Trump Regrets

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Funny you should mention that, Bill. I, too have noticed such. In fact, at times when I would openly praise Trump's actions or expressions of policy, my determination to do so is dampened by the still tedious braying about 'nevertrumpers being Hillary supporters'.

And the equally tedious habit of some to rub anything positive Trump does into the faces of those who didn't vote for him.  It would be nice to never hear "NeverTrumpers", "Trumpistas" or "Cruzbots" ever again.

I, and others have tried to bury that hatchet, but some people just keep digging it back up.

No argument there at all.  It is frustrating on both ends sometimes.

We can't just discuss an issue as an issue, because the issue and the man have been emotionally attached together in the minds of those who seem to see Trump as a messiah figure.

And they've also become emotionally attached in the minds of some who see him as a devil figure.  It would be nice if, at some point, we could kind of get passed all that, but you're absolutely correct that some Trump supporters don't make that easy.

[libertybele]

Oh yes you were.  You make a habit of it.  I really am convinced you place yourself above others for your ability to embrace Trump.  Guess what?  I don't have to.  He is the same clown that I didn't vote for and I won't post things to prop him up just to make you happy.  People have picked out certain tweets to make fun of these people who are not happy with their choice.  The truth is though that these are people who supported Trump and got him elected.  They expected him to do what he said he would do.  But he hasn't been able to do it.  And with "lock her up".  Never had the intention.  It was the Art of the deal.  To mislead people.  They should have known.

That Mexico was not buying a wall.  Not only did he know they wouldn't he hires illegal immigrants to build his buildings.  he hires on H2b for his hotels and service jobs.
That Donald and Hillary are good friends.  As seen immediately when he praised her presence at his Inauguration lunch.  His daughter Tiffany seated with the Clintons.
That he would not be able to repeal O'care.  Because he stated he wanted Socialized health care and he would make sure that everyone would be covered.

 The clues were there but people were caught up in a "fake" hope that Trump would MAGA.  Now they aren't happy.  I knew it and stated these things over and over right here on this site.

Trump has not been impressive in any way.  You can make yourself feel better with your analysis of the ability to rise above yourself.  But don't try to analyze others because we haven't seen praiseworthy performance. 

Oh, and I don't know what is going on in Syria.  We were supposed to be fighting ISIS.  I brought up the point that Trump in 2013 after a gas attack was having a twitter episode where he proclaimed we shouldn't get involved and that Obama was stupid if he did.  Look who is getting involved.  I can't say what it is.  Wag the dog.......... But I agreed with his twitters in 2013.  If we can't focus on ISIS, Al Qaeda and other Islamic devils killing people in Syria then we shouldn't do a thing.  I don't agree with McLame arming rebels and I won't agree with Trump doing it either.

Chosen, I have never been a Trump supporter, but, he is our President.  Whether or not you voted for him, he is our new Commander in Chief.  Yes without a doubt he has liberal tendencies and he said some pretty awful things during his campaign.  When he took office I was willing to give him a clean slate.  His pre inaugural festivities displayed an abundant amount of patriotism and I was deeply moved.

You are correct the wall has fallen by the wayside and it looks like Bammycare may be here to stay.  We have a conservative Supreme court justice ... IMHO from this point forward anything positive coming from him will be certainly more than I expected.

Whether you like him or not, his missile launch on Syria showed leadership.  If you think that launch was unnecessary, I would invite you to watch the following clip (wait a few minutes for it to launch).

https://www.crtv.com/levintv?utm_source=cr&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=cr&utm_term=levin&utm_content=levin-ep251-free-040717-crwebsite

