An Honest Challenge for the Never Trumpers

[truth_seeker]

The law should be an instrument of justice, not revenge.  I'd tread carefully about establishing a precedent whereby the passage of an election means the winners can prosecute and imprison the losers.  The peaceful transfer of power has been a hallmark of this nation for two centuries, with the one exception leading to a brutal war.   

Hillary suffered a humiliating defeat, and was punished by being denied the perks of power.  I have no interest in seeing her in an orange jumpsuit -  the precedent would make us look like a banana republic.   

A leadership game is played whereby folks at the top use "plausible deniability."

--Did the top people know their banks were urging borrowers to use forged documents, and fraudulent representations to make "liar loans?"

--Did Nixon's top people know about the break-ins, subsequent cover-ups?

--Did Hillary Clinton and others know laws were being broken to advance here candidacy?

Former AG John Mitchell served time in prison, when his role was proved.

Why should democrats this time, be spared punishments issued in Nixon's time?

Wouldn't Justice be served by searching for the evidence, and pursuing charges against those that appear to be guilty f crimes against our Republic?

[Bigun]

May we both hope Trump gives us the opportunity to prove you wrong.

PRAYING for that to happen!

[INVAR]

The break between Trump supporters and supporters of anyone but is simply irreconcilable.

The charges of treason and being declared enemies of the country along with those wonderful death threats made by your fellow Trump fanatics for my public refusal to vote for him (and thus automatically assigned a Hillary voter and supporter) during the campaign made that fact abundantly clear.

You have made Trump your island, and I happily consider myself your enemy.

In fact, the mutual feeling is both of us see one another as no better than an Obama or Hillary supporter - and therefore we have absolutely nothing in common upon which to stand together.

[Cyber Liberty]

The law should be an instrument of justice, not revenge.  I'd tread carefully about establishing a precedent whereby the passage of an election means the winners can prosecute and imprison the losers.  The peaceful transfer of power has been a hallmark of this nation for two centuries, with the one exception leading to a brutal war.   

Hillary suffered a humiliating defeat, and was punished by being denied the perks of power.  I have no interest in seeing her in an orange jumpsuit -  the precedent would make us look like a banana republic.   

People don't get a "Get out of jail free" card because they lost an election, the "humiliation" of losing is insufficient reason to let somebody get away with Treason.  We're not talking about breaking a Campaign Finance regulation here, or hiring a brother-in-law, we're talking about putting the country in jeopardy because of Hillary Clinton's desire to keep her government business out of public sight.  Her sloppy email tricks weren't because she was stupid, they were because she wanted to avoid scrutiny.

Swell, you know the difference between Revenge and Retribution, but you're a little unclear about which applies here.

[Cyber Liberty]

Even though she committed numerous crimes that would have put any lower level person in Leavenworth for the rest of their natural lives.

Very telling!

A point I just tried to make.  Let's see how he weasels out of it.

[Right_in_Virginia]

The charges of treason and being declared enemies of the country along with those wonderful death threats made by your fellow Trump fanatics for my public refusal to vote for him (and thus automatically assigned a Hillary voter and supporter) during the campaign made that fact abundantly clear.

You have made Trump your island, and I happily consider myself your enemy. 

If I'd have had the power, I could not have chosen a more appropriate and useful NT spokesperson that you @INVAR

Keep on truckin' baby ....   ^-^

[Cyber Liberty]

Pffft .... NT's will move the goal post.  It's what they do.

This reply from you is why good people just say, "To heck with you" and refuse to praise your guy even when he does well. 

[roamer_1]

People don't get a "Get out of jail free" card because they lost an election because the "humiliation" of losing is insufficient reason to let somebody get away with Treason.  We're not talking about breaking a Campaign Finance regulation here, or hiring a brother-in-law, we're talking about putting the country in jeopardy because of Hillary Clinton's desire to keep her government business out of public sight.  Her sloppy email tricks weren't because she was stupid, they were because she wanted to avoid scrutiny.

Swell, you know the difference between Revenge and Retribution, but you're a little unclear about which applies here.

We are a nation of laws, not people. And until that is fixed, all the rest means nothing. But, as I said upthread, Don't  hold your breath.

[Bigun]

People don't get a "Get out of jail free" card because they lost an election because the "humiliation" of losing is insufficient reason to let somebody get away with Treason.  We're not talking about breaking a Campaign Finance regulation here, or hiring a brother-in-law, we're talking about putting the country in jeopardy because of Hillary Clinton's desire to keep her government business out of public sight.  Her sloppy email tricks weren't because she was stupid, they were because she wanted to avoid scrutiny.

Swell, you know the difference between Revenge and Retribution, but you're a little unclear about which applies here.

The Clintoons have had a "get out of jail free" card since the day they emerged on the national scene and IMHO ending that is a key to restoring our republic.

[INVAR]

If I'd have had the power, I could not have chosen a more appropriate and useful NT spokesperson that you @INVAR

Oh please do! 

I cannot think of a more perfect overt True Believer and political party hack to misquote me at every occasion than you.

[Right_in_Virginia]

Oh please do! 

I cannot think of a more perfect overt True Believer and political party hack to misquote me at every occasion than you.

You're cute when you realize you've lost an argument @INVAR  ... 

Keep on truckin', dear!

