Levin: Biggest News Yesterday Was Not Obamacare … and 'This Is Going to Be an Earthquake'

[libertybele]

One thing we should be aware of/cautious about is liberal groups are watching this very, very closely as well. They would love the opportunity to move in on a convention and make a whole lot of 'services' rights.

It is up to the state legislators; not the everyday John and Jane Doe.  As far as I know, there are now currently more GOP legislators then DEM.  Convention of States has already done a 'trial' or simulation convention last year to get a feel as to how things would go.  It left me with some reassurance:

https://www.conventionofstates.com/cossim

[libertybele]

They don't have any say in any Amendments passed by a Constitutional Convention. They are law the minute the required number of state legislatures.

Everyone wants to brag about how many state houses the GOP controls these days...time to put that advantage to good use.

   At the rate things are going, we may not get another opportunity.

[libertybele]

Can you describe in 25 words or less, what this hopes to accomplish?

Use words and ideas, aimed at ordinary citizens,, not self-described conservative political junkies.

Thanks in advance.

In a nutshell (and I'm slowly learning) the purpose is to take power that the FEDS have taken away from the states and return power to the states.

"Article V says, there are two methods to propose amendments to the Constitution.

1. Congress can propose amendments to the Constitution at any time if 2/3 of both houses of Congress agree.

2. A Convention of States can propose amendments if 2/3 of states submit applications for such a convention. These applications must all deal with the same issue (i.e., limiting the power and jurisdiction of the federal government)....


...After the states propose, debate, and vote upon the proposed amendments, they will be sent to the 50 states for ratification. Three-quarters of the states must agree for any of the proposed amendments to be ratified.

Congress has no authority to stop such a process.

https://www.conventionofstates.com/solution

[Bigun]

In a nutshell (and I'm slowly learning) the purpose is to take power that the FEDS have taken away from the states and return power to the states.

As I  said earlier,  they can do that right now if they can find the courage.

[the_doc]

 
@Bigun
@corbe

I have no confidence that the electorates of the individual states can do one bit better at electing delegates to any such convention than they have demonstrated in selecting what currently "serves" us in Washington.  in short, I do not TRUST them putting their hands on the Constitution!

I submit that a few amendments are desperately needed to thwart federal corruption.  I also submit that the Congress--which is a big part of the corruption problem--will never give us those desperately needed amendments.  (Remember McConnell saying that term limits will not be entertained by Congress?  The problem is that corrupt federal officeholders are guarding their own henhouse.)  It seems to me that worrying endlessly about the States doing the right thing is counterproductive.  Despite your worries about the States being every bit as corrupt as the Federal government, I believe the record suggests otherwise.  (The RNC is corrupt, of course, and the RNC's tentacles do reach into State politics, to be sure, but the individual States are much more responsive to us--so we have to try to use the States' Constitution-amending power to fix the federal abuses.)

Besides, I don't see any reason to believe that the States will give us decidedly bad amendments.  The worst scenario that I regard as a realistic worst-case scenario is that the Convention would simply fizzle, would be unable to put together useful, ratifiable proposals.

***

In short, if you don't trust the States to "put their HANDS on the Constitution," then you evidently wouldn't trust anyone to do so--whereas the Constitution ITSELF definitely contains provisions for amendments and furthermore specifically trusts the States to do that very thing--apart from Congress on occasion of covenantal necessity.  Furthermore, it is obvious that this State-centered process for proposing Constitutional amendments was put into the Constitution by Framers who realized that the States might need to seize back power from the too-comfortable and irresponsible or even downright crooked feds. 

Thus, if you are a Constitutional conservative, I urge you to relax a bit.   I hear our Framers telling us to do the Convention of States.  I hear them telling us through the Constitution itself that we need to do it right now--before it's too late (if it's not already too late in the providence of God, of course!).       

[corbe]

   What he said, @the_doc

   It's time, it's also time to start a 3rd party or take over the Constitution Party, just as Trump hijacked the GOP (no surprise to most I know), we aren't getting any younger.

[libertybele]

   What he said, @the_doc

   It's time, it's also time to start a 3rd party or take over the Constitution Party, just as Trump hijacked the GOP (no surprise to most I know), we aren't getting any younger.

I've given that thought as well. Hmmm... Hijacking rather than Cruz, Lee, Paul, Meadows joining with them?? You do though have a point. Do you think the bigger money donors would continue to support them if they joined the Constitution Party? Also, interestingly, 2016 VP Bradley of the Constitution Party is giving a speech at their national meeting on the perils of a Con Con (Constitutional Convention) which is different than an Article V Convention.

