Author Topic: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative  (Read 4589 times)

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Offline LMAO

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #25 on: January 21, 2017, 07:15:18 pm »
I don't know what trump "Is".  But I'm damn sure going to keep my stupid mouth shut till I can judge him on his record.... That clock started yesterday.

I wish the rest of you would do the same.

Just say'n

So far, what I'm seeing is mixed. His appointee to budget director is good. I doubt we would get a true fiscal hawk if Hillary won. I hope Mulvaney(sp) has more influence on his mind and not his daughter.

"America First" is  catchy  but it should not be used as a phrase to grow the debt and the size of the federal government. We already had "Hope and Change" and we ended up with 60 some percent saying the country is on the wrong track
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Offline EasyAce

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #26 on: January 21, 2017, 07:15:51 pm »
Oh, I'm sure you did somewhere, some time.  ^-^

I probably used different words to say the same thing. His were better than mine. :)


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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #27 on: January 21, 2017, 07:16:11 pm »
I don't know what trump "Is".  But I'm damn sure going to keep my stupid mouth shut till I can judge him on his record.... That clock started yesterday.

I wish the rest of you would do the same.

Just say'n

Under normal circumstances, I'd agree, but the alienation caused by his Orangeness and his ilk during the past year has not earned that level of decorum.  We can be just as unapologetic as F'n Trump.
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Offline JustPassinThru

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2017, 07:45:19 pm »
"America First" is a cornerstone of progressivism?
America First, seldom means what it seems to mean on face value.

Populism is a cover for progressivism.  Populists work on the emotions of the lowest common denominators...gin up the mob. 

Huey Long was a populist.  Of a more gentlemanly sort, so was Franklin Roosevelt.

Lyndon Johnson wore a populist coat...it didnt' fit well but his aims and his contempt for the Little People fit in well with the true populists.

Lyndon LaRouche tried to be a populist; but he was at the wrong time.  Reagan's plans were keeping America humming; and malcontents were not so engaging.

So...no...I see nothing positive in "populism."

How about "Americanism"?  "Constitutionalism"?  "Federalism"?  I know those terms take explaining, these days...but it used to be, kids were expected to learn them and their meanings in Junior High.

Offline Cripplecreek

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #29 on: January 21, 2017, 07:57:01 pm »
Quote
Trump’s populism has crossover with some such policy, just as it does with Bernie Sanders’ democratic socialism. But it has no philosophical crossover with conservatism itself, because it is predicated on the notion that the government represents the dreams of the people, and the Great Leader represents their agent.

I wish I'd written that.

Part of the problem is that people don't understand what progressivism is. They think it means left but it doesn't and never has. If you ask them what makes Trump a conservative they say things like Border control and putting America first but progressive party founder Teddy Roosevelt supported those things as did real conservative Calvin Coolidge and progressive democrat Woodrow Wilson.

Progressivism is primarily about giving government ever more power under the guise of helping. Teddy Roosevelt was conservative by our standards today but his progressive party platform supported things like the direct election of senators, social security, income taxes (all of which we got within a few years) and a national health insurance system (which we have now).  His supporters will claim Trump is against all of those things but he's been vague about them as well as breathing fire.

As a conservative I want to see the power of the federal government diminished on every front. That includes the executive branch and the president himself. Just yesterday Mike Lee offered up the first test of conservatism of the new session and a direct shot across the bow of Trump.

Mike Lee (R-UT) introduced the Global Trade Accountability Act Friday, a bill that would subject all Executive Branch trade actions (including raising tariffs) to congressional approval.


http://www.lee.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?p=press-releases&id=8DA8C6CF-3413-4D60-9985-3CB8CAE83157

In the Medellin vs Texas case (Thank you Ted Cruz) the supreme court ruled that international treaties don't bind the individual states if there is no congressional legislation binding them. My state's attorney General cited Medellin vs Tex when he announced that we would not be lifting our state imposed sanctions against Iran.

A president should have the executive order available to him but using it should be exceedingly rare and they should be backed up by congressional legislation.



Offline DCPatriot

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2017, 07:57:46 pm »
Valid point.

