Author Topic: Is Hillary still going to debate Trump? If She's Leading By Double Digits, Why Would She Need to Debate?  (Read 3400 times)

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Offline SirLinksALot

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SOURCE: HOTAIR

URL: http://hotair.com/archives/2016/08/05/is-hillary-still-going-to-debate-trump/

by: AllahPundit



Four days ago that question was upside down: Is Trump still going to debate Hillary? He hinted on Twitter and in interviews that the schedule was unfair because it conflicted with NFL games, a convenient pretext for boycotting the debates later. That was good strategic sense on Trump’s part: A 90-minute one-on-one debate with a thoroughly prepared Clinton would present lots of traps for him to expose how thin his policy knowledge is. So long as the race is close he has a strong incentive to either skip the debates or insist that Gary Johnson and Jill Stein be included in order to reduce his own speaking time.

But what if the race isn’t close in late September? How do the incentives work then?

Quote
If the polls are going to look like this, why would Clinton want to debate?

— Michael B Dougherty (@michaelbd) August 4, 2016

Yeah, why? Why would a candidate who’s coasting to victory take a needless risk by giving Trump an opportunity to get back in the race? Hillary could have a terrible debate like Obama did in his first contest with Romney in 2012; Trump could surprise everyone by preparing diligently and have a great debate himself, convincing swing voters he’s prepared to be president; or Trump, through sheer bravado, could do his alpha-male shtick effectively enough to persuade undecideds that he’d be a strong leader while Hillary would be soft and weak. Even if Trump doesn’t prepare on policy, he’ll come armed with plenty of populist ammo about jobs, free trade, Libya and Iraq, and so on. If she’s up 10 points at the time, she’ll have nowhere to go but down. So why would she assume the risk (or, at the very least, why would she agree to more than one debate)?

The best reason I can come up with is that ducking Trump would send a soft/weak signal in its own way. The girl’s afraid to take on the bully; who else would she be afraid to take on as president? On top of that, I think Clinton takes pride in her debating ability. She went toe-to-toe with Obama a few dozen times eight years ago and then held off Bernie Sanders this year. Even in a “bad” debate for her, it’s unthinkable that she wouldn’t display a tighter grasp of policy than Trump would. She probably figures she can’t lose. And if she did want to skip them, what would her pretext be? She had no problem with the primary debates this year being scheduled on weekend evenings and in other garbage time, the better to keep undecideds from tuning in and getting a look at Bernie. If the presidential debates are up against the NFL, so what?

If Clinton’s playing a prevent defense in the fall, though, then Trump will be in a position where he has to throw deep. The worse the polls get for him, the less of a choice he has on whether to debate or not. The debates would be his hail-mary chance to reset the race by impressing viewers. A series of strong performances would smash the image he’s built for himself as an ill-informed blowhard — and the amazing thing is, there isn’t much Clinton could do to prevent that. She’d challenge him on his points, of course, but most viewers don’t know policy well enough themselves to tell who’s right and who’s wrong. They’d be watching mostly as a referendum on Trump: Does he sound like he knows what he’s talking about? If so, maybe he’s presidential material after all. All Trump has to do is prepare. But he probably won’t. Because Trump.

There’s still a chance that he and Hillary won’t be alone onstage, which is good news if you think that more speaking time for him is mostly just more opportunities for him to screw up. Red State noted this tidbit in a CNBC story a few days ago:

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While the commission vehemently denies it, Fahrenkopf acknowledged the prevailing sensitivity about political elites obstructing outsiders. He even suggested it might consider giving an inch to a third-party candidate who is close enough to the cutoff point. Former Bill Clinton press secretary Mike McCurry, the CPD’s other co-chair, said his group will consult Frank Newport, editor in chief of Gallup, in the event that a third-party candidate polls within the “gray zone.”

“If someone came in and let’s say he was [polling] at 14.5 percent and the margin of error in five polls was 3 points, we are going to have to sit down and look at it,” Fahrenkopf said. “But right now that person would not be included.”

Gary Johnson’s at 11-12 percent in some recent polls. If he’s at 13 in mid-September and both libertarians and Republicans are clamoring for him to be allowed onstage, will the commission really say no?

Answer: They might if Trump himself opposes including Johnson. Which, inexplicably, he’s currently doing:

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RUCKER: What would you negotiate for? Do you want for example Gary Johnson and Jill Stein?

TRUMP: No because they’re not getting any . . . I’d rather have head to head and right now they’re not getting any numbers. She’s doing better than he is, but right now in some polls she’s actually not doing badly.

RUCKER: There were some Jill Stein supporters in Philadelphia.

TRUMP: She doesn’t get media coverage only because people perceive her as hurting Hillary Clinton. I’m not sure that that’s true.

RUCKER: I don’t know about that.

TRUMP: People perceive her as hurting Clinton. I think she’s doing very well. I don’t think the numbers will be good enough for them to be in the debate.

