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rangerrebew

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Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« on: May 16, 2017, 09:13:09 am »
Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
'We were told to stand down on this case and I can't share any information with you'
Published: 6 hours ago
 

Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich, who was murdered nearly one year ago, was communicating with WikiLeaks before his death, according to the family’s private investigator.

Investigator Rod Wheeler, a former D.C. police homicide detective who was hired by the Rich family, told Fox 5 in Washington, D.C., Rich’s laptop had evidence indicating he had been in contact with the organization.

“Now, questions have been raised on why D.C. police, the lead agency on this murder investigation for the past ten months, have insisted this was a robbery gone bad when there appears to be no evidence to suggest that,” the news station reported Monday.

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2017/05/dead-dnc-staffer-had-contact-with-wikileaks/#bo0lfEuFOWdsiFYu.99

Offline edpc

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2017, 09:32:54 am »
Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
'We were told to stand down on this case and I can't share any information with you'

Sigh - the convenience of being cryptic.  Do I believe there's more to this case?  Sure, but these nebulous statements about the 'evidence' and dark, shadowy 'stand down' dude are so hackneyed.  This is the kind of stuff people do when they're going nowhere, so they gather enough information to float a book deal and tease public interest.
I disagree.  Circle gets the square.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2017, 09:34:41 am »
Sigh - the convenience of being cryptic.  Do I believe there's more to this case?  Sure, but these nebulous statements about the 'evidence' and dark, shadowy 'stand down' dude are so hackneyed.  This is the kind of stuff people do when they're going nowhere, so they gather enough information to float a book deal and tease public interest.

It's a world nut daily article posted by @rangerrebew . What did you expect?  :tongue2:

Offline driftdiver

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2017, 10:24:45 am »
It's a world nut daily article posted by @rangerrebew . What did you expect?  :tongue2:

@Weird Tolkienish Figure.
Still far more meaningful then your typical post wtf.

Personally I appreciate the effort @rangerrebew takes to post articles.  He greatly adds value to this site.
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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2017, 10:54:29 am »
@Weird Tolkienish Figure.
Still far more meaningful then your typical post wtf.

Personally I appreciate the effort @rangerrebew takes to post articles.  He greatly adds value to this site.


Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2017, 11:32:00 am »
Quote
Seth Rich, slain DNC staffer, had contact with WikiLeaks, say multiple sources
Fox News, May 16, 2017, Malia Zimmerman

The Democratic National Committee staffer who was gunned down on July 10 on a Washington, D.C., street last July just steps from his home had leaked thousands of internal emails to WikiLeaks, law enforcement sources told Fox News.

A federal investigator who reviewed an FBI forensic report detailing the contents of DNC staffer Seth Rich’s computer generated within 96 hours after his murder, said Rich made contact with Wikileaks through Gavin MacFadyen, a now-deceased American investigative reporter, documentary filmmaker, and director of WikiLeaks who was living in London at the time.

“I have seen and read the emails between Seth Rich and Wikileaks,” the federal investigator told Fox News, confirming the MacFayden connection. He said the emails are in possession of the FBI, while the stalled case is in the hands of the Washington Police Department.

The revelation is consistent with the findings of Rod Wheeler, a former DC homicide detective, Fox News contributor and whose private investigation firm detective firm was hired by Rich’s family to probe the case. Rich was shot from behind in the wee hours, but was not robbed.

“My investigation up to this point shows there was some degree of email exchange between Seth Rich and Wikileaks,” said Wheeler. “I do believe that the answers to who murdered Seth Rich sits on his computer on a shelf at the DC police or FBI headquarters.”

The federal investigator, who requested anonymity, said 44,053 emails and 17,761 attachments between Democratic National Committee leaders, spanning from January 2015 through late May 2016, were transferred from Rich to MacFadyen before May 21.

On July 22, just 12 days after Rich was killed, Wikileaks published internal DNC emails that appeared to show top party officials conspired to stop Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont from becoming the party’s presidential nominee. That controversy resulted in Debbie Wasserman Schultz resigning as DNC chairperson. A number of Sanders supporters refused to back party nominee, Hillary Clinton, and some subsequently formed groups to work against Clinton and their party.

WikiLeaks leader Julian Assange has stopped short of identifying Rich as the source of the emails, but has taken a keen interest in the case, and has not denied working with Rich.

“WikiLeaks has decided to issue a US$20k reward for information leading to conviction for the murder of DNC staffer Seth Rich,” the organization announced.

Washington’s Metropolitan Police Department has no suspects and no substantial leads as to who the killer or killers may be, sources close to the investigation said. Metropolitan Police, including the police chief, have refused to discuss the case, despite requests from Fox News dating back 10 months.

The FBI’s national office declined to confirm its role in the investigation, but sources said the bureau provided cyber expertise to examine Rich’s computer.

Wheeler believes powerful forces are preventing the case from a thorough investigation.

My investigation shows someone within the DC government, Democratic National Committee or Clinton team is blocking the murder investigation from going forward,” Wheeler told Fox News. “That is unfortunate. Seth Rich’s murder is unsolved as a result of that.”


More: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/05/16/slain-dnc-staffer-had-contact-with-wikileaks-investigator-says.html


Offline mountaineer

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2017, 12:17:27 pm »

Report: Investigator Says Evidence Showing Deceased DNC Staffer Seth Rich Was Emailing With WikiLeaks
by Jeff Poor15 May 20176,893



Monday during the 10 p.m. ET news broadcast on Fox’s Washington, D.C. affiliate WTTG, correspondent Marina Marraco said an investigation by former D.C. homicide detective Rod Wheeler found that the now-deceased Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich had been emailing with WikiLeaks.

Rich was killed last year in the northwest quadrant of Washington, D.C. According to local police, the incident was likely a botched robbery. However, Rich’s death has been the subject of other speculations given the timing of his death coincided with a WikiLeaks dump of Democratic National Committee emails.

Wheeler explained to Marraco the obstacles he has faced in dealing with both the local police and the FBI during his investigation and argued that Rich’s computer may offer some more details.

“[Neither] the police department nor the FBI have been forthcoming,” Wheeler said. “They haven’t been cooperating at all. I believe that the answer to solving his death lies on that computer, which I believe is either at the police department or at the FBI. I have been told both.”

Wheeler went on to claim that he had a source within the police department who said the computer could link Rich to WikiLeaks. But he noted that a source within the police department told him of a “highly unusual” instruction for police to “stand down” on that murder investigation.

“Actually, I have a source inside the police department that has looked at me straight in the eye and said, ‘Rod, we were told to stand down on this case, and I can’t share any information with you.’ Now, that’s highly unusual for a murder investigation, especially from a police department. Again, I don’t think it comes from the chief’s office, but I do believe there is a correlation between the mayor’s office and the DNC and that is the information that’s going to come out tomorrow.”  ... Breitbart
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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2017, 12:18:47 pm »
You mean that world nut daily says there is a another conspiracy??
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Offline mountaineer

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2017, 12:21:32 pm »
You mean that world nut daily says there is a another conspiracy??
WND isn't the only news outlet reporting on the Seth Rich-Wikileaks connection.
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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2017, 12:48:57 pm »
WND isn't the only news outlet reporting on the Seth Rich-Wikileaks connection.


Sorry I have heard way to much conspiracy theories  to last me a lifetime.
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Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2017, 12:58:08 pm »
When we first heard of Seth Rich being killed under unusual circumstances,   a lot of us surmised that he was one of the sources for Wikileaks damaging information about the DNC. 



It is interesting that this speculation has turned out to be true,   and it makes it much harder to believe that his killing was just a coincidence. 


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Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2017, 12:58:43 pm »
I see that the #NT's dismissing this story because it has a named source, but WaPo's Jihad against Trump with nothing but unnamed sources is the gospel.

Says a lot about the #NT's critical thinking. It also raises the question why they have their panties in a bunch over a Rat problem? Only a Leftist would find this revelation a detestable development.

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2017, 01:03:22 pm »

Sorry I have heard way to much conspiracy theories  to last me a lifetime.


Me too.   Everybody knows that "conspiracies"  never happen. 


1.

The Dreyfus Affair: In the late 1800s in France, Jewish artillery officer Alfred Dreyfus was wrongfully convicted of treason based on false government documents, and sentenced to life in prison. The French government did attempt to cover this up, but Dreyfus was eventually pardoned after the affair was made public (an act that is credited to writer Émile Zola).


2.

The Mafia: This secret crime society was virtually unknown until the 1960s, when member Joe Valachi first revealed the society’s secrets to law enforcement officials.  What was known was that organized crime existed, but not that the extent of their control included working with the CIA, politicians and the biggest businesses in the world.


3.

MK-ULTRA: In the 1950s to the 1970s, the CIA ran a mind-control project aimed at finding a “truth serum” to use on communist spies. Test subjects were given LSD and other drugs, often without consent, and some were tortured. At least one man, civilian biochemist Frank Olson, who was working for the government, died as a result of the experiments. The project was finally exposed after investigations by the Rockefeller Commission.


4.

Operation Mockingbird: Also in the 1950s to ’70s, the CIA paid a number of well-known domestic and foreign journalists (from big-name media outlets like Time, The Washington Post, The New York Times, CBS and others) to publish CIA propaganda. The CIA also reportedly funded at least one movie, the animated “Animal Farm,” by George Orwell. The Church Committee finally exposed the activities in 1975.



5.

Manhattan Project:  The Manhattan Project was the codename for a project conducted during World War II to develop the first atomic bomb. The project was led by the United States, and included participation from the United Kingdom and Canada. Formally designated as the Manhattan Engineer District (MED), it refers specifically to the period of the project from 1942–1946 under the control of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, under the administration of General Leslie R. Groves. The scientific research was directed by American physicist J. Robert Oppenheimer.


6.

Asbestos: Between 1930 and 1960, manufacturers did all they could to prevent the link between asbestos and respiratory diseases, including cancer, becoming known, so they could avoid prosecution. American workers had in fact sued the Johns Manville company as far back as 1932, but it was not until 1962 that epidemiologists finally established beyond any doubt what company bosses had known for a long time – asbestos causes cancer.


7.

Watergate: Republican officials spied on the Democratic National Headquarters from the Watergate Hotel in 1972. While conspiracy theories suggested underhanded dealings were taking place, it wasn’t until 1974 that White House tape recordings linked President Nixon to the break-in and forced him to resign.



8.

The Tuskegee Syphilis Study: The United States Public Health Service carried out this clinical study on 400 poor, African-American men with syphilis from 1932 to 1972. During the study the men were given false and sometimes dangerous treatments, and adequate treatment was intentionally withheld so the agency could learn more about the disease. While the study was initially supposed to last just six months, it continued for 40 years. Close to 200 of the men died from syphilis or related complications by the end of the study.


9.

Operation Northwoods: In the early 1960s, American military leaders drafted plans to create public support for a war against Cuba, to oust Fidel Castro from power. The plans included committing acts of terrorism in U.S. cities, killing innocent people and U.S. soldiers, blowing up a U.S. ship, assassinating Cuban émigrés, sinking boats of Cuban refugees, and hijacking planes. The plans were all approved by the Joint Chiefs of Staff, but were reportedly rejected by the civilian leadership, then kept secret for nearly 40 years.


10.

1990 Testimony of Nayirah: A 15-year-old girl named “Nayirah” testified before the U.S. Congress that she had seen Iraqi soldiers pulling Kuwaiti babies from incubators, causing them to die. The testimony helped gain major public support for the 1991 Gulf War, but — despite protests that the dispute of this story was itself a conspiracy theory — it was later discovered that the testimony was false. The public relations firm Hill & Knowlton, which was in the employ of Citizens for a Free Kuwait, had arranged the testimony.  It turned out that she had taken acting lessons on request of the CIA and was actually the niece of a major politician in Kuwait.  Nayirah was later disclosed to be Nayirah al-Sabah, daughter of Saud bin Nasir Al-Sabah, Kuwaiti ambassador to the USA.



‘What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.’
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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2017, 01:16:29 pm »
WND isn't the only news outlet reporting on the Seth Rich-Wikileaks connection.


Also, World Nut Daily has been pimping fake news for over twenty years.. So why I should I start believing them now??
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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2017, 01:17:17 pm »

Me too.   Everybody knows that "conspiracies"  never happen. 


1.

The Dreyfus Affair: In the late 1800s in France, Jewish artillery officer Alfred Dreyfus was wrongfully convicted of treason based on false government documents, and sentenced to life in prison. The French government did attempt to cover this up, but Dreyfus was eventually pardoned after the affair was made public (an act that is credited to writer Émile Zola).


2.

The Mafia: This secret crime society was virtually unknown until the 1960s, when member Joe Valachi first revealed the society’s secrets to law enforcement officials.  What was known was that organized crime existed, but not that the extent of their control included working with the CIA, politicians and the biggest businesses in the world.


3.

MK-ULTRA: In the 1950s to the 1970s, the CIA ran a mind-control project aimed at finding a “truth serum” to use on communist spies. Test subjects were given LSD and other drugs, often without consent, and some were tortured. At least one man, civilian biochemist Frank Olson, who was working for the government, died as a result of the experiments. The project was finally exposed after investigations by the Rockefeller Commission.


