Democrats Intro Automatic Gun-Fire Prevention Act to Ban Gun Parts

[Smokin Joe]

Then here's your argument:  don't ban bump stocks, regulate them the same as automatic weapons.   

Just stay away from the argument that nothing about bump stocks should change.

Absolutely not.

This is one incident. A gruesome one, absolutely horrific. But I will point out that one of these has been used in a crime, a crime which is poorly understood in regards motive. No other bump-fire device has been used in a crime, yet you advocate heavily regulating these devices, devices which the BATFE under the Obama administration twice okayed.

There is a lot of emotion surrounding this incident, and that appears to be the driving force behind calling for a ban. One thousand times as many people die from hospital acquired infections every year as were killed in this incident. Two thousand times as many more than were killed in this incident die annually because their doctors screwed up. We won't even go into the number killed in abortions, but to put this one-off incident into perspective, there are things in this world far deadlier than a device which has been used once in a highly unusual crime, and other factors which might prevent such a crime would be far more effective than taking the property of innocent people from them without due process of law--people who have done nothing wrong.

Then, too, comes the question of just what devices you are talking about. Will the Aleve I take that takes the stiffness out of my trigger finger and enables me to cycle the firearm more efficiently be considered a "machine gun"? How about a tactical glove that takes the chill away and lets me operate the trigger better? --a rubber band that, with proper technique can duplicate the effects of a bump stock? --a loop of para cord or bootlace?
Without making anything that can be used to replicate that rate of fire illegal, there is no point, but my point is that you can't make everything that can be used to do that illegal without making it illegal for someone with lace up boots to have a semi-auto, or making someone who has a semi-auto a criminal for having a bungee cord.

Another law? No. We already have laws against shooting people. If that didn't do it, making criminals out of innocent people will not accomplish your goal. I am not willing to give up my rights or endure the hazard of someone else's interpretation of what is or isn't something that could help me shoot faster for the mere illusion of safety.

[DB]

roamer wrote:
"I literally and likely don't know anyone who is into guns that hasn't done so already.
It's a parlor trick, and not a serious mod."

It got pretty "serious" with 12 rifles equipped with 'em up on the 32nd floor in Vegas a few days' back...

This is an issue that isn't goin' away.
Sure as shootin', this slimeball Paddock probably lit the fuse in some others' dark souls.

I know, I know -- someone is going to reply to this post by repeating "the rubber band and pencil trick". That one actually takes some skill to put together and make workable.

But a bump/slide stock? It's an easy bolt-on accessory that works much better.
Anyone can do it.
Not full auto, of course not. But perhaps... "the next best thing".

I don't want to see them banned and existing owners made outlaws for keeping them.
But there's going to have to be some sort of compromise on this one.
Even the NRA can see that.

Best solution that I can reckon is that ATF be given some regulation over them.
Maybe "class 3".
Hmmm.... how about a new "class 3a"?  (as in, "accessory")

When you ban something any idiot can make you cheapen the law and it does nothing to stop crime. Only the law abiding won't have what you banned. Might as well outlaw rubber bands over a certain size... The criminals don't care about the law and will continue on ignoring them regardless.

So in short, banning bump stocks will not affect intentional mass murder one iota and what's the point when that's the case? The only point left is punishing gun owners who follow the law. Just one more layer of the onion removed from the 2nd amendment with gun owners always getting the short end of the deal...

[DB]

Absolutely not.

This is one incident. A gruesome one, absolutely horrific. But I will point out that one of these has been used in a crime, a crime which is poorly understood in regards motive. No other bump-fire device has been used in a crime, yet you advocate heavily regulating these devices, devices which the BATFE under the Obama administration twice okayed.

There is a lot of emotion surrounding this incident, and that appears to be the driving force behind calling for a ban. One thousand times as many people die from hospital acquired infections every year as were killed in this incident. Two thousand times as many more than were killed in this incident die annually because their doctors screwed up. We won't even go into the number killed in abortions, but to put this one-off incident into perspective, there are things in this world far deadlier than a device which has been used once in a highly unusual crime, and other factors which might prevent such a crime would be far more effective than taking the property of innocent people from them without due process of law--people who have done nothing wrong.

Then, too, comes the question of just what devices you are talking about. Will the Aleve I take that takes the stiffness out of my trigger finger and enables me to cycle the firearm more efficiently be considered a "machine gun"? How about a tactical glove that takes the chill away and lets me operate the trigger better? --a rubber band that, with proper technique can duplicate the effects of a bump stock? --a loop of para cord or bootlace?
Without making anything that can be used to replicate that rate of fire illegal, there is no point, but my point is that you can't make everything that can be used to do that illegal without making it illegal for someone with lace up boots to have a semi-auto, or making someone who has a semi-auto a criminal for having a bungee cord.

Another law? No. We already have laws against shooting people. If that didn't do it, making criminals out of innocent people will not accomplish your goal. I am not willing to give up my rights or endure the hazard of someone else's interpretation of what is or isn't something that could help me shoot faster for the mere illusion of safety.

It's a "gotta do something mentality"... Emotional driven thinking that doesn't actually solve the problem but makes them feel better as if they had. And since the consequences of what they demand fall on someone else they don't see what the big deal is. Why do you need that is what they say... With that reasoning there's no limit to what "we really don't need"...

Individual commercial airline pilots have purposely killed hundreds of people per incident multiple times. True mass murder. That's the reality of evil men. No law in a free society can stop evil people bent on killing.

[DB]

It sounds like a number of people here simply want to offer up bump stocks to the alter of the left as a sacrifice to have them move on.

There's a word for that. Appeasement.

Appeasement never ends well. They bully always wants more.

[Smokin Joe]

It sounds like a number of people here simply want to offer up bump stocks to the alter of the left as a sacrifice to have them move on.

There's a word for that. Appeasement.

Appeasement never ends well. They bully always wants more.

The alleged solution will not solve a problem which is unique, anyway. More laws to create problems for the law abiding will not stop those who break existing laws to break windows and shoot people.

[Fantom]

Because bump stocks turn guns into automatic weapons.

And with a four inch piece of two *four, a spring , two screws and a yardstick I can make one. Any law which only stops lawfull citizens is bad law.

[Fantom]

@roamer_1

The people pushing for this fluffy regulation crap don't realize that the Feds won't stop there.  Next 30 round magazines will be the problem.  Then the caliber of rifles sold.  Then guns having less than an (insert number here) pound trigger pull.  Then night sights...or the ability to fire single action.

Give Big Government types an inch and they'll take 10 miles.  Like I said earlier...before we know it we'll be limited to .22LR rifles and .380 pistols none of which will be able to fire 5 founds in double action with a 14 pound trigger.

Right, it is the slippery slope in action.

The left/regressives and the misguided ban this item, it sets the precedence that they can ban anything else.

[Fantom]

The alleged solution will not solve a problem which is unique, anyway. More laws to create problems for the law abiding will not stop those who break existing laws to break windows and shoot people.

Right. ban the murderer..not the knife.

A law against murder does not affect law abiding or moral people. It does affect murderers, albeit sadly, after the fact. Apply the same reasonable standard to bump stocks, and you only affect those who misuse them.

We add additional felonies for using a firearm in the commission of a crime.  Another example of law that only affects the criminals.

[txradioguy]

Right, it is the slippery slope in action.

The left/regressives and the misguided ban this item, it sets the precedence that they can ban anything else.

Exactly!!

And the last thing we need is people who are supposedly on our side of the aisle going along with this junk.