Trump orders officials to look at $100 billion in new Chinese tariffs

[edpc]

Last first as is my wont.

Well, these last tariffs are after Kudlow joined. Seems he is down with the fight.

Yeah... seems like there was no chance Reagan would tear down that wall either. I see where you are coming from.


I am fine with broadening the tax base. Like most conservatives/kudlow/Austrian economics. And no, losing 170 billion and gaining 800 billion is not a blow to American workers. It is a blow to China mercantilism and global military expansion.

No, Kudlow is OK with using them as a threat in negotiations.  Watch him get marginalized, if not completely walk if they’re fully implemented.

[Fantom]

It didn’t last.

China Military Tells Russia 'We've Come to Support You' Against U.S.
 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/china-military-tells-russia-apos-161427016.html

Heh... Russia is not the Soviet Union. It worked... unless we make China the new Soviet Union by sending them our factories , tech, and a trillion a year to boot.

[Hoodat]

Last I looked China owns $1.3T, or over 7% of Treasuries.

Not a problem.  Once Trump takes the US through bankruptcy court, those T-bills will be paid out for pennies on the dollar.

[Fantom]

No, Kudlow is OK with using them as a threat in negotiations.  Watch him get marginalized, if not completely walk if they’re fully implemented.

And President Trump has always said it was about negotiating a better...fair deal for America...working for us now.

That is why Kudlow joined.

[libertybele]

Foolish move on Trump's part. It's not just about a trade war, but also a currency war.  China would like nothing better than to have the yuan as the global currency rather than the dollar. 


https://www.thebalance.com/u-s-debt-to-china-how-much-does-it-own-3306355

[Fantom]

Not a problem.  Once Trump takes the US through bankruptcy court, those T-bills will be paid out for pennies on the dollar.

I am good with that... just another reason for China not to go there. Talk 'Bout holding all the cards. 

[Fantom]

Foolish move on Trump's part. It's not just about a trade war, but also a currency war.  China would like nothing better than to have the yuan as the global currency rather than the dollar. 


https://www.thebalance.com/u-s-debt-to-china-how-much-does-it-own-3306355

Really, currency manipulation... keeping the Yuan artificially low, is part of the bill of particulars against China.

[edpc]

And President Trump has always said it was about negotiating a better...fair deal for America...working for us now.

That is why Kudlow joined.

Think about how ridiculous that is.  Unless you’re actually willing to pull the trigger, a gun is just an expensive paperweight.

[Fantom]

Think about how ridiculous that is.  Unless you’re actually willing to pull the trigger, a gun is just an expensive paperweight.

 I own a lot of expensive paperweights. Not.... ;D

Willing to pull the trigger keeps the wolves at bay. Strange that I have yet too need to pull the trigger 'Eh. Think... 'Bout that.

There was this strategy... called MAD.... it worked.

If your opponent knows you will not pull that trigger... you are his bitch. That is what the last several decades China has  counted on. Now the thief is looking down the barrel of a .45 Colt.... I think I know who will blink in this instance.

We hold all the cards.. Thankfully we have a President now who not only knows it.... but will pull the trigger.

That gives Kudlow some real negotiating power... and that is why he joined. The man is not a fool.

[edpc]

I own a lot of expensive paperweights. Not.... ;D

Willing to pull the trigger keeps the wolves at bay. Strange that I have yet too need to pull the trigger 'Eh. Think... 'Bout that.

There was this strategy... called MAD.... it worked.

Come on. You are smarter than this.  MAD only works as a deterrent, because both sides know the other will do it. Hence, the willingness...which is why your ‘wolves’ are at bay.

[Fantom]

Come on. You are smarter than this.  MAD only works as a deterrent, because both sides know the other will do it. Hence, the willingness...which is why your ‘wolves’ are at bay.

Actually, MAD works even better to keep those with more to lose in line.

In this case, China has far more to lose than us. That is why, after a few face saving grimaces.... they will acquiesce to Trump and Kudlow.

[edpc]

U.S. stock index futures fell in reaction to Trump's latest statement. Financial markets have swung wildly over the past few days in response to fears of escalating trade tensions between Washington and Beijing.

"Rather than remedy its misconduct, China has chosen to harm our farmers and manufacturers," Trump said.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/china-win-trade-war-u-133843334.html


Strange.  These tariffs aren’t actually in place, as Kudlow has said, but they’re causing short term harm, which is what Ross said would be necessary, but it’s not Trump’s fault, even though they’re in response to proposed US tariffs.

[WingNot]

I like it.  If you are going to be a bear...be a grizzly!   Maul those chinky bastards!

[Fantom]

U.S. stock index futures fell in reaction to Trump's latest statement. Financial markets have swung wildly over the past few days in response to fears of escalating trade tensions between Washington and Beijing.

"Rather than remedy its misconduct, China has chosen to harm our farmers and manufacturers," Trump said.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/china-win-trade-war-u-133843334.html


Strange.  These tariffs aren’t actually in place, as Kudlow has said, but they’re causing short term harm, which is what Ross said would be necessary, but it’s not Trump’s fault, even though they’re in response to proposed US tariffs.

