Author Topic: Hand Me That Wrench: Farmers and Apple Fight Over the Toolbox . Alex Fitzpatrick Jun 22, 2017  (Read 3266 times)

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Offline mirraflake

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Nope.  Some of the profits are on the back end.  Cars used to be simpler, and easier to work on, and many a dad was a Sunday driveway mechanic.  Now they're more complex, but only need a tuneup every 50,000 miles or more.  Tires used to need changing at least twice a year here in the snow belt -- now they're radials and just get rotated every other LOF.

I drive a lot for my job about 40-50k miles per year. I usually trade cars in when they get 160-175k miles. Other than brakes, oil changes, air filter and tires I have never even changed plugs. I got over 80k miles on my Goodyears the car came with and they still had tread but I let the car get out of alignment so the inside was worn down.

I remember the old points and rotor and cap days lol

@SunkenCiv


Offline mirraflake

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Back in the old days a farmer would keep his tractor for 25-30 years. Today full time farmers keep their new tractors on average 7-9 years according to industry records

The dealer I bought my tractor from said in the old days 1970's when his father ran the business  they would sell 50 tractors per year if they were lucky. He told me in the month of April they sold 38  and we have less family farms.

People want the very latest gadgets and nice paint.

I have neighbors like that buy the latest Kubota and 2 years later trading it in for  a new model because they get bored with it.


Offline Smokin Joe

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Maybe they should try his way, then. It puts a lot of bread on a lot of tables.
I'm glad his way works for him. I'm glad he feeds lots of people. Please note:

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North Dakota is number one in the production of two wheat classes: hard red spring and durum. On average, the state's farmers grow nearly half of the nation's hard red spring wheat (250 million bushels) and two-thirds of the durum (50 million bushels). That's just part of the agricultural output, overall wheat production is second to Kansas most years.
The solution isn't trying to grow something inappropriate for the climate, it's to buy different equipment next time.

Just for your viewing pleasure (If you see a lot of trees, well, it wasn't North Dakota. :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41tdkNct4Tg
It is a different sort of farming than you see further South, it is not land which commonly lends itself to that which can be done on 500 acre farms in warmer and more moist climates, and it puts food on tables around the world.

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North Dakota also is the leading U.S. producer of sunflower, barley, dry edible beans, navy and pinto beans, canola, flax, oats, honey, lentils and dry peas. The state also is a major producer of sugarbeets, potatoes, hay and specialty crops such as mustard seed, buckwheat and crambe.

http://www.ndwheat.com/buyers/default.asp?ID=293

That sort of farming is really only economical on a large scale. Very large. Which takes large equipment because the growing season here is short. (We get 16 hours of sunlight at peak of summer, but by winter, we're down to 8 hours of sunlight and 30 below zero is not uncommon.)
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline goodwithagun

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How much ag welfare are they getting for not trying new methods?
I stand with Roosgirl.

Offline mirraflake

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How much ag welfare are they getting for not trying new methods?

US farming crop yields increase each year, better fertilizers, gps on tractors and seeders to control right amount of seeds and fertilizer. 

Farmers are at the front of using the very latest technology.

As I said before crop subsidies to farmerss keep our food prices stable. Without subsidies one year bread would be 1.00 loaf, next year 10.00 loaf.

@goodwithagun

Offline Smokin Joe

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How much ag welfare are they getting for not trying new methods?
For starters, I lived in the Shenandoah Valley for a few years while I went to college. Lovely place, even if parts of it are getting downright crowded. I like mountains and trees, I like warm climates, too, but the coldest air temperatures I experienced there were ten degrees above zero.

Here, we have no mountains. Most of the trees away from the river bottoms (the ones which haven't been flooded along the Missouri) have been planted as shelter belts to keep wind from blowing the fields to Minnesota.

My first reaction when I arrived here to the absence of things between here and there, "there' being a very long ways away by Shenandoah Valley standards, considering you aren't standing on the south peak of Massanutten Mountain, was that there was nothing to get behind to shelter from the wind. Now, that was an extreme case, because Grand Forks, ND is in the middle of the old Lake Agassiz plain, otherwise known as The Red River Valley up this way (not to be confused with the Red River in Texas), but it is actually one of the flattest places on earth, and a site for microwave transmission experiments because the terrain is flatter than the open ocean.

Add in the 'climate shock', as in my ignorance I was regaled by the locals with stories of how the temperature would get to 30 below and stay there for weeks. I took those stories at face value, and to my surprise, there was no exaggeration. We had a month with the high temperature of zero. (Little did I know it was a truly nasty winter, at least until I caught a couple of locals griping about it.)

Salatan's methods are wonderful for small farms with different crops, in different locations. It might even work on a small scale here, in places where water is more plentiful along the little bit of river bottom the Corps of Engineers hasn't flooded out or seized because it could be, but that is a terribly small nibble of the land here.

For the rest, those methods aren't likely to work. There is not the population density to support the 'local customer' aspect.

By contrast, the Shenandoah Valley has I-81, I-64, and I-66 (Not to mention US 33) to bring in outside customers, as if Stanton and Harrisonburg (and Waynesboro) were not large enough to support such an operation. (My, how they've grown since I was there last). Stanton alone has a population over 2/3 of the whole county I live in, and that's just one of the 53 counties in ND where wheat is grown (Yep, all 53).

So, I guess we'll just have to keep sending unit trains of hard red wheat and durum out of here, some of which will be exported, some used here in the US.
(Freighter loading with grain at Duluth, MN, Maltese flag, Polish ownership)

Just because that's too much bread and pasta for anyone in this area.

Farming, like anything based on weather and soil type and terrain, is not a one size fits all deal. The tractors and tillage equipment used here would have a hard time turning around in the tobacco fields I worked in as a child in Southern Maryland. A 'big' tractor for there, then might be used to pull a few bales out to livestock here (Those are considered 'collectors items' now, or are in use by 'hobby' farmers and small field operations.)
I think it is wonderful that the folks at Polyface Farm have going what they do, but it's no more appropriate here than 'winter wear' in Ft. Lauderdale, FL is for Minot, ND.

The software at issue here, (because that's what these malfunctions are, generally, software problems) is used to keep track of the application of ag chemicals (including fertilizers) and seeding operations, minimizing the amount of material used for optimal yields. That's important when you're farming six or seven thousand acres, as is getting that crop in in a timely fashion, because the growing season on America's steppes is short.



We're in the purple part at the top of the map. It calls for a different sort of farming, and with grain prices what they are (even with the annually adjusted subsidies) efficiency and scale are the key to making a living.

You can't do efficiency or scale without good equipment, and that was the issue here. There sits a mechanically able tractor, with the 60 ft. seeder rig behind it, fueled up and ready to go and the software glitches and stops the whole operation. Farmers, who are used to fixing their own stuff and getting back to work, want the information they need to do so. John Deere thinks they'll just have to wait for the tech to show up, but a week or two for that to happen is lost yield. That dog won't hunt.  **nononono*
« Last Edit: July 10, 2017, 09:37:28 pm by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis