting rid of police departments by 'Conservatives'.

Which is the same thing liberal Leftists will tell you when you eschew their plans to tax you into oblivion when you refuse to knuckle-under their class warfare wealth-guilt appeals for bigger and more intrusive government to fund their constituencies.
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...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #29 on: August 04, 2018, 08:16:16 pm »
Yes, but now progressive taxes -err.... 'investments' ... are now "Conservative" values.   We have arrived at the place in the Republican mindset that if you consider the taxes we are forced to pay to fund a corrupt debt-driven government to be 'theft', then you will be accused of wanting anarchy and getting rid of police departments by 'Conservatives'.

Which is the same thing liberal Leftists will tell you when you eschew their plans to tax you into oblivion when you refuse to knuckle-under their class warfare wealth-guilt appeals for bigger and more intrusive government to fund their constituencies.

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/08/02/understanding-phase-ii-of-the-u-s-vs-china-trade-confrontation/


We have been At War with China for decades.

What we're seeing right now is the Threat of counter tariffs to get rid of Existing tariffs from a Hostile Foreign Nation.

A den of thieves.

Read the comments

My personal favorite:

jmclever says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:52 pm   

Thankfully, President Trump knows how to wage and win a war using dollars instead of our sons and daughters and bullets!

Thank you, Lord, for President Trump!

Another good observation:

" I was wondering whether this piece was about current day China or pre-WWII Japan."
[/b]

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Offline Emjay

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #30 on: August 04, 2018, 08:24:32 pm »
Yeah.  I understood.  I can afford it.  That's the liberal excuse for progressive taxes.

Who said anything about progressive taxes.  You are the total master at irrelevancy.
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Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #31 on: August 04, 2018, 08:27:28 pm »
We have been At War with China for decades.

What we're seeing right now is the Threat of counter tariffs to get rid of Existing tariffs from a Hostile Foreign Nation.

A den of thieves.

Nuke 'em from orbit then, just to be sure.  That'll show 'em!

Or, just continue taxing Americans into oblivion and call it patriotic tariffing.  Different kind of destruction levied after government itself created the problem, but misery inflicted just the same.

It will be fun to watch everyone under 40 lose their freaking minds when everything electronic that they are dependent on costs 20 times what it does today once this trade war really gets going. 
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2018, 08:57:26 pm »
Nuke 'em from orbit then, just to be sure.  That'll show 'em!

Or, just continue taxing Americans into oblivion and call it patriotic tariffing.  Different kind of destruction levied after government itself created the problem, but misery inflicted just the same.

It will be fun to watch everyone under 40 lose their freaking minds when everything electronic that they are dependent on costs 20 times what it does today once this trade war really gets going.

And then after the dust settles and all those "OMG! We Don't Want Manufacturing HERE In The US because, . . . . Robots", or something, kicks in, IN the US the prices will go back down and the quality will go up.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #33 on: August 04, 2018, 09:13:22 pm »
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/08/02/understanding-phase-ii-of-the-u-s-vs-china-trade-confrontation/


We have been At War with China for decades.

Then why are we buying $500 billion of their stuff?  Why are we trading with them at all?

Quote
What we're seeing right now is the Threat of counter tariffs to get rid of Existing tariffs from a Hostile Foreign Nation.

What we are seeing is citizens paying more taxes with each purchase, and governments collecting it.  We are seeing the government pick the winners and losers of business.  We will soon see a lot more of those losers.

Quote
jmclever says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:52 pm   

Thankfully, President Trump knows how to wage and win a war using dollars instead of our sons and daughters and bullets!

Thank you, Lord, for President Trump!

Did I say losers?  I meant casualties.

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #34 on: August 04, 2018, 09:15:08 pm »
Nuke 'em from orbit then, just to be sure.  That'll show 'em!

Or, just continue taxing Americans into oblivion and call it patriotic tariffing.  Different kind of destruction levied after government itself created the problem, but misery inflicted just the same.

It will be fun to watch everyone under 40 lose their freaking minds when everything electronic that they are dependent on costs 20 times what it does today once this trade war really gets going.


Yeah. The fact that Govt created this mess means Govt has no business stepping in to clean it up./?????????

Or would it be better to just ignore it until it truly spins out of control - by the American Consumer Financing China's Expansionist Plans, and the US gets involved in another of China's Proxy Wars like Korea and Vietnam?

My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

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Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #35 on: August 04, 2018, 09:16:59 pm »
And then after the dust settles and all those "OMG! We Don't Want Manufacturing HERE In The US because, . . . . Robots", or something, kicks in, IN the US the prices will go back down and the quality will go up.

The Romans thought they were invincible too.

As did the Greeks.

As did every single republic that came before ours.

Fiscal stupidity was the severed carotid in every single one of them.

