Half of Viking city of Sigtuna were immigrants: study

[Sanguine]

@To-Whose-Benefit? Some very impressive work you've done!

So, for the title "Half of Viking city of Sigtuna were immigrants: study", it's a big, duh - Vikings were traveling Scandinavians, and that they were immigrants is obvious.   

[truth_seeker]

My Swedish great grandparents, came to America in the 186s and 70s.
One side were  among the most early in the settlement in Chisago County Minnesota, which were the basis for Vilhelm Moberg's "Emigrants" series of historical novels. From Smaland.

The other side from near Karlstad. Varmlands.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

@Sanguine

Thank you.

Speaking of immigrants, @ B References has @121:

hann kom út síð landnáma-tíðar, hann hafði verit í vestr-víking ok haft ór vestr-víking þræla Írska,

He came out improved (with) landnaming tidings (news of land taken/ownership named), he had been into (the) west-(a) viking and had out of (his) west-viking slaves Irish.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

As for Viking names, here's a pdf of a translation from modern Swedish by a lady who knows a Lot about Vikings.

www.vikinganswerlady.com/FTP_Files/NordisktRunnamnslexicon.zip

They usually mean something very martial. Not just weird sounding tongue twisters.

When you run across a Viking name, this will help you figure out what it means.


The hero in my fiction is named Jarnulf.

Jarn means iron, and though Viking smiths made steel they never bothered with a separate word for it.

It was all iron to them. And they used the word poetically to describe weapons: swords, axes, spears etc.

Ulf means wolf.

So he's either Ironwolf or Weaponwolf.

[musiclady]

My Swedish great grandparents, came to America in the 186s and 70s.
One side were  among the most early in the settlement in Chisago County Minnesota, which were the basis for Vilhelm Moberg's "Emigrants" series of historical novels. From Smaland.

The other side from near Karlstad. Varmlands.

The Emigrants series is great!  I lived, and have family still in Minnesota and have been to Stillwater, part of where the series takes place.

My Mom's parents were born in Varmland....... her Dad in Vase (near Karlstad) and her Mom in a tiny little town named Vagsjofors, up north.  My great grandparents were born in Lungsund, Varmland.

My Dad's dad came from Pershyttan, and lived in Nora, Orebro and his Mom came from Erikstad, Dalsland, and her parents from Bolstad and Gestad.

My husband and I visited each of those places a couple of years ago, many of which were the same as they were in the late 19th and early 20th centuries when they came here.

It was an eerie experience for me, because, though I had never been there, I felt like I was home.

[Smokin Joe]

Somebody had to pick the lettuce.     

So, Vikings took slaves? Hooda thunkit?

[sneakypete]

So, Vikings took slaves? Hooda thunkit?

@Smokin Joe

Some Vikings raided a town on the seacoast of England or Ireland,can't remember which now,and after sacking it they took the survivors as slaves and sold them in Africa.

That's right,Africans were buying white SLAVES hundreds of years before black slaves were sold in Virginia.

When are white people going to get THEIR reparations for having THEIR ancestors enslaved?

[Smokin Joe]

@Smokin Joe

Some Vikings raided a town on the seacoast of England or Ireland,can't remember which now,and after sacking it they took the survivors as slaves and sold them in Africa.

That's right,Africans were buying white SLAVES hundreds of years before black slaves were sold in Virginia.

When are white people going to get THEIR reparations for having THEIR ancestors enslaved?

Just wait until we start getting white farmers from the ANC's territory. I bet there will be cartwheeling sh*tfits when they try to say they are "African-Americans"...

[Sanguine]

Just wait until we start getting white farmers from the ANC's territory. I bet there will be cartwheeling sh*tfits when they try to say they are "African-Americans"...

Remember, Theresa Kerry was an African-American?

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

Old Norse is a highly inflected language, and can sometimes be incomprehensible without the cultural background.

Here's a Viking snub that's fallen by the wayside.

Hann/Hon er nef-vitr mikilsti.

He/She is nose-wise too much.