I'm not trying to convince you of anything and you are absolutely entitled to your opinion, I only ask you to consider that the DEMS, progressives and RINO's have vowed to take him down. In observation, I have never seen a President treated with such disdain by the media and his own party. We're only 70 some days into his administration; I hope he makes some more positive headway and I truly pray and hope for his success.  He fails and this country fails right along with him.  IMHO a huge amount of blame needs to be placed on Congress; we have a majority and they should be supporting him rather than siding with the left.  As I have stated numerous times; unless we get rid of the RINO's in Congress and replace them with conservatives, we're not going to see much change.  Yes, we warned his supporters that in all probability things that would happen. Unfortunately they didn't listen; there isn't a whole lot we can do but hold this president and Congress' feet to the fire...and support and praise them when they get it right.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Trump is treated with disdain, as was Bush. But let's not pretend that Trump doesn't bring a lot of this stuff on himself.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Chosen, I have never been a Trump supporter, but, he is our President. 

He's also the only tool we've got to unwind things from Obama's Presidency.

[Idiot]

It's a full time job blaasting him for the stupid/offensive stuff he says and does now.

Seen his latest tweet?

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/851767718248361986

Phrasing, dude, phrasing.

"North Korea is looking for trouble. If China decides to help, that would be great. If not, we will solve the problem without them! U.S.A."

That right there scares the crap out of me.  Poking someone with nukes is not a wise idea.  Keeping your mouth shut and doing something covert....well that's another matter.

[EC]

Poking someone with nukes is not a wise idea.

Stick the words "a lunatic" in there, and I agree.

[Idiot]

Stick the words "a lunatic" in there, and I agree.

Oooops....my bad...lol.

[Cyber Liberty]

Poking someone with nukes is not a wise idea. 

You put your finger on exactly why every tin-horn dictator in the world wants nukes, even if there's no likelihood he'll ever use them.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

You put your finger on exactly why every tin-horn dictator in the world wants nukes, even if there's no likelihood he'll ever use them.

QFT

[bolobaby]

He's also the only tool we've got to unwind things from Obama's Presidency.

@Maj. Bill Martin and @Smokin Joe

Well, Bill, you got the "tool" part right, heh.

But in all seriousness:

Yes, he is the president. Yes, we are depending on him to do right by us, but...

NO, that does not mean we should swallow every turd sandwich he serves up, like the Ryancare bill. That, to me, is the most frustrating part of the way the Trumpettes conduct themselves. Nothing Trump does is ever wrong or needs improvement. It's laughable. Any right-minded conservative should have been able to take one look at the Ryancare bill and know it was a sham.

Any right-minded conservative should know there would be no "phase II" or "phase III." Look at the way Washington conducts itself. They are constantly re-prioritizing because of other important work. "Well, it looks like tax cuts may have to wait." "I guess a repeal will have to wait." Get serious.

I give Trump credit where credit is due. You can check my posting history on that. What I *dont* do is give Trumpettes credit when Trump does something conservative THAT ANY OTHER REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT WOULD HAVE DONE.

This is the SECOND most aggravating part of dealing with the Trumpettes. When Trump nominated Gorsuch, they made it sound like we had to thank them. Please. Get real. If Ted Cruz had won the nomination, we'd also have gotten Gorsuch or better. They make it sound like they somehow saved the GOP from a Republican president who would have nominated Ruth Bader Ginsburg. They are so full of themselves that I can't even say they are full of **** because there's no room to stuff **** in.

Oh, but wait - I can already hear their keyboards warming up, getting ready to tell me that - thanks to them - we don't have Hillary. What a joke. When the primary was in full swing, candidates like Ted Cruz were faring better in a head-to-head match-up against Hillary than Trump. The fact that Trump won just goes to show that *Hillary was never going to win, regardless of the nominee*. We could have nominated a clown (and we did) and still win the election.

So, while I'm not trying to re-fight the primary, it would be nice if the Trumpettes stopped being so sinfully proud of themselves for their "great accomplishment" of getting Trump elected. They just revel in rubbing our noses in that smelly pile of manure every chance they get, coupled with the most dismissive and immature emoticons they can find.