[corbe]

   It's just wishful thinking on my part @libertybele but if the few stalwart Conservatives you mentioned above left the GOP for the Constitution Party or Federalist, for that matter, Hopefully some big donors like Mercer and Adelson would follow and the individual contributions from Americans sick of the DEM/REP crap could not be discounted either.
   We could have a new platform by party convention ready by 2019. pipedream I know.

[INVAR]

Think what I am about to state very carefully.

We, this people who are in this land right now - ARE NOT governed by the same morality, principles and religious commonality our Founders were.  We no longer respect, give deference to or live our lives through the prism of moral and historical knowledge and understanding that made the kind of liberty we once enjoyed in this country possible.

The Conservative 'right' in this country, cannot agree among itself what the definition of liberty is,  or what moral constraints on behavior in selecting our rulers should be applied, much less expect of themselves.

A corrupted and debased people having cut the mooring ropes to the religion of morality and temperance that mandated a people be self-governed before their God - are not a people who will safeguard, or even WANT the kind of liberty some of us seek a restoration of.

This people have grown ignorant and soft in our prosperity, having tossed out our sure foundations, discarded the religion and morals that enabled a people to be unified and self governing.   The foundations the Constitution rested upon are uprooted which is why it no longer has power to govern. It cannot restrain the unbridled passions that doom an enlightened society to that which plagues the rest of the world.

This government and the majority of the population do not want what some of us desire a return to.

The idea that this people will ratify amendments to return power to the states, restrict the overreaching burden of power by the federal beast that they now look to as Provident Provider, and not empower the exact opposite is beyond absurd.

II Chronicles 7:14 applies - and few to none will even consider that as a remedy to what actually is the root cause of where we have arrived.

[libertybele]

   It's just wishful thinking on my part @libertybele but if the few stalwart Conservatives you mentioned above left the GOP for the Constitution Party or Federalist, for that matter, Hopefully some big donors like Mercer and Adelson would follow and the individual contributions from Americans sick of the DEM/REP crap could not be discounted either.
   We could have a new platform by party convention ready by 2019. pipedream I know.

Well, I don't see it as so much of pipe dream, provided that Cruz (in particular) would even consider leaving the GOP? I remember back when Ron Paul was running and he was asked to join the Constitution party and he declined stating that it was more advantageous for him to say with the GOP.

No time like the present ... I think those so inclined should write a letter to Cruz asking him to consider running 3rd party or joining the Constitution Party and writing the Constitution Party as well.  Bottom line is, it takes more money and a candidate has to meet different qualifications to run 3rd party.  Certainly the Constitution Party already has the framework in place; they need $$$.  Cruz had an excellent ground game and already has accumulated some money -- can that money legally be moved to another party?

[IsailedawayfromFR]

This is what you said that i disagreed with.
I don't believe that is the case at all.  Far from it in fact.

We are still not communicating.

What exactly did I state that you disagree with? That it is a hope and not a fact?

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

This will be wonderful: they will call a constitutional convention, right after the anti-GOP anti-Trump blowback happens, and newly Democratic state legislatures will send delegates who think Bernie sanders is wonderful. They will steer the convention into brave new places none of us have ever dreamed of. They will give American citizens all sorts of new things they now have a "right to".

[IsailedawayfromFR]

As I  said earlier,  they can do that right now if they can find the courage.

The COS is the courage to make the change.

The states can Permanently change the government, which as it now acts is unstable and unresponsive.

I think I see what your concern is:  why make a drastic change when if one executes gumption one can do it without the drastic change?

[corbe]

  @libertybele
   I don't see Cruz leaving the GOP now, it's too late, he'll be starting his reelection campaign in about a year and by the time he's reelected, that  train had done left the station as far as a valid 3rd party approach in 2020, unless Trump/Reince/McConnell really pi$$ him off, box him out, then it's anyone's guess.   
   Another thing I might respectfully add, Sen. Cruz seems genuinely helpful and hopeful our President succeeds.

[Mom MD]

This will be wonderful: they will call a constitutional convention, right after the anti-GOP anti-Trump blowback happens, and newly Democratic state legislatures will send delegates who think Bernie sanders is wonderful. They will steer the convention into brave new places none of us have ever dreamed of. They will give American citizens all sorts of new things they now have a "right to".

Unfortunately they would give them "rights" to the same old thing....  the fruits of my labors.....