The problem is that he is a serial liar, so anything he says could be, just like his campaign garbage, just lies.

That's where that old character problem comes in.  He may DO a few things we approve of, but he will still not BE someone we approve of.

I wish to sincerely thank you for NOT being here yesterday...Inauguration Day.

Seriously.    :beer:
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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #31 on: January 21, 2017, 08:02:28 pm »
I wish to sincerely thank you for NOT being here yesterday...Inauguration Day.

Seriously.    :beer:

And we're off....

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #32 on: January 21, 2017, 08:39:51 pm »
I wish I'd written that.

@EasyAce

I do love the way Shapiro writes.

Offline musiclady

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #33 on: January 21, 2017, 08:53:07 pm »
And we're off....

Nope.  He's the second person to "earn" the right to be on my permanent IGNORE list.

I know he thinks he triumphed when I took a week off, but I saw what he did when I was gone, and I know I'm not his only target.

It's all good.  He can taunt and lie til the cows come home, and I won't be sucked in to the swill.   :patriot:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

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Offline Bigun

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #34 on: January 21, 2017, 08:56:21 pm »
I wish to sincerely thank you for NOT being here yesterday...Inauguration Day.

Seriously.    :beer:

You just can't stop with the a$$&%le routine can you!

 :whistle:
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 08:57:57 pm by Bigun »
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #35 on: January 21, 2017, 08:57:09 pm »
Nope.  He's the second person to "earn" the right to be on my permanent IGNORE list.

I know he thinks he triumphed when I took a week off, but I saw what he did when I was gone, and I know I'm not his only target.

It's all good.  He can taunt and lie til the cows come home, and I won't be sucked in to the swill.   :patriot:

@musiclady @mystery-ak --- and everyone:  Can can we please stay on topic?  If not, can this part of the conversation be moved to another forum on the site and continued there?

Thanks very much.

Offline EasyAce

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2017, 09:05:18 pm »
Part of the problem is that people don't understand what progressivism is. They think it means left but it doesn't and never has. If you ask them what makes Trump a conservative they say things like Border control and putting America first but progressive party founder Teddy Roosevelt supported those things as did real conservative Calvin Coolidge and progressive democrat Woodrow Wilson.

Progressivism is primarily about giving government ever more power under the guise of helping. Teddy Roosevelt was conservative by our standards today but his progressive party platform supported things like the direct election of senators, social security, income taxes (all of which we got within a few years) and a national health insurance system (which we have now).  His supporters will claim Trump is against all of those things but he's been vague about them as well as breathing fire.

Theodore Roosevelt was the archetype for what Michael D. Tanner---in his should-have-been-required-reading-before-2008
book Leviathan on the Right: How Big Government Conservatism Brought Down the Republican Revolution---isolated as
the big-government conservatism type called the "national greatness conservative," whose contemporary avatars Tanner
identified as John McCain and New York Times columnist David Brooks (who sort of coined the phrase in the first place,
but eventually and almost quietly turned away from it by Barack Obama's re-election), arguing (as T.R. pretty much did,
and no shock, since he was one of McCain's political heroes) "Americans needed grand federal crusades to pull them away
from private, parochial concerns and invest their lives with meaning." (Oy gevalt, just what the right didn't need, a
"conservative" version of the "politics of meaning" that once sprang a) from the left, and b) from the loins of Droopy Drawers
and Hilarious Rodent Clinton, both of whom rather admired the man who articulated it, Tikkun editor Michael Lerner!)

As a conservative I want to see the power of the federal government diminished on every front. That includes the executive branch and the president himself. Just yesterday Mike Lee offered up the first test of conservatism of the new session and a direct shot across the bow of Trump.

Mike Lee (R-UT) introduced the Global Trade Accountability Act Friday, a bill that would subject all Executive Branch trade actions (including raising tariffs) to congressional approval.