This is what passes for "intelligent debate" with them now.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

@Maj. Bill Martin and @Smokin Joe

That, to me, is the most frustrating part of the way the Trumpettes....

Stopped reading.  I honestly don't think I can stomach anymore of the Trumpette/Cruzbot garbage from anyone anymore.  It's like being in 8th grade again.

[bolobaby]

Stopped reading.  I honestly don't think I can stomach anymore of the Trumpette/Cruzbot garbage from anyone anymore.  It's like being in 8th grade again.

Your choice, but that's where "the right" is. We are horribly fragmented and - frankly - it's not due to people holding on to conservative principles.

[Cyber Liberty]

Stopped reading.  I honestly don't think I can stomach anymore of the Trumpette/Cruzbot garbage from anyone anymore.  It's like being in 8th grade again.

I refuse to use any of those terms, I think it demonstrates an intellectual laziness.  I don't call any of them, even Democrats, "stupid."  Dismiss your political opponents as stupid at your own peril.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

I refuse to use any of those terms, I think it demonstrates an intellectual laziness.  I don't call any of them, even Democrats, "stupid."  Dismiss your political opponents as stupid at your own peril.

No kidding.  And it lumps everyone with whom you disagrees into the same general category, when generally, there are a great many differences of opinion even among those with whom you disagree.

Everyone who voted for Trump doesn't think alike.  Same with those who didn't vote for him.  The labels just serve to polarize and drown out efforts to discuss issues without rancor.

[corbe]

   @bolobaby I read it past the Trumpette, perceived SLUR, and I thought it was a great expression of your thoughts, similar to mine, put to words.
   Thank You.

[Emjay]

Correct.

@Chosen Daughter @Emjay

What have you noticed, Pray Tell.  Is everybody crazy?

[Cyber Liberty]

Your choice, but that's where "the right" is. We are horribly fragmented and - frankly - it's not due to people holding on to conservative principles.

The liberals in the Party would disagree with you on that.  We had a multi-day thread with thousands of posts fighting over exactly that topic, vis Ryan's Health Care crap sandwich.

[Smokin Joe]

He's also the only tool we've got to unwind things from Obama's Presidency.

That is key.  These are the cards we have, and we'd better play them right.

Wall: Yes some high traffic areas can have better security--git 'er done. That could channel efforts to cross into even more remote areas, where surveillance should be easier, and travel more difficult. Use terrain as a multiplier. 101. All 1954 miles won't get a barrier, but the heavily trafficked areas could get bottlenecked or shut down.
Deport Deport Deport. Reverse the flow.
 
Hit the Sanctuary cities hard.

If they want to be in defiance of Federal Law, give 'em hell.
 
My ancestors were treated to a war over not wanting to submit to the US Federal Government, and I have no sympathy toward others who commonly come from states who fought them but think they are above the system of laws they imposed over 100 years ago. (How's that for re-fighting the Civil War?)

Obamacare: Push to repeal. Fix the follow on problems with separate legislation on an issue by issue basis, but get rid of the omnibus disaster dumped on the American People by the perfidy of the Democrats.

Beef up National Security. Rebuild our military, end the social experimentation, and get back on task: National Defense. Plug the leaks in the intelligence agencies and elsewhere and get rid of the holdovers from the last administration, the moles, and tighten up the works.

Finish the job of reigning in the EPA and associated agencies, and let America make things again. We could use the jobs. Keep rebuilding infrastructure, especially the ability to produce our own energy, without subsidy. Fund some basic research, but leave the production scale units to the marketplace. Remove the ethanol mandate and let the marketplace decide.

Examine the endangered species act and designation, and force the use of that to be cost/benefit analyzed, just like any legislation should be.

That will be a good start.

[Emjay]

Oh, good one Emjay.  Sneak in my mental health.  Pretend that you don't belittle people.  Like your little snarky comment at not being mad at anyone except the person who wasn't here.

