Author Topic: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44  (Read 8441 times)

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Offline Restored

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #50 on: December 01, 2017, 04:25:52 pm »

And yet they couldn't win the primary?   

The Democrats wanted Moore. My guess is they heard the same rumors and found/manufactured some people.
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Offline cato potatoe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #51 on: December 01, 2017, 04:38:05 pm »
Trump defeated Clinton by nearly 30 points in Alabama; that Moore is working with a 4-6 point lead, if those polls are accurate doesn't say much for him.  Strange or Brooks would be walking it.

Alabama is changing like other states in the south.  Moore's style is anachronistic even there.  The age skew of a special election may work in his favor this time.

Offline EdJames

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #52 on: December 01, 2017, 10:35:51 pm »
The candidate is irrelevant. The Democrats have to flip this seat. It will be a major victory in a season of defeats.

I agree, just questioning why he thought that Brooks or Strange would still be ahead by a very large margin.

Offline EdJames

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #53 on: December 01, 2017, 10:37:21 pm »
Good question. If Roy Moore survives this eleventh-hour hit job he will have beaten the odds. Very few republicans ever survive.

Leftists are so mean and dirty in their pursuit of power. I doubt Strange or Brooks would’ve escaped same or similar treatment if they were in Moore’s place. It’s what the left does with the help of their media tools.

Yes, that was my implied point.  I have no doubt that Strange or Brooks would have also come under a blistering attack, if not exact in nature, most certainly to degree.

Offline EdJames

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #54 on: December 01, 2017, 10:40:05 pm »
Honestly,  I think I'd be making a different argument.  A nearby thread addresses when it may be okay to support a morally deficient candidate in order to defeat a larger evil.   That argument would be appealing if it were Strange or Brooks hit by similar charges,  because I think each is both conservative and qualified for the office he seeks.  My issue with Moore is that he's scoffed at following the law as an officer of the court, and been removed for such misconduct twice as a result.   An individual with such disregard for the Constitution and his oath of office has no place in the Senate.   So, sex scandal aside,  Moore is unfit whereas Strange and Brooks are not. 

That's my messy, but honest, answer to your hypothetical.   

Please.  You know full well that I and many others have asked you to specify the "law" that you accuse Moore of disregarding.  To date, you have not done so.

I agree with most, if the candidate were Strange or Brooks, there would be an intense personal attack of one nature or another.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #55 on: December 01, 2017, 10:42:14 pm »
Trump to appear at campaign-style rally miles from Alabama border as special election looms

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,292918.0.html


Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #56 on: December 01, 2017, 10:55:15 pm »
Good question. If Roy Moore survives this eleventh-hour hit job he will have beaten the odds. Very few republicans ever survive.

Leftists are so mean and dirty in their pursuit of power. I doubt Strange or Brooks would’ve escaped same or similar treatment if they were in Moore’s place. It’s what the left does with the help of their media tools.

Democrats=maximum dirty tactics, without remorse, without guilt, etc. Win baby win.

Certain "conservatives"-"republicans" want only candidates dressed all in white, on election day. Even if that means losing.

Methinks they confuse politics with church, but that is just me.



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Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #57 on: December 01, 2017, 10:57:03 pm »
Trump to appear at campaign-style rally miles from Alabama border as special election looms

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,292918.0.html

Gee, only days ago there was a story to the contrary.
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Online Sighlass

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #58 on: December 01, 2017, 11:16:33 pm »
Alabama (and Auburn) still has some fight in her.... When Yankee comedians send leftist clowns down to mock Roy Moore, sometimes the people rebel against the elitists doing it.


« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 11:43:53 pm by Sighlass »
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Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #59 on: December 01, 2017, 11:27:40 pm »
Alabama still has some fight in her.... When Yankee comedians send leftist clowns down to mock Roy Moore, sometimes the people rebel against the elitists doing it.

One member on this site, suggested Moore's voters were "gap-toothed hicks."


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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #60 on: December 01, 2017, 11:42:57 pm »
Three choices in a binary choice? Once again I will mention that bi doesn't mean what you think it means.
It's like tic-tac-toe. You can take the 'X's, you can take the 'O's, or you can refuse to play. Three choices.
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Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

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Online Sighlass

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #61 on: December 01, 2017, 11:43:02 pm »
One member on this site, suggested Moore's voters were "gap-toothed hicks."

