The battle of Charlottesville: A continuing discussion thread about the War between the States

[Mom MD]

   That is possibly the stupidest thing I've ever seen you type @jpsb   
   To insinuate that NT'ers here are aligned with the 'progressive left' in any manner, war or no war, just because we didn't vote for 'your' guy, is just absurd, but carry on.

Trump is more aligned with the progressive left than NTers.  Conservatives and those who don't support Trump do so because he is too far left, not too far right.

[Mom MD]

 

Conspicuously absent from your most recent version of events is the protestor who defends  Lee's legacy while at the same time condemns the white supremacists who have stolen the valor of the Confederate battle flag by turning it into a symbol of racism while hiding their faces like a bunch of cowards.

To hell with these racist scumbags on both sides.  We could have saved Lee's legacy.  But after today, there is no way possible of doing so, because the Lee name is now associated in blood with these schmucks.

Yet all you care about is propping up Trump.

[sneakypete]

Presser: Charlottsville is the birthplace of democracy. Who knew?

@don-o

It's not.  I believe that "honor" goes to Moscow.

[Cripplecreek]

Conspicuously absent from your most recent version of events is the protestor who defends  Lee's legacy while at the same time condemns the white supremacists who have stolen the valor of the Confederate battle flag by turning it into a symbol of racism while hiding their faces like a bunch of cowards.

To hell with these racist scumbags on both sides.  We could have saved Lee's legacy.  But after today, there is no way possible of doing so, because the Lee name is now associated in blood with these schmucks.

Yet all you care about is propping up Trump.

And the worst part is, they're too stupid or cowardly to admit that Trump feels the same about the confederate battle flag and monuments as Barrack Obama or Nancy Pelosi.

[Hoodat]

Most conservatives and patriots would agree with the protest and want to preserve our history.  But it is not appropriate to do it at an event sponsored/permitted by the Klan.  We need to hold our own event and make every effort to exclude the alt right crowd.  I know they are not right wing, but we have lost the war of words over what they are called.  We need to be sure we denounce them as swiftly and thoroughly as we do BLM, not attend events with them.

Ditto to the umpteenth power!

[sneakypete]

I thought Athens was.

@Hoodat

I think Athens was just the first one we know about. There is no such thing as a successful democracy,and never has been.

Which is why the Founding Fathers took care to make sure America  wouldn't be a democracy. A wise move the career criminals we call politicians are still working hard at reversing on a daily basis.

[GtHawk]

@don-o

And the news reports that it was shot down by Neo-Nazi Kluxxers in a Camaro with a painting of Trump on the hood will start in 5....4.....3.....2.....1.

Sorry, hours ago there was FR headcase claiming it was shot down by a BLM sniper brought back from Afghanistan. To the credit of a semblance of sanity on the site, he was roundly ridiculed.

[sneakypete]

In my eyes, not a lick of difference between KKK and BLM.  Both scum that I wish would evaporate off the face of the earth.

@catfish1957

Yeah,what you said!

[sneakypete]

Would you abridge both their free speech rights?

@catfish1957  @don-o

I can't speak for catfhis1957,but I certainly wouldn't. If I did,I would be no better than  them. This is America,and EVERYBODY is supposed to have the right to speak their minds without fear  of government retribution.

[sneakypete]

If he had any cajones, he'd called them out by name (BLM).

@catfish1957

Maybe he did,and the media edited his comments for PC reasons?

[sneakypete]

Yes, I am sure BLM was there as well as the other usual suspects in large protest, but so were a lot of people not part of these groups that just wont tolerate public demonstrations of KKK and White Nationalist who are bringing violence to town.

@NavyCanDo

Uhhh,who were the aggressors,the protesters,or the communist agitators?

[sneakypete]

Where was Governor McAuliffe?   If he were a Republican, the press would be all over him.

@dfwgator

Careful how you talk about our next president!

You don't really want you name on a list,do you?

BTW,his son was recently arrested with a crowd of anarchists that were rioting on the left coast. He was all dressed in black,and wearing a black handkerchief on his face while creating mischief,and someone pulled his handkerchief down  right before some news photographer took a photo.

[sneakypete]

White nationalists, neo-Nazis and members of the 'alt-right' with body armor and combat weapons evacuate comrades who were pepper sprayed after the 'Unite the Right' rally was delcared a unlawful gathering by Virginia State Police

@edpc


And you KNOW the men in that photo were White Nationalists and Neo-Nazi's HOW?

Maybe it was the American flag sewn on the front of the vest,next to the Confederate Flag.