Longer I think on it the funnier it's gotten.

It meant the person was such an accomplished master at looking down their nose at others they'd become cross-eyed from studying it.

[truth_seeker]

Old Norse is a highly inflected language, and can sometimes be incomprehensible without the cultural background.

Here's a Viking snub that's fallen by the wayside.

Hann/Hon er nef-vitr mikilsti.

He/She is nose-wise too much.


Longer I think on it the funnier it's gotten.

It meant the person was such an accomplished master at looking down their nose at others they'd become cross-eyed from studying it.

aka "proto - nevertrump language"

[The_Reader_David]

Perhaps the archaeologists need to be reminded what the Norse word "thrall" meant. 

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

aka "proto - nevertrump language"

It does tend to disturb someone's field of vision, don't it?

 

[musiclady]

aka "proto - nevertrump language"

Way to turn a great thread into a "Trash your fellow Briefer" attack thread, @truth_seeker .


Some people are so obsessed with despising their fellow(?) Conservatives that their brains stop working......   

[musiclady]

It does tend to disturb someone's field of vision, don't it?

 

And you too, @To-Whose-Benefit? , sharing in the ridicule??

You added so much to this thread, and now you are helping to drive your fellow Viking loving, and Viking blooded Briefers away with a thread hijack....

Shame on you. 

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

@truth_seeker
@musiclady

Do you understand the legal concept of making nið?

Do you understand the concept of a scorn pole?

If the defenceless NTs need, and Expect, their own Safe Space here as one of them recently admonished me: "It's a public Forum and you can't make me stop posting." 

Var Þeir reisa upp niðstang, neinn ver, ok ekki vera ver lata kugask.
Was They (who) raised up scorn pole, not we, and not will we be cowered into submission.

[MOD3]

Let's stay on topic.  This has absolutely nothing to do with Donald Trump.

[truth_seeker]

Let's stay on topic.  This has absolutely nothing to do with Donald Trump.

Should I connect the Runes?

@MOD3

[musiclady]

@truth_seeker
@musiclady

Do you understand the legal concept of making nið?

Do you understand the concept of a scorn pole?

If the defenceless NTs need, and Expect, their own Safe Space here as one of them recently admonished me: "It's a public Forum and you can't make me stop posting." 

Var Þeir reisa upp niðstang, neinn ver, ok ekki vera ver lata kugask.
Was They (who) raised up scorn pole, not we, and not will we be cowered into submission.

One of the best things about this forum is how (most people) seem to be able to have intelligent conversations about topics on which they agree or have a commonality, even if they violently disagree on other subjects.

Bringing Trump into this thread tore a big fat hole in that concept and for me was a hijack that makes me want nothing more to do with a thread that was fascinating to me.

Is it really that important to you to attack your fellow Briefers on a thread about Viking cities??  Really??

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

One of the best things about this forum is how (most people) seem to be able to have intelligent conversations about topics on which they agree or have a commonality, even if they violently disagree on other subjects.

Bringing Trump into this thread tore a big fat hole in that concept and for me was a hijack that makes me want nothing more to do with a thread that was fascinating to me.

Is it really that important to you to attack your fellow Briefers on a thread about Viking cities??  Really??

Is it really important to you (obviously) to play grade school teacher and chide me and @truth_seeker for sharing a joke?

No member was named. No member was personally insulted. And no Forum rules were violated.

And yet, Mods let it go For MONTHS, when We were personally insulted for "bowing down to our - color which shall not be named - God", along with a lot more dehumanizing characterizations.

@MOD3 didn't get involved until Your sensibilities dressed the 2 of us down.

You are more than welcome to whatever opinions you want to hold, but as far as playing by the rules here goes, Apparently Free Speech and Equal Protection don't apply when 2 members who don't trash Trump regularly, trade a laugh.

This is a Political Site and dragging in the Speech Police doesn't do it credit.

But 'I' am being rude to MY 'Fellow Briefers/Conservatives'?

Oh Yeah, this is a Viking Thread so I better post something to do with Viking Society.