Well some of us are... just like every other section of America, we have it all.
Exodus 18:21 Furthermore, you shall select out of all the people able men who fear God, men of truth, those who hate dishonest gain; and you shall place these over them as leaders over ....

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #62 on: December 01, 2017, 11:45:27 pm »
A wise man once said there's no such thing as "bi".
Yep. Andrew Dice Clay.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #63 on: December 01, 2017, 11:48:29 pm »
“None of the above” makes you feel good about yourself but does nothing to achieve a viable or just outcome. Pull that lever, and you’ve just marginalized yourself within the process; you’ve in essence, raised the white flag on participating in your own future.

That’s nothing to be proud of.
I think "none of the above" should be on the ballot. If it gets the most votes, dump the candidates and try again.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #64 on: December 01, 2017, 11:54:02 pm »
I think "none of the above" should be on the ballot. If it gets the most votes, dump the candidates and try again.

That is one idea, but we might never get a winner (until I change my name of "One of the Above").

My preference is you get one vote.  It can be for one candidate, or against one candidate.  I think that would make third parties much more viable, and it'd be fun to see a candidate blather on about a "mandate" when they won with a negative vote total.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #65 on: December 01, 2017, 11:56:56 pm »
It is not in the best interest of the nation to elect either Roy Moore or Doug Jones to the Senate.   That ship has sailed.   As to which one is worse,  I don't rightly know.   I would write in Mr. Brooks and chalk this up as another election where the two party system has failed to provide us with any good choices.

I've been getting used to doing that a lot lately.       
Oh come on @Jazzhead, you just don't like Moore because he stood up for the Alabama Constitution's provisions (approved by 81% of the voters) that marriage is between one man and one woman, and nothing else constitutes marriage, in opposition to a District judge ruling.

Twice the man lost his job standing on principle.
Have you even ever once lost your job for standing on principle?
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #66 on: December 02, 2017, 12:04:12 am »
Total disagreement.  We're a nation of laws, not of men.   There are mechanisms under the Constitution for addressing bad decisions by judges.   Follow them, or we've really morphed into the arbitrary tyranny the right wing whackjobs rail about.   
Moore was bounced once for refusing to subvert the Alabama Constitution (LAW!) to comply with a single District Judge's ruling.
Tyranny, indeed, considering the Constitutional Amendment Moore was upholding had been approved by 81% of the voters in the State.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Oceander

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #67 on: December 02, 2017, 12:06:08 am »
Moore was bounced once for refusing to subvert the Alabama Constitution (LAW!) to comply with a single District Judge's ruling.
Tyranny, indeed, considering the Constitutional Amendment Moore was upholding had been approved by 81% of the voters in the State.

The federal district courts decision was supreme to the Alabama state constitution.  Moore is a lawless git, without a real conservative bone in his body. 

Offline Fantom

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #68 on: December 02, 2017, 12:15:43 am »
The federal district courts decision was supreme to the Alabama state constitution.  Moore is a lawless git, without a real conservative bone in his body.

Ah, a federalist/communist makes some noise I see.

Sorry, real Conservatives are not "Federalist".  Sell that garbage at the local ACLU.
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Online Sighlass

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #69 on: December 02, 2017, 12:22:16 am »
The federal district courts decision was supreme to the Alabama state constitution.  Moore is a lawless git, without a real conservative bone in his body. 

Actually it was argued and even the NYsLimes agreed that was not necessarily the case. I can't find the full article right this minute, but here was another one that admitted as much.

Quote: "Some legal scholars say that the chief justice may be correct in his interpretation of the immediate scope of the federal court’s rulings and how they apply to the probate judges." END QUOTE

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/09/us/gay-marriage-set-to-begin-in-alabama-amid-protest.html

Another leftist article that deals with this issue.

https://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/01/alabama_chief_justice_roy_moor_2.html

I want to also point out that the first time the unelected lawyers threw Roy Moore out, they made it clear it was not over the 10 commandment statue, which they knew was constitutional.

I will post the first sentences of the decision removing Moore the first time.

