Cruz: Those who bolstered Trump 'will bear that responsibility going forward'

[geronl]

Have you ever considered the fact that that was because the Plymouth Colony was founded by "religious nuts" who followed God's laws, and England was not?   Respect for women is right up there in the New Testament, and that's what they were relying on for wisdom.

These religious nuts allowed women to own taverns! (called "public houses") (at least 2 known in records) They even allowed women to drink in public! There even a court report of a woman and a man getting fined for public drunkeness.

Oh for shame. :p

[roamer_1]

I looked into his history. When Donald Trump says he's doing something, building something, it gets done.

I found that to be untrue.

He has a good reputation in the banking, business and real estate communities in that regard.

Likewise, untrue. He has defaulted many times, his corporate shells have gone bankrupt, his business acumen has lofted many failures.

His long track record is public record and easily searchable.

Yeah... that's my problem with him.

His record shows me a man of low moral character, and questionable honor (to be kind), who does not keep his vows, or his contracts.
I sure must be looking at a different record.

[musiclady]

These religious nuts allowed women to own taverns! (called "public houses") (at least 2 known in records) They even allowed women to drink in public! There even a court report of a woman and a man getting fined for public drunkeness.

Oh for shame. :p

Well, no one says they were perfect!  :dx1:

(btw, the "religious nuts" reference was from the post you responded to).

[INVAR]

“No people will tamely surrender their Liberties, nor can any be easily subdued, when knowledge is diffused and Virtue is preserved. On the Contrary, when People are universally ignorant, and debauched in their Manners, they will sink under their own weight without the Aid of foreign Invaders. “

Samuel Adams, letter to James Warren, November 4, 1775

“Nothing is more certain than that a general profligacy and corruption of manners make a people ripe for destruction. A good form of government may hold the rotten materials together for some time, but beyond a certain pitch, even the best constitution will be ineffectual, and slavery must ensue.”

John Witherspoon, The Dominion of Providence Over the Passions of Men, 1776

"Nothing is more essential to the establishment of manners in a State than that all persons employed in places of power and trust must be men of unexceptionable characters. "

Samuel Adams, letter to James Warren, November 4, 1775

THANK YOU for posting what our Founders and Patriarchs warned us about!

Well folks, look around.

The fact we are even having this debate is due to the fact that this people are become universally ignorant (Hosea 4:6), and debauched in our behavior and select rulers that match their lack of moral character because this people were fed a LIE that they should not judge behavior.

[HonestJohn]

Morals and values change over time. It just happens. At one point you'd be jailed if as a woman you showed your ankle. Because while we do need a strong moral foundation (like murder is wrong) not all values are equal.

Yep.

Heck, at one point it was found morally right to torture Jews, confiscate their property, and then burn them alive in a spectacle for the people (auto-de-fe).  The Catholic church even found it so godlike they even ran the process.

It was called the Spanish Inquisition.

[HonestJohn]

WHOOT!!!

We are over 1000 posts!

Mr. Banana Pibbles thanks you.

[musiclady]

Yep.

Heck, at one point it was found morally right to torture Jews, confiscate their property, and then burn them alive in a spectacle for the people (auto-de-fe).  The Catholic church even found it so godlike they even ran the process.

It was called the Spanish Inquisition.

Ah.......... the old "Spanish inquisition" argument.   I'm sure the Crusades will be hot on its heels......

 

The Spanish Inquisition has NOTHING to do with the general moral principles which hold a society together, and which our Founders understood were required to keep the Republic from collapsing.

Actually, IMO, we're watching the country disintegrate, in part because public education has taught minds full of mush to equate the Spanish Inquisition with  Christian morality.

Discernment is our friend @HonestJohn

[truth_seeker]

Not to be rude either,  but the US Constitution concludes with a reference to  "Our Lord".

And they used the same term for members of the upper house of the British parliament, I seem to recall.

And it is often stated that some of our founders were Deists, which is understandable given the religious history of the preceding 200 years, on both sides of the Atlantic.

Therefore, I find proof our founders expected rigid Christianity alone, to be unproved.

[INVAR]

I find proof our founders expected rigid Christianity alone, to be unproved.