He said that shortly before the barrage of terrible polls this week started falling and shortly after Roger Stone had called for including Johnson and Stein, no doubt to provide more anti-Hillary voices onstage. I can see why, if Trump is way behind and desperate to catch up, he might prefer a higher-risk strategy of debating Clinton one-on-one. But if he’s only a few points behind, as he was when he gave that last quote, why wouldn’t he want the help? Pure ego or is there something else driving it?

Offline MajorClay

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Good question, I don't think she will.

Offline guitar4jesus

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With the state of the situation on both sides today, I just can't see any debates happening at this point.

Offline SirLinksALot

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With the state of the situation on both sides today, I just can't see any debates happening at this point.

The state of Trump's campaign at this point in time is -- IT's DISORGANIZED.

What's the current state of Hillary's campaign?

Offline ScottinVA

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Offline cato potatoe

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It may be less trouble for her to participate in the debates rather than answer five thousand media questions about skipping them.  And besides, if Trump is willing to make a fool of himself three more times, she would be wasting an opportunity to broaden the destruction.

Offline guitar4jesus

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The state of Trump's campaign at this point in time is -- IT's DISORGANIZED.

What's the current state of Hillary's campaign?

Hiding out until the trumpstorm passes.

Offline Cripplecreek

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Oh she'll be wanting to debate Trump.

Online libertybele

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It may be less trouble for her to participate in the debates rather than answer five thousand media questions about skipping them.  And besides, if Trump is willing to make a fool of himself three more times, she would be wasting an opportunity to broaden the destruction.

Of course she'll debate him.  She knows that he doesn't have the knowledge or even a clue about the issues.  Question, is, will Trump debate her?  My hunch has always been he wont.  He's already making up excuses. The schedule isn't acceptable to him and he claims that the election is probably rigged.
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Offline musiclady

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Oh she'll be wanting to debate Trump.

I did so want to see Carly Fiorina debate Hillary!

Even though my first choice was Cruz, a debate between the sharp, articulate Carly and the dark, ugly Hillary would have been a sight to behold!
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Offline Cripplecreek

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I did so want to see Carly Fiorina debate Hillary!

Even though my first choice was Cruz, a debate between the sharp, articulate Carly and the dark, ugly Hillary would have been a sight to behold!

Yeah I was impressed with Fiorina and thought she was a great pick for Ted Cruz.

Offline Gov Bean Counter

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Of course she'll debate him.  She knows that he doesn't have the knowledge or even a clue about the issues.  Question, is, will Trump debate her?  My hunch has always been he wont.  He's already making up excuses. The schedule isn't acceptable to him and he claims that the election is probably rigged.

She also knows there is no way the moderators will allow Trump to turn the general election debates into the clown show that the Republican debates were. They will cut his mic when he starts talking over her. Then he strokes out.
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Offline musiclady

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Yeah I was impressed with Fiorina and thought she was a great pick for Ted Cruz.

I was SO ready to vote for a Cruz/Fiorina ticket in November!  They would have thumped Hillary up side the head, and we would have hope for this nation.

But alas, the populist poseur and his bag of lies fooled too many people, and we are facing the end of this country as founded....  **nononono*

Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

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Offline Night Hides Not

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It may be less trouble for her to participate in the debates rather than answer five thousand media questions about skipping them.  And besides, if Trump is willing to make a fool of himself three more times, she would be wasting an opportunity to broaden the destruction.

I think she'll do quite well in the debates. She's a policy wonk, and she won't get any hard hitting questions from her allies that will dominate the panels.
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Offline Night Hides Not

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I was SO ready to vote for a Cruz/Fiorina ticket in November!  They would have thumped Hillary up side the head, and we would have hope for this nation.

But alas, the populist poseur and his bag of lies fooled too many people, and we are facing the end of this country as founded....  **nononono*

I'm waiting to hear that those who excel at six dimensional chess are usually poor debaters.   **nononono*
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Offline musiclady

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I'm waiting to hear that those who excel at six dimensional chess are usually poor debaters.   **nononono*

 :laugh:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline ExFreeper

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If Johnson were in the debates, who would benefit the most?  Personally, I believe Johnson will hurt Trump the most.

Obviously Utah, Colorado, and New Mexico would take away votes for Trump however I'm unsure if they would change the outcome. 

Georgia on the other had has seen an increase of the libertarian party and if close, could swing for the state for Clinton.

I found the below interesting:


Quote
American presidential elections are not set up to favor third parties. The first-past-the-post voting methods, in which the winner of the state gets all its electoral votes, make it hard for third parties to get a foothold. (In political science, this is a concept known as Duverger’s Law.)

Historically, winning 10 percent is an achievement. Since George Wallace won 13.5 percent in 1968, only Ross Perot in 1992 earned more than 10 percent of the vote nationwide. But it’s worth noting that Mr. Perot, while getting 19 percent, did not get a plurality of votes in any state, so he was awarded no electoral votes.

Will It Last?

