Author Topic: Manchester Suicide Bombing  (Read 29761 times)

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Offline driftdiver

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Why not? Why not outlaw Islam, seize their lands and properties, burn their places of worship, and send them out of the country (or behead them) if they refuse to swear fealty to the Crown and the CoE? It has been done before, only to Catholics, under Henry VIII.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Monasteries
It is not without precedent, however moldy, only the will is lacking.
(I'm not trying to start the 'troubles' again, just making a historical point.)

Its been done before.
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Offline EC

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #301 on: May 23, 2017, 03:23:09 pm »
ISIS claims responsibility for Manchester terror attack

ISIS has claimed responsibility for the terror attack that killed at least 22 people Monday night outside an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, United Kingdom.

According to Israeli media, ISIS said in a video they posted online that "This is just the beginning."

http://www.jpost.com/Breaking-News/ISIS-claims-responsibility-for-Manchester-terror-attack-493635
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Offline driftdiver

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #302 on: May 23, 2017, 03:25:31 pm »
That's what baffles me about these bombings.  Every single time lately the authorities KNEW or had interaction with the terrorist.

Yet they aren't jailed or otherwise shown the door and are left to do horrific things like this bombing.

I just don't get it.

@txradioguy
Because their leaders will punish them for being islamaphobic.
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We can't blame Islam, Catherine!!!! It's one of the worlds great religions and it's a religion of peaceTM!!!!

They will not see the evil before them until they're personally forced to bow before the blade.

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I swear I think they'll lay their heads underneath that blade if it makes them seem more tolerant.  In a way, they're doing it now.

Offline Victoria33

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As you know, my son has lived in London for 30 years.  He just got safely back to London from Siberia making a documentary film.  When something happens in England, my first thought is, "Where is Wayne this minute?"  I haven't heard from him since this bombing happened, but surely he was not there.  I will send him an email to make sure.

Offline TomSea

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #305 on: May 23, 2017, 03:41:36 pm »
Seeing how the "troubles" was not a religious war and a conflict between UK and Ireland; that is unrelated.

Not only that, the Church of England/Anglican came to replace the Church of Rome but remained very similar. That's hardly about dissolving a religion.

Offline Sanguine

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@CatherineofAragon

As you know, my son has lived in London for 30 years.  He just got safely back to London from Siberia making a documentary film.  When something happens in England, my first thought is, "Where is Wayne this minute?"  I haven't heard from him since this bombing happened, but surely he was not there.  I will send him an email to make sure.

@Victoria33, that is scary.  My son and DIL were there for several years, and I always worried.   

Offline anubias

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"Knowing about" is shaky grounds, though.  They're keeping their eyes on probably hundreds or thousands of potential terrorists.  They simply can't "do something" about all of them, and even if they're doing their best, the ugly truth is that every once in a while one will get past the guards.  The problem is, in a country like the UK, governed by rule of law, subject to Constitutional constraints ... how do you keep it balanced?

Had he done anything for which he could actually be arrested?  Consider carefully how you'd answer.  Do you think you'd like to live in a place where being arrested "on suspicion" was the norm.  After all, you post here -- to many on the left you're as suspicious and dangerous as the bomber was.

How does a free society deal with those that do not adhere to our laws and values?  When I ponder that question and think about what happens when that society is overrun by those that do not, I realize that our future is grim.  I believe the answer will eventually be isolationism, but by the time those that wish to welcome these people with open arms are in agreement, it may be too late as we may already be overrun.

I see no peaceful path to stop those that do not follow the rule of law and wish us harm.  I pray those that are far more knowledgeable and intelligent than I know the answer and implement it before it is too late.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2017, 03:53:57 pm by anubias »

Silver Pines

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@CatherineofAragon

As you know, my son has lived in London for 30 years.  He just got safely back to London from Siberia making a documentary film.  When something happens in England, my first thought is, "Where is Wayne this minute?"  I haven't heard from him since this bombing happened, but surely he was not there.  I will send him an email to make sure.