Ever heard of the "letters of Confederation"? If not,you might want to look them up.

[Smokin Joe]

@Hoodat

You're kidding,right?

You seriously believe the press reports that all those protesters were kluxxers and nazi's?

REALLY?

Why?

I have been playing catch-up, but you have touched on a few things I'd like to sum up. First, if the media see one cross, one hood, or even a Confederate Battle Flag, they'll whip out the KKK. If they see one guy with a swastika, the whole gathering will be painted as neo-Nazis. It is how the media roll. Unfortunately, the presentation in the future will be that anyone trying to preserve the history of those who risked all they had to fight for their home States autonomy and the Confederacy, independent of the Union, will be painted as neoNazis or Klansmen without any regard to their background or motives.
Big Brother has spoken, and the "counter-protests" were indeed likely well-organized disruptive events, perhaps tipped off by people in government who sympathize, for whatever reason, with the BLM and Antifa types. Add in the official disruption and confusion about where the permit for protests was to be sited, and some earnest people walked into a set-up flat footed. The media have their optics, the fool who ran down people in the street has guaranteed that it will be far more difficult to protest the destruction of monuments, the renaming of buildings, streets, and the ongoing erasure of a significant part of this country's history from public view.
With the fables being spooned into little brains about the entire conflict, the concept of rebelling against Federal usurpation and mistreatment will be crushed as an historical reality.
That is what must be fought against, and those who one would expect to fight against the muzzling of voices from the past are instead fighting to shut any opposition up, to make them nonpersons in an historical sense. Typical of Socialist Orwellianism, the Antifa and BLM people are actually fighting for Fascist control of information, about as totalitarian as it gets. Now their allies in the media have an event to point to and examples to wave of blood in the streets, likely none of which would have happened if they had let the protesters have their say and booked the park for the week after.

[sneakypete]

Like it or not it was the KKK that applied for the permit.

Where did you get that info from? This is the first time I have heard that. The reports I read earlier didn't identify the permit holder as a Kluxxer.

They are vermin.

Is that any way to talk about undercover FBI agents?

Show a little respect for your masters!

[dfwgator]

Is that any way to talk about undercover FBI agents?

 

[sneakypete]

I would submit your supposition is probably more correct than not.

I saw some 3%ers out there and they are not Klansmen. They are patriots, most former .mil.

Who/what are the 3 percenters? Never heard of them before.

[edpc]

And you KNOW the men in that photo were White Nationalists and Neo-Nazi's HOW?

Maybe it was the American flag sewn on the front of the vest,next to the Confederate Flag.

Ever heard of the "letters of Confederation"? If not,you might want to look them up.

@sneakypete

The words in the post are in italics because it's the caption that accompanied the photo.  Take it up with AP.

[TomSea]

Daily Mail shows suspect in march; one can ignore their sensationalizing which they are doing, it's their business.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4785732/Man-charged-murder-plowing-car-protesters.html


With glasses on left.  What he did seems like something a 20 year old might do, lack of self-control, possibly let his emotions get the best of him. Of course, we don't know the full story yet, I just speculate on this.

The day was met with more tragedy, when a Virginia State Police helicopter, carrying Lieutenant H Jay Cullen (left), 48, and Trooper-Pilot Berke M.M. Bates. Police confirmed that they both died at the scene

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4785732/Man-charged-murder-plowing-car-protesters.html#ixzz4pbkLWMsv
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

My condolences to these troopers' families and friends.

Charlottesville will be sued if it is all true and I suspect that it is, the police stood down.

Kyle Bristow may have been the organizer from what I've heard, an alt-right activist.  He's the one who might have had a permit. The "Unite the Right" people did have a permit from what I understand.

[Smokin Joe]

My condolences to these troopers' families and friends.

Agreed. Prayers up for their families and friends.

[sneakypete]

@INVAR @Mom MD

Most conservatives and patriots would agree with the protest and want to preserve our history.  But it is not appropriate to do it at an event sponsored/permitted by the Klan.

I can't argue with that on one level,but on another level,why are we allowing the media and the lef (repeating myself here) define who we can associate with? ESPECIALLY given that they have the habit of identifying pretty much every random white guy you see as a Nazi,a Kluxxer,or both?

Don't get me wrong,I have no problem at all with the permit holder saying "you can stay,but you gotta go" to anyone,but we MUST stop  allowing the media to pimp us out.

 

We need to hold our own event and make every effort to exclude the alt right crowd.