We are poised to outdo them all in the size and stupidity department ... combined.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline Suppressed

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #36 on: August 04, 2018, 09:19:29 pm »
If you have intelligence, why do you choose to post a completely irrelevant answer?  What does that even mean?

@Emjay

It's rather clear to those who have a basic understanding of economics, but since you've admitted you don't, I'll try to explain (and I don't mean that condescendingly, at all...I think it's admirable that you admit you don't follow some of this).


Imagine you want to buy a piece of candy from me for a nickel.  Do you think it's fair for the government to come in, guns drawn, and say that you have to be charged more for it?  That's what the tariff-pushers are saying should happen.

And where does that extra charge go to?  It goes to union bosses, underperforming-business owners, etc. 


My point is, rather than do the leftist thing and have the government order wealth transfer at the muzzle of guns, why not have those of you who want to transfer that money just cut the checks yourselves, and not force all of us to live in the la-la-leftland?
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Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #37 on: August 04, 2018, 09:22:33 pm »
We are seeing the government pick the winners and losers of business.  We will soon see a lot more of those losers.

Well the new conventional wisdom is that it is okay when Trump or Republicans do it, then it's patriotic...but NOT OKAY when the Democrats do it. 

Yeah. The fact that Govt created this mess means Govt has no business stepping in to clean it up./?????????

Oh yes, because taxing Americans more for what they want to buy, and where a monstrous chunk of technology is produced and manufactured is always the way you clean up a decades-old calculated mistake of granting China Most Favored Nation Status.

Trade Wars always end up costing a hell of a lot more than just fiat paper and digital monetary notes.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #38 on: August 04, 2018, 09:31:06 pm »

Oh yes, because taxing Americans more for what they want to buy, and where a monstrous chunk of technology is produced and manufactured is always the way you clean up a decades-old calculated mistake of granting China Most Favored Nation Status.

Trade Wars always end up costing a hell of a lot more than just fiat paper and digital monetary notes.


That idea is predicated upon the condition that you are fighting a symmetrical war.
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #39 on: August 04, 2018, 09:52:20 pm »
Well the new conventional wisdom is that it is okay when Trump or Republicans do it, then it's patriotic...but NOT OKAY when the Democrats do it. 

Ironic.  The previously condemned actions of rats by the GOP, are now justifications for the Trump GOP becoming the tax and spend party.  They did it first.

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #40 on: August 04, 2018, 10:08:42 pm »

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1025833273191264256

Quote
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

....Tariffs will make our country much richer than it is today. Only fools would disagree. We are using them to negotiate fair trade deals and, if countries are still unwilling to negotiate, they will pay us vast sums of money in the form of Tariffs. We win either way......
12:58 PM - 4 Aug 2018

higher taxes make us richer   :thud:

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #41 on: August 04, 2018, 10:24:05 pm »

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1025833273191264256

higher taxes make us richer   :thud:

No, no no no... not "taxes" , call them 'investments' - it helps the plebes swallow government robbery and spendaholiscism as a patriotic and moral duty we must agree to without complaint.

And didn't Pelosi say nearly the same damned thing in terms of higher taxes to increase food stamps and welfare makes the economy richer?   You know, the very notion that these Trump supporters at one time went berserk over?
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #42 on: August 04, 2018, 10:28:53 pm »
That idea is predicated upon the condition that you are fighting a symmetrical war.

So you're saying that taxing Americans more for what they want to buy, and that a monstrous chunk of the world's technology is produced and manufactured in China is only predicated on the condition of symmetrical warfare?

Or is it that trade wars don't ever end up costing a hell of a lot more than just fiat paper and digital monetary notes unless it's a symmetrical war?

Perhaps you will tell us that trade wars never turn into symmetrical or asymmetrical wars, and that we got nothing to worry about except a little more wallet pain when we need a new i-phone, computer or TV.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Online LMAO

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #43 on: August 04, 2018, 11:18:15 pm »

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1025833273191264256

higher taxes make us richer   :thud:

I guess go far enough to the right and it takes you left
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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #44 on: August 04, 2018, 11:26:07 pm »
So you're saying that taxing Americans more for what they want to buy, and that a monstrous chunk of the world's technology is produced and manufactured in China is only predicated on the condition of symmetrical warfare?

Or is it that trade wars don't ever end up costing a hell of a lot more than just fiat paper and digital monetary notes unless it's a symmetrical war?

Perhaps you will tell us that trade wars never turn into symmetrical or asymmetrical wars, and that we got nothing to worry about except a little more wallet pain when we need a new i-phone, computer or TV.


Figured as much. Went Right over your head in your irresistible need to pontificate short sighted, principled, irrevelancies.

I inject the Korean War and the Vietnam War, and you're off griping about the price of an iphone.

And while we're At it, . . . . Who the hell actually Needs a bleeding iphone?