[Mom MD]

  @libertybele
   I don't see Cruz leaving the GOP now, it's too late, he'll be starting his reelection campaign in about a year and by the time he's reelected, that  train had done left the station as far as a valid 3rd party approach in 2020, unless Trump/Reince/McConnell really pi$$ him off, box him out, then it's anyone's guess.   
   Another thing I might respectfully add, Sen. Cruz seems genuinely helpful and hopeful our President succeeds.

I would love to see Cruz make a real run at the White House.  Unfortunately I'm afraid our country is too far gone for that.  Time will tell.

[bigheadfred]

Unfortunately they would give them "rights" to the same old thing....  the fruits of my labors.....

Under the banner, "We Are All Equal".

[berdie]

This will be wonderful: they will call a constitutional convention, right after the anti-GOP anti-Trump blowback happens, and newly Democratic state legislatures will send delegates who think Bernie sanders is wonderful. They will steer the convention into brave new places none of us have ever dreamed of. They will give American citizens all sorts of new things they now have a "right to".

That is what scares me about the process.

[Smokin Joe]

At this rate, it will take another 25 years to get enough States to pass. By that time, who knows what the prevailing attitudes will be.

Given the prevailing attitudes in universities, imagine, if you will, those students in their 50s with PhDs in the prevailing art of snowflakedom, tenured and stuffing the heads of another generation with dreck. They will have had four generations of teaching the teachers, of establishing historical legitimacy, of controlling the information which reaches little minds, rendered even easier by the absence of hard copy and the deniability created by claiming surviving copies have been digitally altered.
Imagine as well that the surviving minions of the Global Collective are still funding astroturf operations that the even more dumbed down populace are convinced by the Ministry of Truth to be spontaneous eruptions of deep, deep, feeling (which trumps all)...because logic will be shunned in educated circles.

The outlook on the present course is not good. It is not good even now with the Liberal/Communists refining the art of appearing to be concerned citizens even as they silence the voices of true dissent for fun and profit.

If the actions of the Convention of States can be steered directly or indirectly by the media optics, there is little cause for optimism. Legislators first and foremost will save their phoney baloney jobs.

We have already seen that "Republican" means little more than the label on a particular brand of caramel colored cola flavored fizzy water.
It has become just another sticker on a flask of generic socialism.
It is not based on principle any more, and "Cconservatism" has been devalued by the claims of many who clearly are not very conservative.

Having Republicans in control of statehouses gives me little reason to cheer, except for the ever present and still somewhat factual concept that "Democrats would be worse".
At least I know the dems are out to screw us all. With the Republicans we just wait and see and try to catch the crumbs. Needless to say, I am unabashedly disappointed int the GOP, especially after some of the shenanigans this last year here.

[libertybele]

Think what I am about to state very carefully.

We, this people who are in this land right now - ARE NOT governed by the same morality, principles and religious commonality our Founders were.  We no longer respect, give deference to or live our lives through the prism of moral and historical knowledge and understanding that made the kind of liberty we once enjoyed in this country possible.

The Conservative 'right' in this country, cannot agree among itself what the definition of liberty is,  or what moral constraints on behavior in selecting our rulers should be applied, much less expect of themselves.

A corrupted and debased people having cut the mooring ropes to the religion of morality and temperance that mandated a people be self-governed before their God - are not a people who will safeguard, or even WANT the kind of liberty some of us seek a restoration of.

This people have grown ignorant and soft in our prosperity, having tossed out our sure foundations, discarded the religion and morals that enabled a people to be unified and self governing.   The foundations the Constitution rested upon are uprooted which is why it no longer has power to govern. It cannot restrain the unbridled passions that doom an enlightened society to that which plagues the rest of the world.

This government and the majority of the population do not want what some of us desire a return to.

The idea that this people will ratify amendments to return power to the states, restrict the overreaching burden of power by the federal beast that they now look to as Provident Provider, and not empower the exact opposite is beyond absurd.

II Chronicles 7:14 applies - and few to none will even consider that as a remedy to what actually is the root cause of where we have arrived.

Agreed; the moral decay/political correctness has whittled away at the Constitution.  While I hear what you are saying, I also see evidence of an under current in our country stronger than before that is rejecting that political correctness; otherwise you wouldn't have seen the overwhelming support towards an outsider who had never held political office nor the overwhelming support for a constitutional conservative. Both caught the establishment on both sides by surprise. I do believe that we have legislators at the state level that are conservative enough to extract some power from the FEDS and return it to the states.  As absurd as it may sound to you, I feel it is just as absurd to not at least try. 

