Author Topic: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee  (Read 8317 times)

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Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #25 on: April 04, 2016, 03:50:45 pm »
News flash:  Winning elective office is a pre-requisite to accomplishing things.

Wisconsin is a good example.   In five years, Governor Walker and the GOP legislature have disempowered public Unions, lowered taxes, built a surplus, enacted Voter ID, disbanded the corrupt Government Accountability Board, defunded Planned Parenthood, enabled "Right to Work" and other conservative reforms.    And, Donald Trump came into the state and trashed those accomplishments.

On the national scale there is this dirty little secret:   the GOP Congress has no power to stop a lawless Executive and a Senate with 45 Democrats who would block any reform.   That's just the fact.   Folks who are angry at the GOP are simply misdirecting anger more legitimately aimed at Barack Obama, Reid, Pelosi and Democrat congress members. 

I've stopped listening to, or caring about, the grievances of people too intellectually lazy to understand or acknowledge who is their ally and who is their enemy in this political war.

At the local and state level there are varying degrees of success.

Once you get to the national level, ugh. Here in Ohio, my choice for Senator is Rob Portman, or Ted Strickland.

I'm sick and tired of the apologists. It seems to me that the House controls the purse strings. Any time some kind of pre-emptive action is discussed, the apologists say, it's a bad plan, can't be done, would cost politically. So, any attempts at reigning in Obama are explained away as being too risky, too difficult, impossible.

But, the Republicans said, give us the House and Senate and we'll reign in the Obama administration? So, what happened, did they not understand the task when they were promising to do it? Now they say, with only the House and Senate, we don't have enough power, we need the White House too!

And that's how you get a Trump.

So, Trump is peeing all over the party, and the GOP's response is, they don't have enough power, and don't blame us, you people picked us! By the way, could you vote for us again, it's really important this time.

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2016, 03:53:47 pm »
Never said anything was fine. Things are pretty far from fine. I'm just tired of the whining. Don't mischaracterize my argument, son.

I characterize what you post, as you posted it, dad. Here's a thought, be clear about what you mean.

It's ironic that someone who whines so much would be whining about not what others post, but the manner in which they post it. There should be a term for a whiner who whines about whining. I got it: WTF!

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2016, 03:56:38 pm »
I characterize what you post, as you posted it, dad. Here's a thought, be clear about what you mean.

It's ironic that someone who whines so much would be whining about not what others post, but the manner in which they post it. There should be a term for a whiner who whines about whining. I got it: WTF!

You're whining about whining about whining.  I win.

Offline ArneFufkin

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2016, 04:03:55 pm »
At the local and state level there are varying degrees of success.

Once you get to the national level, ugh. Here in Ohio, my choice for Senator is Rob Portman, or Ted Strickland.

I'm sick and tired of the apologists. It seems to me that the House controls the purse strings. Any time some kind of pre-emptive action is discussed, the apologists say, it's a bad plan, can't be done, would cost politically. So, any attempts at reigning in Obama are explained away as being too risky, too difficult, impossible.

But, the Republicans said, give us the House and Senate and we'll reign in the Obama administration? So, what happened, did they not understand the task when they were promising to do it? Now they say, with only the House and Senate, we don't have enough power, we need the White House too!

And that's how you get a Trump.

So, Trump is peeing all over the party, and the GOP's response is, they don't have enough power, and don't blame us, you people picked us! By the way, could you vote for us again, it's really important this time.

Vote Democrat then.   That's what a vote for Trump will be.  Bon Appétit.

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #29 on: April 04, 2016, 04:05:21 pm »
You're whining about whining about whining.  I win.

You win! And your prize is president Hillary Clinton.

Enjoy!

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #30 on: April 04, 2016, 04:07:31 pm »
Vote Democrat then.   That's what a vote for Trump will be.  Bon Appétit.

Translation: "I love my party, even if it's worthless. If you don't, go away."

Winning plan. You're another winner... you win Hillary Clinton, enjoy seeing her take the White House. Let the good times roll.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #31 on: April 04, 2016, 04:10:13 pm »
You win! And your prize is president Hillary Clinton.

Enjoy!

Haha, how would you defeat Hillary in November? Since you're such a genius of course. I want to hear what you would do.

Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #32 on: April 04, 2016, 04:39:17 pm »
I'm not sure how. The couple of thousand delegates that go to the convention are not DC 'establishment', they are people from the local precincts who are pledged in some way to a candidate, a vast majority enthusastically so as they were chosen based on what they do for the local party and 'being there' in the precinct meeting and State meeting for their candidate. If someone doesn't immediately quality on the first vote, the candidate go to work convincing delegates to vote for them on the second, third, or whatever vote.

Trump or Cruz have far fewer to convince as they come in with a larger slate of loyal delegates.

Ryan would have to convince over 1200 delegates to abandon the loyalty they came in for him.

Same can be said for any non-candidate put up for a vote.

Exactly. If Cruz or Trump come up short, they have the capability to cobble together a coalition of delegates to get over the hump. Ryan won't have any juice going in to the convention cold.

Bill Cipher

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #33 on: April 04, 2016, 04:51:35 pm »
Trump is the symptom.

A rudderless, do nothing GOP is the disease.

Nonsense.  A small bunch of well meaning fools who are so blinded by anger and hatred of Obama they've allowed themselves to be conned by a grifter is the problem.  These people sit on their duffs, never get involved in the day to day political process, and then are surprised that somehow the political process hasn't taken them into account. 