[GrouchoTex]

I believe Trump (though he’s been criticized mercilessly for it) was trying to restore the rule of law regarding the policy memorandum sent from Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano to CBP, that eventually became the illegal Obama EO establishing DACA.

But, again as with anything Donald Trump does, he was attacked for insisting that congress act and do something about DACA, illegal in its present form. Legislation after all is congress’ job, not the president’s.

This president, as far as I can tell stays within the lines of his constitutional responsibilities.

I agree, and I wasn't sure what to expect, honestly.
He does follow constitutional guidelines in matters concerning congress or the courts.

[aligncare]

This reply from you is why good people just say, "To heck with you" and refuse to praise your guy even when he does well.

What you just described is pride, plain old stubborn pride.

Our country is more important than petty emotion.

[Cyber Liberty]

What you just described is pride, plain old stubborn pride.

Our country is more important than petty emotion.

Maybe it is, but I can't blame people for not expressing positive thoughts when somebody always takes the opportunity to rub their noses in it.  And, in this case, somebody always does (present company not included).

[INVAR]

You're cute when you realize you've lost an argument

You call THIS an 'argument'?

No sweetie, this is just mutually stating stances - because there is no argument for the purposes of persuasion to be had here.  We see one another as anathema to the other and possessing nothing in common in which to consider ourselves allies or countrymen.

It's a short hop from declaring that people like me are 'damaging to Trump's "brand" - and then asserting the same thing in terms of the country.

But then, you people have been declaring those of us supporting someone besides Trump as traitors to the country since the primaries in 2016.

[aligncare]

Maybe it is, but I can't blame people for not expressing positive thoughts when somebody always takes the opportunity to rub their noses in it.  And, in this case, somebody always does (present company not included).

I can’t say I don’t understand your point, I certainly have been guilty of emotionalism at times in the realm of politics.

We may all succumb occasionally to our human frailties. Besides, generally, political gamesmanship SUCKS. And that’s a fact, Jack!

[LMAO]

A NeverTrump, to me, is someone who doesn't want the President to succeed.  Many of us had serious, even existential, reservations about his experience and temperament,  and remain frustrated at his many unforced errors.   

But damn right I want him to succeed.   I want the economy to flourish,  the rule of law to prevail, and our national interests pursued.   Trump is doing his part.   

And this morning, as the government is shut down, compare and contrast how the Trump administration is trying to minimize the hardship of the situation,  while Obama sought only to weaponize it.   Trump has many enemies,  and too flippin' many of them seek destruction for its own sake.   

@Jazzhead

Couldn’t of said it better myself

[Silver Pines]

@DCPatriot

In short, I concur with prominent Never Trumper David French, who just last month counseled his colleagues to follow these guidelines: “Praise him when he’s right, critique him when he’s wrong, apply the same standards to your own side that you apply to ideological opponents, and keep your eyes fixed on the larger, more important cultural trends.”

I've been doing that all along.  In response, I'm told I hate Trump and want him to be impeached.   

[goodwithagun]

Our country is more important than petty emotion.

You're correct and I’d prefer a leader who kept his own emotions in check, especially on Twitter.

[Frank Cannon]

@DCPatriot

I've been doing that all along.  In response, I'm told I hate Trump and want him to be impeached.   

I thought you had a hard on for Roy Moore?

[INVAR]

I thought you had a hard on for Roy Moore?

FOR???????

No, no, no, no - good Sir.

Not 'for'. 

Definitely NOT for.

[Silver Pines]

I thought you had a hard on for Roy Moore?

@Frank Cannon

I had to take a backseat to you on the Moore threads.  You were always there, shimmying your butt and twirling your pasties at Roy.   

You just couldn’t quit him.

[DCPatriot]

I've been doing that all along.  In response, I'm told I hate Trump and want him to be impeached.   

...you should have included the following paragraphs: 

But have Never Trumpers done this? On a regular basis, those of us who voted for Trump are called on to repudiate his latest ill-advised comment or tweet, or to condemn a past indiscretion. And with words similar to French’s, I recently wrote, “When the president does the right thing, we commend him and encourage him. When he does the wrong thing, with full respect for his office, we express our differences. Is this really so hard?”

But I ask again, have you done this as Never Trumpers?

Doesn’t your integrity compel you to be even-handed, or, perhaps, to acknowledge where, at times, you may have been wrong?

You've got work to do, @CatherineofAragon !   ^-^

[Smokin Joe]

The charges of treason and being declared enemies of the country along with those wonderful death threats made by your fellow Trump fanatics for my public refusal to vote for him (and thus automatically assigned a Hillary voter and supporter) during the campaign made that fact abundantly clear.

You have made Trump your island, and I happily consider myself your enemy.

In fact, the mutual feeling is both of us see one another as no better than an Obama or Hillary supporter - and therefore we have absolutely nothing in common upon which to stand together.

The irony is that much of what Trump has enacted or signed while in office I can support.
The onus of failure falls more on the Congress than the White House.

However, those insufferable people who insisted I vote for him remain insufferable, especially now that they are trying to tell us there will be no reconciliation. That is their self fulfilling prophesy, and they can have it. Why would I want to reconcile with people who allegedly shared my philosophy (if not my principles) and who have acted (and continue to act) thus?
 

[RoosGirl]

...you should have included the following paragraphs: 

You've got work to do, @CatherineofAragon !   ^-^

Can you point us to some things you've said that were critical of Trump in the last year?