This lake in India is straight out of a horror movie

[Oceander]

Love your liberal tactics of debate whenever you've been cornered.   

Cornered by what?  Belief is just that, belief, and as the saying goes, there but for the Grace of God ....  Belief is by the Grace of God, not by the grace of empirical evidence.  Just as a Christian does not feel compelled to believe in God because they've been confronted with indubitable empirical evidence of God's existence, why should anyone else be compelled to demonstrate an empirical basis for their beliefs?  If you want to compare Hinduism to something as crass as "believing that a bovine is a deity" then you're going to have to deal with the fact that your belief in the Holy Trinity can be just as crassly compared to one of the greatest post-hoc rationalizations the world has seen.  What do I mean by that?  Simply that, by the 3rd or 4th Century the Church Fathers realized, somewhat belatedly, that they were worshiping Christ, not God.  To fix that, but without uprooting several hundred years of practice, they simply rationalized Christ into the Godhead.  BTW, I'm not just picking on Christianity.  In my view, Muslims aren't even worshiping God, they worship Mohammed.  It is his name that is inviolate.

On the other hand, if you want a more nuanced view of the Holy Trinity to be respected by others, then you ought to respect the fact that some may see cows as a symbol of divinity as well.

Which reminds me, perhaps you ought to start reading up on some of that, such as the history of the doctrine of the Holy Trinity, which did not appear in the Bible and which was not fully developed until about the 4th Century AD:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity#History.

You might also want to read up a bit more on Hindu's relationship with cows:

Hindus don’t worship cows. We respect, honour and adore the cow. By honouring this gentle animal, who gives more than she takes, we honour all creatures.

Hindus regard all living creatures as sacred – mammals, fishes, birds and more. We acknowledge this reverence for life in our special affection for the cow. At festivals we decorate and honour her, but we do not worship her in the sense that we worship the Deity.

To the Hindu, the cow symbolizes all other creatures. The cow is a symbol of the Earth, the nourisher, the ever-giving, undemanding provider. The cow represents life and the sustenance of life. The cow is so generous, taking nothing but water, grass and grain. It gives and gives and gives of its milk, as does the liberated soul give of his spiritual knowledge. The cow is so vital to life, the virtual sustainer of life, for many humans. The cow is a symbol of grace and abundance. Veneration of the cow instils in Hindus the virtues of gentleness, receptivity and connectedness with nature.

Elaboration: Who is the greatest giver on planet Earth today? Who do we see on every table in every country of the world –breakfast, lunch and dinner? It is the cow. McDonald’s cow-vending golden arches and their rivals have made fortunes on the humble cow. The generous cow gives milk and cream, yogurt and cheese, butter and ice cream, ghee and buttermilk. It gives entirely of itself through sirloin, ribs, rump, porterhouse and beef stew. Its bones are the base for soup broths and glues. It gives the world leather belts, leather seats, leather coats and shoes, beef jerky, cowboy hats – you name it. The only cow-question for Hindus is, “Why don’t more people respect and protect this remarkable creature?” Mahatma Gandhi once said, “One can measure the greatness of a nation and its moral progress by the way it treats its animals. Cow protection to me is not mere protection of the cow. It means protection of all that lives and is helpless and weak in the world. The cow means the entire subhuman world.”

In the Hindu tradition, the cow is honoured, garlanded and given special feedings at festivals all over India, most importantly the annual Gopashtama festival. Demonstrating how dearly Hindus love their cows, colourful cow jewellery and clothing is sold at fairs all over the Indian countryside. From a young age, Hindu children are taught to decorate the cow with garlands, paint and ornaments. Her nature is epitomized in Kamadhenu, the divine, wish-fulfilling cow. The cow and her sacred gifts –milk and ghee in particular –are essential elements in Hindu worship, penance and rites of passage. In India, more than 3,000 institutions called Gaushalas, maintained by charitable trusts, care for old and infirm cows. And while many Hindus are not vegetarians, most respect the still widely held code of abstaining from eating beef.

By her docile, tolerant nature, the cow exemplifies the cardinal virtue of Hinduism, noninjury, known as ahimsa. The cow also symbolizes dignity, strength, endurance, maternity and selfless service.

In the Vedas, cows represent wealth and joyous Earthly life. From the Rig Veda (4.28.1;6) we read. “The cows have come and have brought us good fortune. In our stalls, contented, may they stay! May they bring forth calves for us, many-coloured, giving milk for Indra each day. You make, O cows, the thin man sleek; to the unlovely you bring beauty. Rejoice our homestead with pleasant lowing. In our assemblies we laud your vigour.”