Third-party candidacies have a history of fading. Since 1968, all of the major third-party candidates have seen their polling averages decline closer to the election. The problem is that voting for a third party is often viewed as a wasted vote, which more people accept as Election Day draws near.

The one exception is, again, Mr. Perot’s 1992 campaign. His support began to erode early in the summer and continued to shrink after he left the race abruptly in mid-July. But after he rebooted his campaign on Oct. 1, with only a little more than four weeks until Election Day, his polling average doubled.

Often, the timing of the major party conventions can affect the standing of third-party candidates in the polls. The party convention typically serves to consolidate the disaffected portions of the party (such as die-hard supporters of Bernie Sanders or Ted Cruz). In turn, support for third-party candidates declines. But this isn’t always the case. While John Anderson’s polling support was cut in half between the end of the 1980 major party conventions and Election Day, Ralph Nader’s polling average actually increased slightly(from 3.9 to 4.4 percent) between the 2000 conventions and Election Day, although he wound up with 2.7 percent of the vote.

Does It Matter?

Whether Mr. Johnson’s candidacy could damage the Trump or Clinton campaign more remains unclear. Polls show no significant difference in the Clinton-Trump margin between those that include Mr. Johnson and those that don’t.

His message — fiscal conservatism, liberal social policies and military isolationism — could appeal to people in either party, and there are enough disaffected voters in either party to provide a solid base of support. Mr. Johnson’s strongest polling so far has come from the West — his home state, New Mexico; Colorado; and Utah, a solid Republican state whose Mormon population has proved to be especially unreceptive to Mr. Trump.

For any third-party presidential campaign, there are two big hurdles. Mr. Johnson has already passed the first one: getting on the ballot in every state. The second — getting into the debates — could prove far more challenging.

The eligibility requirements, set by the nonpartisan Commission on Presidential Debates, state that a candidate has to hit 15 percent in five national surveys a few weeks before the debate to earn a place on the stage. That threshold can make or break a candidacy. No third-party candidate has been invited to the presidential debates since Mr. Perot in 1992. Jill Stein, the Green Party’s presumptive nominee, is on the ballot in roughly half the states, with plans to be on many more; she is polling in the low-single digits and is a long shot to make the debates.

The first debate is scheduled for Sept. 26. If Mr. Johnson can increase his standing in the polls by five points in the next six weeks or so, he could have a major impact on the race. Even if he can’t, there is always the potential for a third party to swing a close election in one candidate’s favor.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/04/upshot/can-gary-johnson-the-libertarian-nominee-swing-the-election.html?_r=0

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Offline NavyCanDo

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If the downward spiral continues and the only ones left supporting him are the 14 million who voted for him in the primaries he may not meet the qualifications for the debate.

 The Commission on Presidential Debates (CPD) requires that candidates poll at 15 percent in five national surveys leading up to the three scheduled debates.
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Offline NavyCanDo

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A nation that turns away from prayer will ultimately find itself in desperate need of it. :Jonathan Cahn

Offline musiclady

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 8888crybaby How much better it would have been.

And America would have had a chance to recover....

Now we have Trump, who will lose to Hillary, and either would be a disaster anyway.

What a stupid, STUPID choice "Republicans" have made.  The choice to finish the destruction of their party, and the country......
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online libertybele

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I did so want to see Carly Fiorina debate Hillary!

Even though my first choice was Cruz, a debate between the sharp, articulate Carly and the dark, ugly Hillary would have been a sight to behold!

I was just thinking that myself!  Carly would have chewed her up and spit her out.  It would have been a "cat flight" like no other.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2016, 11:35:47 am by libertybele »
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Offline montanajoe

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Of course she will, the American public has come to expect the fall debates, if you are running for POTUS they come with the territory. She undoubtedly understands that, Trump...not so much :shrug:

Online jmyrlefuller

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Keep in mind, Presidential candidates are expected to debate. So, if she refuses, it will hurt her.

Now, if both refuse, that's another issue altogether, but I think Trump learned an important lesson last time. You don't turn down free publicity.
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Offline EC

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Clinton has exactly zero downside to being willing to debate. Sure, she's not a nice person, or a people person, or particularly human for that matter, but everyone knows that already, so the exposure aspect is a wash.

Trump is NOT a good debater. While his trademarked brand of attacking could be effective, he'll not be permitted to get away with that during these debates, and on policy the guy is dire. She'd wipe the floor with him.

Conversely, if Trump refuses to do the debates, it's yet another line of attack for the Dems.
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Offline Cripplecreek

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Clinton has exactly zero downside to being willing to debate. Sure, she's not a nice person, or a people person, or particularly human for that matter, but everyone knows that already, so the exposure aspect is a wash.

Trump is NOT a good debater. While his trademarked brand of attacking could be effective, he'll not be permitted to get away with that during these debates, and on policy the guy is dire. She'd wipe the floor with him.

Conversely, if Trump refuses to do the debates, it's yet another line of attack for the Dems.

Clinton certainly isn't going to be rattled by Trump's usual insults. She's probably heard far worse from Bill.