FORTY YEARS OF SAVING SOCIAL SECURITY WOULD NET THE AVERAGE WORKING PERSON $1.3 MILLON DOLLARS…

[Elderberry]

Radio Legendary 12/5/2017

The Social Security check is now (or soon will be) referred to as a “Federal Benefit Payment?” I’ll be part of the one percent to forward this. I am forwarding itl because it touches a nerve in me, and I hope it will in you. Please keep passing it on until everyone in our country has read it.

The government is now referring to our Social Security checks as a “Federal Benefit Payment.” This isn’t a benefit. It is our money paid out of our earned income! Not only did we all contribute to Social Security but our employers did too. It totaled 15% of our income before taxes.

If you averaged $30K per year over your working life, that’s close to $180,000 invested in Social Security.

If you calculate the future value of your monthly investment in social security ($375/month, including both you and your employers contributions) at a meager 1% interest rate compounded monthly, after 40 years of working you’d have more than $1.3+ million dollars saved!

More: http://radiolegendary.com/2017/12/the-semantics-of-money/

[Fantom]

Radio Legendary 12/5/2017

The Social Security check is now (or soon will be) referred to as a “Federal Benefit Payment?” I’ll be part of the one percent to forward this. I am forwarding itl because it touches a nerve in me, and I hope it will in you. Please keep passing it on until everyone in our country has read it.

The government is now referring to our Social Security checks as a “Federal Benefit Payment.” This isn’t a benefit. It is our money paid out of our earned income! Not only did we all contribute to Social Security but our employers did too. It totaled 15% of our income before taxes.

If you averaged $30K per year over your working life, that’s close to $180,000 invested in Social Security.

If you calculate the future value of your monthly investment in social security ($375/month, including both you and your employers contributions) at a meager 1% interest rate compounded monthly, after 40 years of working you’d have more than $1.3+ million dollars saved!

More: http://radiolegendary.com/2017/12/the-semantics-of-money/

Which alone would be enough for a retirement in dignity...instead of the poverty that one would get from that same SS confiscation. Now imagine what a real rate of return..say the 7% Stock market return.

[edpc]

From time to time, I get that statement from Soc Sec, showing my income and withholding.  I've worked and paid FICA since I was 15.  I'd like to have that 7.5% over the last 34 years.

[Fantom]

From time to time, I get that statement from Soc Sec, showing my income and withholding.  I've worked and paid FICA since I was 15.  I'd like to have that 7.5% over the last 34 years.

It's more than 7.5%. Your employers contribution is the same amount. Including Medi-Scam it is 15.3%. Trust me, your employer considers that part of your pay package. I know that is how I look at it when I hire an employee.

Having worked for myself these last 27 years.. it is 15.3%.

Actually, for anyone making less that $110,000, I believe is the number, your effective rate is much higher. Say you make $30,000... you are paying for everyone who makes $110,000 ( the cutoff level for FICA). At least the employer portion. Buy a loaf of bread, part of the cost factored in by Rainbow is their FICA tax paid on the Regional manager.

[edpc]

It's more than 7.5%. Your employers contribution is the same amount. Including Medi-Scam it is 15.3%.

Oh, I know.....it's just that I'm certain I would have done more with it.  Even if I was foolish, it's mine.

[Bigun]

Many working people in this country pay nothing in income taxes but every last one of them pays fica and medicare taxes on every dollar they earn including the first one!  Anybody want to talk about a regressive tax we can start right there!

[Bigun]

Oh, I know.....it's just that I'm certain I would have done more with it.  Even if I was foolish, it's mine.

And the dirty little secret is that you pay it all.  It's part of your compensation package whether or not you recognize it.

[Fantom]

Many working people in this country pay nothing in income taxes but every last one of them pays fica and medicare taxes on every dollar they earn including the first one!  Anybody want to talk about a regressive tax we can start right there!

Actually, it is probably the closest thing to the "Fair tax" we will get. Everyone pays the same... for the same worthless payout based on total paid in.

Would that it was privatized. Would have to fund the changeover. I would think selling mineral rights/fed land would cover it.

