Author Topic: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’  (Read 8471 times)

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HAPPY2BME

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #25 on: February 19, 2016, 06:39:15 am »
You need to get the facts straight and then get back to me!  Ted Cruz never forgot to file anything!

============================

Are you speaking as a personal representative of Ted Cruz, with full access to his filing system; both electronic and paper filing systems?

Do you have receipts to prove such a statement?

Offline aligncare

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #26 on: February 19, 2016, 01:46:53 pm »

"Ted Cruz Didn’t Report Goldman Sachs Loan in a Senate Race"

Snip...

Neither loan appears in reports the Ted Cruz for Senate Committee filed with the Federal Election Commission, in which candidates are required to disclose the source of money they borrow to finance their campaigns. Other campaigns have been investigated and fined for failing to make such disclosures, which are intended to inform voters and prevent candidates from receiving special treatment from lenders. There is no evidence that the Cruzes got a break on their loans.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/14/us/politics/ted-cruz-wall-street-loan-senate-bid-2012.html?_r=0

"FEC complaints filed against Ted Cruz for undisclosed loans in 2012 Senate campaign"

updated 3pm Wednesday with FEC confirming receipt of complaint, and at 5:15 with new complaint filed by two campaign watchdog groups

WASHINGTON – The left-leaning group Texans for Public Justice filed a complaint Tuesday alleging that Ted Cruz purposely hid more than $1 million in loans from major banks during his 2012 Senate campaign.

The allegations mirror details uncovered last week by The New York Times, which found that Cruz had failed to report loans from Goldman Sachs and Citibank to the Federal Election Commission, as required under federal campaign law.

http://trailblazersblog.dallasnews.com/2016/01/fec-complaint-filed-against-ted-cruz-for-undisclosed-loans-in-2012-senate-campaign.html/


Donald Trump, a businessman and real estate developer, flubbed an esoteric debate question about the "nuclear triad" and everyone had a cow!

The attorney, Ted Cruz, "forgot" to comply with FEC election law, and his supporters say "no, he did not forget to file." 

I hope Cruz takes the time to brush up on the constitution before taking office in January.

Offline mountaineer

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #27 on: February 19, 2016, 02:24:18 pm »
Trump On Obamacare: ‘I Like The Mandate’ [VIDEO]
9:01 AM 02/19/2016

Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump told CNN’s Anderson Cooper he likes the mandate established by President Barack Obama’s Affordable Care Act that everyone must have insurance or pay a fine.

Cooper asked Trump during a town hall forum on Thursday night  “If Obamacare is repealed and there’s no mandate for everybody to have insurance, what’s to — why would [an] insurance company … insure somebody who has a pre-existing condition?”

Trump responded, “Well, I like the mandate. OK. So here’s where I’m a little bit different. I don’t want people dying on the streets, and I say this all the time. And I say this — look, I did five speeches, maybe six speeches today. We had a lot of rallies. We had of thousands and thousands of people. I mean, we get big crowds.”

Trump added, “Every time I talk about this I get standing ovations. The Republican people, they’re wonderful people. They don’t want people dying on the streets. Sometimes they’ll say Donald Trump wants single payer because there’s a group of people — as good as these plans are and by the way your insurance will go way down, you’ll have better plans, you’ll get your own doctor, which Obama lied.”

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2016/02/19/trump-on-obamacare-i-like-the-mandate-video/#ixzz40cjzlpZm
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HAPPY2BME

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #28 on: February 19, 2016, 02:39:05 pm »
Trump On Obamacare: ‘I Like The Mandate’ [VIDEO]
Sometimes they’ll say Donald Trump wants single payer because there’s a group of people — as good as these plans are and by the way your insurance will go way down, you’ll have better plans, you’ll get your own doctor, which Obama lied.”

===================================

Obama DID lie.

Offline NavyCanDo

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #29 on: February 19, 2016, 08:23:00 pm »
The most unpopular part of Obamacare now has a champion in the Republican presidential field. Via the Right Scoop, Donald Trump was asked on Thursday night by CNN's Anderson Cooper, "If…there's no mandate for everybody to have insurance, what's to—why would an insurance company not have a preexisting—insure somebody with a preexisting condition?" Trump replied, "Well, I like the mandate. Okay, so here's where I'm a little bit different. I don't want people dying on the streets. And I say this all the time."