Here, have a good look at what centralizing Authority did to the Most Free Society I've ever found chronicled.

Viking Age Iceland, Privatization Run Amok or Libertarian Paradise?

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com/2016/04/viking-age-iceland-privatization-run.html

[musiclady]

Is it really important to you (obviously) to play grade school teacher and chide me and @truth_seeker for sharing a joke?

No member was named. No member was personally insulted. And no Forum rules were violated.

And yet, Mods let it go For MONTHS, when We were personally insulted for "bowing down to our - color which shall not be named - God", along with a lot more dehumanizing characterizations.

@MOD3 didn't get involved until Your sensibilities dressed the 2 of us down.

You are more than welcome to whatever opinions you want to hold, but as far as playing by the rules here goes, Apparently Free Speech and Equal Protection don't apply when 2 members who don't trash Trump regularly, trade a laugh.

This is a Political Site and dragging in the Speech Police doesn't do it credit.

But 'I' am being rude to MY 'Fellow Briefers/Conservatives'?

Oh Yeah, this is a Viking Thread so I better post something to do with Viking Society.

Here, have a good look at what centralizing Authority did to the Most Free Society I've ever found chronicled.

Viking Age Iceland, Privatization Run Amok or Libertarian Paradise?

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com/2016/04/viking-age-iceland-privatization-run.html

I get it.  It's MY fault that truth_seeker hijacked the thread with a slam against Conservatives like me on a thread where it was totally irrelevant. 

I didn't call the Mods (never do), and I have nothing to do with what they do and what they tolerate, so that too is irrelevant, your whining notwithstanding.

I have never once made fun of you for your loyalty to Trump, nor will I..... but I now see how little respect you have for me because I don't share that loyalty, and that's worth finding out.

Nonetheless, I find it disappointing that you feel the way you do, and that your sensitivity about (a Viking snowflake??  Isn't that an oxymoron??) and loyalty to Trump has overpowered our common interest in my Nordic heritage.

Sic semper political forums, eh?  You lose friendships over totally stupid stuff, and for some reason you think that's a good thing. 

[DCPatriot]

Jobs no self-respecting Swedes would do, I'm sure.....

Seems to me that if male Vikings were 'buried' on set afloat boats/rafts, yeah...the cemeteries would be filled with "immigrants" of that region.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

I get it.  It's MY fault that truth_seeker hijacked the thread with a slam against Conservatives like me on a thread where it was totally irrelevant. 

I didn't call the Mods (never do), and I have nothing to do with what they do and what they tolerate, so that too is irrelevant, your whining notwithstanding.

I have never once made fun of you for your loyalty to Trump, nor will I..... but I now see how little respect you have for me because I don't share that loyalty, and that's worth finding out.

Nonetheless, I find it disappointing that you feel the way you do, and that your sensitivity about (a Viking snowflake??  Isn't that an oxymoron??) and loyalty to Trump has overpowered our common interest in my Nordic heritage.

Sic semper political forums, eh?  You lose friendships over totally stupid stuff, and for some reason you think that's a good thing. 

"You are more than welcome to whatever opinions you want to hold"

A Viking Snowflake?

Are you familiar with the terms regi or ergi?

Insults, slanders/nîð were a criminal offence right up there with attacks on your person or property.

And provided you acted AT the 'scene of the action' an airtight defense in Court to kill your slanderer on the spot. If you walked away from it you could still take it up in Court and have your attacker Outlawed for it.

But times have moved on and today we have Free Speech instead.

BTW; I have never personally belittled you for your beliefs either.

