Trump's shutdown gamble now hinges on a wall many Republicans were never truly sold on

[Formerly Once-Ler]

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-s-shutdown-gamble-now-hinges-wall-many-republicans-never-ncna958426

For two years, the GOP had many opportunities to fund Trump’s wall both in part or in whole and it declined on every occasion.

On Friday, January 11, a dubious milestone was reached. We are now living through what has become the longest government shutdown in American history. This seemingly intractable stalemate has created the illusion of partisan consensus. Democrats seem united in opposition to President Donald Trump’s demand for a small amount of funding that would be used to construct portions of the president’s long-promised wall along the U.S.-Mexico border. Republicans, meanwhile, are posturing as though they have always supported Trump’s quest for the boundary. Neither is true.

In truth, though, it is the GOP that is showing more serious signs of cracking — and that’s to be expected.

While Democrats have more incentive to hold firm and wait for the growing pain of the shutdown to pressure Republicans into folding, there are signs that some more vulnerable liberal lawmakers are getting antsy. “If I am getting comments and contact from my constituents expressing concern that the Democrats are not prioritizing security, then I think we can do better,” said Rep. Abigail Spanberger, a Democrat representing a district Trump won in 2016. Democratic sources who spoke with Politico conveyed growing anxiety among the party’s newest elected officials over their leaders’ refusal to grant any funding for a border barrier even as they profess support for provisions like new service roads, port personnel, and technological security enhancements — spending that would well exceed the $5.7 billion sought by the White House.

In truth, though, it is the GOP that is showing more serious signs of cracking — and that’s to be expected. The Republican Party was never united in support of Donald Trump’s wall in the first place.

More at link.

[Smokin Joe]

Murkowski? Collins? What, the cryptoDemocrats are losing their facades? If Mc Cain wasn't dead, he'd be right there, turning coat with the rest of the RINOs.

Polls blaming Republicans? Blaming Trump for the shutdown? (Exposing a tremendous lack of knowledge about how government works.)

Fine, put together a Bill and force the Dems to vote on it. When they vote it down, they own it. Settle it.

[libertybele]

It is NOT what those in Congress want, it IS what the PEOPLE want and NEED!!  Many of those RINO's campaigned on building a wall because they knew that's what the people wanted.

Anyone with half a brain cell realizes that a wall will impede illegal trafficking of various sorts and is needed to assist border patrol.

Ultimately it will help to retain the sovereignty of this country and save this country BILLIONS.  Most importantly it will save lives.

[skeeter]

Murkowski? Collins? What, the cryptoDemocrats are losing their facades? If Mc Cain wasn't dead, he'd be right there, turning coat with the rest of the RINOs.

Polls blaming Republicans? Blaming Trump for the shutdown? (Exposing a tremendous lack of knowledge about how government works.)

Fine, put together a Bill and force the Dems to vote on it. When they vote it down, they own it. Settle it.

Murkowski & Collins can own it too. The sooner we're done with those squishes the better.

[andy58-in-nh]

Neither party has ever wanted a physical barrier at the southern border: that's why we don't have one, after 30 years of talking about it.

However, a majority of Americans continue to desire such a wall, and in large part that is why Donald Trump was elected. For Trump to abandon the effort to build it would be to abandon the people who elected him, and I do not see him doing that.

[libertybele]

Murkowski & Collins can own it too. The sooner we're done with those squishes the better.

Murkowski, Collins and Mittens; all three lack half a brain cell and would vote against any funding.  IMHO even IF there was a funding bill submitted I believe it would fail in the Senate.  I don't think Trump has the votes on either side.  His opportunity of getting this done was when he had full majority in both Houses. 

His only option is to declare a national emergency and the chances of that getting done decreases with every day that the government is shutdown.

[libertybele]

Neither party has ever wanted a physical barrier at the southern border: that's why we don't have one, after 30 years of talking about it.

However, a majority of Americans continue to desire such a wall, and in large part that is why Donald Trump was elected. For Trump to abandon the effort to build it would be to abandon the people who elected him, and I do not see him doing that.

Too much money and too much corruption would be curtailed with a wall.  Open borders globalists have deep pockets; they also exist within Congress.

