Okay, #NeverTrump, Enough Already

[Relic]

When Trump stops his insults, we'll stop ours.  I have no doubt he'll never stop.

Not an emotional wound.  Every single day Trump presents an opportunity to ratify why I'm #NeverTrump.

Ok, whatever helps you sleep at night.

[Mechanicos]

I think if the Trump cult could convince us they're aren't just an angry mob..maybe actually show some disapproval for some of the more outrageous things he does that definately are NOT Presidential...we'd feel a lot better.

But we can't even get the Trump cult to even tell us where he stands on Constitutional issues and critical policy issues.

That he is so UN PC is one of the things that draw so many Americans to him. That brashness, that in-your-face chess moves, that rope -a-dope 3 steps ahead is not used in first attack but is seen usually in a first defensive action. Name one politician he has eviscerated who did not take a shot at him first. Bottom line, its refreshing.

Oh and Critical policy issues like Immigration, Trade, Islam, etc. he is the only one who brought them out.

As far as Constitutional issues hes been on them for years - just not wrapping himself in the term for optics.
Couple of examples:
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/anti-gun-control-rally-albany-brings-trump-article-1.1742627
http://dennismichaellynch.com/must-see-donald-trumps-position-on-the-blm/

Point is he walks the walk not talks the talk like the "Constitutional Conservative" (sic) who voted to renew the extremely unconstitutional Patriot Act.

Here is a compilation going back decades on Trump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmHwLaOloh4

 

[Hoodat]

but Sunday proved to be something of a watershed. I realized that people who would rather post nasty memes about Trump than sweet reminisces about their moms were not sane enough for Jack World. I started “unfollowing” them.

Know what I found out on Sunday Jack? I found out Trump was a Leftist and didn't want to have anything to do with Conservatives. Said so one the morning shows. You can do what you want but voting for a Progressive dope just because he has an R after his name is why the country is circling the drain.

Screw you and screw Trump. May you both go down in flames.

Well stated.  I can see the Trumps and the Clintons enjoying a meal at some 5-star Manhattan restaurant on a November Wednesday to celebrate Hillary's  election victory.

[Hoodat]

Oh and Critical policy issues like Immigration, Trade, Islam, etc. he is the only one who brought them out.

Trump has adopted Bernie Sanders' position on trade.  And on immigration, he is for amnesty as long as they get deported first, at which point the door will be open.  I'm not sure of his position on islam, but I hope it doesn't involve muslims having to wear crescents patched to their clothes and living in segregated ghettos.

[ScottinVA]

To insult Trump is to insult his voters

I see... his voters feel offended when we express opposition to their candidate.

Interesting the article doesn't address months of rampant, scurrilous attacks on Ted Cruz, his family and his supporters from Trump and minions of Trumpette Nation.   That said, if Trump can manage to force himself for more than 30 seconds to focus on pertinent national issues and show he has an ability to lead and get on well with others who don't kiss his ring, perhaps some minds will be changed.   That tired crap of "if you don't support him, you're supporting Hillary" doesn't cut it.  Let Trump convince us why he's worthy of our vote.

[Mechanicos]

Trump has adopted Bernie Sanders' position on trade.  And on immigration, he is for amnesty as long as they get deported first, at which point the door will be open.  I'm not sure of his position on islam, but I hope it doesn't involve muslims having to wear crescents patched to their clothes and living in segregated ghettos.

[RetBobbyMI]

We'll see how far Trump back away from the GOP platform shaped by the numerous Cruz (Trump in disguise) delegates.

[ScottinVA]

Well stated.  I can see the Trumps and the Clintons enjoying a meal at some 5-star Manhattan restaurant on a November Wednesday to celebrate Hillary's  election victory.

I can see the Trumps and Clintons celebrating Hillary's 35-state victory together as the returns roll in on Election Night.  Business necessity, and all, don'tcha know.

[Hoodat]

BS

TRADE

Donald Trump: Here's the one area where Bernie Sanders and I agree
http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-bernie-sanders-trade-tpp-2016-2

Donald Trump says he agrees with Bernie Sanders on trade policy
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/donald-trump-says-he-agrees-with-bernie-sanders-on-trade-policy-2015-08-10

AMNESTY

Trump: I’d ‘Expedite’ Legal Immigration Process for ‘Good’ Illegals After Getting Them Out
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/07/27/trump-id-expedite-legal-immigration-process-for-good-illegals-after-getting-them-out/

Who Knew? Trump Favors Amnesty for Undocumented Immigrants
http://www.newsweek.com/who-knew-trump-favors-amnesty-undocumented-immigrants-395512

------------------------------------

You should pay more attention to what Trump actually says instead of focusing on what you wish he had said.