And folks wonder why it seems at every turn another right is being regulated, taxed, abolished or ignored. People wonder why the Constitution is abrogated.  People wonder how we ended up with two vulgar and despicable human beings at the top of their parties for the highest office in the land.

The root cause of everything is the one thing a majority either do not want any exposure to, or are indifferent to.

So I hope everyone who despises even reading the notion of morality and Christianity in society,  enjoys the current culture and the further coming loss of your rights and liberties.

It's the kind of society you have when "rigid Christianity" no longer exists to influence the culture in any way shape or form.

This people worked hard to rid itself of the influence of the bible on the culture.  Even here, the often knee-jerk revulsion to the mention of biblical morality in the discussion of rights and liberties is very revealing.

You won't have your rights or the liberties you once knew for much longer.

Everything you see now and in the near future are the fruits this people have richly earned for themselves and their posterity.

From Obama to Transgendered bathrooms to BLM and the war on cops, Jihadist Islam and all the woes and miseries we see in the news each day.  All comes down to the root cause that everyone pretends never existed and shouldn't exist.

America in decline is a perfect reflection of the character of the nation as it dives towards Gommorah as it surpasses Sodom.

Such a people cannot maintain liberty or freedom, indeed it will eschew it from themselves and embrace that which every other despotic top-down government on earth provides their subjects.

[the_doc]

And they used the same term for members of the upper house of the British parliament, I seem to recall.

And it is often stated that some of our founders were Deists, which is understandable given the religious history of the preceding 200 years, on both sides of the Atlantic.

Therefore, I find proof our founders expected rigid Christianity alone, to be unproved.

The Deists had far less influence on our Constitution than most of today's Americans have been led to believe.  The overwhelming majority of delegates to the Constitutional Convention were conservative Protestants.  Even Benjamin Franklin, a strongly pro-Christian Deist and one of only three Deists in the Convention, later said that he was delighted to be able to tell the crowned heads of Europe that America was founded quite deliberately on the Bible.

[Sanguine]

Yep.

Heck, at one point it was found morally right to torture Jews, confiscate their property, and then burn them alive in a spectacle for the people (auto-de-fe).  The Catholic church even found it so godlike they even ran the process.

It was called the Spanish Inquisition.

There's a bit more to it than that - or a bit less, depending on one's claims:

The Spanish Inquisition is often cited in popular literature and history as an example of Catholic intolerance and repression. Modern historians have tended to question earlier and wildly exaggerated accounts concerning the severity of the Inquisition. Henry Kamen asserts that the 'myth' of the all-powerful, torture-mad inquisition is largely an invention of nineteenth century Protestant authors with an agenda to discredit the Papacy.[2]

....The Spanish Inquisition can be seen as an answer to the multi-religious nature of Spanish society following the reconquest of the Iberian Peninsula from the Muslim Moors. After invading in 711, large areas of the Iberian Peninsula were ruled by Muslims until 1250, when they were restricted to Granada, which fell in 1492. However, the Reconquista did not result in the total expulsion of Muslims from Spain, since they, along with Jews, were tolerated by the ruling Christian elite. Large cities, especially Seville, Valladolid and Barcelona, had significant Jewish populations centered in Juderia, but in the coming years the Muslims were increasingly subjugated by alienation and torture. The Jews, who had previously thrived under Muslim rule, now suffered similar maltreatment....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Inquisition

[libertybele]

And folks wonder why it seems at every turn another right is being regulated, taxed, abolished or ignored. People wonder why the Constitution is abrogated.  People wonder how we ended up with two vulgar and despicable human beings at the top of their parties for the highest office in the land.

The root cause of everything is the one thing a majority either do not want any exposure to, or are indifferent to.

So I hope everyone who despises even reading the notion of morality and Christianity in society,  enjoys the current culture and the further coming loss of your rights and liberties.

It's the kind of society you have when "rigid Christianity" no longer exists to influence the culture in any way shape or form.

This people worked hard to rid itself of the influence of the bible on the culture.  Even here, the often knee-jerk revulsion to the mention of biblical morality in the discussion of rights and liberties is very revealing.

You won't have your rights or the liberties you once knew for much longer.