4.

Operation Mockingbird: Also in the 1950s to ’70s, the CIA paid a number of well-known domestic and foreign journalists (from big-name media outlets like Time, The Washington Post, The New York Times, CBS and others) to publish CIA propaganda. The CIA also reportedly funded at least one movie, the animated “Animal Farm,” by George Orwell. The Church Committee finally exposed the activities in 1975.



5.

Manhattan Project:  The Manhattan Project was the codename for a project conducted during World War II to develop the first atomic bomb. The project was led by the United States, and included participation from the United Kingdom and Canada. Formally designated as the Manhattan Engineer District (MED), it refers specifically to the period of the project from 1942–1946 under the control of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, under the administration of General Leslie R. Groves. The scientific research was directed by American physicist J. Robert Oppenheimer.


6.

Asbestos: Between 1930 and 1960, manufacturers did all they could to prevent the link between asbestos and respiratory diseases, including cancer, becoming known, so they could avoid prosecution. American workers had in fact sued the Johns Manville company as far back as 1932, but it was not until 1962 that epidemiologists finally established beyond any doubt what company bosses had known for a long time – asbestos causes cancer.


7.

Watergate: Republican officials spied on the Democratic National Headquarters from the Watergate Hotel in 1972. While conspiracy theories suggested underhanded dealings were taking place, it wasn’t until 1974 that White House tape recordings linked President Nixon to the break-in and forced him to resign.



8.

The Tuskegee Syphilis Study: The United States Public Health Service carried out this clinical study on 400 poor, African-American men with syphilis from 1932 to 1972. During the study the men were given false and sometimes dangerous treatments, and adequate treatment was intentionally withheld so the agency could learn more about the disease. While the study was initially supposed to last just six months, it continued for 40 years. Close to 200 of the men died from syphilis or related complications by the end of the study.


9.

Operation Northwoods: In the early 1960s, American military leaders drafted plans to create public support for a war against Cuba, to oust Fidel Castro from power. The plans included committing acts of terrorism in U.S. cities, killing innocent people and U.S. soldiers, blowing up a U.S. ship, assassinating Cuban émigrés, sinking boats of Cuban refugees, and hijacking planes. The plans were all approved by the Joint Chiefs of Staff, but were reportedly rejected by the civilian leadership, then kept secret for nearly 40 years.


10.

1990 Testimony of Nayirah: A 15-year-old girl named “Nayirah” testified before the U.S. Congress that she had seen Iraqi soldiers pulling Kuwaiti babies from incubators, causing them to die. The testimony helped gain major public support for the 1991 Gulf War, but — despite protests that the dispute of this story was itself a conspiracy theory — it was later discovered that the testimony was false. The public relations firm Hill & Knowlton, which was in the employ of Citizens for a Free Kuwait, had arranged the testimony.  It turned out that she had taken acting lessons on request of the CIA and was actually the niece of a major politician in Kuwait.  Nayirah was later disclosed to be Nayirah al-Sabah, daughter of Saud bin Nasir Al-Sabah, Kuwaiti ambassador to the USA.




Also, the North American Union..
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2017, 01:26:05 pm »

Sorry I have heard way to much conspiracy theories  to last me a lifetime.

And, that's exactly the point of flooding us with conspiracies.  We get to the point where we don't believe any of them or pay attention to them...even the ones that we should.

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2017, 01:30:00 pm »
And, that's exactly the point of flooding us with conspiracies.  We get to the point where we don't believe any of them or pay attention to them...even the ones that we should.


Basically the Boy Who Cried Wolf..
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2017, 02:22:04 pm »

Me too.   Everybody knows that "conspiracies"  never happen. 


1.

The Dreyfus Affair: In the late 1800s in France, Jewish artillery officer Alfred Dreyfus was wrongfully convicted of treason based on false government documents, and sentenced to life in prison. The French government did attempt to cover this up, but Dreyfus was eventually pardoned after the affair was made public (an act that is credited to writer Émile Zola).


11. Soy is making kids 'gay' http://www.wnd.com/2006/12/39253/
Soy is feminizing, and commonly leads to a decrease in the size of the penis, sexual confusion and homosexuality. That’s why most of the medical (not socio-spiritual) blame for today’s rise in homosexuality must fall upon the rise in soy formula and other soy products.

Offline TomSea

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2017, 02:31:43 pm »
A number of news sources are posting this story.

http://www.fox5dc.com/news/local-news/254852337-story

The family's private investigator allegedly is saying this.