Well, that's certainly "a little bit different"—in fact, it's hard to get a lot more "different" than to run for president as a Republican and support the hated cornerstone of President Obama's signature legislation. This "mandate for everybody to have insurance" is, of course, the unprecedented requirement that, for the first time in the more than 200 years of United States history, private American citizens must buy a product or service of the federal government's choosing merely as a condition of living in their own country. 

To the best of my knowledge, not since Mitt Romney has a prominent Republican officeholder or top-tier candidate for office expressed fondness for the individual mandate.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/trump-i-like-obamacares-individual-mandate/article/2001172
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Offline NavyCanDo

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #30 on: February 19, 2016, 08:24:54 pm »
Not seeing how anyone in TrumpNation can defend what Trump said, or defend the Obamacare Mandate.      But they will try, ohhhh, will they try.
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Offline ABX

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #31 on: February 19, 2016, 08:26:09 pm »
Oh come on, you can't hold him to this. He said it a long time ago. He made this comment 02/18/2016. That is a lifetime ago in today's politics.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #32 on: February 19, 2016, 08:30:36 pm »
Oh come on, you can't hold him to this. He said it a long time ago. He made this comment 02/18/2016. That is a lifetime ago in today's politics.

 :beer:
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Offline jmyrlefuller

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #33 on: February 19, 2016, 08:48:25 pm »
Oh come on, you can't hold him to this. He said it a long time ago. He made this comment 02/18/2016. That is a lifetime ago in today's politics.
And he was misquoted.
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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #34 on: February 19, 2016, 08:58:00 pm »
If you don't like the mandate, then you either support single payer or you don't care about solving the access issue for folks with pre-existing conditions. 

Pick your poison folks - an individual mandate so all must purchase private insurance, or a collectively-financed system that covers everyone.   There's really no other alternative to addressing the access issue.   

The "triumph" of ObamaCare is that it created the expectation that the government will address the access issue.  I'm afraid that, as a practical matter, there's no going back.   
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Offline ABX

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #35 on: February 19, 2016, 09:05:45 pm »
If you don't like the mandate, then you either support single payer or you don't care about solving the access issue for folks with pre-existing conditions. 

Pick your poison folks - an individual mandate so all must purchase private insurance, or a collectively-financed system that covers everyone.   There's really no other alternative to addressing the access issue.   

The "triumph" of ObamaCare is that it created the expectation that the government will address the access issue.  I'm afraid that, as a practical matter, there's no going back.

Actually, the access issue was already addressed without single payer or the mandate under the Bush administration. A pre-existing condition high risk pool was created to compensate insurance companies so they would provide coverage.
https://www.disabilityrightslegalcenter.org/about/documents/CLRCNewsletterOctober-NIN-FINAL.pdf

Also, the HIPAA act of 1996 prevented insurers from denying coverage under employee based insurance coverage for pre-existing conditions.

What happened with the ACA was that these pools were closed so now, those with pre-existing conditions actually had to pay far more for coverage (technically they aren't denied, they just have to pay so much they might as well be).
http://www.ihealthcareupdates.com/obamacare-pcip-program-shuts-down/


So it isn't an either or option. The argument was moot before Obama took office. 
« Last Edit: February 19, 2016, 09:08:36 pm by AbaraXas »

Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #36 on: February 19, 2016, 09:23:16 pm »
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/02/19/donald-trump-on-obamacare-i-like-the-mandate/

Quote
During Thursday’s CNN Townhall event, when pressed by moderator Anderson Cooper on the “benefits” of the ObamaCare mandate, Republican frontrunner Donald Trump said, “Well, I like the mandate.” He then went on to blast ObamaCare as a “disaster” and President Obama as a liar.

Trump made clear that he is not for single payer healthcare and wants to allow private insurers to compete across state lines. Trump is, however, in favor of taking care “of those who cannot take care of themselves.” We do not want “people dying on the streets,” Trump said.

Here is the full segment:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIDi2wlgZN4

Quote
The open question, though, is Trump’s stand on the mandate. Is he going to use the federal government as a cudgel to force every America to purchase a product?

 

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #37 on: February 19, 2016, 09:33:32 pm »
If you don't like the mandate, then you either support single payer or you don't care about solving the access issue for folks with pre-existing conditions. 

Pick your poison folks - an individual mandate so all must purchase private insurance, or a collectively-financed system that covers everyone.   There's really no other practical alternative to addressing the access issue.   

