Author Topic: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed  (Read 757 times)

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Offline Relic

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Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« on: May 19, 2016, 02:00:49 pm »
Let's say you're reading an article about a man who raised a pit bull for the purpose of entering it in dogfights. He teaches it to be mean, to attack mercilessly. He makes it strong, feeds it red meat. And then one day this pit bull mauls him. Would you have any sympathy for that man?

This is not a charitable way of looking at the conservative #NeverTrump movement, but it's what I keep returning to when I think about why it's been so unsuccessful. It's a movement led by conservative opinion leaders, media personalities, and Republican consultants -- the people who really run the GOP, or at least did before Donald Trump came along. The base they've stoked has turned on them, and they're upset. But they'd be a lot more sympathetic if they'd cop to the fact that they are largely responsible for his rise.

Whether you're right or left, there are endless reasons to oppose Trump. Remember that he is, among many other things, a vaccine truther. So you'd think that conservatives would have better luck standing up to him. Movement conservatism is a pretty coherent governing philosophy, and it's easy to see where he's deviated from the scriptures handed down by the likes of Burke, Friedman, Hayek and Buckley. The problem is no one, or rather very few people outside Washington's many right-wing think tanks, seem to be getting all that exercised about his heresies.

Shouldn't this produce a little soul searching on the right? You'd hope so, but we've seen very little of it. They've lost control of a party they've dominated for decades, but #NeverTrump, broadly speaking, doesn't seem all that curious as to why. The conclusions, they suspect, would be uncomfortable, so better to focus on devising new ways to hit Trump.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-nevertrump-failed/

Offline sinkspur

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Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline Relic

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Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2016, 02:47:45 pm »

The political pundits all admit that there is a phenomenon this year.

Then those pundits fall into two categories: 1. Those who understand it, and 2. Those angry it isn't going the way they desire it would go.

"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline alicewonders

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2016, 02:52:20 pm »
So, suddenly Glen Beck's Blaze is ok with you?  :silly:

Rassmussen has Trump up 5 points.

 :smokin: :laugh: :smokin: :laugh: :smokin:
Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline bolobaby

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2016, 02:57:42 pm »
@Relic

Amazing that you criticize someone posting a link to The Blaze.

Did you even bother to read the article you posted, or were you just taken by the allure of the title? Because - if you read it - it's pretty damn critical of Trump and Trumpettes. In fact, it's written from a liberal's point of view, referring constantly to conservatives and the GOP as "they." It's a piece designed to SCOLD people for supporting Trump and SCOLD #NeverTrump for not being able to stop him.

Here...

Whether you're right or left, there are endless reasons to oppose Trump. Remember that he is, among many other things, a vaccine truther.
...
Shouldn't this produce a little soul searching on the right? You'd hope so, but we've seen very little of it.
...
"Trump is a closet leftist!" they yell. Okay, fine. Now tell me how you let him beat you -- explain how the base vulgarian, the poster child for crony capitalism, the shock-jock-loving misogynist who barely even bothers to pretend he's a Christian took your party away.
...
Like a lot of paranoid fantasies, it's seductive: my enemies are real, they're evil, and that's the reason bad things happen. It was also a very dangerous idea to inject into the public, this notion that the elites aren't just incompetent but actually traitorous. But many professional conservatives helped disseminate it, out of the mistaken belief that all that anti-elite animus would benefit them. And then Trump came along with a similar but more appealing message -- Obama is out to get you, but so was George W. Bush, and so are all those fuddy-duddy Republicans in Washington. They're all out to screw you. I'll protect you. Vote Trump.

And then there is this gem, where the author really wants (all) conservatives to look into their soul and realize they have been wrong all along:

Or maybe it's time for the professional conservatives opposing Trump to have a serious discussion about how they got here. To reckon with how they've done business and whether they still have a message with mass appeal. To reexamine their thinking, confess their sins, and seriously ask why ideas that are supposedly so beneficial to everyone -- from free trade to social security privatization -- just don't seem to resonate with the electorate.

...and on and on...

This WHOLE piece is a liberal hit piece on the right. The. Whole. Damn. Thing.

This is why #NeverTrump gets so flustered with people who WILL support Trump - they can't tell liberalism from conservativism. This is liberal scolding of the entire conservative movement - to those that support Trump, and those that don't - at its worst.

Nice job.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2016, 03:01:01 pm by bolobaby »
How to lose credibility while posting:
1. Trump is never wrong.
2. Default to the most puerile emoticon you can find. This is especially useful when you can't win an argument on merits.
3. Be falsely ingratiating, completely but politely dismissive without talking to the points, and bring up Hillary whenever the conversation is really about conservatism.
4. When all else fails, remember rule #1 and #2. Emoticons are like the poor man's tweet!