When I saw Lee's proposal I could only imagine Donaldus Minimus's mental tumblers spinning to come up with
a nickname for Lee---something like "Pinky Lee," of course . . . ;)

A president should have the executive order available to him but using it should be exceedingly rare and they should be backed up by congressional legislation.
I think the executive order should be restored to what I think was its original purpose, administering the executive
branch and not making an end-run around the legislative priority of Congress. The Constitution says the
president shall recommend legislation from time to time, not that his ideas for legislation become an
automatic consideration or approval from Congress.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 09:05:57 pm by EasyAce »


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Online corbe

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #37 on: January 21, 2017, 09:07:04 pm »
I wish to sincerely thank you for NOT being here yesterday...Inauguration Day.

Seriously.    :beer:

    Most of us were here and stayed away from your lovefest out of respect for decorum UNLIKE some of the Trumpsters on every Cruz thread.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #38 on: January 21, 2017, 09:17:33 pm »
It's like speaking to a rock, @Right_in_Virginia ...not at all worth it.

These are the some of the same members that fiercely defended their claim that Donald Trump was acting only as a "Trojan Horse" for Hillary Clinton...just because as a businessman based in NYC...he contributed to Democrats.

@DCPatriot  @Right_in_Virginia

They are not conservatives. They are Bush League Republicans,pushing for globalism.
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Offline Cripplecreek

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #39 on: January 21, 2017, 09:20:48 pm »
@EasyAce

Quote
"Americans needed grand federal crusades to pull them away from private, parochial concerns and invest their lives with meaning."

Or as Wilsonian progressive Walter Lippman said....

Quote
"Mass man functioned as a bewildered herd who must be governed by a specialized class whose interests reach beyond the locality."

Or more recently Cass Sunstein...

Quote
Once we know that people are human and have some Homer Simpson in them, then there's a lot that can be done to manipulate them.


Offline DCPatriot

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #40 on: January 21, 2017, 09:36:44 pm »
@DCPatriot  @Right_in_Virginia

They are not conservatives. They are Bush League Republicans,pushing for globalism.

I'm sure that's NOT it, @sneakypete

Trump was simply taking the opportunity, while the entire world waited and hung on every word...to let the People know he was going to follow thru on everything he said.

* America First
* Better trade deals
* Better small business environment (SB is the true backbone of the economy)
* Americans hire first...means better paying jobs
* Eradicate radical Islamic terrorism from the face of the earth.   vs. the very people sitting behind him who wouldn't even admit it existed.


....and yet, to too many #NeverTrump people on the forum, their hatred and embarrassment of getting the entire election wrong, won't allow them to give any credit to the man himself.

To some of them, they're still stuck on stupid...saying he's a serial liar (?)...comparing him to Benito and/or Adolph, etc..

I've found that there are now MORE members who were part of the anti-Trump that are willing to have cordial back-and forth with us. 

Their common sense prevailed and recognize we're far ahead as a country and advancing true Patriotism (in a sense that more and more voters will be positively affected by his policies than negatively)

Whether anybody noticed it or not, yesterday, President Trump was building the Party. 

With the extreme positions of the Democrats, and also putting their focus on special interest groups at the expense of Lunch Bucket Joe and Joe the Plumber...and their respective families...

He intends to entice them to join the GOP.  And we all know he gets what he sets out to do.

 :beer:
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #41 on: January 21, 2017, 10:03:25 pm »
I just love getting pinged to these arguments.....put ea other on ignore or settle it in pms.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #42 on: January 21, 2017, 10:57:57 pm »
I just love getting pinged to these arguments.....put ea other on ignore or settle it in pms.

I'm sure you don't love it @mystery-ak   And I appreciate that.

But, you set the rules here.  How about one as simple as this:  "The purpose of this site is to discuss, as adults, the issues of the day.  To this end, we will stay on the topic of each thread.  Polluting threads with personal opinions about other posters will no longer be tolerated. If you have something to say about each other, do so in PMs or on the Member Only forums.  The posts that ignore this rule will be removed or moved, regardless of the BR member."

Doable?






 
« Last Edit: January 21, 2017, 10:58:27 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline INVAR

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2017, 12:32:43 am »

They are not conservatives. They are Bush League Republicans,pushing for globalism.

Presumptive. 

I'm no longer a Republican, Bush sucked (BOTH of them IMO) and I'm no fan of global Marxism.