[Mechanicos]

TRADE

Donald Trump: Here's the one area where Bernie Sanders and I agree
http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-bernie-sanders-trade-tpp-2016-2

Now the rest of the story they both agree its a problem. Trump made clear hes the only one who can fix it. So They both agree its a problem area, nothing more. Even you agree with Sanders on this issue.

Donald Trump says he agrees with Bernie Sanders on trade policy
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/donald-trump-says-he-agrees-with-bernie-sanders-on-trade-policy-2015-08-10

Same. only agreeing there is a problem same as you do.

AMNESTY

Trump: I’d ‘Expedite’ Legal Immigration Process for ‘Good’ Illegals After Getting Them Out
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/07/27/trump-id-expedite-legal-immigration-process-for-good-illegals-after-getting-them-out/

Who Knew? Trump Favors Amnesty for Undocumented Immigrants
http://www.newsweek.com/who-knew-trump-favors-amnesty-undocumented-immigrants-395512

Again this is misinformation. What part of legal immigration is escaping your cognitive process? Are you against Ellis island? That's all it is. Nothing says they all come back in. Nowhere does it say what Cruz lied about. Legal means the same as it is for all immigrants. 

------------------------------------

You should pay more attention to what Trump actually says instead of focusing on what you wish he had said.

I actually did pay attention to what Trump actually said without the filter of the Dishonest Bush lawyer spinning it. Maybe you should try it.

[RetBobbyMI]

I actually did pay attention to what Trump actually said without the filter of the Dishonest Bush lawyer spinning it. Maybe you should try it.

Making rational thoughtful educated arguments will do more good than stooping the the Trump-like name calling. Didn't you mom ever tell you to play nice?

[Hoodat]

I actually did pay attention to what Trump actually said without the filter of the Dishonest Bush lawyer spinning it. Maybe you should try it.

TRUMP'S OWN WORDS:

"I was watching him and he talked about trade and how we're getting ripped off left and right on trade. I think I can take that paragraph and use it in my speech, [because it] is what I'm saying. It's one of my big things; we're getting killed by China."

D Trump, Aug 2015

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/Donald-Trump-china-trade-Bernie-Sanders/2015/08/10/id/669331/

[ArneFufkin]

As I said, I can respect that choice.  Depending on what happens during the campaign, I may end up voting for him myself.  Or not.

What I really worry about with Trump is a long-term destruction of the Republican brand which, flawed though it is, is still the only organized resistance to the Democrats.  I am also concerned that ratification of the type of campaign he ran will poison future primaries if he succeeds.  So I have to weigh those concerns in the same hopper with how each of them would govern.

It is not an easy choice.

It's not just the GOP brand that Trump is obliterating, it's political conservatism.

Recall that he went into Wisconsin -  one of the spectacular and hardest won GOP/Conservative success stories in recent memory - and trashed the accomplishments of Scott Walker and the Republican Legislature in front of a Janesville crowd of spittle-laden UAW blue-fist monkeys. 

He's a cancer and his supporters are, by and large, arsonists and vandals.

[Mechanicos]

TRUMP'S OWN WORDS:

"I was watching him and he talked about trade and how we're getting ripped off left and right on trade. I think I can take that paragraph and use it in my speech, [because it] is what I'm saying. It's one of my big things; we're getting killed by China."

D Trump, Aug 2015

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/Donald-Trump-china-trade-Bernie-Sanders/2015/08/10/id/669331/

We are getting ripped off in trade. Where is agreeing with a truth a bad thing? Even you agree with it.

[GrouchoTex]

Everything still seems emotionally charged at the moment, which I think will die down in time.
To say Insulting Trump is Insulting his supporters is odd.
It is the trump supporters who have continued to insult me, even after he became the last candidate in the race.
I am still getting harassed, for things like "being too stupid" to board the Trump Train in the first place.
I have also been called a closet democrat.
Both (and many more) have been hurled my way just within this past week.
I had reservations (to put it mildly) about McCain and Romney, but I still voted for them, even though neither were my candidate of choice.
No McCain or Romney supporters continued to attack me after they secured the nomination.
McCain and Romney surrogates did not tell me to get on board or leave the party (Like Trump surrogate Huckabee said yesterday).
Hate to say it, but scorched earth campaigning works both directions, and is a double edged sword.
Trump(and his supporters) have the time to change all of this.
It remains to be seen if he/they will try or not.