There is nothing preventing protest organizers from doing this now,but the lack of will. Wouldn't even be hard to do. Pretty much all a protest organizer would have to do would be to put up posters and notify the media that Swastikas and White sheets and hoods as articles of clothing would NOT be allowed,and then then sell tickets  stating the same. Charge a buck apiece for the tickets,and donate all money over expenses to the national debt. If you sell someone a ticket and they accept,they are agreeing to your terms and you have a right to eject them if they violate the agreement.

[sneakypete]

Conspicuously absent from your most recent version of events is the protestor who defends  Lee's legacy while at the same time condemns the white supremacists who have stolen the valor of the Confederate battle flag by turning it into a symbol of racism while hiding their faces like a bunch of cowards.

@Hoodat

Say WHUT?????? You mean to tell me those retards with single-digit IQ's actually have the power to steal all that valor and symbols?

Hoodathunkit?

Hey! MAYBE it was the media that have kept saying that over and over,and now you believe it to be true?

To hell with these racist scumbags on both sides.  We could have saved Lee's legacy.  But after today, there is no way possible of doing so, because the Lee name is now associated in blood with these schmucks.

Not one chance in hell. How old are you,anyhow,3? Lee's legacy has been dragged through the mud ever since the day he resigned from Mr.Lincoln's Army and came home to lead the Army of Virginia. I have heard his described as a "traitor and rebel" my whole damn life.

In case nobody has ever splained this to you,the winners get to write the history books.

Yet all you care about is propping up Trump.

That's the ticket,Bubba! Bring Trump into it because you have nothing else.

[sneakypete]

And the worst part is, they're too stupid or cowardly to admit that Trump feels the same about the confederate battle flag and monuments as Barrack Obama or Nancy Pelosi.

@Cripplecreek

WHY are you people continuing to get distracted by outside forces? Near as I can tell,Trump,Pelosi,and Obomber were not even there.

FOCUS,PEOPLE,FOCUS!

[sneakypete]

I have been playing catch-up, but you have touched on a few things I'd like to sum up. First, if the media see one cross, one hood, or even a Confederate Battle Flag, they'll whip out the KKK. If they see one guy with a swastika, the whole gathering will be painted as neo-Nazis. It is how the media roll. Unfortunately, the presentation in the future will be that anyone trying to preserve the history of those who risked all they had to fight for their home States autonomy and the Confederacy, independent of the Union, will be painted as neoNazis or Klansmen without any regard to their background or motives.
Big Brother has spoken, and the "counter-protests" were indeed likely well-organized disruptive events, perhaps tipped off by people in government who sympathize, for whatever reason, with the BLM and Antifa types. Add in the official disruption and confusion about where the permit for protests was to be sited, and some earnest people walked into a set-up flat footed. The media have their optics, the fool who ran down people in the street has guaranteed that it will be far more difficult to protest the destruction of monuments, the renaming of buildings, streets, and the ongoing erasure of a significant part of this country's history from public view.
With the fables being spooned into little brains about the entire conflict, the concept of rebelling against Federal usurpation and mistreatment will be crushed as an historical reality.
That is what must be fought against, and those who one would expect to fight against the muzzling of voices from the past are instead fighting to shut any opposition up, to make them nonpersons in an historical sense. Typical of Socialist Orwellianism, the Antifa and BLM people are actually fighting for Fascist control of information, about as totalitarian as it gets. Now their allies in the media have an event to point to and examples to wave of blood in the streets, likely none of which would have happened if they had let the protesters have their say and booked the park for the week after.

@Smokin Joe

WELL STATED!

[sneakypete]

Daily Mail shows suspect in march; one can ignore their sensationalizing which they are doing, it's their business.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4785732/Man-charged-murder-plowing-car-protesters.html


With glasses on left.  What he did seems like something a 20 year old might do, lack of self-control, possibly let his emotions get the best of him. Of course, we don't know the full story yet, I just speculate on this.
My condolences to these troopers' families and friends.

Charlottesville will be sued if it is all true and I suspect that it is, the police stood down.

Kyle Bristow may have been the organizer from what I've heard, an alt-right activist.  He's the one who might have had a permit. The "Unite the Right" people did have a permit from what I understand.

@TomSea

I am just GUESSING the helicopter did what helicopters are prone to do,and just fell out of the sky for mechanical reasons. I once had a helicopter pilot in the army correct me when I said helicopters fly. He said "They don't fly. What they do is beat the air into submission".

BUT.....,if somebody DID shoot it down or cause it to crash in some way,I hope those people are caught,convicted, and quickly put to death.