Carry on!  I am not the only one who notices.

Here is my mental health advise to you.  Get out of the chair and enjoy the trade winds.  Take a stroll on the beach.

And I don't hate anyone, ever.  Not Trump, not you.  Not anyone.  Not in my vocabulary.  Just tired of accusations.

Look, I'm glad you liked my reply.  It is the last one I will make to you.  I have serious concerns about you.

For example, you have taken a lot of my general remarks as being addressed to you.  They were not.  That remark about not being mad at anyone except the person who wasn't here was about someone you do not even know.  Certainly not about you. 

Get help!

[Emjay]

Stopped reading.  I honestly don't think I can stomach anymore of the Trumpette/Cruzbot garbage from anyone anymore.  It's like being in 8th grade again.

Really !!!  Sometimes I feel like we should have a map of the playground showing where the swings and slides are.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

The liberals in the Party would disagree with you on that.  We had a multi-day thread with thousands of posts fighting over exactly that topic, vis Ryan's Health Care crap sandwich.

Lots of us were on different sides of that one, more as a matter of strategy than of desired end results.  But that thread did kind of exemplify some of these problems.  A lot of folks can't seem to discuss these issues without name-calling/demonizing the people on the other side.

We don't all agree on how best to advance conservative principles -- that should shock/surprise/offend nobody.

[Smokin Joe]

Your choice, but that's where "the right" is. We are horribly fragmented and - frankly - it's not due to people holding on to conservative principles.

@Maj. Bill Martin @bolobaby

Well, how about we start right here.

We're going to disagree on how some things get done, even how much gets done. We DON'T need to throw egregious aggravations in the soup. I reckon there will be plenty of aggravation to go around without that crap.

Face it, we AGREE on a lot of what needs to be done.

Whether we like the personality who is the standard bearer for getting that done or not is IRRELEVANT. IF we are going to get it done we need to do a couple of things.

First, put aside the sniping over primaries, the labels, and that animosity.
I know some won't but that just throws a monkey wrench into the process.

We need to become more mission oriented. Being right about something is nice, getting credit is fun and feels good, but there is no satisfaction like getting the job done.
Let's decide on the objectives we can agree on. Then let's come up with a way to accomplish those objectives. Discussion should be centered around the objectives and whether or not they are being met, and personalities of the players become a side discussion as to why that is or is not happening.

My previous post listed a few things we all agree on. Some are all-or-nothing propositions, because, imho, that is the best approach. Those issues have one step solutions.
Others we can take a partial victory and sort out the tougher spots later because that will indeed be a step in the right direction. We will disagree on what approach is appropriate for some of those issues, but I think we can solidly agree on others.

I'd be thrilled to see the snark and crap and "Hillary supporter" lies and other nonsense dry up and blow away.  But it won't unless people realize criticism of the POTUS on a personal, behavioural, or policy level is criticism of  that individual, his actions, or his proposed policies, and not a referendum on their choices during the election.

If we fail to remove that stumbling block, this place will look like a cowtown barroom brawl on a Saturday night with everyone rolling in the dirt gouging eyes and chomping ears and nothing getting done--which WILL make our opinions useless, because no one is going to read through that childish dreck to see them.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

@Maj. Bill Martin @bolobaby

Well, how about we start right here.

We're going to disagree on how some things get done, even how much gets done. We DON'T need to throw egregious aggravations in the soup. I reckon there will be plenty of aggravation to go around without that crap.

Face it, we AGREE on a lot of what needs to be done.

Whether we like the personality who is the standard bearer for getting that done or not is IRRELEVANT. IF we are going to get it done we need to do a couple of things.

First, put aside the sniping over primaries, the labels, and that animosity.
I know some won't but that just throws a monkey wrench into the process.

We need to become more mission oriented. Being right about something is nice, getting credit is fun and feels good, but there is no satisfaction like getting the job done.
Let's decide on the objectives we can agree on. Then let's come up with a way to accomplish those objectives. Discussion should be centered around the objectives and whether or not they are being met, and personalities of the players become a side discussion as to why that is or is not happening.