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2016, 03:03:24 pm »
So, suddenly Glen Beck's Blaze is ok with you?  :silly:

Rassmussen has Trump up 5 points.

It's not Glenn Beck.  It's Matt Walsh who is a widely respected journalist who contributes to American Thinker, Townhall and other conservative outlets.

Rasmussen carries a heavy Republican bias, according to Nate Silver.  Their 2014 polls were among the worst in the industry.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/interactives/pollster-ratings/
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2016, 03:09:16 pm »
And #Nevertrumps STILL can't figure it out.

They still continue their endless argument addiction, instead of listening for clues, which are entirely in the open.

Here is one for an example: At the Costa Mesa rally he brought families, that have lost loved ones due to violent illegal immigrants.  Mr. Trump connects, because he isn't merely talking in abstract terms.

Career politicians talk, and talk. Just like their argument addicted #nevertrump supporters.

BTW Rasmussen has Trump ahead, and Mr. Trump was back in the news early today telling Brits to have muslims turn in other muslims for terrorism.

To #nevertrumps, this just another subject for their neverending argument. To ordinary people it is common sense.




"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2016, 03:14:40 pm »
Quote
You say you want someone who’s politically incorrect. You’re so desperate for political incorrectness — a supremely ridiculous reason to vote a guy into the Oval Office, but never mind — that your esteem for him only grows when he belittles the disabled, mocks American prisoners of war, calls women dogs, calls his opponents p*ssies, calls for the assassination of women and children, says he’d like to have sex with his daughter, brags about his adultery, etc.

You’re excited by the most vile statements and most cretinous behavior imaginable — not remotely deterred by any of it, no matter how many times he gloats over infidelity, curses his opponents, and publicly ogles his own children — because, you say, it’s politically incorrect. That is how unfathomably desperate you are for someone to come along and just say what’s on their mind, you claim. You’re so fed up with political correctness that you celebrate political incorrectness without distinguishing between the healthy sort and the “LOL I slept with married women and I’m not sorry” sort. It doesn’t matter if you don’t personally agree, you say, you just respect the hell out of someone who’s willing to shoot straight, even when ”shooting straight” means comparing Ben Carson to a child molester, calling the entire electorate of Iowa stupid, and referring to women as “pieces of ass.”

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/dear-trump-fan-so-you-want-someone-to-tell-it-like-it-is-ok-here-you-go/
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline bolobaby

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2016, 04:04:31 pm »
And #Nevertrumps STILL can't figure it out.

They still continue their endless argument addiction, instead of listening for clues, which are entirely in the open.

Here is one for an example: At the Costa Mesa rally he brought families, that have lost loved ones due to violent illegal immigrants.  Mr. Trump connects, because he isn't merely talking in abstract terms.

Career politicians talk, and talk. Just like their argument addicted #nevertrump supporters.

BTW Rasmussen has Trump ahead, and Mr. Trump was back in the news early today telling Brits to have muslims turn in other muslims for terrorism.

To #nevertrumps, this just another subject for their neverending argument. To ordinary people it is common sense.

Yep - great job siding with see-BS and a total liberal hit piece.

And you wonder why we won't side with you or Trump. You've lost the ability to see liberal propaganda when it bites you DIRECTLY on the nose.
How to lose credibility while posting:
1. Trump is never wrong.
2. Default to the most puerile emoticon you can find. This is especially useful when you can't win an argument on merits.
3. Be falsely ingratiating, completely but politely dismissive without talking to the points, and bring up Hillary whenever the conversation is really about conservatism.
4. When all else fails, remember rule #1 and #2. Emoticons are like the poor man's tweet!

Offline Relic

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2016, 04:19:41 pm »
@Relic

Amazing that you criticize someone posting a link to The Blaze.

...

Nice job.

I read it. I'm going to vote for Trump, but I'm not the pro Trump person you seem to think I am.

The article is a fair one, and it eviscerates the #NeverTrump'ers for lack of vision, unwillingness to recognize the current situation, and inability to understand why some of their unpopular stances aren't embraced by the public.

You read it, but did you understand it?

Offline bolobaby

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2016, 05:13:26 pm »
I read it. I'm going to vote for Trump, but I'm not the pro Trump person you seem to think I am.

The article is a fair one, and it eviscerates the #NeverTrump'ers for lack of vision, unwillingness to recognize the current situation, and inability to understand why some of their unpopular stances aren't embraced by the public.

You read it, but did you understand it?