[GrouchoTex]

To insult Trump is to insult his voters

I see... his voters feel offended when we express opposition to their candidate.

Interesting the article doesn't address months of rampant, scurrilous attacks on Ted Cruz, his family and his supporters from Trump and minions of Trumpette Nation.   That said, if Trump can manage to force himself for more than 30 seconds to focus on pertinent national issues and show he has an ability to lead and get on well with others who don't kiss his ring, perhaps some minds will be changed.   That tired crap of "if you don't support him, you're supporting Hillary" doesn't cut it.  Let Trump convince us why he's worthy of our vote.

Exactly

[Frank Cannon]

It's not just the GOP brand that Trump is obliterating, it's political conservatism.

Recall that he went into Wisconsin -  one of the spectacular and hardest won GOP/Conservative success stories in recent memory - and trashed the accomplishments of Scott Walker and the Republican Legislature in front of a Janesville crowd of spittle-laden UAW blue-fist monkeys. 

He's a cancer and his supporters are, by and large, arsonists and vandals.

Right there is all you need to know why Conservatives are not even close to warming up to Donny and he knows it. That is why is making a play for people he is more ideologically in tune with.....Bernie supporters.

[Hoodat]

I disagree with Trump and Sanders.  Trade deficits are not a bad thing when those exported dollars end up being re-imported as investment dollars.  We buy Chinese goods because they are cheap.  This is a bonus for consumers, providing more utility for their consumer dollars.  And we can't sell good to China because they do not provide the value that their price warrants (which is why US companies are setting up shop in China just as Japanese and German companies have done here in the US).  Besides, why would a Chinese consumer pay the cost of a Mercedes for a typical GM automobile when they could have a Mercedes instead?

Trump should know better.  After all, he uses Chinese manufacturers for his own consumer products.  Yet he knows that people are dumb enough to buy into this unfair trade BS.  And of course none of it addresses services which are a major US export.

But the bottom line is that Trump indeed has adopted Sanders' trade policy.  And that is illustrated clearly with Trump saying he was going to borrow Sanders' rhetoric and implement it in his own speeches, which he has now done.

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it.  I have already seen the historical evidence of what can happen in the name of 'fair trade'.  The 1930s are a prime example of that.  The advent of Japanese manufacturers into the luxury car business is another.  US sugar prices are yet another.  Ever wonder why candy makers keep leaving the US?  It is because our government prefers Hawaiian sugar growers at the expense of Chicago candy manufacturers.   So in the name of fair trade, the US consumer pays seven times the world price of sugar.

[INVAR]

The charge that Trump is a liberal does not change hearts or minds either.

It's not a charge, it's a FACT.  Trump's positions, supports and past statements identify Trump as a Liberal Leftist on key issues Conservatives oppose, and Trump has been wholly dismissive and derogatory towards Conservatives even as recently as this past weekend.

In the faint praise department, Trump is as reliably conservative as McCain.

So, out-the-window goes the whole 'dump the Establishment' meme many Trump Believers think their political savior stands upon.

The Second Amendment, the pro-life cause, and our national borders will have more of a future under Trump than they would have under McCain and inarguably more than under Hillary.

We have absolutely NO PROOF of that, beyond Trump's ever-changing policy statements depending on what crowd or person he is talking to.

And to believe there would be no difference between a Trump presidency and a Clinton one is to have ignored the last quarter-century of American history.

The difference is very clear - the Electorate can vote for a Fascist Populist or a Marxist Communist in a Mao Pantsuit.  That's the difference.  Not a choice at all.

The Constitution is still subverted to the whims of a monarch that the people loft upon their champion.

Say what one will, but Trump won fair and square.

So did Mussolini. 

To insult Trump is to insult his voters.

A people who want a monarch and make such a man their prince in absolute indifference of care to the Constitution and the foundational principles that established this former Republic, deserve to be insulted.

The problem is that there are a lot of these voters, and they have the potential to expand -- or contract -- the Republican base.

The Republican Party is dead and gone, and deservedly so.  These voters will ensure the Constitution and Conservatism is buried alongside it given what I am reading online.