Offline jmyrlefuller

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #34 on: April 04, 2016, 05:45:54 pm »
Exactly. If Cruz or Trump come up short, they have the capability to cobble together a coalition of delegates to get over the hump. Ryan won't have any juice going in to the convention cold.
With that being so, I don't see Paul Ryan going for it. Quite frankly, he has a "beta" personality—quiet, wonkish, non-confrontational and not a particularly strong leader. Note how quickly he backed down from the budget he proposed after the Democrats went all "killing Grandma" on him.

Ryan is not the kind of guy who stands up well in a fight. If there's any substantial opposition to the idea of him running for President, he will back down and ask someone else to run.

I don't see a lot of people on the GOP bench who could build the kind of coalition that would be needed to get the nomination. They'd have to be universally respected both among the establishment and the delegates who had come to support Trump or Cruz, and seen as able to take on either the Clinton machine or (less likely) a guy in Sanders who has a wave of grassroots support based on his embrace of a tidal wave of cultural "change" (I'd call it collapse). Scott Walker might fit that bill, and there's some buzz that he dropped out just to be in this kind of position. So might a couple of other blue-state governors (Maine's Paul LePage, Michigan's Rick Snyder) but there's no evidence yet that they'd be interested.
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Offline ArneFufkin

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #35 on: April 04, 2016, 05:57:49 pm »
Translation: "I love my party, even if it's worthless. If you don't, go away."

Winning plan. You're another winner... you win Hillary Clinton, enjoy seeing her take the White House. Let the good times roll.

Your post is pure nonsense.  Typical of Trumpster "critical thinking".

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #36 on: April 04, 2016, 06:10:40 pm »
Nonsense.  A small bunch of well meaning fools who are so blinded by anger and hatred of Obama they've allowed themselves to be conned by a grifter is the problem.  These people sit on their duffs, never get involved in the day to day political process, and then are surprised that somehow the political process hasn't taken them into account.

37% is a small bunch? Okay then.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #37 on: April 04, 2016, 06:11:42 pm »
37% is a small bunch? Okay then.

37% of what?

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #38 on: April 04, 2016, 06:11:46 pm »
Your post is pure nonsense.  Typical of Trumpster "critical thinking".

And you're post is typical of a bigoted moron who doesn't even realize I'm not a "Trumpster"

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #39 on: April 04, 2016, 06:13:45 pm »
37% of what?

I'm going with a conservative number of Republicans who support Trump.

Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #40 on: April 04, 2016, 06:29:48 pm »
Should Ryan become the nominee, he will go down as having lost as VP candidate, and lost as Potus candidate.

Has that ever occurred before in history?

Seriously, these discussions start with "Top Republican" says, and winds up discussing Trump.

This site is now dominated by a few people with "anti-Trump" obsession.

"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #41 on: April 04, 2016, 06:33:26 pm »
Should Ryan become the nominee, he will go down as having lost as VP candidate, and lost as Potus candidate.

Has that ever occurred before in history?

Seriously, these discussions start with "Top Republican" says, and winds up discussing Trump.

This site is now dominated by a few people with "anti-Trump" obsession.

I've noticed a significant decline in participation.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #42 on: April 04, 2016, 06:52:44 pm »
I'm going with a conservative number of Republicans who support Trump.

My point was, that it is probably 37% of a smallish number.  So, not very impressive in the big picture.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #43 on: April 04, 2016, 06:53:55 pm »
I've noticed a significant decline in participation.

Have you?  I think @AbaraXas can pull the numbers and let us know if that is indeed the case.

Offline Relic

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #44 on: April 04, 2016, 07:00:11 pm »
My point was, that it is probably 37% of a smallish number.  So, not very impressive in the big picture.

Really? How much did Romney lose to Obama by?

Let's take that smallish number, 37%, and say half of them, around 18% are so angry they vote third party, or don't vote, or go away from voting Republican and don't come back.

Do you think the GOP is doing so well that it can afford to lose 17% of it's base voters?

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #45 on: April 04, 2016, 07:05:53 pm »
Really? How much did Romney lose to Obama by?

Let's take that smallish number, 37%, and say half of them, around 18% are so angry they vote third party, or don't vote, or go away from voting Republican and don't come back.

Do you think the GOP is doing so well that it can afford to lose 17% of it's base voters?

Again, what do you propose they do to keep these voters?

Bill Cipher

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #46 on: April 04, 2016, 07:24:51 pm »
Really? How much did Romney lose to Obama by?

Let's take that smallish number, 37%, and say half of them, around 18% are so angry they vote third party, or don't vote, or go away from voting Republican and don't come back.

Do you think the GOP is doing so well that it can afford to lose 17% of it's base voters?

You're assuming that the people who vote in the primaries constitute the entire GOP base.  They do not.  You're also assuming that he delegate count is a good proxy for the actual popular interest. It isn't, in particular because the delegate count is skewed by the winner take all states.  Take these factors into account and the number who represent the hard core base for Trump becomes quite small when compared to the actual GOP base in the general election.

HonestJohn

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #47 on: April 04, 2016, 07:27:44 pm »
Trump is the symptom.

A rudderless, do nothing GOP is the disease.

More like a virulently self-destructive "blow up the GOP" voter base is the disease.

HonestJohn

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #48 on: April 04, 2016, 07:29:51 pm »
That's the problem.

"Ahem, bluster, bluster, The GOP has won this, that and the other. See! They are grand indeed!"

What has the GOP accomplished?
Is it possible that Democrats are so bad, that in many of those elections, the voters turned to Republicans in desperation?

Just recently, they've managed to allow those who believe in the Christian definition of marriage to refuse service to those married outside of that.

HonestJohn

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Re: Top Republicans believe Paul Ryan will be nominee
« Reply #49 on: April 04, 2016, 07:32:21 pm »
I've noticed a significant decline in participation.

And yet we are seeing a record number of page views.