I read it for exactly what it said. Allow me to paraphrase:

"Conservatives are an angry, low-life bunch. They're so angry and illiterate, they just nominated a full-fledged retard for president. Some 'principled' conservatives in the GOP tried to stop Trump from getting nominated and failed. Why did they fail? Because their ideas are stupid and outdated, unlike progressive ideas which would lead us directly to utopia. Now they are stuck with a small-handed, small-brained jackwad for whom there are many reasons to object. Next time act more like liberals from the get-go instead of trying to pitch regressive outdated ideas."

The funny thing is that - although the writer clearly thinks Trump is offensive and a bad choice for president - he doesn't get the fact that Trump *actually* represents the more progressive set of ideas that he wants conservatives to embrace in the first place!

But remember: to moonbats, Trump has said enough offensive things that they would reject him outright despite the fact that they will get more of their agenda with him in office than, say, Cruz, Kasich, or Rubio.

Now - your inability to recognize this article for that exact summary is why we have people supporting Trump. They can't see the forest for the trees.
How to lose credibility while posting:
1. Trump is never wrong.
2. Default to the most puerile emoticon you can find. This is especially useful when you can't win an argument on merits.
3. Be falsely ingratiating, completely but politely dismissive without talking to the points, and bring up Hillary whenever the conversation is really about conservatism.
4. When all else fails, remember rule #1 and #2. Emoticons are like the poor man's tweet!

Offline Relic

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2016, 12:57:19 am »
I read it for exactly what it said. Allow me to paraphrase:

"Conservatives are an angry, low-life bunch. They're so angry and illiterate, they just nominated a full-fledged retard for president. Some 'principled' conservatives in the GOP tried to stop Trump from getting nominated and failed. Why did they fail? Because their ideas are stupid and outdated, unlike progressive ideas which would lead us directly to utopia. Now they are stuck with a small-handed, small-brained jackwad for whom there are many reasons to object. Next time act more like liberals from the get-go instead of trying to pitch regressive outdated ideas."

The funny thing is that - although the writer clearly thinks Trump is offensive and a bad choice for president - he doesn't get the fact that Trump *actually* represents the more progressive set of ideas that he wants conservatives to embrace in the first place!

But remember: to moonbats, Trump has said enough offensive things that they would reject him outright despite the fact that they will get more of their agenda with him in office than, say, Cruz, Kasich, or Rubio.

Now - your inability to recognize this article for that exact summary is why we have people supporting Trump. They can't see the forest for the trees.

Look up infer vs. imply.

You assume much.

Offline montanajoe

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2016, 01:02:41 am »
Will know the success or failure of #NeverTrump on November 8, 2016 not before...

Offline don-o

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2016, 01:04:09 am »
Failed. Not at all. It's a work in progress.

Offline don-o

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2016, 01:07:59 am »


The funny thing is that - although the writer clearly thinks Trump is offensive and a bad choice for president - he doesn't get the fact that Trump *actually* represents the more progressive set of ideas that he wants conservatives to embrace in the first place!

But remember: to moonbats, Trump has said enough offensive things that they would reject him outright despite the fact that they will get more of their agenda with him in office than, say, Cruz, Kasich, or Rubio.

Now - your inability to recognize this article for that exact summary is why we have people supporting Trump. They can't see the forest for the trees.

Elegantly stated. Well done.

Offline bolobaby

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Re: Commentary: Why #NeverTrump failed
« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2016, 01:33:29 am »
Look up infer vs. imply.

You assume much.

And therein lies the problem with the people who have settled on Trump. They cannot see the clear implications of a statement like this...

Or maybe it's time for the professional conservatives opposing Trump to have a serious discussion about how they got here. To reckon with how they've done business and whether they still have a message with mass appeal. To reexamine their thinking, confess their sins, and seriously ask why ideas that are supposedly so beneficial to everyone -- from free trade to social security privatization -- just don't seem to resonate with the electorate.

...from a progressive liberal hack editor for the Daily Beast and opinion editor for see-BS who brought us "fake but accurate."

This is why we can't expect anyone who has settled on Trump to see Trump's own implications - namely, "Everything I say is BS. For example, you won't get your wall. Later, I'll make some awesome 'deal' and claim that the THREAT of the wall was my bargaining chip for getting that 'deal.' You conservatives won't think it's an awesome deal, but the folks I hobnob with - the Clintons and Soros of the world - they'll love it. The press will also talk about how great it is because they'll try to normalize the betrayal of conservatives by lionizing my 'deal-making prowess.'"
How to lose credibility while posting:
1. Trump is never wrong.
2. Default to the most puerile emoticon you can find. This is especially useful when you can't win an argument on merits.
3. Be falsely ingratiating, completely but politely dismissive without talking to the points, and bring up Hillary whenever the conversation is really about conservatism.
4. When all else fails, remember rule #1 and #2. Emoticons are like the poor man's tweet!