Quote
Rod Wheeler, a private investigator hired by the Rich family, suggests there is tangible evidence on Rich's laptop that confirms he was communicating with WikiLeaks prior to his death.

Now, questions have been raised on why D.C. police, the lead agency on this murder investigation for the past ten months, have insisted this was a robbery gone bad when there appears to be no evidence to suggest that.

Wheeler, a former D.C. police homicide detective, is running a parallel investigation into Rich’s murder. He said he believes there is a cover-up and the police department has been told to back down from the investigation.

"The police department nor the FBI have been forthcoming,” said Wheeler. “They haven't been cooperating at all. I believe that the answer to solving his death lies on that computer, which I believe is either at the police department or either at the FBI. I have been told both.”

When we asked Wheeler if his sources have told him there is information that links Rich to Wikileaks, he said, “Absolutely. Yeah. That's confirmed."

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2017, 02:43:18 pm »
11. Soy is making kids 'gay' http://www.wnd.com/2006/12/39253/
Soy is feminizing, and commonly leads to a decrease in the size of the penis, sexual confusion and homosexuality. That’s why most of the medical (not socio-spiritual) blame for today’s rise in homosexuality must fall upon the rise in soy formula and other soy products.



You have linked an article that is not part of that list I cited,  and portrayed it as being part of that list I cited.    From my perspective,  this smacks of a dishonest attempt to mislead people into thinking your "Soy"  article is part of my list of conspiracies that turned out to be true. 


The correct entry "11"  in my list is as follows.

Quote
11.

Counter Intelligence Programs Against Activists in the 60s:  COINTELPRO (an acronym for Counter Intelligence Program) was a series of covert, and often illegal, projects conducted by the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) aimed at investigating and disrupting dissident political organizations within the United States. The FBI used covert operations from its inception, however formal COINTELPRO operations took place between 1956 and 1971. The FBI’s stated motivation at the time was “protecting national security, preventing violence, and maintaining the existing social and political order.” 





Again,  I consider what you did quite misleading,   so I am now asking if that was your intent? 


What were you trying to accomplish by this deceitful  tactic? 
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2017, 03:01:30 pm »


You have linked an article that is not part of that list I cited,  and portrayed it as being part of that list I cited.    From my perspective,  this smacks of a dishonest attempt to mislead people into thinking your "Soy"  article is part of my list of conspiracies that turned out to be true. 

Only you were fooled into thinking my comment was part of your list of conspiracies.

Offline anubias

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2017, 03:07:36 pm »

The libs here are hilarious!  This article with named sources qualifies as a "Wolf" story, but all the BS thrown against the wall the last two weeks was worth commenting on as truth and spewing childish neener-neeners at Trump. 

I realize some of you are probably getting paid for your posting, but those of you who aren't should look at trying to find gainful employment to give you something to do.  Granted nothing that requires critical thinking, but maybe a job in advertising or marketing where lying is considered an asset.  Now that Trump is in and your beloved Zero is gone, there will be opportunities for employment other than Soros paid shilling for all of you.  You guys should think about it.  Seriously.

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2017, 03:12:07 pm »
Only you were fooled into thinking my comment was part of your list of conspiracies.



I wasn't fooled at all because I had read the rest of my list and I knew instantly that your number "11"  was not part of it.   You don't think putting the number "11"  on it made it appear to be a continuation of my list?   


I looked at the original article.   It did not contain a number "11"  in it.   


You are like the group that put that "fearless girl"  statue in front of the Wall Street Bull.    Your work is derivative of mine,  and fundamentally alters my message.   


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Offline skeeter

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2017, 03:18:05 pm »
When we first heard of Seth Rich being killed under unusual circumstances,   a lot of us surmised that he was one of the sources for Wikileaks damaging information about the DNC. 



It is interesting that this speculation has turned out to be true,   and it makes it much harder to believe that his killing was just a coincidence.

Assange implied as much. What new here is the 'stand down order' angle.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Dead DNC staffer 'had contact' with WikiLeaks
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2017, 03:19:13 pm »


I wasn't fooled at all because I had read the rest of my list and I knew instantly that your number "11"  was not part of it.   You don't think putting the number "11"  on it made it appear to be a continuation of my list?   


I looked at the original article.   It did not contain a number "11"  in it.   


You are like the group that put that "fearless girl"  statue in front of the Wall Street Bull.    Your work is derivative of mine,  and fundamentally alters my message.

FWIW, I immediately understood that 11 was an addition by the commenter and not part of the original comment.