House Passes Bill Authorizing CMP Sale of Army Surplus 1911 Pistols

[txradioguy]

The House of Representatives has passed a bill that includes language approving the sale of the U.S. Army’s surplus stock of .45 ACP 1911 pistols to the public through the Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP).

Introduced in the House in June, H.R. 2810—the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) for Fiscal Year 2018—authorizes appropriations for Department of Defense programs and activities. While it was up for consideration in the House Armed Services Committee, Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Alabama, added an amendment to compel the Army to release its excess M1911A1 handguns to the CMP. The legislation—with the new amendment—was approved in the House by a vote of 344-81.

According to a report from the NRA, in November 2015 President Obama signed the NDAA for Fiscal Year 2016 into law with language that approved the transfer of no more than 10,000 of its 100,000 excess 1911 pistols, sitting in storage at a taxpayer expense of about $200,000 per year, to the CMP every year. However, no such transfers were ever made while Obama was in office.

But that could all change with the passage of the NDAA for Fiscal Year 2018. Rogers’ amendment, Section 1064, makes the 1911 transfer compulsory, with the language changed from “the Secretary may transfer” to “the Secretary shall transfer” with regard to the excess pistols. The 10,000 yearly cap would also be removed.

“The CMP’s sales of 1911s would be treated as other retail sales under the federal Gun Control Act, including the attendant background checks and point of sale record keeping. The design of the pistols dates back to the late 19thCentury, and they come equipped with a seven-round magazine. One would think this would render the sales harmless in the eyes of the “reasonable gun safety regulation” crowd, but we’re not holding our breath,” the NRA said.

While the House passed its version of the NDAA for Fiscal Year 2018, the Senate still has to approve its bill. After that, both chambers of Congress will convene a conference committee to “resolve the differences in their bills,” according to the NRA.


http://www.personaldefenseworld.com/2017/07/cmp-1911-pistols/

[Elderberry]

I assume the CMP sales process for the 1911s will be similar to the Garands. I renewed my TSRA membership, so I should be "Good to Go" once I get the word.

[Wingnut]

transfer of no more than 10,000 of its 100,000 excess 1911 pistols

I wonder if that will drive the cost of a new 1911 down in the market place.    But then 10,000 unit probably isn't enough to make a difference.

[txradioguy]

I wonder if that will drive the cost of a new 1911 down in the market place.    But then 10,000 unit probably isn't enough to make a difference.

I'm thinking it will depend on what these Government Issue 1911's are sold for.

[Wingnut]

I'm thinking it will depend on what these Government Issue 1911's are sold for.

J I'll pay 250  for one of those surplus ones.   Maybe 300.

[txradioguy]

J I'll pay 250  for one of those surplus ones.   Maybe 300.

I would too...heel I might buy two at that price if they'd let me! And if they offer them at that price as opposed to say $800-1,000 for each gun it will drive the retail cost down as well...which is good for everyone.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

There is no such thing as a 'Surplus' 1911 so long as even One soldier is saddled with one of those s**t useless, underpowered Beretta .9mm.

[Elderberry]

How much will CMP 1911 Pistols Cost?

Posted December 8, 2015 in Pistols by Steve Johnson

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/12/08/how-much-will-cmp-1911-pistols-cost/

Gun nuts throughout the USA are desperate to know how much the CMP 1911 pistols will cost once they go on sale. There is a lot we do not yet know about the CMP 1911 pistols. In fact, there is a lot the CMP does not yet know about the program. We contacted them but have not yet heard back.

Before making a guesstimate on how much the pistols will cost let us first look at what we do know for sure:

    We know the US Army has about 100,000 pistols in storage. The cost of storing these guns is upwards of $200,000 each year. Less than 10,000 of these 1911 pistols were given away by the Army to law enforcement or to equip allied military forces.
    These pistols were manufactured during or before WWII. The last of these to be manufactured is thought to be an Ithaca M1911 in 1945.
    New legislation instructs the Army to release 10,000 of these 1911s each year to the Civilian Marksmanship Program over the next ten years.----

----I would expect CMP 1911 pistols to be about 30-50% less than the current market price. The market price for WWII M1911 pistols is about $1000 – $4000+. $2000 seems to be the going price for Service Grade pistols.