The "triumph" of ObamaCare is that it created the expectation that the government will address the access issue.  I'm afraid that, as a practical matter, there's no going back.   
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Offline NavyCanDo

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #38 on: February 19, 2016, 09:37:14 pm »
There is no way that a conservative can defend what he said, or defend the mandate and its stiff fine for not complying. Only Liberals would support "the mandate" which truly is the worse part of Obamacare, and something that the Supreme court ruled to be unconstitutional.
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Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #39 on: February 19, 2016, 09:39:48 pm »
If you don't like the mandate, then you either support single payer or you don't care about solving the access issue for folks with pre-existing conditions. 



I know. It is so much better now that all the dead bodies are not littering the streets anymore from all the pre-existing condition people. Long Live Obamacare/Trumpcare!

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #40 on: February 19, 2016, 09:43:32 pm »
There are all sorts of problems with the Affordable Care Act,  but the individual mandate isn't one of them.  If anything, the mandate should be stronger.  That's because the only other practical means to addressing the access issue (for folks with pre-existing conditions) is single payor (collectively financed) health coverage.   

Let's not forget that the origins of the mandate are conservative intellectuals who, back in the seventies, developed the concept as a means of warding off a single payer system.  Obama seized on the idea as the most effective way of convincing Blue Dog Democrats to sign on to the ACA. 

A mandate is necessary because a cost-effective insurance regime will be undercut by free riders.   As it is,  the ACA is collapsing because the mandate is ineffective in convincing healthy millenials from buying health insurance.   They rationally decide to rely on their own resources,  leaving an insurance market that's forced to cover unhealthy older folks without enough healthy younger folks to made insurance affordable.    There's actually an easy fix for this (let me know if you're interested in having me explain it),  but as it is, the ineffectiveness of the mandate is what's killing the ACA. 

And that, of course, may be exactly what conservatives (and some cynical liberals) want.   But be warned -  the access issue is out of the bag.  There's no going back, and if the mandate doesn't create rational and affordable private insurance markets that cover folks with pre-existing conditions, than the only viable alternative is single payor.     

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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #41 on: February 19, 2016, 09:49:37 pm »
There is no way that a conservative can defend what he said, or defend the mandate and its stiff fine for not complying. Only Liberals would support "the mandate" which truly is the worse part of Obamacare, and something that the Supreme court ruled to be unconstitutional.

I can and will defend the mandate because the alternatives are worse.   Either single payer, or a return to the bad old days when folks with medical conditions were laid off, lost their employer-provided insurance, and were unable to purchase private insurance.

The folks who have benefitted most from the ACA have, in fact, been white males in their fifties laid off following the 2008 recession.  For the first time, they've been able to get more or less "affordable" private health insurance, where otherwise they'd be high and dry.

The ACA is a hugely complex piece of legislation.   I am no defender of the ACA,  but its my job to know the damn thing frontwards and backwards,better than most folks in Congress.   I'd be pleased to enter into a substantive dialogue about its good and bad points with anyone who's interested.  But this is not something that can necessarily be shoved into a "conservative" or "liberal" box.  It's far too complex and nuanced for that.       
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #42 on: February 19, 2016, 09:50:52 pm »
This is one of the more disingenuous threads I've seen lately.  Apparently no one actually watched the tape.   I did and also saw this live.  Here is what you missed: 

In answering a specific question about pre-existing conditions:

The mandate Mr. Trump likes is the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage----AND ONLY the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage.

Are we all clear now?
« Last Edit: February 19, 2016, 09:52:58 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline aligncare

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #43 on: February 19, 2016, 09:58:53 pm »
This is one of the more disingenuous threads I've seen lately.  Apparently no one actually watched the tape.   I did and also saw this live.  Here is what you missed: 

In answering a specific question about pre-existing conditions:

The mandate Mr. Trump likes is the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage----AND ONLY the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage.

Are we all clear now?

I have no doubt that Donald Trump wants to open up healthcare to the free-market.

Offline jmyrlefuller

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #44 on: February 19, 2016, 10:00:33 pm »
This is one of the more disingenuous threads I've seen lately.  Apparently no one actually watched the tape.   I did and also saw this live.
Called it!

Oh come on, you can't hold him to this. He said it a long time ago. He made this comment 02/18/2016. That is a lifetime ago in today's politics.
And he was misquoted.
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Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #45 on: February 19, 2016, 10:03:59 pm »
This is one of the more disingenuous threads I've seen lately.  Apparently no one actually watched the tape.   I did and also saw this live.  Here is what you missed: 

In answering a specific question about pre-existing conditions:

The mandate Mr. Trump likes is the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage----AND ONLY the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage.