[libertybele]

I haven't quite reached full retirement age (and that year has now been extended another year by the govt) but on the bottom of my estimated social security benefit statement it says in fine print "*Your estimated benefits are based on current law.  Congress has made changes to the law in the past and can do so any any time.  The law governing benefit amounts may change because, by 2034, the payroll taxes collected will be enough to pay only about 79 percent of scheduled benefits."

So ... in other words, the funds that I have paid into the system won't be available to me! I and a lot of others are going to get royally screwed! If they gut social security and medicare, there are going to be a whole lot of people living in the streets ... or I should say dying in the streets.  That's reality folks.

[Fantom]

I haven't quite reached full retirement age (and that year has now been extended another year by the govt) but on the bottom of my estimated social security benefit statement it says in fine print "*Your estimated benefits are based on current law.  Congress has made changes to the law in the past and can do so any any time.  The law governing benefit amounts may change because, by 2034, the payroll taxes collected will be enough to pay only about 79 percent of scheduled benefits."

So ... in other words, the funds that I have paid into the system won't be available to me! I and a lot of others are going to get royally screwed! If they gut social security and medicare, there are going to be a whole lot of people living in the streets ... or I should say dying in the streets.  That's reality folks.

But but but...I thought Gov'ment were safer than the Stock Market.  Was that not the leftist rant for Socialist Insecurity?

[libertybele]

But but but...I thought Gov'ment were safer than the Stock Market.  Was that not the leftist rant for Socialist Insecurity?

It would be of course a whole different story, if $$ weren't mandated to be taken out of my paycheck and given to the government so that it would be saved for me in my 'golden' (ya right) years only to find out that the money that they've taken isn't there!  So ... should I bring up bank accounts that are supposedly FDIC insured?? IMHO, that's a joke.  The gov't has supposedly insured bank accounts, but yet can't payout social security to those who have paid into it?  Social security is in trouble but so is the financial stability of the U.S.  The stock market is due for a correction sooner or later and the generation retiring now and in 5 years is larger than the generation after it, meaning that there won't be enough people investing to sustain such financial instruments like annuities, muni's, REIT's, etc.,  that those retiring now and in the near future are counting on for income in addition to social security. 

[Oceander]

And of course private investments always gain value at really high rates of return.  Not a single 401(k) was damaged by the 2008 financial crisis.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

I haven't quite reached full retirement age (and that year has now been extended another year by the govt) but on the bottom of my estimated social security benefit statement it says in fine print "*Your estimated benefits are based on current law.  Congress has made changes to the law in the past and can do so any any time.  The law governing benefit amounts may change because, by 2034, the payroll taxes collected will be enough to pay only about 79 percent of scheduled benefits."

So ... in other words, the funds that I have paid into the system won't be available to me! I and a lot of others are going to get royally screwed! If they gut social security and medicare, there are going to be a whole lot of people living in the streets ... or I should say dying in the streets.  That's reality folks.

The funds you paid in were never going to be available to you, and they never claimed they would be.  The funds you paid in were used to pay off the earlier "investors".  That's how a Ponzi scheme works.  If you receive "benefits", it can only be with the funds paid in by your kids and grandkids.

[Fantom]

Of course, the stock market always corrects.. and always grows. Governments always fail, but economies continue on.

Philosophical is about as deep as I care to go now. Maybe in the 'Morn, over corned beef hash and eggs, I'll put a post up worthy of the subject.

I will say it is nice that someone actually brought up a substantial policy debate.

[Fantom]

And of course private investments always gain value at really high rates of return.  Not a single 401(k) was damaged by the 2008 financial crisis.

  You and I are 'Bout to agree, and that is a good thing.

[Bigun]

Even the worst private sector investment known to man - a whole life insurance policy - is FAR and away better than Social Security!

[RoosGirl]

Except the gov't would have to raise taxes across the board.  The average working person would never be allowed to keep that much of their own money.

[libertybele]

The funds you paid in were never going to be available to you, and they never claimed they would be.  The funds you paid in were used to pay off the earlier "investors".  That's how a Ponzi scheme works.  If you receive "benefits", it can only be with the funds paid in by your kids and grandkids.