I still find fault with Trump for not making this attempt to build a wall in the first year of his presidency.  Waiting till the majority in the House was lost and before the new Congress was sworn in raises definite question and concern and even his sincerity of wanting a wall.

What I am certain of, is he doesn't want to leave his post with having failed on building a wall; THAT is not in his character.

I am still not confident that he will seek re-election and certainly the DEMS could take the oval office in 2020. 

[edpc]

Too much money and too much corruption would be curtailed with a wall.  Open borders globalists have deep pockets; they also exist within Congress.

I still find fault with Trump for not making this attempt to build a wall in the first year of his presidency.  Waiting till the majority in the House was lost and before the new Congress was sworn in raises definite question and concern and even his sincerity of wanting a wall.

What I am certain of, is he doesn't want to leave his post with having failed on building a wall; THAT is not in his character.

I am still not confident that he will seek re-election and certainly the DEMS could take the oval office in 2020.

Here’s how you know Trump was never serious about the wall, until it became a political imperative. The people in the House who were most strident about a barrier and funding for border security were Freedom Caucus members. Despite that, this is what Trump said in 2017....


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump

The Freedom Caucus will hurt the entire Republican agenda if they don't get on the team, & fast. We must fight them, & Dems, in 2018!

55.2K
7:07 AM - Mar 30, 2017

[EdJames]

Neither party has ever wanted a physical barrier at the southern border: that's why we don't have one, after 30 years of talking about it.

However, a majority of Americans continue to desire such a wall, and in large part that is why Donald Trump was elected. For Trump to abandon the effort to build it would be to abandon the people who elected him, and I do not see him doing that.

Exactly.

[Night Hides Not]

Not to go off topic, but neither party wants to balance the budget or reduce the deficit.

I expect that from the Democrats, but IMO the Republicans have been far worse at controlling spending as evidenced by the growth of the debt of nearly 8 trillion dollars over the past 8 years.

[EdJames]

Too much money and too much corruption would be curtailed with a wall.  Open borders globalists have deep pockets; they also exist within Congress.

I still find fault with Trump for not making this attempt to build a wall in the first year of his presidency.  Waiting till the majority in the House was lost and before the new Congress was sworn in raises definite question and concern and even his sincerity of wanting a wall.

What I am certain of, is he doesn't want to leave his post with having failed on building a wall; THAT is not in his character.

I am still not confident that he will seek re-election and certainly the DEMS could take the oval office in 2020.

Trump, and everyone else, had to deal with the realities presented.

I am sure that you realize that the House leadership structure and the version of the rules that they adopt (regardless of which party holds the majority and the Speakership) is carefully controlled to ensure that legislation will only come to the House floor for a vote that is approved by the leadership.  (The same holds true in the Senate, though the mechanics differ.)

The only bills that would come to the floor for a full House vote were those that Ryan approved and supported in advance. 

Trump had to face reality when he was sworn in, Ryan was the House Speaker and McConnell was Senate Majority Leader.  Those facts weren't going to change.

I suspect that he had to make some "deals" early on to get some of his goals moved forward.  Without knowing the details of this deal-making, all that we can do is guess and speculate.

It appears that he was able to gain their support for three main items in the 115th Congress:
1.  Senate confirmation of justices and judges.
2.  Mild version of tax reform (with the emphasis on the corporate side)
3.  Funding to re-build the military (that was left in tatters by the prior administration).

Funding for the wall was clearly not part of these negotiations (which is why we saw it only emerge at this juncture, as the 115th congress closed).

Regardless of the campaign rhetoric, every President must deal with the realities of the legislative leadership that is present.

[EdJames]

Not to go off topic, but neither party wants to balance the budget or reduce the deficit.

I expect that from the Democrats, but IMO the Republicans have been far worse at controlling spending as evidenced by the growth of the debt of nearly 8 trillion dollars over the past 8 years.

That is pretty clear as well!

[libertybele]

Here’s how you know Trump was never serious about the wall, until it became a political imperative. The people in the House who were most strident about a barrier and funding for border security were Freedom Caucus members. Despite that, this is what Trump said in 2017....


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump

The Freedom Caucus will hurt the entire Republican agenda if they don't get on the team, & fast. We must fight them, & Dems, in 2018!