[driftdiver]

@ScottinVA

Trumps entire campaign is built around insulting and marginalizing his competition.  He's done a very good job of it.   He can't switch over to the big tent model now.

[kevindavis007]

We are getting ripped off in trade. Where is agreeing with a truth a bad thing? Even you agree with it.

What is wrong with cheap goods?

[Mechanicos]

I disagree with Trump and Sanders.  Trade deficits are not a bad thing when those exported dollars end up being re-imported as investment dollars.  We buy Chinese goods because they are cheap.  This is a bonus for consumers, providing more utility for their consumer dollars.  And we can't sell good to China because they do not provide the value that their price warrants (which is why US companies are setting up shop in China just as Japanese and German companies have done here in the US).  Besides, why would a Chinese consumer pay the cost of a Mercedes for a typical GM automobile when they could have a Mercedes instead?

Trump should know better.  After all, he uses Chinese manufacturers for his own consumer products.  Yet he knows that people are dumb enough to buy into this unfair trade BS.  And of course none of it addresses services which are a major US export.

But the bottom line is that Trump indeed has adopted Sanders' trade policy.  And that is illustrated clearly with Trump saying he was going to borrow Sanders' rhetoric and implement it in his own speeches, which he has now done.

This line is total BS he has not adopted Sanders trade policy. the ONLY thing he did was agree we are being ripped off. And that is a true fact. So please stop adding to it and say8ng there was any policy agreement.

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it.  I have already seen the historical evidence of what can happen in the name of 'fair trade'.  The 1930s are a prime example of that.  The advent of Japanese manufacturers into the luxury car business is another.  US sugar prices are yet another.  Ever wonder why candy makers keep leaving the US?  It is because our government prefers Hawaiian sugar growers at the expense of Chicago candy manufacturers.   So in the name of fair trade, the US consumer pays seven times the world price of sugar.

[bilo]

To insult Trump is to insult his voters

That's pretty much the way I see it.  Now we're getting down to the nub of why we got stuck with this clown.

And I will continue to insult Trump.

#NeverTrump.

My initial reaction to Trump's crude insults of his opponents was positive. It was so unusual. As the primaries progressed I began to realize why candidates would go out of their way to avoid insulting their opponents. If they won the nomination they would need allies and making your opponents bitter enemies would make that pretty tough. Trump and his followers have created this mess. Now they are finding that a lot of the voters who supported other candidates are not going to jump on the "Trump train".

The response of Trump and his followers further illustrates how self defeating they are. Trump proclaims he doesn't need these voters that he will have enough Rats vote for him and his followers like Huckabee say any who won't fall in line should leave the GOP.

I'm not even touching on all the policy positions that are not in line with the GOP. I'm just looking at the lack of strategic thinking and bad tactics of Trump and his followers. Who knows he may win, but it sure won't be with me.

[Free Vulcan]

The Trumpets who seem to think that they're going to strongarm conservatives into voting for him with their 'get in line' intimidation have another thing coming.

Trump said he doesn't need our vote. He's the Dealmaker. He made an offer.

I took the offer. The deal is made. See how easy that was?

So stop trying to prattle around with a big stick thinking you're going to cow us.

[GrouchoTex]

My initial reaction to Trump's crude insults of his opponents was positive. It was so unusual. As the primaries progressed I began to realize why candidates would go out of their way to avoid insulting their opponents. If they won the nomination they would need allies and making your opponents bitter enemies would make that pretty tough. Trump and his followers have created this mess. Now they are finding that a lot of the voters who supported other candidates are not going to jump on the "Trump train".

The response of Trump and his followers further illustrates how self defeating they are. Trump proclaims he doesn't need these voters that he will have enough Rats vote for him and his followers like Huckabee say any who won't fall in line should leave the GOP.

I'm not even touching on all the policy positions that are not in line with the GOP. I'm just looking at the lack of strategic thinking and bad tactics of Trump and his followers. Who knows he may win, but it sure won't be with me.

Trump's crude insults of his opponents lead to Trump's supporters crude insults of his opponent's supporters.

It as if we went through a bloodbath to pick our team captain. Now the captain and those who supported him realize that they may have to forfeit, because they don't have enough team members left to field a lineup. Some have stayed with the team and the rest of them have all gone off to become free agents.
Half of the Captain's supporters say"Go ahead and leave, see if I care!", while the other half say "You can't leave or the other team wins!"