I do like to buy things from Japan that are not made here.

Swords specifically.
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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #44 on: January 22, 2017, 02:08:47 am »
Declaring one's enemies is not smart, but foolish.

For you telegraph your intentions to them before you are capable of acting.

That gives them time to prepare.

He's turned Theodore Roosevelt's axiom of "Speak softly and carry a big stick" on it's head.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #45 on: January 22, 2017, 02:51:42 am »
I'm sure that's NOT it, @sneakypete

Trump was simply taking the opportunity, while the entire world waited and hung on every word...to let the People know he was going to follow thru on everything he said.

* America First
* Better trade deals
* Better small business environment (SB is the true backbone of the economy)
* Americans hire first...means better paying jobs
* Eradicate radical Islamic terrorism from the face of the earth.   vs. the very people sitting behind him who wouldn't even admit it existed.


....and yet, to too many #NeverTrump people on the forum, their hatred and embarrassment of getting the entire election wrong, won't allow them to give any credit to the man himself.

To some of them, they're still stuck on stupid...saying he's a serial liar (?)...comparing him to Benito and/or Adolph, etc..

I've found that there are now MORE members who were part of the anti-Trump that are willing to have cordial back-and forth with us. 

Their common sense prevailed and recognize we're far ahead as a country and advancing true Patriotism (in a sense that more and more voters will be positively affected by his policies than negatively)

Whether anybody noticed it or not, yesterday, President Trump was building the Party. 

With the extreme positions of the Democrats, and also putting their focus on special interest groups at the expense of Lunch Bucket Joe and Joe the Plumber...and their respective families...

He intends to entice them to join the GOP.  And we all know he gets what he sets out to do.

 :beer:

@DCPatriot

I hope you are right.
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Offline DCPatriot

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #46 on: January 22, 2017, 02:54:05 am »
@DCPatriot

I hope you are right.

Me too, my friend.   
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline TomSea

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2017, 02:58:18 am »
I'm sure that's NOT it, @sneakypete

Trump was simply taking the opportunity, while the entire world waited and hung on every word...to let the People know he was going to follow thru on everything he said.

* America First
* Better trade deals
* Better small business environment (SB is the true backbone of the economy)
* Americans hire first...means better paying jobs
* Eradicate radical Islamic terrorism from the face of the earth.   vs. the very people sitting behind him who wouldn't even admit it existed.


....and yet, to too many #NeverTrump people on the forum, their hatred and embarrassment of getting the entire election wrong, won't allow them to give any credit to the man himself.

To some of them, they're still stuck on stupid...saying he's a serial liar (?)...comparing him to Benito and/or Adolph, etc..

I've found that there are now MORE members who were part of the anti-Trump that are willing to have cordial back-and forth with us. 

Their common sense prevailed and recognize we're far ahead as a country and advancing true Patriotism (in a sense that more and more voters will be positively affected by his policies than negatively)

Whether anybody noticed it or not, yesterday, President Trump was building the Party. 

With the extreme positions of the Democrats, and also putting their focus on special interest groups at the expense of Lunch Bucket Joe and Joe the Plumber...and their respective families...

He intends to entice them to join the GOP.  And we all know he gets what he sets out to do.

 :beer:

Passion, I heard that coming home, they were repeating the address tonight on the radio.

Offline TomSea

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #48 on: January 22, 2017, 02:59:02 am »
    Most of us were here and stayed away from your lovefest out of respect for decorum UNLIKE some of the Trumpsters on every Cruz thread.

@corbe

Exactly and thanks for pointing this out to everyone.

 :amen:

Offline DCPatriot

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Re: TRUMP INAUGURAL ADDRESS: Brilliant, Populist, NOT Conservative
« Reply #49 on: January 22, 2017, 02:55:55 pm »
Presumptive. 

I'm no longer a Republican, Bush sucked (BOTH of them IMO) and I'm no fan of global Marxism.

I do like to buy things from Japan that are not made here.

Swords specifically.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YyBtMxZgQs
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

"Hello Darkness, my old Friend...stood up too fast once again! Paul Simon 2024.