Author Topic: U.K. govt. agency warning that coming massive space storms will wipe out modern society by killing a  (Read 329 times)

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Offline rangerrebew

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U.K. govt. agency warning that coming massive space storms will wipe out modern society by killing all electronics
November 27, 2018 | JD Heyes | NaturalNews.com | 4,512 views
 
 
The Met Office in the United Kingdom is warning that massive solar storms that occur on an average of about once every 100 years are coming and that, without adequate warning, they could wipe out most technology on earth, hurling much of the world back to the 18th century.

The country’s national weather service says Britain could be “crippled by huge electrical disturbances caused by storms in space unless a satellite network is built that can detect them coming,” The Sunday Times reported last week.

http://www.thedailysheeple.com/u-k-govt-agency-warning-that-coming-massive-space-storms-will-wipe-out-modern-society-by-killing-all-electronics_112018
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Offline thackney

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...Britain could be “crippled by huge electrical disturbances caused by storms in space unless a satellite network is built that can detect them coming,” The Sunday Times reported last week.

Exactly how is that eight minute warning going to change the result?
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Offline jpsb

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Exactly how is that eight minute warning going to change the result?

I doubt you'd get an 8 minute warning, those charged particles are moving pretty fast too.

Offline The Ghost

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Exactly how is that eight minute warning going to change the result?

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Online Skeptic

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This seems like a job for Captain Obvious.

Online DB

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Exactly how is that eight minute warning going to change the result?

I believe the issue is low frequency magnetic fields induce near DC currents in longer electrical transmission lines and those currents saturate the magnetic cores of the transformers connected to them. When the transformer core saturates it looks like a sudden short causing large currents to flow burning out the transformers. If the transformers are de-energized before the low frequency currents saturate the transformers they are not damaged.

So the satellites providing a few minute warning allows the generators to be shutdown/disconnected from the distribution system saving the distribution system from the coming magnetic disturbance.

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Offline thackney

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I believe the issue is low frequency magnetic fields induce near DC currents in longer electrical transmission lines and those currents saturate the magnetic cores of the transformers connected to them. When the transformer core saturates it looks like a sudden short causing large currents to flow burning out the transformers. If the transformers are de-energized before the low frequency currents saturate the transformers they are not damaged.

So the satellites providing a few minute warning allows the generators to be shutdown/disconnected from the distribution system saving the distribution system from the coming magnetic disturbance.

Transformers work on alternating currents, not DC.  DC or near DC has no changing current, which does not create magnetic flux in the core, which does not create faults.

But saturating the core in a transformer does not cause faults anyways.  It is just the limit of the core's ability to carry any additional magnetic flux.  It is directly related to the maximum current that can pass through the transformer.  When you over saturate, the transformer stops sending additional current, it is topped out.  It does not fault due to saturation.

I am an electrical engineer, specialized in power systems.  Your description is not a concern.

Generating voltage spikes in long line transmission lines is a concern, but the modern power system have voltage "shunts" to protect from surges, lightning strikes, etc.
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Offline Restored

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That's why you plug your equipment into a surge protector.
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Online DB

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Transformers work on alternating currents, not DC.  DC or near DC has no changing current, which does not create magnetic flux in the core, which does not create faults.

But saturating the core in a transformer does not cause faults anyways.  It is just the limit of the core's ability to carry any additional magnetic flux.  It is directly related to the maximum current that can pass through the transformer.  When you over saturate, the transformer stops sending additional current, it is topped out.  It does not fault due to saturation.

I am an electrical engineer, specialized in power systems.  Your description is not a concern.

Generating voltage spikes in long line transmission lines is a concern, but the modern power system have voltage "shunts" to protect from surges, lightning strikes, etc.

