Mark Cuban: Amend U.S. Constitution to Make Healthcare a Right

[Jazzhead]

All that matters (or should matter) is saving unborn lives.   Persuasion can and will do that.   Agitating to take away the Constitutional rights of women is a distraction from the task at hand.   The genie is out of the bottle  - the patriarchy is no more.   All that's left is the matter of saving lives.   I advocate the most effective way of doing that, given current realities.     

[Hoodat]

All that matters (or should matter) is saving unborn lives.

All that matters is the Constitution and the ability of the people to mold and shape their society through their legislatures - something that you championed when it came to social security, yet something you wholeheartedly reject when it comes to abortion and "gay" [sic] marriage.

The genie is out of the bottle  - the patriarchy is no more.

The exact same argument that Jefferson offered in defense of slavery.

[Jazzhead]

How anyone can refer to themselves as Conservative, Christian or American at all by disagreeing with any of that is deceived beyond their comprehension, or they are a pusher and purveyor of evil and it's agenda.

Speak for yourself.  You're all meaningless talk.  Agitating to bring back the subjugation of women on the basis of holy books is not going to save a single unborn life.   No, that takes persuasion based on the TRUE Christian values of compassion, empathy, and charity.   Not coercion.

Plenty of REAL Christians are doing the hard work of persuading and supporting women - one life at a time - to do the right thing.   Lazy Bible-thumpers like yourself who want the State to enforce their old-school patriarchy are more interested in power than stemming the tide of this holocaust.       

[Jazzhead]

All that matters is the Constitution and the ability of the people to mold and shape their society through their legislatures - something that you championed when it came to social security, yet something you wholeheartedly reject when it comes to abortion and "gay" [sic] marriage.

As a conservative, I support individual rights guaranteed by the Constitution against the government leviathan.  Yes,  that includes the Constitutional rights of women.   

[Hoodat]

As a conservative, I support individual rights guaranteed by the Constitution against the government leviathan.

Again, show me where this right exists in the Constitution.

[geronl]

But here is where you and I differ. I see Roe as coercion. It forced States to permit slaughter by finding a "right" which has never existed. You have your harness backwards, there, the horse goes in front.
Roe didn't criminalize abortion, for thousands of years people have recognized killing babies in the womb is as wrong as murdering adults with axes, and both were forbidden by law. No one sees laws against axe murderers as coercion.

 

[Jazzhead]

Again, show me where this right exists in the Constitution.

Article III.   

[Hoodat]

Speak for yourself.  You're all meaningless talk.  Agitating to bring back the subjugation of women on the basis of holy books is not going to save a single unborn life.

Whoa, wait just a minute here.  The subjugation of women?  This whole argument started because of women exercising the liberty to get knocked up any time they please.  You call that subjugation?

And the only reason this argument continues is because of men who want to have that out from 18 years of child support after exploiting those non-subjugated women by treating them like sperm receptacles.

And of course none of this addresses your abject failure of showing anything at all 'Consitutional' about Roe.  There is nothing in the Constitution that allows the tyranny of denying States or other jurisdictions from regulating abortion.  Yet you keep pushing the falsehood that there is.  Why lie?

[Jazzhead]

 

I see Roe as coercion. It forced States to permit slaughter by finding a "right" which has never existed.

SJ, why should a woman be forced by the State to reproduce?   You don't even want to be forced by the State to purchase a damn insurance policy.   Why are your individual rights precious, but not your daughter's?   

And again - abortion is morally wrong.   I understand your passion about the millions of lives lost.   All I'm saying is that agitating to take away the Constitutional rights of half the population is a fool's errand,  when that energy could be invested in the difficult but ultimately effective work of saving lives, one at a time.     

[Jazzhead]

Whoa, wait just a minute here.  The subjugation of women?  This whole argument started because of women exercising the liberty to get knocked up any time they please.  You call that subjugation?

Denying a woman the freedom to decide whether to reproduce is subjugation.   

Give it up.  Persuasion is the way to go.   

  And of course none of this addresses your abject failure of showing anything at all 'Consitutional' about Roe.  There is nothing in the Constitution that allows the tyranny of denying States or other jurisdictions from regulating abortion.  Yet you keep pushing the falsehood that there is.  Why lie?

The Constitution exists to protect the individual rights of citizens against subjugation by the State. You've got this whole tyranny thing ass-backwards.   

[Hoodat]

Denying a woman the freedom to decide whether to reproduce is subjugation.

Yet no one is denying women that right.  They are perfectly free to reproduce a new unique singular human life. 

The Constitution exists to protect the individual rights of citizens against subjugation by the State. You've got this whole tyranny thing ass-backwards.   

Again, show me where I can find this right to abortion and gay marriage in the Constitution.

[Smokin Joe]

All that matters (or should matter) is saving unborn lives.   Persuasion can and will do that. 

Closing the slaughterhouses where those lives are taken just might be a good step, too, ya think? You don't stop drug dealers by letting them take over a strip mall.