Everything you see now and in the near future are the fruits this people have richly earned for themselves and their posterity.

From Obama to Transgendered bathrooms to BLM and the war on cops, Jihadist Islam and all the woes and miseries we see in the news each day.  All comes down to the root cause that everyone pretends never existed and shouldn't exist.

America in decline is a perfect reflection of the character of the nation as it dives towards Gommorah as it surpasses Sodom.

Such a people cannot maintain liberty or freedom, indeed it will eschew it from themselves and embrace that which every other despotic top-down government on earth provides their subjects.

  America is in decline because of the moral decay in our society and the attack on Christianity. 

[Norm Lenhart]

Such a people cannot maintain liberty or freedom, indeed it will eschew it from themselves and embrace that which every other despotic top-down government on earth provides their subjects.

Anyone besides me notice that the very same people on this thread who want conservatism to be a nebulous formless undefined 'for everyone' kinda thing are the very same people that make excuses for people like Trump and Romney? That argue to this day for lesser evil voting?

Anyone that can point to one here that hasn't?

How very odd. Wait...I misspelled 'odd' "PREDICTABLE is not spelled with an 'O'.

[RoosGirl]

Anyone besides me notice that the very same people on this thread who want conservatism to be a nebulous formless undefined 'for everyone' kinda thing are the very same people that make excuses for people like Trump and Romney? That argue to this day for lesser evil voting?

Anyone that can point to one here that hasn't?

How very odd. Wait...I misspelled 'odd' "PREDICTABLE is not spelled with an 'O'.

To what end?  To makes themselves feel better?  To feel like they're one of the cool kids?  I just don't understand it.  Why care so much about being called a conservative?

[Norm Lenhart]

To what end?  To makes themselves feel better?  To feel like they're one of the cool kids?  I just don't understand it.  Why care so much about being called a conservative?

For some, To ensure actual conservatism and actual conservatives waste all their time fighting them instead of getting our collective poop together.

For others, they think at the grade school level and big ideas hurt their heads.

All these arguements about 'open conservatism that is whatever you want it to be" is the exact same arguement as

"Everyone has their own truth"

That is 100% a liberal idea. Conservatives do not embrace liberal ideas. Liberal ideas are by definition what Conservatism and conservatives fight against.

This thread has already seen the open conservative crowd engage in an orgy of circular logic with the occasional turnoff into flat out lying about stated positions. It is no different than the psuedocons on FR who did the same thing and some of them are in fact the same people.

We see how that turned out.

But ultimately, they will throw themselves on the floor and scream for the candybar no matter what logic, history or reason we give them. Because thats what liberals do. Disrupt conservatives, rewrite history and mock you for not embracing 'their truth'.

[RoosGirl]

For some, To ensure actual conservatism and actual conservatives waste all their time fighting them instead of getting our collective poop together.

For others, they think at the grade school level and big ideas hurt their heads.

All these arguements about 'open conservatism that is whatever you want it to be" is the exact same arguement as

"Everyone has their own truth"

That is 100% a liberal idea. Conservatives do not embrace liberal ideas. Liberal ideas are by definition what Conservatism and conservatives fight against.

This thread has already seen the open conservative crowd engage in an orgy of circular logic with the occasional turnoff into flat out lying about stated positions. It is no different than the psuedocons on FR who did the same thing and some of them are in fact the same people.

We see how that turned out.

But ultimately, they will throw themselves on the floor and scream for the candybar no matter what logic, history or reason we give them. Because thats what liberals do. Disrupt conservatives, rewrite history and mock you for not embracing 'their truth'.

I'm #2 above. :P

[Norm Lenhart]

I'm #2 above. :P

You seem fine with big ideas to me.

[RoosGirl]

You seem fine with big ideas to me.

I use a random sentence generator to make most of my comments. :)

[Smokin Joe]

I think it is a mistake to gage the size of a voting block nationally based on one's own circle of acquaintances.  I think your number is very high, at least if you're talking about Christian conservatives who also have conservative political views.  Either that, or they don't -- and haven't ever -- really shown up in force at the polls.

