Trump leaves the conservative establishment arrogant and unmoored

[HonestJohn]

Look, you don't seem to understand, let me try once again to spell it out for you.

I don't like Trump, I have the same issues with Trump as most of you do. However, I don't think this is Trump's doing. It's an unresponsive GOP that created Trump.
Furthermore, I believe the election is already lost. There is nothing anyone can do to salvage that. However, attacking, insulting Trump supporters will do just what Trump supporters have wished for, burn it down. The GOP without Trump supporters will really and truly be powerless.

Unresponsive GOP, my @ss!

The GOP has done everything their voter base has asked.  186 thousand attempts to repeal Obamacare - check.  Shutdown the government to stop Obamacare - check. Sequestration - check. And on and on and on.

They have not succeeded in many efforts, but not for a lack of trying.

1/3 of the GOP voter base is furious *BECAUSE* they got what they voted for.

[HonestJohn]

How about some civility?

Let it play out. Trump will not be the nominee. If Trump wins the nomination, I'll be more shocked than when Obama beat Romney. I'm not saying it can't happen, but I strongly doubt it.

Trump supporters are not evil, they're not stupid, and they're not deserving of contempt. What they are is angry disaffected voters. They're tired of fighting, and having those that reap the rewards of electoral wins, ultimately ignore their concerns. They're scared, watching the country they love move leftward and downward at a rapid rate.

Instead of attacking Trump supporters with a ferocity that is never used when attacking Democrats, try to understand. It's their choice, let it go at that. When Trump is denied the nomination, some will peel away, but most will come around, if they haven't been pissed off and pissed on by establishment types on a daily basis. I'm not talking about just this forum, this forum is meaningless in the greater scheme. I'm talking about media types who are right leaning.

Or, you can keep attacking, because you believe they deserve it. And when the GOP can't win a national election to save their lives, you can wonder why.

Civility?  Civility is, in essence, doing to others as you want others to do unto you.

When Trump insults Megyn Kelly, he is saying that such behavior *IS* what he wants done to him.
When Trump lies, he is asking for that behavior to be returned unto him.
When his supporters sucker punch someone, they ask *FOR* that behavior to be returned.
When his supporters demand a purge, they ask *FOR* that behavior to be do to them.

It's the Golden Rule.  The foundation of society.

Civility in a nutshell.

What's being asked *ISN'T* civility, but deference and obsequious behavior towards his supporters.

So let's put the shoe on the other foot.  Where is the call for Trump and his supporters to behave civilly, extending an olive branch to those he and his have insulted and injured?

Is that a bridge too far?  Does that only extend in one direction?

[Relic]

Unresponsive GOP, my @ss!

The GOP has done everything their voter base has asked.  186 thousand attempts to repeal Obamacare - check.  Shutdown the government to stop Obamacare - check. Sequestration - check. And on and on and on.

They have not succeeded in many efforts, but not for a lack of trying.

1/3 of the GOP voter base is furious *BECAUSE* they got what they voted for.

Cherry picking. Nice.

186 thousand? Really? Can you document that?

Shutdown the government? You mean Ted Cruz don't you? The rest of the GOP hates him for that.

It's ok, believe what you like. How's it working for you?

[HonestJohn]

Cherry picking. Nice.

186 thousand? Really? Can you document that?

Shutdown the government? You mean Ted Cruz don't you? The rest of the GOP hates him for that.

It's ok, believe what you like. How's it working for you?

186 thousand is hyperbole.  Are you implying that the GOP hasn't pushed a very large number of repeal bills through the House?

Shutdown... you mean to say that the GOP voter base got their wish after all?  And that it was Cruz that did it?  And that voter-base is so upset at Cruz that they are looking at Trump?  Talk about the quintessence of being 'upset' at getting exactly what they voted for.

In essence, this is a reinforcement of the point made.

[Bill Cipher]

How about some civility?

Let it play out. Trump will not be the nominee. If Trump wins the nomination, I'll be more shocked than when Obama beat Romney. I'm not saying it can't happen, but I strongly doubt it.

Trump supporters are not evil, they're not stupid, and they're not deserving of contempt. What they are is angry disaffected voters. They're tired of fighting, and having those that reap the rewards of electoral wins, ultimately ignore their concerns. They're scared, watching the country they love move leftward and downward at a rapid rate.

Instead of attacking Trump supporters with a ferocity that is never used when attacking Democrats, try to understand. It's their choice, let it go at that. When Trump is denied the nomination, some will peel away, but most will come around, if they haven't been pissed off and pissed on by establishment types on a daily basis. I'm not talking about just this forum, this forum is meaningless in the greater scheme. I'm talking about media types who are right leaning.