@Victoria33

Will you let us know when you hear from him?  Doubtless he's all right, but if I had a loved one over there, I would worry, too.

Offline Smokin Joe

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.... Mentioned by one of our resident hand-wringers, right?  "OOhhhh, the west is done, done, done!!!  8888crybaby"  They're as bad as the vigil-goers.  All bluster and no rational thought. 

I expect the British authorities are probably a lot more brutal about this stuff than people recognize, and for sure the French are.  Granting the reflexive and well-nigh suicidal protectiveness of the left, they don't represent the feelings of most. 

"Knowing about" is shaky grounds, though.  They're keeping their eyes on probably hundreds or thousands of potential terrorists.  They simply can't "do something" about all of them, and even if they're doing their best, the ugly truth is that every once in a while one will get past the guards.  The problem is, in a country like the UK, governed by rule of law, subject to Constitutional constraints ... how do you keep it balanced?

Had he done anything for which he could actually be arrested?  Consider carefully how you'd answer.  Do you think you'd like to live in a place where being arrested "on suspicion" was the norm.  After all, you post here -- to many on the left you're as suspicious and dangerous as the bomber was.
With any cell phone or other communications traffic indicating intent, "Possession of bomb making materials" has been used as a charge. Those suspected could be more closely monitored, but that takes people, budget, and the will to do so, within the rules. At some point the system becomes so severely infiltrated that the normal mechanisms of secrecy no longer remain secret, or even are not applied. (DOJ under Obama, for instance)
Unfortunately, the direction all this takes us in is one of Bills of Attainder and the tracking of every expenditure and purchase, all totalitarianism wrapped in the mantle of providing "safety", and equally to be rejected in a free society.
The only other way to exert control is to do away with the nonsense of "multiculturalism" when dealing with fundamentally incompatible cultures and retain separation. Too late to impose that without a pogrom.
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Offline Victoria33

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@Victoria33
Will you let us know when you hear from him?  Doubtless he's all right, but if I had a loved one over there, I would worry, too.
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@CatherineofAragon

Will let you know when/if I get answer to my email.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #311 on: May 23, 2017, 03:54:52 pm »
Cell phone jammers in all public arenas would work...let the people complain.  Then ask them...would they rather do without FB and Snapchat for a couple hours or be dead?

Most of the attacks here are with weapons...not bombs...because of the terrorist's ability to purchase them in the States that isn't available to them in Europe.

And at the end of the day...the very fact that there are CCW permit holders in the crowd and they don't know who they are is a bigger deterrent than how accurately one can shoot.

Hence the reason the attacks in the U.S. have happened in gun free zones.
The terrorists aren't going to ask someone how well they did at the range last weekend before they decide whether or not to open fire.
Sorry, I did not mean to imply that concealed carry would be completely ineffective. Only in situations where typical bomb vests and IEDs were the M.O. In firearm attacks, firearms still hold sway, although again I will mention the target is not just center of mass (body armor), but that salad plate sized target. upper legs count, too (Femur/Femoral Artery, downward trajectory), and may be preferable if there are people in the background to risking a through and through or miss hitting people in the background, at head/upper torso level.

No, I'm not ruling out guns or being armed, just that in this one case, they may not have been able to make a difference. Anyone shooting someone with a bomb vest should expect to be wounded at a minimum in the blast, unless they are doing so from distances more suited to a rifle shot. (not that Center of mass can't be done from farther out with a pistol).
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline TomSea

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #312 on: May 23, 2017, 03:57:51 pm »
China, at least in that troubled Western province of their's has outlawed growing long beards.

China or some other nation has also outlawed wearing those Islamic pants, pants with the cuffs about half way up the shin, short pant legs.

These terror acts are just constant, really, I'm starting to lose track of them now.

Offline Fishrrman

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #313 on: May 23, 2017, 03:58:10 pm »
Now comes this:

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #314 on: May 23, 2017, 04:05:22 pm »
Seeing how the "troubles" was not a religious war and a conflict between UK and Ireland; that is unrelated.