Here's an explanation of nîð and scorn poles, since you didn't answer my previous query.

http://lexicon.ff.cuni.cz/html/oi_cleasbyvigfusson/b0455.html

NÍÐ, n. [Ulf. neiþ = GREEK; A. S. nîð; O. H. G. nid; Germ, neid; Dan.-Swed. nid :-- contumely, Vsp. 56; segja e-m níð, Akv. 35. 2. particularly as a law term, a libel, liable to outlawry :-- of a libel in verse, yrkja, kveða níð um e-n, Nj. 70; ef maðr kveðr níð um mann at lögbergi ok varðar skóggang, Grág. (Kb.) ii. 184: the classical passages in the Sagas are Hkr. O. T. ch. 36, cp. Jómsv. S. ch. 13 (Fms. xi. 42, 43), Kristni S. ch. 4, Nj. ch. 45, Bjarn. 33 (the verse). Another and even graver kind of níð was the carving a person's likeness (tré-níð) in an obscene position on an upraised post or pole (níð-stöng), for an instance of which see Bjarn. 33; ef maðr görir níð um annan ok varðar þat fjörbaugs-garð, en þat er níð ef maðr skerr tréníð manni eðr rístr eða reisir manni níðstöng, Grág. i. 147; when the post was set up, a horse's head was also put up, and a man's head was carved on the pole's end, with dire Runes and imprecations; all this is described in a lively manner in Eg. ch. 60 and Vd. ch. 34, Landn. 4. ch. 4, Rd. ch. 25. The beina-kerlinga-vísur of mod. times are no doubt a remnant of the old níðstöng; -- certain stone pyramids (varða) along mountain-roads are furnished with sheeps' legs or horses' heads, and are called beina-kerling (bone carline); one of the most noted is on the Kaldadal, as one passes from the north to the south of Iceland, it is even marked in the map; a passing traveller alights and scratches a ditty called beina-kerlinga-vísa (often of a scurrilous or even loose kind) on one of the bones, addressing it to the person who may next pass by; for a specimen see Bjarni 193, as also in poems of Jón Þorláksson, for there hardly was a poet who did not indulge in these poetical licences. In popular legends the devil always scratches his writing on a blighted horse's bone.

[musiclady]

I just came back to remove my "Viking snowflake" comment as unnecessary and not particularly kind, but I see that it was grabbed up and responded to with great length.

So, I guess I'm glad I didn't live during the Viking days if pointing out ones sensitivity could result in punishment by death.

Sounds like my Viking ancestors had something in common with today's college students requiring safe spaces to keep them from having their feelings hurt. 

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

I just came back to remove my "Viking snowflake" comment as unnecessary and not particularly kind, but I see that it was grabbed up and responded to with great length.

So, I guess I'm glad I didn't live during the Viking days if pointing out ones sensitivity could result in punishment by death.

Sounds like my Viking ancestors had something in common with today's college students requiring safe spaces to keep them from having their feelings hurt. 

Not so. Since there were no forms of mass communication, internet, newspapers, a person's reputation was real property. It determined how the rest of society received them and interacted with them.

Honor (and reputation) called for the head of a household (usually a farmer) to extend hospitality (food and lodging) for 3 days to travelers. Most would, with whatever means they had, and word got around that Thorstein was a generous and upright man. In return, his esteem around the District rose as people spoke well of him, gave him the benefit of the doubt, and opened doors to him and his householders.

Can't remember which saga it was in, but there was one man who earned himself the name of Halfdan the meal stingy. Needless to say that didn't do much good for him around His neighborhood.

And of course there was a downside to Abusing the hospitality of others.

If bums just traveled around the District mooching bed and board they were castrated as criminal vagrants.


Those who weren't Landed Men/Women made agreements for 1 year at a time to work on the farms of those who owned them. And once every year came the "Moving Days" when they could figuratively sign on for another year, or go sign on to work for another farm owner.

So you can see how being known as the 'Meal Stingy' could cost you money, as no one would want to work your farm for you.

Society was full employment. Didn't agree to work for your keep as a farm owner's 'householder'?

Criminal Vagrancy again. See above.


At the other end of the spectrum came the word regi/ergi (depending on the scribe and edition).

It was the lowest insult one man could call another. It translates as 'unmanly'.

It covered cowardice, effeminate behavior, cross dressing, and homosexuality.

The target was not only legally allowed, but expected, to kill his slanderer on the spot.