@thackney, DC (or near DC) does cause magnetic fields in the the transformers core just like any other electromagnet works. It just isn't coupled to the secondary (only the changes in current are coupled with the magnetic flux changes). The long transmission lines are not fully balanced and large very low frequency currents are induced in the lines as the magnetic fields around the earth fluctuate with a solar storm. Transformers are designed for the frequencies they are intended to pass. Transformers are generally designed to have a relatively high impedance verses the load at the frequency of operation so that the load is what the source sees instead of the load and the transformer combined. At DC the transformer looks like the primary winding resistance to the source and so it doesn't take very much voltage on the winding to develop high currents. The high currents are what saturate the core be it DC or AC. Very low frequencies can easily saturate a core designed for higher frequencies. Some transformers are designed to operate in saturation acting as voltage regulators and have specific modifications to handle it without overheating. The vast majority of transformers can't gracefully handle saturation if the current isn't limited coming into it. And depending on the level of saturation the transformer can look like a short to the source quickly exceeding the winding's current handling ability.


Offline thackney

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@thackney

http://www.ee.co.za/article/solar-storms-and-power-transformers-is-it-necessary-to-change-the-viewpoint.html

Thank you for that link.  I am going to review this topic more, I remained very doubtful.  I note in the article:

Quote
...thus, it is fair to say that the only experimentally confirmed fact is a GIC with an amplitude of up to 6 A in power transformers in the South African power grid. All the other data is based on speculation and assumptions, which are not confirmed by registered measurement results....

...After thorough examination of the reasons given in the above mentioned article and familiarisation with the results of analysis of transformer damage in South Africa, performed by various authors, there is reason to doubt the creditworthiness of the statement mentioned in the article and suspicion in an attempt to include solar storms to transformer damage in order to hide the real problems in the electrical energy industry....

...It should be noted that individual emissions of GIC with an amplitude exceeding 10 A are very short, lasting 20 seconds [20], while the thermal time constant of power transformers’ heating according to the standard [9] amounts to 30 to 45 minutes, i.e., the temperature will not have enough time to change significantly during these emissions. Even long lasting GIC ranging from 20 to 30 A (according to the same standard) are not enough to damage supply transformers.

Thus, the geomagnetic induced currents occurring during solar storms in all of the regions located in the southern hemisphere do not reach the values capable of damaging supply transformers....

It also seems to me, to claim this damage to solar storms, while nearly all transformers connected in the same system goes undamaged, is not likely.
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Online DB

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Thank you for that link.  I am going to review this topic more, I remained very doubtful.  I note in the article:

It also seems to me, to claim this damage to solar storms, while nearly all transformers connected in the same system goes undamaged, is not likely.

I will agree that there is a lot of speculation in terms what will actually happen in a major solar storm. I assume you meant "are damaged" above and not "undamaged"? And yes, I agree if that's the case. With a wide spread area of transformers going into saturation I would think the feed to them would over current and shut down automatically before they all individually fried. I would think the biggest risk would be the very high voltage primary long distance transmission line transformers. Lots of energy available at one point if something suddenly goes wrong without addition transformers helping spread the saturation overload.

Regarding transformer saturation characteristics, it varies widely with the design of the transformer core. It can vary from no saturation with an air core to very sharp saturation. Lots of variables.

Offline thackney

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I will agree that there is a lot of speculation in terms what will actually happen in a major solar storm. I assume you meant "are damaged" above and not "undamaged"? And yes, I agree if that's the case. With a wide spread area of transformers going into saturation I would think the feed to them would over current and shut down automatically before they all individually fried. I would think the biggest risk would be the very high voltage primary long distance transmission line transformers. Lots of energy available at one point if something suddenly goes wrong without addition transformers helping spread the saturation overload.

Regarding transformer saturation characteristics, it varies widely with the design of the transformer core. It can vary from no saturation with an air core to very sharp saturation. Lots of variables.

The amperage levels discussed would not be any overcurrent shutdown.  If this was caused by a solar storm, it seems nearly every transformer would have had damage not just this one. 
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The article asserts:
"The Met Office in the United Kingdom is warning that massive solar storms that occur on an average of about once every 100 years"

OK.
If that's the case, when were these storms recorded in the twentieth, nineteenth, and eighteenth centuries?


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