QUOTE..."At the outset, this court emphasizes that this is a case concerning only possible violations of the Canons of Judicial Ethics. It is NOT a case about the public display of the Ten Commandments in the State Judicial Building nor the acknowledgment of God. Indeed, we recognize that the acknowledgment of God is very much a vital part of the public and private fabric of our country." END QUOTE

He did nothing unconstitutional. They even carefully admit that. Moore never got his day in court over the constitutionality of the ten commandments monument or for whether federal judges had more rights to interpret SCOTUS rules .
« Last Edit: December 02, 2017, 12:26:23 am by Sighlass »
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #70 on: December 02, 2017, 03:32:26 am »
Ah, a federalist/communist makes some noise I see.

Sorry, real Conservatives are not "Federalist".  Sell that garbage at the local ACLU.

Conservatism used to spring from the Federalists and the writings of men of contemplative wisdom.
Conservatism today is founded on the principles and ideology of "here, hold ma beer."

Calling @Oceander a communist just makes YOU sound stupid.  Unfortunately you haven't the tools to sound smarter on other topics, or entertain me.

Reading your posts is worthless.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2017, 03:33:07 am by Once-Ler »

Oceander

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #71 on: December 02, 2017, 03:36:50 am »
Actually it was argued and even the NYsLimes agreed that was not necessarily the case. I can't find the full article right this minute, but here was another one that admitted as much.

Quote: "Some legal scholars say that the chief justice may be correct in his interpretation of the immediate scope of the federal court’s rulings and how they apply to the probate judges." END QUOTE

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/09/us/gay-marriage-set-to-begin-in-alabama-amid-protest.html

Another leftist article that deals with this issue.

https://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/01/alabama_chief_justice_roy_moor_2.html

I want to also point out that the first time the unelected lawyers threw Roy Moore out, they made it clear it was not over the 10 commandment statue, which they knew was constitutional.

I will post the first sentences of the decision removing Moore the first time.

QUOTE..."At the outset, this court emphasizes that this is a case concerning only possible violations of the Canons of Judicial Ethics. It is NOT a case about the public display of the Ten Commandments in the State Judicial Building nor the acknowledgment of God. Indeed, we recognize that the acknowledgment of God is very much a vital part of the public and private fabric of our country." END QUOTE

He did nothing unconstitutional. They even carefully admit that. Moore never got his day in court over the constitutionality of the ten commandments monument or for whether federal judges had more rights to interpret SCOTUS rules .

So he got kicked out because he engaged in unethical behavior as a judge.  Acting unethically as a judge makes him moral?

My God, people here like to laugh at the contortions and knots democrats will tie themselves into to avoid owning the logical conclusions of their policies, and then they do exactly the same to themselves over this PoS fake conservative from Alabama.

Offline roamer_1

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #72 on: December 02, 2017, 03:45:53 am »
Ah, a federalist/communist makes some noise I see.

Sorry, real Conservatives are not "Federalist".  Sell that garbage at the local ACLU.

Well, technically, yes, Conservatives ARE federalists - Oddly enough, 'federalism' is a component-based government wherein various states retain their own autonomy and their own sovereignty.

Federalists are about the various states' sovereignty, and reducing the federal behemoth back into its Constitutional boundaries.

Odder still:

a Statist is one who claims that sovereignty resides foremost in the federal government.

Go figger  :shrug:

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #73 on: December 02, 2017, 04:41:31 am »
Total disagreement.  We're a nation of laws, not of men.


Yes we are,  and men cannot change the law from a judge's bench.  It can only be changed legislatively. 

Federal judges have become tyrants,  and Roy Moore stood up to them.  Finally someone did the right thing with those lying bastards that tried to usurp our laws.   



  There are mechanisms under the Constitution for addressing bad decisions by judges.
 


That system has failed.  It is broken.  Congress does not have the guts to impeach a judge for a bad decision,  nor do they have the necessary unity to do it.   The media (sockpuppets for the New York Crony Capitalist/Deep State coalition) steer public opinion,  and there is nothing with which to counter their power.   


Follow them, or we've really morphed into the arbitrary tyranny the right wing whackjobs rail about.   


We morphed into Federal Tyranny back in 1861, and people were too foolish to realize it.   We are a long way from the separation of powers the founders created.  It is now all concentrated in New York and Washington DC.  Those two cities effectively run the nation.   
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Online Sighlass

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Re: Latest Alabama poll shows Moore leading Jones 49-44
« Reply #74 on: December 02, 2017, 04:47:12 am »
So he got kicked out because he engaged in unethical behavior as a judge.  Acting unethically as a judge makes him moral?