Based on the market prices, the CMP’s pricing history and the the increase of supply that these pistols will bring to the market, my guesstimate pricing for CMP 1911 pistols are:
Grade    Price
CMP Rack Grade 1911 Price    – *
CMP Field Grade 1911 Price    $750
CMP Service Grade 1911 Price    $850
CMP Special Grade 1911 Price    $1100
Other **    $1800 +

* I do not expect there to be rack grade pistols for sale initially.
** Depending on what is in the Army inventory, there could be a range of rare pistols in their own categories, but not rare enough to go to auction.

I hope the prices will be lower than my estimates. I know many of you are hoping for $500 1911 pistols but I do not realistically expect this to happen. Modern 1911 pistols are popular enough in their own right without the added attraction of being military surplus.

[txradioguy]

There is no such thing as a 'Surplus' 1911 so long as even One soldier is saddled with one of those s**t useless, underpowered Beretta .9mm.

Thankfully we've started getting rid of those POS pistols and we're in the process of transitioning to the Sig Sauer P320.

The 101st should be getting the first shipment shortly.

[Elderberry]

Civilian Marksmanship Program <info@thecmp.org>

CMP 1911 Information - January 29, 2018


Status of the CMP 1911s, 1/29/2018:
 
The CMP has been authorized to receive 8,000 1911 type pistols from the United States Army.
 
The 1911s have been received by the CMP.  A complete inventory will be conducted over the course of this week. The pistols will then be securely stored until the Army-approved 1911 building and armory infrastructure is completed.  That completion is anticipated to be approximately 60 days from now. Once the 1911 armory is completed, inspection, grading, repair, and ultimately test firing of the pistols will begin. (Please be aware that the CMP was led to believe that we were ready to move forward, but three weeks ago facility requirements were changed, and we are now fulfilling those requirements.)
 
The CMP 1911 order packet will be posted 90 days prior to the order acceptance date and opening sales date. No orders will be accepted prior to that date. Please visit www.thecmp.org, click on the Sales icon then 1911 Information, for the latest. CMP customer service has been inundated with calls and emails concerning the 1911s and no further information is available at this time.
 
The CMP will keep everyone posted as we move through this process.


Mark Johnson
Chief Operating Officer
Civilian Marksmanship Program
www.thecmp.org

[Bigun]

I'll probably buy one.

[Elderberry]

http://thecmp.org/cmp_sales/1911-information/

Some decisions further clarified updated 12/19/2017:

    CMP will have an all-new 1911 order form, 1911 purchasing instructions, a 1911 page on our web site, a dedicated 1911 FFL fax number and email address for the FFL holder to send their FFL with customer's name attached. The customer will have to send in a complete new order packet with all new qualifying criteria included. Everyone will be a new customer, everyone starts with no advantage or disadvantage. CMP 1911 is an FFL governed operation and is a separate entity from CMP and has to have its own record keeping operation with no ties to the old CMP records.
    Decisions concerning the grade and pricing of the 1911s will not be made until inspection has occurred of a substantial quantity which will take an estimated 150 days post receipt.  CMP will price at fair market value in accordance with CMP's enabling legislation.
    Potential purchasers will have to provide to CMP a new set of documents exhibiting:  1) proof of U.S. Citizenship, 2) proof of membership in a CMP affiliated club, 3) proof of participation in a marksmanship activity, 4) a new form 2A with notary, 5) a signed copy of the 01, or 02, or 07 Federal Firearms License in which the 1911 will be transferred to.
    A NICS background check will be performed by CMP on the customer to assure the customer is eligible to purchase prior to shipment to the FFL licensed dealer. The customer must receive a "proceed" from NICS prior to shipment of the pistol to the FFL licensed dealer.
    The CMP customer will be required to complete a form 4473 in person at the FFL dealers place of business, successfully passing a NICS check, in which the information is provided by the FFL holder to NICS, before the pistol can be transferred.  This is a second NICS check performed on the customer.
    Qualified CMP customer will only be allowed to purchase one 1911 per calendar year.
    No 1911s available in the CMP stores, or on line, only mail order sales.  All 1911 orders will come in via USPS, UPS, Fed EX, etc.
    CMP will set the date in which it will accept orders for the 1911s. The date will be posted to the world.
    Orders will only be accepted via mail order delivery, USPS, UPS, Fed Ex, etc.
    Orders will only be accepted post marked on the date or after, no early orders.
    Once CMP receives 10,000 orders, customer names will be loaded into the Random Number Generator.
    The Random Number Generator will provide a list of names in sequence order through a random picking process to CMP.
    Customers will be contacted in the sequence provided by the Random Number Generator.
    When the customer is contacted a list of 1911 grades and pricing options that are available will be offered for selection of one 1911 type pistol.
    As CMP proceeds down the sequenced list less grades and pricing options will be available.

