Author Topic: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself  (Read 787 times)

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Online corbe

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President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself

 By Jeffrey Crouch, opinion contributor - 07/23/17 03:00 PM EDT


The media is abuzz with speculation about President Trump’s clemency powers after the story broke that his lawyers are mulling options for himself and his family.

The president himself on Saturday seemed to confirm the report, asserting that he has "complete power" to pardon relatives, aides and possibly himself.

How does the clemency power work? Who could he pardon? Can he pardon himself? Should he?

The fact is, Trump can pardon any federal crime, ranging from moon-shining to treason. He may grant clemency as soon as an offense is committed: no need to wait for the offender to be sentenced, tried, or even charged with a crime. Overall, the courts have protected a broad, wide-ranging clemency power for the chief executive. Still, he may not pardon a future federal crime, excuse a state offense, or exercise clemency “in cases of impeachment,” as noted in Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 of the Constitution.

The remedy for an unpopular clemency decision comes from Congress. Members can hold hearings, subpoena documents, call witnesses, and otherwise raise the profile of the clemency decision.
 
They can also delay funding for presidential priorities, drag their feet on his policy priorities, and refuse to confirm presidential nominees. In more extreme cases, they can pursue impeaching the president, or even try to amend the Constitution.

How likely it is Congress will take these actions, with Republicans in control, is another matter completely.

Who could he pardon?

It’s clear that President Trump could pardon anyone caught up in special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation – today, if he wanted to do so. He could grant as many or as few pardons as he wished, would not have to specify the crimes they are being pardoned for, and could make the language of the pardon as broad or as narrow as he wanted. Whether the political context would support any of these moves is unclear, but there’s little question that Trump has the legal power to act.

Can he pardon himself?

<..snip..>

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/the-judiciary/343269-trump-clemency-and-the-self-pardon-possibility
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline the_doc

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2017, 09:46:11 pm »
Pardoning oneself is a legally ridiculous idea.  If a POTUS can pardon himself, he is COMPLETELY ABOVE THE LAW.  (Our Framers would consider today's lawyers complete fools for speculating about this.)

Offline Cripplecreek

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2017, 09:59:39 pm »
Right off the top its an admission of guilt combined with a belief that he should be above the law.

Offline endicom

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2017, 10:52:28 pm »
So Trump is guilty?

Of what?

Online corbe

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2017, 11:03:13 pm »
   Besides being a NY Liberal @endicom absolutely nothing, has been proven.
   I hope it stays that way, but you can't deny that President Trump shares a lot of the responsibility for this CF of Collusion. 
   Throwing his AG under the BUS to 'fake news' NYT last week, stepping all over his obummercare repeal message the day before was the political capital that is being flushed.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline INVAR

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2017, 12:15:53 am »
So Trump is guilty?

Of what?

Exactly.

So why is he talking about pardoning himself, family members and campaign staff if he's guilty of nothing?

All he will do is create the appearance that the crazy charges are true and that he considered himself above the law.

At least that is how I will view it.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Online DB

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2017, 12:30:41 am »
Exactly.

So why is he talking about pardoning himself, family members and campaign staff if he's guilty of nothing?

All he will do is create the appearance that the crazy charges are true and that he considered himself above the law.

At least that is how I will view it.

To be fair, this story doesn't quote Trump saying anything. Just a bunch of speculation about what his lawyers are doing.

Offline endicom

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2017, 12:48:25 am »

So why is he talking about pardoning himself, family members and campaign staff if he's guilty of nothing?



Is he?

Online corbe

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2017, 12:53:12 am »
To be fair, this story doesn't quote Trump saying anything. Just a bunch of speculation about what his lawyers are doing.

    Fair Analysis @DB , And that is why I put it in Editorial/Opinion
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline EasyAce

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Re: President Trump, consider the risks of pardoning yourself
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2017, 02:27:19 pm »
To be fair, this story doesn't quote Trump saying anything. Just a bunch of speculation about what his lawyers are doing.
He tweeted this on Saturday:

Quote
Donald J. Trump ✔ @realDonaldTrump
While all agree the U. S. President has the
complete power to pardon
, why think of that
when only crime so far is LEAKS against
us.FAKE NEWS
4:35 AM - 22 Jul 2017
(Emphasis added.---EA.)


"The question of who is right is a small one, indeed, beside the question of what is right."---Albert Jay Nock.

Fake news---news you don't like or don't want to hear.