‘Death by GPS’: Officials warn against trusting tech in the wilderness - KSL

[Joe Wooten]

Great points all!

All that's left, and pursuant to the OP, I offer a quaint old-timey notion:

Map, compass, and know how to use them.
Nothing, ever, beats knowing your terrain.
GPSers have lost a very important skill.

Which is the answer I give to all the Scouts in our troop who tell me map and compass are obsolete and useless.

I don't have a smart phone and never use a GPS device.

[Joe Wooten]

I loved the maps AAA use to give to members and trip ticks.

They still give them out or at least did up to last year.....

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Which is the answer I give to all the Scouts in our troop who tell me map and compass are obsolete and useless.

I don't have a smart phone and never use a GPS device.

I think people are getting navigation apps and GPS units confused here. GPS units should work the world over. The military uses them, this was their purpose.


Where these people are getting into trouble is plugging an address into say "Apple maps" or "Google maps" and letting the app guide them. In Boston Apple maps repeatedly tries to take me over the Longfellow Bridge, which has been closed for a year now due to construction.


In an urban area it's not a big deal, out in the middle of nowhere, could be a life and death decision.

[Smokin Joe]

I think people are getting navigation apps and GPS units confused here. GPS units should work the world over. The military uses them, this was their purpose.


Where these people are getting into trouble is plugging an address into say "Apple maps" or "Google maps" and letting the app guide them. In Boston Apple maps repeatedly tries to take me over the Longfellow Bridge, which has been closed for a year now due to construction.


In an urban area it's not a big deal, out in the middle of nowhere, could be a life and death decision.

You are right in that the GPS unit just gives a location, it is the maps which provide the frame of reference. Navigation apps/programs are only as good as the maps in them, and sometimes those are pitifully outdated or misleading.

[musiclady]

I don't have a GPS system. I still use old school maps, or ask for directions

Maps are 1000% better than GPS.

If we do use GPS it's only as a back up to REAL directions.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Maps are 1000% better than GPS.

If we do use GPS it's only as a back up to REAL directions.

 


Depends on the map right? This is just "old fartism" to me. My GPS app is essential to not sitting in traffic to boston.


You old farts need to get off my lawn.

[roamer_1]

GPS units should work the world over.

Unless the batts are dead, or the unit is damaged in a fall, or it gets wet, or it's fairly cold.
That's the problem. They're reliable until they aren't. And when they aren't, they're a brick.

A map in a ziplock bag, and a good compass are a very durable system - Reliable in any weather.
(I might add that I actually have three compasses in my full outfit, as my belt, pack, and go-bag each have one, albeit that only the one in my belt is of a high quality)

I would say GPS is fine to carry, providing one also carries a compass and map for backup... carry both... Because electronics are notoriously incompatible with wilderness.

But my complaint is that GPS is too easy, so folks will tend to go that way, and forget learning navigation in the process. Kinda like how I can't remember phone numbers anymore, because the phone does that for me. I have lost the ability to retain them.

[roamer_1]

Which is the answer I give to all the Scouts in our troop who tell me map and compass are obsolete and useless.

fairly easy to remedy... Take em out, set them up to use a cheap gps unit to get home... then drop a rock on it, before you hand it to them...

I't great that you are teaching them the old way - it is a primary skill, whether they know it or not. Also basic nav by stars and sun (though you probably already knew that too) It's amazing how few people even know where to find the constellations anymore.

[Cripplecreek]

Don't be a moron and die.

Got it.

[roamer_1]

Don't be a moron and die. Got it.

LOL! Easier for some, more than others...
 

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

fairly easy to remedy... Take em out, set them up to use a cheap gps unit to get home... then drop a rock on it, before you hand it to them...

I't great that you are teaching them the old way - it is a primary skill, whether they know it or not. Also basic nav by stars and sun (though you probably already knew that too) It's amazing how few people even know where to find the constellations anymore.

What's so hard about that?  https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/skyview-free-explore-universe/id413936865?mt=8

[Cripplecreek]

LOL! Easier for some, more than others...
 

In my youth I put myself in a few situations that could have gone very badly very quickly. Usually there was alcohol, a girl, or both involved.

One of the worst was setting out at 9 pm for a 30 mile walk to my girlfriend in a northern Michigan snowstorm. 6 hours later after not seeing any cars during hours of walking I was getting pretty concerned myself. Fortunately a big national guard truck rolled up next to me. They said that they had shut the highway down and were just patrolling to make sure no one was stranded out there.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

I think people are getting navigation apps and GPS units confused here. GPS units should work the world over. The military uses them, this was their purpose.

Right.  A GPS unit will just tell you where you are, which can be incredibly useful information, particularly in the military.  It is an enormous boost for accurate targeting, for example, and in places (like the desert) that lack useful terrain features with which to navigate by.

Navigation aids tell you routes, and that can be dangerous.  To some extent, navigation aids and GPS's are somewhat equivalent to calculators as opposed to doing math "long hand".  The calculator can make many computations much easier, but should never be relied upon without a basic knowledge of mathematics/arithmetic to back it up.