I have a smart phone, and I detest it. It's always offering me 99 more options than I have Any use for and I spend a lot of time menu surfing just to turn its PITA intrusions Off.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2018, 11:31:18 pm by To-Whose-Benefit? »
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Offline INVAR

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #45 on: August 04, 2018, 11:41:20 pm »
And while we're At it, . . . . Who the hell actually Needs a bleeding iphone?

I have a smart phone, and I detest it. It's always offering me 99 more options than I have Any use for and I spend a lot of time menu surfing just to turn its PITA intrusions Off.

Just like a freaking liberal Leftist.

If you don't see a need or want for something, no one else should either - and if they do - tax the hell out of them for it to make you feel better about the 'fairness' of things.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #46 on: August 05, 2018, 12:37:07 am »
Just like a freaking liberal Leftist.

If you don't see a need or want for something, no one else should either - and if they do - tax the hell out of them for it to make you feel better about the 'fairness' of things.


The argument, (here we go again) completely eludes you.

Threatened Counter tariffs have China biting its own tail, as it faces implosion.

And you're obssessing over the price of a ridiculously expensive, portable phone.

We can stop China here and now,with Threats of tariffs, or we can fight a real military war against them in the future, with our young people coming home in flag draped coffins.

https://www.binglee.com.au/tech/phones/apple-iphone

 iPhone X 256GB Silver
$1,829

What's more expensive, an $1829 electronic toy or the lives of our young people in a shooting war?

Where will we have to fight them to another draw next? The Phillipines in 20 years?
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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #47 on: August 05, 2018, 12:46:46 am »
Just like a freaking liberal Leftist.

If you don't see a need or want for something, no one else should either - and if they do - tax the hell out of them for it to make you feel better about the 'fairness' of things.


And BTW: repeatedly calling me a Liberal Leftist or a Democrat doesn't bother me, considering it's you and that's your coldest shot.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

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Offline Suppressed

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #48 on: August 05, 2018, 12:54:08 am »

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1025833273191264256

higher taxes make us richer   :thud:

He said, "our country richer"... not the people, who get poorer.
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Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Why is Trump fighting the trade war?
« Reply #49 on: August 05, 2018, 01:00:04 am »
Told you to read the comments on that link. (Waste of my time)

Maybe, Just MAYBE, you'll get a clue as to who and what we're up against/funding with American Dollars.



Ausonius says:   
August 2, 2018 at 6:33 pm   

Concerning the Chinese dependence on intellectual theft:

My son briefly attended the medical school at USC in Los Angeles about 10 years ago. The Chinese students openly, blatantly, flagrantly, and constantly cheated on everything. They were organized in groups and each group was responsible for cheating in certain classes.

The professors, undoubtedly told to look the other way so that the administration could pocket the Chinese government’s money for tuition, did absolutely nothing.

How many Americans – honest, diligent Americans – were denied a spot for these cheating schmucks?

My son left, completely disgusted by the situation and the atmosphere of accepting cheating as “the Chinese way of studying,” and came back to Ohio.



Jenny R. says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:21 pm   

This is endemic with Chinese students — they are allowed, one might say encouraged, to do this in China. It’s all memorizing test material and nothing else. So, by the time they get to college in the U.S. they are incapable of critical thinking; it’s a new skill they have to learn…IF they can because they have also been taught that they are the superior students.
So, it isn’t just a thinking skill they have to learn but an entire mindset that has to be readjusted.
A lot of them don’t succeed, almost refuse to. The ones that do, don’t want to go back — freedom of thought is a heady intoxicant.
This is one of the areas where the Chinese government went horribly wrong: they have operated from the centrally controlled platform and from the mindset that they really did know what was best (this was a societal thing that should not have been encouraged, yet it was encouraged — we get to see the implications of this on top of the consequences of their one child policy — the country is a psychological basket case in many regards)….this has effected their domestic and foreign policies in all areas…and they will most likely reap what they have sowed (for they do not appear to know how to change).
This was explained to me by my Chinese immigrant aunt, 40 odd years ago — she always said if they would change, become more open (in all ways) that they would do well…and that China would not be such a threat (for the internal fissures which drive the external aggression and other issues could be mitigated). But if they did not, then China would ultimately destroy itself — and it would be a matter of protecting the rest of the world from their implosion.

I think we will find out shortly.



Orville R. Bacher says:   
August 2, 2018 at 7:40 pm   

China is not a “competitor”. They are an enemy. Think of today’s China as 1920’s and 1930’s Japan. Better to wind their necks in now. Later means a much, much higher cost.
Essentially, there is hardly anything that the U.S.A. can’t make for the home market. And it is way past time to outsource the U.S. Chamber of Foreign Commerce.




The content and tenor is uniform right down the page, comment after comment.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com