55.2K
7:07 AM - Mar 30, 2017

Yes, one of Trump's biggest errors was not teaming up and utilizing the Freedom caucus.  That was then, this is now.  IF the GOP doesn't find a way to fund and build the wall, they are ALL toast.

I don't think at this point in time it really matters if the barrier is concrete or steel, Americans lose without the wall.  Liberal socialism hasn't worked, and won't work in the future.

[Emjay]

It is NOT what those in Congress want, it IS what the PEOPLE want and NEED!!  Many of those RINO's campaigned on building a wall because they knew that's what the people wanted.

Anyone with half a brain cell realizes that a wall will impede illegal trafficking of various sorts and is needed to assist border patrol.

Ultimately it will help to retain the sovereignty of this country and save this country BILLIONS.  Most importantly it will save lives.

And yet, some people insist on regarding a wall as Trump's toy.  Go figure.

[libertybele]

Trump, and everyone else, had to deal with the realities presented.

I am sure that you realize that the House leadership structure and the version of the rules that they adopt (regardless of which party holds the majority and the Speakership) is carefully controlled to ensure that legislation will only come to the House floor for a vote that is approved by the leadership.  (The same holds true in the Senate, though the mechanics differ.)

The only bills that would come to the floor for a full House vote were those that Ryan approved and supported in advance. 

Trump had to face reality when he was sworn in, Ryan was the House Speaker and McConnell was Senate Majority Leader.  Those facts weren't going to change.

I suspect that he had to make some "deals" early on to get some of his goals moved forward.  Without knowing the details of this deal-making, all that we can do is guess and speculate.

It appears that he was able to gain their support for three main items in the 115th Congress:
1.  Senate confirmation of justices and judges.
2.  Mild version of tax reform (with the emphasis on the corporate side)
3.  Funding to re-build the military (that was left in tatters by the prior administration).

Funding for the wall was clearly not part of these negotiations (which is why we saw it only emerge at this juncture, as the 115th congress closed).

Regardless of the campaign rhetoric, every President must deal with the realities of the legislative leadership that is present.

I clearly understand that expecting change with the same leadership wasn't going to happen.  That is why Pres. Trump should have declared a national emergency to erect a wall after Gorsuch was sworn and if not then, after McCain passed; the element of surprise would have been on his side and  he would have faced less opposition from the House and Senate then he is now and chances are the issue would have already gone through the court system.

[edpc]

Yes, one of Trump's biggest errors was not teaming up and utilizing the Freedom caucus.  That was then, this is now.  IF the GOP doesn't find a way to fund and build the wall, they are ALL toast.

There was never any seriousness about it. In fact, during the infamous post-election meeting, Trump argued to Pelosi the House vote was irrelevant, because he couldn't achieve the Senate 60 vote quorum.

So, even if the House had been held in the midterms, you'd still be at that impasse through 2020. You can believe there would be no shutdown, with a Republican majority Congress still in place. So, those who were ousted in the midterms - who had previously not even reached agreement among themselves as a majority - set the curtains on fire, then left the building.

Some of them, like Paul Ryan, will collect a healthy congressional pension. Others have moved on to lucrative lobbying, law firm, and consulting positions, while the shutdown affects people outside the furloughed workers.

Now, the president is boxed in. There's no genuine fight for principle here. You're being so played.

[libertybele]

There was never any seriousness about it. In fact, during the infamous post-election meeting, Trump argued to Pelosi the House vote was irrelevant, because he couldn't achieve the Senate 60 vote quorum.

So, even if the House had been held in the midterms, you'd still be at that impasse through 2020. You can believe there would be no shutdown, with a Republican majority Congress still in place. So, those who were ousted in the midterms - who had previously not even reached agreement among themselves as a majority - set the curtains on fire, then left the building.

Some of them, like Paul Ryan, will collect a healthy congressional pension. Others have moved on to lucrative lobbying, law firm, and consulting positions, while the shutdown affects people outside the furloughed workers.

Now, the president is boxed in. There's no genuine fight for principle here. You're being so played.

Nope, not being played at all.  I NEVER expected any real change with McConnell and Ryan in leadership.  NEVER.  What I have stated several times is that Trump should have declared a national emergency long ago and made this push long before the mid terms.  For him to wait just before the new Congress was sworn in is suspect and questionable.