Agitating to take away the Constitutional rights of women is a distraction from the task at hand.   

I have asked before and will ask again. Please cite the Article, Section, or Amendment that gives women the right to kill their babies in the womb. You can't. That 'right' was granted by judicial fiat, and nothing else. The instinct seen readily in Nature is for the mother to protect their offspring, for the herd to protect the young, the females, and even the pregnant, in an effort to ensure the survival of the species. The 'right' you assert flies in the face of all that is natural.

The genie is out of the bottle  - the patriarchy is no more.

So is nuclear fission, but we don't set up a 'Nukes R Us' in every town.
Women have always had control over their sexual activity in Western Culture. They are the ones with the right to say "no". Anything else would be forcible rape, and we have laws against that. Additionally, there are the means to prevent pregnancy. They are cheap and readily available.

  All that's left is the matter of saving lives.   I advocate the most effective way of doing that, given current realities.   

You would assert that shutting down clinics killing thousands a day would not be an effective method of saving lives? 
Persuasion to prevent pregnancy won't save lives, it will prevent them. While that is a step in the right direction, keeping the abattoirs open will only ensure the slaughter continues. Nothing short of removing that option to murder will stop it from being used.

[Jazzhead]

Your passion is noted, SJ  But what stands in the way of "closing down the abattoirs" is the United States Constitution.

I say devote that passion to persuasion - you're good at it - not the advocacy of coercion.   

[Hoodat]

Your passion is noted, SJ  But what stands in the way of "closing down the abattoirs" is the United States Constitution.

Repeating the lie will not make it true.

[Sanguine]

Article III.

This?

Article III:
Section 1

The judicial Power of the United States shall be vested in one supreme Court, and in such inferior Courts as the Congress may from time to time ordain and establish. The Judges, both of the supreme and inferior Courts, shall hold their Offices during good Behaviour, and shall, at stated Times, receive for their Services a Compensation, which shall not be diminished during their Continuance in Office.
Section 2

The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority; — to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls; — to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction; — to Controversies to which the United States shall be a Party; — to Controversies between two or more States; — between a State and Citizens of another State; — between Citizens of different States; — between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects.

In all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, and those in which a State shall be Party, the supreme Court shall have original Jurisdiction. In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.

The Trial of all Crimes, except in Cases of Impeachment, shall be by Jury; and such Trial shall be held in the State where the said Crimes shall have been committed; but when not committed within any State, the Trial shall be at such Place or Places as the Congress may by Law have directed.
Section 3

Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.

The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.

[thackney]

Speak for yourself.  You're all meaningless talk.  Agitating to bring back the subjugation of women on the basis of holy books is not going to save a single unborn life.   No, that takes persuasion based on the TRUE Christian values of compassion, empathy, and charity.   Not coercion.

Plenty of REAL Christians are doing the hard work of persuading and supporting women - one life at a time - to do the right thing.   Lazy Bible-thumpers like yourself who want the State to enforce their old-school patriarchy are more interested in power than stemming the tide of this holocaust.

In spite of your anti-bible rhetoric, stopping the killing of these lives is most like to come about by all of us treating it as a life.  It is murder.  To pretend otherwise is how we got into this mess in the first place.

[Hoodat]

This?

The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority; — to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls; — to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction; — to Controversies to which the United States shall be a Party; — to Controversies between two or more States; — between a State and Citizens of another State; — between Citizens of different States; — between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects.

Note how it does not extend to cases between a citizen and the state in which they reside.

[Jazzhead]

Repeating the lie will not make it true.

Refusing to acknowledge reality does not mean you have changed it.   The Supreme Court has ruled - time and again - that the Constitution guarantees the right of a woman to decide for herself whether to reproduce.   All we can do is persuade her to do the right thing.   

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Note how it does not extend to cases between a citizen and the state in which they reside.

Well, it does if the case involves a federal law, the Constitution, or treaties.

[Jazzhead]

stopping the killing of these lives is most like to come about by all of us treating it as a life. 

I agree.  Persuasion works.   Hearts and minds can be changed.   

[Jazzhead]

This?

Yes.

[Hoodat]

This?

Yes.

I've read it five times now.  Still don't see where it says abortion and gay marriage are federal rights.

[thackney]

I agree.  Persuasion works.   Hearts and minds can be changed.

And telling people it is okay to kill an unborn child if it is not convenient for you, defeats that argument of treating them as a life.

[Sanguine]

Yes.

@Jazzhead, you know that doesn't work.  Very lazy answer.

[Jazzhead]

And telling people it is okay to kill an unborn child if it is not convenient for you, defeats that argument of treating them as a life.

Then tell them otherwise!  And help a woman in crisis whose partner has flown the coop -  because that's what "convenience" boils down to in the real world -  a woman gets pregnant, and gets abandoned by her partner and perhaps even her family.   That's when abortion appears to be the only way out.