My previous post listed a few things we all agree on. Some are all-or-nothing propositions, because, imho, that is the best approach. Those issues have one step solutions.
Others we can take a partial victory and sort out the tougher spots later because that will indeed be a step in the right direction. We will disagree on what approach is appropriate for some of those issues, but I think we can solidly agree on others.

I'd be thrilled to see the snark and crap and "Hillary supporter" lies and other nonsense dry up and blow away.  But it won't unless people realize criticism of the POTUS on a personal, behavioural, or policy level is criticism of  that individual, his actions, or his proposed policies, and not a referendum on their choices during the election.

If we fail to remove that stumbling block, this place will look like a cowtown barroom brawl on a Saturday night with everyone rolling in the dirt gouging eyes and chomping ears and nothing getting done--which WILL make our opinions useless, because no one is going to read through that childish dreck to see them.

 

[Emjay]

@Maj. Bill Martin @bolobaby

Well, how about we start right here.

We're going to disagree on how some things get done, even how much gets done. We DON'T need to throw egregious aggravations in the soup. I reckon there will be plenty of aggravation to go around without that crap.

Face it, we AGREE on a lot of what needs to be done.

Whether we like the personality who is the standard bearer for getting that done or not is IRRELEVANT. IF we are going to get it done we need to do a couple of things.

First, put aside the sniping over primaries, the labels, and that animosity.
I know some won't but that just throws a monkey wrench into the process.

We need to become more mission oriented. Being right about something is nice, getting credit is fun and feels good, but there is no satisfaction like getting the job done.
Let's decide on the objectives we can agree on. Then let's come up with a way to accomplish those objectives. Discussion should be centered around the objectives and whether or not they are being met, and personalities of the players become a side discussion as to why that is or is not happening.

My previous post listed a few things we all agree on. Some are all-or-nothing propositions, because, imho, that is the best approach. Those issues have one step solutions.
Others we can take a partial victory and sort out the tougher spots later because that will indeed be a step in the right direction. We will disagree on what approach is appropriate for some of those issues, but I think we can solidly agree on others.

I'd be thrilled to see the snark and crap and "Hillary supporter" lies and other nonsense dry up and blow away.  But it won't unless people realize criticism of the POTUS on a personal, behavioural, or policy level is criticism of  that individual, his actions, or his proposed policies, and not a referendum on their choices during the election.

If we fail to remove that stumbling block, this place will look like a cowtown barroom brawl on a Saturday night with everyone rolling in the dirt gouging eyes and chomping ears and nothing getting done--which WILL make our opinions useless, because no one is going to read through that childish dreck to see them.

If I may add a request, could we stop personally attacking people we disagree with?  I've made general remarks that some people have taken as personal insults.

By the way, you used another word I love ... 'dreck.'  It takes me back.  It was the favorite word of a boss I once had, he probably used it 50 times a day.

To me, it's a given that Trump has disgusting personal qualities that I can never respect.  That being said, dwelling on those now is futile and pointless.

He has stated some conservative goals and has made a lot of effort in that direction with some success.  That's all I'll say.

[Cyber Liberty]

Lots of us were on different sides of that one, more as a matter of strategy than of desired end results.  But that thread did kind of exemplify some of these problems.  A lot of folks can't seem to discuss these issues without name-calling/demonizing the people on the other side.

We don't all agree on how best to advance conservative principles -- that should shock/surprise/offend nobody.

The only thing that bothered me about that discussion was a certain person who swears he's a rick-ribbed conservative Republican, but is everything but.  I don't mind having spirited discussions with fellow conservatives about how to get from here to there, but I don't have patience with people who disagree with our goals and are involved in the argument just to get people fighting with each other. 

In internet lingo, they're "trolls."