My God, people here like to laugh at the contortions and knots democrats will tie themselves into to avoid owning the logical conclusions of their policies, and then they do exactly the same to themselves over this PoS fake conservative from Alabama.

Perhaps what you don't/won't admit is Moore is more witty about the constitution than you give him credit for. Perhaps it scares you.



Is Alabama’s  Judge on the Right Side of the Law? (Edited by me for brevity)

https://www.thedailybeast.com/is-alabamas-anti-gay-judge-on-the-right-side-of-the-law

Some legal experts say that Justice Moore may have the law on his side.

The debate over “states’ rights” and federalism.

This is, after all, the same Roy Moore who went to the legal mat to defend “Roy’s Rock,” a gigantic stone carving of the Ten Commandments—and won.

From the perspective of the legal details, though, the two cases are different. Governor Wallace rested only on constitutional ideals, and a view of federalism that was settled by the Civil War. Justice Moore’s order relied on the niceties of administrative law.

Technically speaking, the Alabama cases, Searcy vs. Strange (adoption) and Strawser v. Strange (marriage), resulted in injunctions against Alabama’s executive branch of government, represented by the attorney general, not to enforce Alabama’s same-sex marriage amendment. They did not extend to probate judges, who were not parties to the case and are employees not of the executive, but of the judicial branch.

And the head of the judicial branch? Chief Justice Roy Moore.

In two memos, one on February 3 and the second on February 8, Moore wrote that probate judges aren’t bound by the injunctions. In the first memo, he said that probate judges aren’t required to defer to the district court’s reasoning—essentially leaving it up to them to decide. In the second, he changed his mind, and ordered probate judges to disobey it “to ensure the orderly administration of justice.”

“Roy Moore got it right,” wrote Florida law professor Howard Wasserman on the Prawfsblawg legal blog last week. “And without bigoted or anti-federal rhetoric.” Probate judges are not covered by the injunction, and Moore is within his rights as head of the judicial branch.

Wasserman told The Daily Beast that “this is more than technical. Judge Granade made a mistake—or allowed the plaintiffs to make a mistake—in forming their case. The result is an injunction against the person (the attorney general) who lacks any power to do anything with respect to licenses and no injunction against the people (probate judges) who do.”

Wasserman added that “any individual probate judge can (and should) be the named defendant if/when he refuses to grant the license.”

Ironically, this can now be done: Now that licenses have been issued, and not issued, in Alabama, a non-issuing probate judge can easily be added to the case and call the marriage off.

Wasserman dismisses the claims that such judges could be jailed for contempt of court. “This would be utterly impossible,” he said. A federal court “cannot hold in contempt anyone who was not party to the federal action, which is only the attorney general.”

Rather, the non-obeying judges can be added to the case as it progresses—precisely because they can now be clearly identified.

Now it’s clear that Moore didn’t need to pull out all the legal stops here. He could easily have taken a broader, common-sense approach to the district court injunction, and brought Alabama in line with all the other states that have reluctantly complied with federal court orders on same-sex marriage.

Clearly, Chief Justice Moore is simply doing anything he can to stop gay marriage—which is good politics too, since his is an elected office and most Alabamans oppose it.

And Moore probably knows that he will lose. He’s lost today, with many judges issuing marriage licenses to jubilant same-sex couples—although many others are not doing so—and his view seems unlikely to prevail at the Supreme Court later this year. This makes his “stand in the courthouse door” an easy piece of political theatre.

It has also created what the New York Times has aptly called “judicial chaos,” with individual probate court judges torn between the demands of their boss and those of a federal court. Moore has created a self-fulfilling prophecy: by warning of judicial chaos and taking action to ostensibly avoid it, he has, instead, created it.

This is probably the point. Opponents of same-sex marriage have long had an image problem. On one side, couples crying tears of joy on the courthouse steps. On the other side—what, exactly? With “judicial chaos,” there is at least a competing narrative.
Exodus 18:21 Furthermore, you shall select out of all the people able men who fear God, men of truth, those who hate dishonest gain; and you shall place these over them as leaders over ....