Compasses are great, although a lot of metal (like an engine block...) can throw them off.

[Idaho_Cowboy]

I keep this pinned up at my desk.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Joe Wooten]

fairly easy to remedy... Take em out, set them up to use a cheap gps unit to get home... then drop a rock on it, before you hand it to them...

I't great that you are teaching them the old way - it is a primary skill, whether they know it or not. Also basic nav by stars and sun (though you probably already knew that too) It's amazing how few people even know where to find the constellations anymore.

Yep. I made a point of doing night navigation by the stars on campouts. I also made them turn off and pocket their flashlights. Even on a moonless night, there is enough light to slowly find your way. Even in the deep woods. Your eyes can adapt to those conditions, but you HAVE to think and truly look at where you are going.

[musiclady]

 


Depends on the map right? This is just "old fartism" to me. My GPS app is essential to not sitting in traffic to boston.


You old farts need to get off my lawn.

When your GPS, for no reason, tells you to get off the freeway and onto the sides streets of Chicago (as my husband's once did), you can get back to me.

GPS is limited in its value, and I use it sparingly and skeptically.  Maps always work.

(Some of us get up to date versions, dear.  That doesn't make us "old farts" by any definition of the word...... even yours).

[Rivergirl]

A few years ago we used our Garmin to find a large appliance store.
Finally it said..........ARRIVING AT DESTINATION ON THE LEFT.
Alrighty then........on the left was the Hudson River.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

When your GPS, for no reason, tells you to get off the freeway and onto the sides streets of Chicago (as my husband's once did), you can get back to me.

GPS is limited in its value, and I use it sparingly and skeptically.  Maps always work.

(Some of us get up to date versions, dear.  That doesn't make us "old farts" by any definition of the word...... even yours).

No such thing as technology that works 100%. Doesn't mean maps work better.


My GPS in indispensible for dealing with Boston traffic. Works great. Maybe a user issue with you?

[musiclady]

No such thing as technology that works 100%. Doesn't mean maps work better.


My GPS in indispensible for dealing with Boston traffic. Works great. Maybe a user issue with you?

I'm a visual learner.  I like to see the whole picture.  Maps do that.  I see north/south/east/west, relative distances, alternate routes and all the other things I need for navigation.

When I-90/94 flooded near the Wisconsin Dells a few years ago and we needed an alternate route, my use of the map was far more efficient than what GPS was saying, and we got around the flooding far more quickly.

GPS shows a limited view, and forces you to trust what they're giving you as opposed to what you can see for yourself.

Perhaps in Boston traffic it helps out.   But in all our thousands upon thousands of miles of cross country traffic over many years, maps have proven to be superior.   I use GPS for accident information and directions to specific restaurants, etc., but for overall traffic across this magnificent country, maps work better.

JMHO.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

I'm a visual learner.  I like to see the whole picture.  Maps do that.  I see north/south/east/west, relative distances, alternate routes and all the other things I need for navigation.

When I-90/94 flooded near the Wisconsin Dells a few years ago and we needed an alternate route, my use of the map was far more efficient than what GPS was saying, and we got around the flooding far more quickly.

GPS shows a limited view, and forces you to trust what they're giving you as opposed to what you can see for yourself.

Perhaps in Boston traffic it helps out.   But in all our thousands upon thousands of miles of cross country traffic over many years, maps have proven to be superior.   I use GPS for accident information and directions to specific restaurants, etc., but for overall traffic across this magnificent country, maps work better.

JMHO.

   We'll agree to disagree.


For flooding, that's a silly comment, how are GPS's supposed to inately know about flooding? I never claimed they were better in every incident.


I love using the maps feature on my phone. Works great.

[musiclady]

   We'll agree to disagree.


For flooding, that's a silly comment, how are GPS's supposed to inately know about flooding? I never claimed they were better in every incident.


I love using the maps feature on my phone. Works great.

When a major US interstate is covered in water and closed, shouldn't GPS know about it?  If it knows about accidents and construction, why not a massive amount of water covering a freeway and closing down all the lanes on both sides?

Not really a silly comment.  A serious, true comment.  The map worked better.  The GPS should have known about the interstate's being closed and directed us off of it.  Fortunately, since everyone else apparently was depending on technology and was therefore stuck on the freeway, there was hardly anyone on the side roads that I found on the map, so we got around the problem lickety split and no one else did!

I know that lots of folks love and depend on GPS, so I have no problem whatsoever with your use of it.

Just don't call people who prefer maps "old farts" again, and we'll be fine.   

[geronl]

I just imagined teens with their faces in their phones realizing they aren't connected and looking around to find themselves surrounded by a forest.

[Joe Wooten]

I just imagined teens with their faces in their phones realizing they aren't connected and looking around to find themselves surrounded by a forest.

I should have had my camera to take a photo of their faces when I made the Scouts turn off their phones and give them to me at one campout a couple of years ago. The looks on their faces was priceless......