Are we all clear now?

Can you find that quote in there where he says he is only discussing the pre-existing portion of the mandate like you said? I heard him quite clearly answer by saying everyone is going to love the new plan (govt' replacement for Zerocare) because it will be wonderful  and then cover pre-existing separately.

As a matter of fact, Trump plan as he laid out doesn't allow you to go without health care.....kinda like Obamacare.

Offline Frank Cannon

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #46 on: February 19, 2016, 10:08:51 pm »
I have no doubt that Donald Trump wants to open up healthcare to the free-market.

Funny. He keeps bringing up how his govt' plans will cover anyone without private insurance. At no time has he or did he talk about free market solutions to pre-existing or the poor. Remember, there are people dying on the streets as Don describes it. He is bucking the GOP system here with govt' plans because the average GOP voter doesn't care about dead people on the street.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #47 on: February 19, 2016, 10:32:07 pm »
Funny. He keeps bringing up how his govt' plans will cover anyone without private insurance.

  Absolutely untrue, Cannon.  Mr. Trump always goes to great trouble to explain in detail how 'no one should be dying in the street".  He's not talking about covering anyone without private insurance--he is talking about keeping state funded insurance (i.e. Medicaid) for the INDIGENT. 

Get the difference, Cannon?  Or do you prefer to be disingenuous?

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #48 on: February 19, 2016, 10:34:34 pm »
Can you find that quote in there where he says he is only discussing the pre-existing portion of the mandate like you said?

Sure I can.  But, I won't.  I don't think you're interested in the truth--so I won't waste my time.

But I will continue to correct any  :bs: you post on a public site.


Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Donald Trump On ObamaCare: ‘I Like the Mandate’
« Reply #49 on: February 19, 2016, 10:34:50 pm »
This is one of the more disingenuous threads I've seen lately.  Apparently no one actually watched the tape.   I did and also saw this live.  Here is what you missed: 

In answering a specific question about pre-existing conditions:

The mandate Mr. Trump likes is the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage----AND ONLY the mandate that pre-existing conditions cannot be excluded from coverage.

Are we all clear now?

I agree - I heard the interview too, and Trump appeared to favor the ACA's core reform of mandating that insurance companies issue policies without regard to an individual's pre-existing conditions.  This is known as "guaranteed issue".   

The problem, of course, is that insurance companies cannot make money with guaranteed issue without either (i) raising rates to unaffordable levels, or (ii) expanding the insurance pool so there are enough healthy lives to offset the unhealthy lives flock to be insured under guaranteed issue.   That's where the individual mandate is supposed to come in.   On pain of paying a tax,  individuals are encouraged to join the pool.  You hardly need such an incentive if you're sick.   You may very well need such an incentive if you're healthy and either consider yourself bulletproof (like a lot of young folks) or have the means to "self-finance" you health care.   What's killing the ACA is the individual mandate isn't working to get enough healthy lives into the individual insurance marketplace.   Folks rationally decide to pay the tax rather than buy health insurance they can't afford*.

And THAT's the big lie of the "Affordable Care Act".   It was never designed to make health insurance more affordable.  It's intent is to expand access.  It's critical flaw is that it stifles competition in the individual marketplace by forcing insurers to provide only gold-plated insurance that covers, among other things,  prescription drugs, mental health treatment, preventive services of all kinds including, notoriously,  contraceptives, maternity care and a host of other services that many folks, if they had the choice, would choose to forego.   But they can't in the ACA marketplace - plans compete not on the host of services covered - they must all be comprehensive, bloated plans - but on the amount of co-pays and deductibles (the so-called bronze, silver, gold and platinum plans).   

It's insane.   Many folks would like the option of getting health insurance for the purpose for which insurance is traditionally intended - to guard against catastrophe.   Not to pay for check-ups and other routine, predictable stuff.  What auto insurance policy covers oil changes?   You pay for that stuff yourself.  But the nanny state refuses to trust individuals to take care of their own health without resort to "free" or almost free routine services.  And that drives up the cost of insurance to unaffordable levels,  so folks have little choice but to pay the tax. 

+++++++++++++++++

*(footnote):  The fact that the mandate was set so low in relation to the cost of purchasing individual insurance is why Justice Roberts concluded the mandate was a Constitutional tax, rather than an unConstitutional compulsion.   It's perfectly voluntary, and millions are proving that every day, by rationally deciding to pay the tax.   

« Last Edit: February 19, 2016, 10:42:09 pm by Jazzhead »
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