Or, you can keep attacking, because you believe they deserve it. And when the GOP can't win a national election to save their lives, you can wonder why.

Right.  So doing everything in their power to perpetuate and excuse Trump's smears of innocent people doesn't deserve any opprobrium.  Continuing to believe in fairytales told by Trump - patently false fairytales - long past the point at which the falsity of those lies has been demonstrated should be treated with the same courtesy as a genuinely contested, and debatable, issue?

In short, we should apply to them the same tired excuses liberals apply to themselves.  Sorry, not buying the snake oil excuses any more. 

[Relic]

186 thousand is hyperbole.  Are you implying that the GOP hasn't pushed a very large number of repeal bills through the House?

Shutdown... you mean to say that the GOP voter base got their wish after all?  And that it was Cruz that did it?  And that voter-base is so upset at Cruz that they are looking at Trump?  Talk about the quintessence of being 'upset' at getting exactly what they voted for.

In essence, this is a reinforcement of the point made.

I thought that hyperbole was the sole domain of "Trumpsters"?

After Cruz shutdown the government, the GOP won big in the mid term. So yeah, the base won over the go along get along.
My guess is Trump supporters would have moved to Cruz had Trump lost the nomination in a contested convention. Some still might.

You made no point, you're just blustering to make yourself feel good, sort of the way monkeys fling poo for entertainment.

[HonestJohn]

I thought that hyperbole was the sole domain of "Trumpsters"?

After Cruz shutdown the government, the GOP won big in the mid term. So yeah, the base won over the go along get along.
My guess is Trump supporters would have moved to Cruz had Trump lost the nomination in a contested convention. Some still might.

You made no point, you're just blustering to make yourself feel good, sort of the way monkeys fling poo for entertainment.

Where did you get that notion about hyperbole?

[Relic]

Right.  So doing everything in their power to perpetuate and excuse Trump's smears of innocent people doesn't deserve any opprobrium.  Continuing to believe in fairytales told by Trump - patently false fairytales - long past the point at which the falsity of those lies has been demonstrated should be treated with the same courtesy as a genuinely contested, and debatable, issue?

In short, we should apply to them the same tired excuses liberals apply to themselves.  Sorry, not buying the snake oil excuses any more.

Why not? Your rulers treat leftists far better than they treat Trump supporters.

You're getting what you want. Trump will lose at a contested convention, and whatever chump they pick will lose to Hillary.

You folks can write to your rulers and congratulate them, and enjoy your next president Clinton.

[Relic]

Where did you get that notion about hyperbole?

I read it 186 thousand times a day from the anti Trump, drooling masses.

[HonestJohn]

I read it 186 thousand times a day from the anti Trump, drooling masses.

Really, then it should be very easy to pick a random post that would point out how the 'drooling anti-Trump masses' constantly say you shouldn't.

Being a drooling mass, I can't see a single example of that.

---

BTW: have you guessed the symbolism of my avatar .gif yet?  My last one was a representation of how one feels after debating one from the Trump side.  This one is a representation of the Trump side, with their joyous leap into their 'unknown', which to the anyone else watching... is just political suicide.

[Relic]

Really, then it should be very easy to pick a random post that would point out how the 'drooling anti-Trump masses' constantly say you shouldn't.

Being a drooling mass, I can't see a single example of that.

Not surprising that you [post modified by Mod1; no personal attacks, please - I gotcher civility right here, and it doesn't include insulting other posters' intelligence]

[HonestJohn]

Not surprising that you ...

Oh, I recognize it, all right.  I turned it right back at you with the request for you to find an example in that large amount.

So, where did you get the notion that hyperbole was only found with, in your words, 'Trumpsters'?

If there isn't any, you can admit it.

[Right_in_Virginia]

#NeverDole 

Funny!   ^-^

[Bill Cipher]

I thought that hyperbole was the sole domain of "Trumpsters"?

After Cruz shutdown the government, the GOP won big in the mid term. So yeah, the base won over the go along get along.
My guess is Trump supporters would have moved to Cruz had Trump lost the nomination in a contested convention. Some still might.

You made no point, you're just blustering to make yourself feel good, sort of the way monkeys fling poo for entertainment.

There's question about whether the shutdown helped or hurt.  It's very possible that the GOP might have done even better if Cruz hadn't shut it down.  That is one of my annoyances with Cruz and my concern that he has a bit of a political tin ear. 

[A-Lert]

Unresponsive GOP, my @ss!

The GOP has done everything their voter base has asked.  186 thousand attempts to repeal Obamacare - check.  Shutdown the government to stop Obamacare - check. Sequestration - check. And on and on and on.

They have not succeeded in many efforts, but not for a lack of trying.

1/3 of the GOP voter base is furious *BECAUSE* they got what they voted for.

A lack of leadership and will.