[DCPatriot]

Funny thing.  Always proven true.  Present a liberal with a reasonable, logical point of view, and they divert.  Look a squirrel!

Exactly.   

But I must admit.  He's very good at it.   If you have no defense?  Dazzle them with bullshit.   

[EC]

The Holy Trinity is a beautiful thing.

Meh. Makes my head hurt. 

[alicewonders]

Meh. Makes my head hurt. 

I confess that my head hurts when I read in the Bible about creation and
God says, "let us make man in our own image".  I wonder who he is talking too.  Some people say he is talking to Jesus - but that does make my head hurt!

[famousdayandyear]

Meh. Makes my head hurt. 

Hey ever body, I know what.  Let's talk SHARIA!  Woo Hoo!

[Oceander]

Funny thing.  Always proven true.  Present a liberal with a reasonable, logical point of view, and they divert.  Look a squirrel!

I have seen precious few reasonable, logical points of view on this thread.  Most of what I see is a particularly ugly, parochial, religious bigotry masquerading as such.

[aligncare]

But if we're honest, we'll judge by our own actions as well, and then cut everyone else some slack the same way we'd like to be cut some slack.

All right who are you and what of you done with the Occeaner from the Bergdahl thread? So help me, if you harmed him you'll have me to answer to.

[aligncare]

I have seen precious few reasonable, logical points of view on this thread.  Most of what I see is a particularly ugly, parochial, religious bigotry masquerading as such.

Ah, there you are. Missed you.

[Oceander]

All right who are you and what of you done with the Occeaner from the Bergdahl thread? So help me, if you harmed him you'll have me to answer to.

Ah, there you are. Missed you.

You gotta take the good with the bad, whichever one you think is which.

[famousdayandyear]

You gotta take the good with the bad, whichever one you think is which.

Liberal translator requested at the scene. STAT

[aligncare]

You gotta take the good with the bad, whichever one you think is which.

I always do      (up to a point)

[alicewonders]

Jesus did say he would rather us be burning hot or ice cold - he hates lukewarm.  We are commanded to fight evil, not to sit back and let it happen.  I believe there is real evil in the world today and we are incumbent to fight it.  When women and children are being sold as sex slaves and people are beheaded because of what they believe, and when innocent people are destroyed by a plane flying into a building......we gotta destroy that kind of evil.

As far as judging other religions - I go by, "by their fruits you shall know them".  What are the fruits? 

[Oceander]

Jesus did say he would rather us be burning hot or ice cold - he hates lukewarm.  We are commanded to fight evil, not to sit back and let it happen.  I believe there is real evil in the world today and we are incumbent to fight it.  When women and children are being sold as sex slaves and people are beheaded because of what they believe, and when innocent people are destroyed by a plane flying into a building......we gotta destroy that kind of evil.

As far as judging other religions - I go by, "by their fruits you shall know them".  What are the fruits? 

Hindus aren't the problem then.  India is a very ancient culture, with some very impressive credentials, sadly most are in the past.  If those are some of the fruits of Hinduism, then it should be known both for the heights of its achievements as well as for the depths of its failings.

[Oceander]

I always do      (up to a point)

I blow hot or I blow cold, I rarely blow lukewarm (do I get any kudoes for that alice?).  I'm the first to admit that sometimes I get a little too overheated, or a little too frosty.

[alicewonders]

I blow hot or I blow cold, I rarely blow lukewarm (do I get any kudoes for that alice?).  I'm the first to admit that sometimes I get a little too overheated, or a little too frosty.

Kudoes.  I'm that way - it's called passion. 

[aligncare]

I blow hot or I blow cold, I rarely blow lukewarm (do I get any kudoes for that alice?).  I'm the first to admit that sometimes I get a little too overheated, or a little too frosty.

I hear you. Trying to make a living these days adds to my general tension level.

That, and the sonofabitches in the park that keyed my new car. I dared tell them to keep their mutts leashed and off the soccer field because other park users --me-- feel intimidated by dogs in a pack off their leash. And there's a dog run not 30 yards away. Well, they showed me. I can't prove which bastard did it. But I'll tell you this, Staten islanders are the most disgusting, self centered neighbors I've ever had.

That's OK I just call 311 every morning with a pet complaint. There's a small chance that one day park enforcement will actually show up and ticket the lot of them.