[WingNot]

Book marked

[edpc]

I assume the CMP sales process for the 1911s will be similar to the Garands. I renewed my TSRA membership, so I should be "Good to Go" once I get the word.

I remember surplus Garands sold in Woolworth's when I was a kid.

[Fantom]

Seems, I remember the Garand repatriations from South Korea being nixed by the obama regime. Any chance those are back in the works?

[driftdiver]

Got an email about the 1911s today.  Sounds like were 60 days before they get the guns and then 90 days before they're on sale.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

I remember surplus Garands sold in Woolworth's when I was a kid.

When America was still, The Land of The Free.

Dear Lord how far we've fallen.

[libertybele]

There is no such thing as a 'Surplus' 1911 so long as even One soldier is saddled with one of those s**t useless, underpowered Beretta .9mm.

??? Help me out here (pleading ignorance) is the 1911 a Colt?  What's wrong with a Beretta .9mm?

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

??? Help me out here (pleading ignorance) is the 1911 a Colt?  What's wrong with a Beretta .9mm?

@libertybele

Yes the 1911A1 is a Colt, designed by John Browning.

The prime 'What's the matter with a 9mm Beretta' as opposed to the Colt in .45 ACP is the gross Lack of power the 9mm has compared to the .45 ACP.

25 years ago the glossy Gun Magazines were referring to the 'New and Improved 9mm' (as a sop to the companies making them and buying full page ads in the mags,) as 'The Wonder 9'.

One old cuss who knew full well better (might have been Jeff Cooper himself) snorted in print that "Yes, It's a Wonder Cartridge alright."

"You shoot the bad guy with it 3 times and Wonder if he's going to fall over."

[Frank Cannon]

??? Help me out here (pleading ignorance) is the 1911 a Colt?  What's wrong with a Beretta .9mm?

9mm's are weak ghetto guns. I have one just as a novelty.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

9mm's are weak ghetto guns. I have one just as a novelty.

They're a .38 Special in a casing designed for an automatic.

As opposed to the Colt SAA .45 Long Colt (that's in every John Wayne movie ever made) in a casing designed for an automatic.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

Unlike the 1911 the only 100% certain 1 shot stop with a 9mm is a head shot.

There's no time or place for that kind of finicky in a military engagement or a burgler in your dark bedroom at 3AM, with you still 75% asleep as he's coming at you.

[Suppressed]

I remember surplus Garands sold in Woolworth's when I was a kid.

My brothers both got surplus Garands and surplus M1 carbines at Woolworth's.

I had to keep my money to pay for college.   



Does anyone know... is it considered a "Straw Purchase" if people put in for the lottery and then sell the gun if they win the lottery?

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

My brothers both got surplus Garands and surplus M1 carbines at Woolworth's.

I had to keep my money to pay for college.   



Does anyone know... is it considered a "Straw Purchase" if people put in for the lottery and then sell the gun if they win the lottery?

It shouldn't be, So Long as you sell the gun through a licensed FFL holder and the buyer completes the required by law background check paperwork, and gets checked out on it before taking delivery of the gun. But you're still strongly advised to check with someone In Your State who knows for sure, like a legit gun dealer or attorney who specializes in firearms law.

[libertybele]

They're a .38 Special in a casing designed for an automatic.

As opposed to the Colt SAA .45 Long Colt (that's in every John Wayne movie ever made) in a casing designed for an automatic.

Thanks for the info -- I'll rethink choices for personal protection.