Unless one worked for themselves and didn't fully pay into the system (God bless them), most people worked and money was directly taken out of their checks and didn't see a dime of it and it was supposedly set aside under the umbrella of social security and yes, we were told that it was going into a 'fund' which many were led to believe would be there when they retired. Several generations have been able to receive benefits. Yes, I fully understand that social security was never meant to be a means of support, but through the years, that's exactly what's happened and social security has always been a political issue.  Yes ... it's a Ponzi scheme.  All I'm saying is that scheme has now failed.  Now what? 

[Suppressed]

It all comes down to whether we have the stomach for letting people starve (or, alternatively, foisting them off onto innocent charities).

Social Security is meant as a more stable investment than a volatile stock market, so we don't have people losing it all or failing to save.  Of course the return will be lower than riskier investments.

(Obviously, things like expanding the recipient pool and longer life spans are problem factors.

[Bigun]

It all comes down to whether we have the stomach for letting people starve (or, alternatively, foist them off onto innocent charities).

Social Security is meant as a more stable investment than a volatile stock market, so we don't have people losing it all or failing to save.  Of course the return will be lower than riskier investments.

(Obviously, things like expanding the recipient pool and longer life spans are problem factors.

Except that with Social Security there is no investment involved!  The money has ALL been stolen and replaced with low grade (read worthless) government bonds!

[libertybele]

Of course, the stock market always corrects.. and always grows. Governments always fail, but economies continue on.

Philosophical is about as deep as I care to go now. Maybe in the 'Morn, over corned beef hash and eggs, I'll put a post up worthy of the subject.

I will say it is nice that someone actually brought up a substantial policy debate.

I hear you.  It's getting late indeed ... I try not to worry and get sleep.  Usually in the morning for me, a yogurt and a piece of peanut butter toast.

[libertybele]

Except that with Social Security there is no investment involved!  The money has ALL been stolen and replaced with low grade (read worthless) government bonds!

   Stolen is exactly right!

[Fantom]

It all comes down to whether we have the stomach for letting people starve (or, alternatively, foisting them off onto innocent charities).

Social Security is meant as a more stable investment than a volatile stock market, so we don't have people losing it all or failing to save.  Of course the return will be lower than riskier investments.

(Obviously, things like expanding the recipient pool and longer life spans are problem factors.

Obviously ...they were not telling the truth. Government is the least stable "investment". They write the rules to steal by.

[Fantom]

I hear you.  It's getting late indeed ... I try not to worry and get sleep.  Usually in the morning for me, a yogurt and a piece of peanut butter toast.

Well, it is going to be 21 degrees in the 'Morn, 38 for a high with Nth winds 15-20 MPH. This bricklayer will have plenty of time to make proper corned beef hash(well out of a can, is anything less more proper?) nice and crispy.

Night Ya'll.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

Unless one worked for themselves and didn't fully pay into the system (God bless them), most people worked and money was directly taken out of their checks and didn't see a dime of it and it was supposedly set aside under the umbrella of social security and yes, we were told that it was going into a 'fund' which many were led to believe would be there when they retired. Several generations have been able to receive benefits. Yes, I fully understand that social security was never meant to be a means of support, but through the years, that's exactly what's happened and social security has always been a political issue.  Yes ... it's a Ponzi scheme.  All I'm saying is that scheme has now failed.  Now what?

Every year since I started paying in I've received a summary which clearly stated that this was NOT a "fund" and that any "benefits" were entirely theorhetical.  Yeah, they talked about a "trust fund" full of gov't bonds, where somehow the gov't owed money to itself, but I can't imagine anyone actually bought into that nonsense.

The scheme has failed.  The money is GONE.  We paid in, and we'd really like to get "our" money back, but it is GONE.  Now what?

1) We suck it up and accept that we were screwed.

2) We demand "our" money back, and screw our kids/grandkids.

3) We demand "our" money back, our kids/grandkids demand "their" money back, and we all screw our great/great-grandkids.

My personal guess is it starts with means testing.  Those of us who saved for retirement will be deemed not to "need' SSI "benefits", so they can "save" those who didn't.