I think that is true of any group, whatever pigeonhole people stuff them in. Homosexuals act as if they are a significant bloc. (What, 2%?) but they tend to hang together, those on either end of the abortion issue (not the ones who think some murder is okay some of the time, but those who would say yea or nay), tend to believe more folks are that involved. Pick an issue, any issue, and how strongly people believe about anything can be ranked up there with whether they want the pastrami sandwich for lunch, for most of the population.

As far as Conservatism goes, the word has been mushed about to be meaningless. Anyone to the right of Karl Marx can pop up a flag and claim to be conservative (on one meaninglessly thin slice of any issue) and not in any way even appear to be conservative on any other issue, and it is this (media fed) dilution of what a Conservative once was: Someone taking stances on issues which are in accordance with the DofI or the Constitution and Bill of Rights (Original intent).  The media do not speak of 100% conservatives as "conservative"--such positions are way past "extremist" to them.

[Norm Lenhart]

I use a random sentence generator to make most of my comments. :)

Still smarter posts than we see from Trump fanatics ;)

[Hoodat]

[txradioguy]

And folks wonder why it seems at every turn another right is being regulated, taxed, abolished or ignored. People wonder why the Constitution is abrogated.  People wonder how we ended up with two vulgar and despicable human beings at the top of their parties for the highest office in the land.

The root cause of everything is the one thing a majority either do not want any exposure to, or are indifferent to.

So I hope everyone who despises even reading the notion of morality and Christianity in society,  enjoys the current culture and the further coming loss of your rights and liberties.

It's the kind of society you have when "rigid Christianity" no longer exists to influence the culture in any way shape or form.

This people worked hard to rid itself of the influence of the bible on the culture.  Even here, the often knee-jerk revulsion to the mention of biblical morality in the discussion of rights and liberties is very revealing.

You won't have your rights or the liberties you once knew for much longer.

Everything you see now and in the near future are the fruits this people have richly earned for themselves and their posterity.

From Obama to Transgendered bathrooms to BLM and the war on cops, Jihadist Islam and all the woes and miseries we see in the news each day.  All comes down to the root cause that everyone pretends never existed and shouldn't exist.

America in decline is a perfect reflection of the character of the nation as it dives towards Gommorah as it surpasses Sodom.

Such a people cannot maintain liberty or freedom, indeed it will eschew it from themselves and embrace that which every other despotic top-down government on earth provides their subjects.

Outstanding post!  Well said!

[East of the Beast]

Such bitterness.  I'm embarrassed for him.   

He's right.You may want to save that embarrassment for the general election.

[Smokin Joe]

And folks wonder why it seems at every turn another right is being regulated, taxed, abolished or ignored. People wonder why the Constitution is abrogated.  People wonder how we ended up with two vulgar and despicable human beings at the top of their parties for the highest office in the land.

The root cause of everything is the one thing a majority either do not want any exposure to, or are indifferent to.

So I hope everyone who despises even reading the notion of morality and Christianity in society,  enjoys the current culture and the further coming loss of your rights and liberties.

It's the kind of society you have when "rigid Christianity" no longer exists to influence the culture in any way shape or form.

This people worked hard to rid itself of the influence of the bible on the culture.  Even here, the often knee-jerk revulsion to the mention of biblical morality in the discussion of rights and liberties is very revealing.

You won't have your rights or the liberties you once knew for much longer.

Everything you see now and in the near future are the fruits this people have richly earned for themselves and their posterity.

From Obama to Transgendered bathrooms to BLM and the war on cops, Jihadist Islam and all the woes and miseries we see in the news each day.  All comes down to the root cause that everyone pretends never existed and shouldn't exist.

America in decline is a perfect reflection of the character of the nation as it dives towards Gommorah as it surpasses Sodom.

Such a people cannot maintain liberty or freedom, indeed it will eschew it from themselves and embrace that which every other despotic top-down government on earth provides their subjects.

The founders respected the concept of God-Given, unalienable Rights. (Declaration of Independence, ...are endowed by their Creator with certain Unalienable Rights, among those, Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness...)

When that Creator, that overwhelming and omniscient power, is removed from the equation, the Rights thus obtained are easy targets and their existence becomes hinged in the minds of those in power on the diktat of man.

[GrouchoTex]

we have one, no wait, two, uh, make that 3...

Great stuff