Five years ago a very young conservative Republican knocked on my door, introduced himself and spoke with passion about his vision as a conservative for the future of the party and the problems he saw around him and he asked for my vote. I knew of him as he grew up locally, and was impressed with him, I voted for him, but I didn't think he had a chance. He was successfully elected to the House of Representatives at age  29.  During his first term, passing 15 bills through the House, 13 became law.  In his 2015 Session, he passed his entire legislative agenda through the House of Representatives.  He has been in continuous contact with his constituents; first he mailed postcards informing of the conservative progress made, then he mailed monthly newsletters and now he's hit the airwaves telling of the accomplishments...in 2016 he was elected for his 3rd term. IMO he has made and continues to make some real progress.

I relay this story as there are still those among us and among our youth that do want to return to our constitutional principles.  Perhaps not the majority, but they do exist.  I also believe more exist at the local and state level than at the federal level.  There are those still willing to work hard, smarter and roll up their sleeves to try and save this country by honoring our Constitution. Maybe an Article V Convention of states is an absurd idea, but I find it more absurd not to try.  The Constitution and Bill of Rights was intended to limit the scope of government; Article I, Sec. 8, lists the powers of Congress. Executive orders were never as prevalent as they are today; executive orders and abuse of power seem to be commonplace and Congress seems to look the other way.  It is time to try to return some of that power back to the states.

"Liberty built civilization".
   - Ron Paul

[truth_seeker]

In a nutshell (and I'm slowly learning) the purpose is to" take power that the FEDS have taken away from the states and return power to the states."

Harbors and ports, highways, railroads, waterways, airports, healthcare, clean air and water, agriculture product safety,  education, law enforcement, national security, telecommunication,  national parks, monuments, forests, public lands, air space, relations and trade with adjoining countries, etc.

 
 

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Harbors and ports, highways, railroads, waterways, airports, healthcare, clean air and water, agriculture product safety,  education, law enforcement, national security, telecommunication,  national parks, monuments, forests, public lands, air space, relations and trade with adjoining countries, etc.

Hillary, is that you?

[Doug Loss]

As I  said earlier,  they can do that right now if they can find the courage.

But your "they" is those in authority in the federal government right now.  Courage isn't what they lack, it's principle and will.  Why in the world would they agree to diminish the power and influence they've accrued for themselves?  No, the only way any reduction in the size and scope of the federal government will come about is by action from the outside--an Article V convention.

[Doug Loss]

Think what I am about to state very carefully.

We, this people who are in this land right now - ARE NOT governed by the same morality, principles and religious commonality our Founders were.  We no longer respect, give deference to or live our lives through the prism of moral and historical knowledge and understanding that made the kind of liberty we once enjoyed in this country possible.

The Conservative 'right' in this country, cannot agree among itself what the definition of liberty is,  or what moral constraints on behavior in selecting our rulers should be applied, much less expect of themselves.

A corrupted and debased people having cut the mooring ropes to the religion of morality and temperance that mandated a people be self-governed before their God - are not a people who will safeguard, or even WANT the kind of liberty some of us seek a restoration of.

This people have grown ignorant and soft in our prosperity, having tossed out our sure foundations, discarded the religion and morals that enabled a people to be unified and self governing.   The foundations the Constitution rested upon are uprooted which is why it no longer has power to govern. It cannot restrain the unbridled passions that doom an enlightened society to that which plagues the rest of the world.

This government and the majority of the population do not want what some of us desire a return to.

The idea that this people will ratify amendments to return power to the states, restrict the overreaching burden of power by the federal beast that they now look to as Provident Provider, and not empower the exact opposite is beyond absurd.

II Chronicles 7:14 applies - and few to none will even consider that as a remedy to what actually is the root cause of where we have arrived.

Got it.  You're afraid of your countrymen and believe all hope is lost.  Even if that's the case, it's no argument for giving up.  Many of the rest of us have more faith in our fellows to do the right thing when forced to make a decision.  And given the high bars put in place for amending the Constitution, worrying about a small faction somehow "running away" with the process is what's beyond absurd.

[Bigun]

But your "they" is those in authority in the federal government right now.  Courage isn't what they lack, it's principle and will.  Why in the world would they agree to diminish the power and influence they've accrued for themselves?  No, the only way any reduction in the size and scope of the federal government will come about is by action from the outside--an Article V convention.

NO Sir! my 'They" is the state governments!  They have immense power but, for the most part, refuse to exercise it!