[famousdayandyear]

Since the original topic (some sort of toxic lake in India of all places) has deteriorated into
 a disorganized discussion of religion, can we again refocus on a real threat to the civilized world:  That would be Sharia.

Anybody familiar with Sharia?
Anybody care about learning Sharia?
Anybody think Sharia will impact the US?
Anybody want to discuss Sharia?

Let's have a dialogue.  Let's get started.  Thanks so much.

[alicewonders]

I hear you. Trying to make a living these days adds to my general tension level.

That, and the sonofabitches in the park that keyed my new car. I dared tell them to keep their mutts leashed and off the soccer field because other park users --me-- feel intimidated by dogs in a pack off their leash. And there's a dog run not 30 yards away. Well, they showed me. I can't prove which bastard did it. But I'll tell you this, Staten islanders are the most disgusting, self centered neighbors I've ever had.

That's OK I just call 311 every morning with a pet complaint. There's a small chance that one day park enforcement will actually show up and ticket the lot of them.

That sucks. 

[musiclady]

Funny thing that.  It was those same "Christians" who torched young women because in their stygian ignorance they thought them witches.  It was those same Christians who decided that you couldn't hold political office if you didn't swear allegiance to a particular Christian sect.

Communism was built on top of some very strong, true, insights about economics and human behaviour, but that fact doesn't make Communism something to praise.

And now let's pull out the mirror:  you claim that Christianity is the fount of all religious freedom, and yet here you are, slamming one religion based on your own Christian beliefs.  Physician, heal thyself.

Well, I see that this thread has had a lot of activity since I went peacefully to sleep last night.  And I see that alice has dealt well with your questions, but I will give a few thoughts before I depart this thread for good.

You bring up the classic post-modern liberalism against Christianity by pointing to the sins and non-Christian behavior of a few in history that your liberal academic upbringing has emphasized and completely denying the whole of Christian history, which, as alice has indicated, is a history of sinners who haven't obeyed Christ's teachings, and plenty of history (which you conveniently overlook) that actually has done what Christ taught - help the poor, feed the hungry, love your neighbor.....

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and not say you were lying when you said that I claimed "Christianity is the fount of all religious freedom."  I do not think you meant to lie, but this is a completely false accusation which I'm sure you thought was clever, but knew at some level was not at all what I said.

I'm not going to repeat all that I have already said, but in a short version I will say that pointing out the TRUTH that Hindu beliefs are causal in India's poverty is not at all the same as saying they don't have the freedom to be Hindu.

Religious tolerance is completely different than believing that all religions are good and that believing in them makes one prosper.  Hinduism's belief in Karma, the caste system, and reincarnation has led to immense poverty and complete lack of caring for the poor.  I believe that Hindus have the freedom to worship their gods in America without retribution.  I have Hindu friends that I love dearly.  That does not mean that I think their religion is good.  In Hinduism, there is a tolerance of pain and poverty.  If I believe in Karma, I don't think it's my job to help anyone else out of their plight.

Christianity teaches the opposite, and thus we have hospitals, schools and multiple charities based on Christian behavior and belief.  Christ taught us to care for each other.  Christ taught us that we, as humans, are ALL precious in God's sight, made in HIS image.  It also teaches us to work hard and do our best.

America was founded on Christian principles, and that is why we, over the last 200+ have had the greatest country in the history of the world.  That is ending as we pull away from the basic virtues that the Founders understood.

I hope you now understand, Oceander, what you missed in spades in reading my posts through your jaded glasses.....

[bkepley]

America was founded on Christian principles, and that is why we, over the last 200+ have had the greatest country in the history of the world.  That is ending as we pull away from the basic virtues that the Founders understood.

I would say Christianity plus Calvinism.  The Puritans believed that hard work and sobriety were indicators that you were one of those chosen to receive everlasting life.  I also suspect the Japanese religion has a great deal to do with Japan's success.

[musiclady]

I would say Christianity plus Calvinism.  The Puritans believed that hard work and sobriety were indicators that you were one of those chosen to receive everlasting life.  I also suspect the Japanese religion has a great deal to do with Japan's success.

Calvinism was in play, but the concept of working hard is very common throughout Scripture, so in that sense, it is just Judeo-Christian.

Good point about Japan.  Their strong ancestor worship and family unity drives them toward excellence, and is very likely causal in their achievements, not only in Asia, but when they emigrate to America.

Hinduism, on the other hand, has led India to its disastrous conditions.  The Indians who succeed there, and here in America are from the highest castes, and therefore achieve a great deal.  The vast majority of Indians, however, are doomed to poverty and failure.