Not only that, the Church of England/Anglican came to replace the Church of Rome but remained very similar. That's hardly about dissolving a religion.
While it was entirely about ending as much as possible the influence of the Church of Rome, (so Henry could be the leader in all things, sacred and secular) the departure from Catholic doctrine was small, just enough for Henry to seize that power, and not enough to be completely repugnant to the nobility and others who had to either go along or rebel. It was also about looting a religion:

Quote
The dissolution of the monasteries in the late 1530s was one of the most revolutionary events in English history. There were nearly 900 religious houses in England, around 260 for monks, 300 for regular canons, 142 nunneries and 183 friaries; some 12,000 people in total, 4,000 monks, 3,000 canons, 3,000 friars and 2,000 nuns. If the adult male population was 500,000, that meant that one adult man in fifty was in religious orders.
, and destroying any influence the papacy had. The wealth of those religious houses (monasteries, and the like) was forfeit and confiscated.

Kindly go to the link and learn.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline EC

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #315 on: May 23, 2017, 04:34:48 pm »
Manchester bomber named by police

Salman Abedi, 22, has been named by police as the suspected suicide bomber who killed 22 people and injured 59 at Manchester Arena on Monday night.

Abedi had not been identified by the coroner so no further details would be given about him, Greater Manchester Police Chief Constable Ian Hopkins said.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40020168
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Offline Idiot

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #316 on: May 23, 2017, 04:40:18 pm »
Manchester bomber named by police

Salman Abedi, 22, has been named by police as the suspected suicide bomber who killed 22 people and injured 59 at Manchester Arena on Monday night.

Abedi had not been identified by the coroner so no further details would be given about him, Greater Manchester Police Chief Constable Ian Hopkins said.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40020168

Wow...there's a surprise...NOT.

Offline EC

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #317 on: May 23, 2017, 04:41:32 pm »
Did anyone expect otherwise?  :shrug:
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Offline Gefn

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Will let you know when/if I get answer to my email.


@Victoria33

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #319 on: May 23, 2017, 04:48:52 pm »
Did anyone expect otherwise?  :shrug:

Nope!  Certainly not this someone! :thud:
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

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Online DCPatriot

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Why not? Why not outlaw Islam, seize their lands and properties, burn their places of worship, and send them out of the country (or behead them) if they refuse to swear fealty to the Crown and the CoE? It has been done before, only to Catholics, under Henry VIII.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Monasteries
It is not without precedent, however moldy, only the will is lacking.
(I'm not trying to start the 'troubles' again, just making a historical point.)

And it's a damned shame that today, you have to add the 'bold'.   

I understand.   "Believe me".    ^-^
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Offline EasyAce

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #321 on: May 23, 2017, 04:56:57 pm »
Did anyone expect otherwise?  :shrug:
Not I, said the fly.

It was merely a question of how long before it was confirmed.

Which does nothing to bring back the dead or heal the injured, unfortunately.


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Fake news---news you don't like or don't want to hear.

Online DCPatriot

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #322 on: May 23, 2017, 04:59:20 pm »
That's what baffles me about these bombings.  Every single time lately the authorities KNEW or had interaction with the terrorist.

Yet they aren't jailed or otherwise shown the door and are left to do horrific things like this bombing.

I just don't get it.

IMO, they are quick to claim the perp is "....already in our system", so they don't get hauled before a public commission and humiliated and shamed.

And then there's justifying $$$ budgeted for your department..... 
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #323 on: May 23, 2017, 05:07:45 pm »
Not I, said the fly.

It was merely a question of how long before it was confirmed.

Which does nothing to bring back the dead or heal the injured, unfortunately.

Have the "Muslims Fear Backlash" stories started up yet?

Offline EC

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Re: Manchester Suicide Bombing
« Reply #324 on: May 23, 2017, 05:10:50 pm »
Have the "Muslims Fear Backlash" stories started up yet?

Not seen any. Yet. Give it a couple days.
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