Hmmn, a wholesale repost without any of the content of your original post... I wonder why. 

What was it...something 'Bout the Soveit union.. and that the current Rusian State was more dangerous because the Warsaw States were not reliable or some such..... as if that has anything to do with the thread.

Is that a fair reconstruction of the post you delete/overwrote... for some odd reason...@edpc

Anyways, have a goodnight.

[Hoodat]

I am good with that... just another reason for China not to go there. Talk 'Bout holding all the cards. 

Seriously?  You are OK with the US defaulting on its debts?  What currency do you think the Saudis and every other oil producing nation will move to once the dollar can't be trusted?  Euros?  Yuan?  You think things are bad now?  Wait until we have to buy Euros or Yuan on the world currency market just to have the correct currency to buy a barrel of oil from Venezuela or Nigeria or Iraq.  Except instead of getting 7 yuan to the dollar, we will be getting only two.  Which means our standard of living will fall considerably.

It also means that the US government will never again be able to borrow.  Government bonds will be no more.  And anyone holding them will be equally screwed.  It's like cutting off your head to spite your nose.

[DB]

Cheap imports have provided the illusion of holding inflation down due to all those printed dollars being added to the economy over the last decade.

Remove the cheap imports and watch the underlying dollar inflation start to rear its ugly head in full view. Especially with all the added spending in the last budget.

This is playing with fire.

[edpc]

Hmmn, a wholesale repost without any of the content of your original post... I wonder why. 

What was it...something 'Bout the Soveit union.. and that the current Rusian State was more dangerous because the Warsaw States were not reliable or some such..... as if that has anything to do with the thread.

Is that a fair reconstruction of the post you delete/overwrote... for some odd reason...@edpc

Anyways, have a goodnight.

It was off topic and I didn’t want to veer too far from the discussion, hence the deletion.

[Frank Cannon]

Cheap imports have provided the illusion of holding inflation down due to all those printed dollars being added to the economy over the last decade.

Remove the cheap imports and watch the underlying dollar inflation start to rear its ugly head in full view. Especially with all the added spending in the last budget.

This is playing with fire.

So we should never do anything to correct these problems and just cower in fear?

[DB]

I am good with that... just another reason for China not to go there. Talk 'Bout holding all the cards. 

Destroying the USA's world economic position for $1.4 trillion without firing a shot would be a really, really good deal for the Chinese.

[Hoodat]

Really, currency manipulation... keeping the Yuan artificially low, is part of the bill of particulars against China.

Artificially low?  It's their currency.  They can do whatever they want to do with it, just as we can do whatever we want with the dollar.

However, the yuan is not artificially low.  It used to be when it was tied to the dollar.  But instead of enjoying US control over THEIR currency, people here complained that it wasn't fair that China tied their currency to ours, and that they should be forced to unlink it.  So guess what?  They did exactly that.  And the result was that the dollar FELL against their currency.  That's right, the dollar is the "artificially low" currency here - not the yuan.

I realize you don't like China and want to exact some sort of revenge on them.  But tariffs won't hurt China.  They will only hurt the US.

[DB]

So we should never do anything to correct these problems and just cower in fear?

There are two issues.

One is as China develops (they started as a third world shit hole) their costs are going up. The Chinese are demanding better pay, better working conditions and better environment conditions. They can't continue to dump all their industrial waste into the rivers and backyards anymore.

The other is we should be positioning ourselves to compete with them as their costs rise. Putting up barriers doesn't make us more competitive. Barriers often lead to stagnation of industry and not it becoming more competitive. To be more competitive we need to lower the taxes and regulation on business. Anyone who tries to start a business these days has a very tough go at navigating all the government red tape and costs.

[Hoodat]

So we should never do anything to correct these problems and just cower in fear?

I don't consider it a problem that China is willing to sell us goods at a loss.  I get excited knowing that when I buy something, China is paying part of the cost.  Idiots.

[INVAR]

Oh goody!  A $100 billion tax increase on American consumers!  And people here are actually cheering this on?  When did this place turn into Dummy Underground?

When Republicans decided Statism and Socialism was A-Okay when THEIR GUY does it.

[Hoodat]

Destroying the USA's world economic position for $1.4 trillion without firing a shot would be a really, really good deal for the Chinese.

@DB

You got that right.  What these people don't understand is that every dollar in trade deficit with China ends up back in the US, either in stock purchase, business investment, or government bonds.  Just think how much we will be hurt when they stop accepting dollars from us.

[Frank Cannon]

I don't consider it a problem that China is willing to sell us goods at a loss.  I get excited knowing that when I buy something, China is paying part of the cost.  Idiots.

Problem is they're not selling it at a loss in the traditional sense. They are cornering the market on key manufacturing processes. They are getting their hands on proprietary tech that they can bootleg. They can cut corners on production to make up for any monetary losses.